ok cabbage... I think we have done it again. We have come to a concensus for the most part. I am ok with about everything you said there. sometimes its just about boiling down to terminology. I will still stick with home run as the objective believing even if you fall short you will find enough extra base hits to make up for the fly outs. But I think that a relatively minor disagreement. I think given your open mind and willingness to talk things out we can officially say you are not ready to be put out to pasture!!