Another theory on the MLB HR surge - PEDs are back

One of the issues I have with pro baseball is that it takes advantage of the fondness we feel for "America's game." How else could a 9 billion dollar industry get away with importing 1/3 of its workers - despite having more than enough Americans available, paying its "apprentices" (spoiler alert, they're not apprentices) less than minimum wage, and not allow employees to change employers (the capitalistic way)? 

Now we have a PED theory: the whole purpose of the PED testing program is NOT to make the game clean; rather, it is to make the customers convinced that an effort is made to make the game clean. (Heck, I didn't know that a full 10% of the players have therapeutic exemptions - which automatically make 10% of the players legally juicing.) 

http://enewspaper.sandiegounio...3c-a82f-1ab095a198ca

It amazed me that pro ball would simply close its eyes when a guy would report with 30 more pounds of muscle compared to just six months before. It amazed me when a trainer would actually find PEDs in a locker and just tell the player to be more careful (in that one instance, the player was caught a few months later by the testing). It amazed me that players openly compare notes on illicit programs.

Every incentive lines up in favor of taking PEDs; those who don't use it are at a distinct disadvantage (and don't even argue the morality - if a player can land a long term contract with generational money, his family trumps any game integrity). The SD Union writer is convinced that PEDs have returned with a vengeance.

Until the clubs have some type of an incentive to make the game clean, PED use will continue to rear its head and distort individual accomplishments. What would happen if a MLB club would lose a roster spot for a positive test (now the suspension is treated as a stint on the DL list; I would argue that because PED use is voluntary, it is NOT comparable); if the player is on a long term contract, the contract is voided and any new contract would require the player be paid the MLB minimum for the length of the voided contract AND they player CANNOT be released or traded, thereby counting as a roster spot) or lose a single digit round draft pick for a MILB positive test? Once the employers are incentivized to clean up the game, progress may be made so that players unwilling to potentially sacrifice future health to the alter of the game can compete on a level field.

 

Original Post
Goosegg posted:

One of the issues I have with pro baseball is that it takes advantage of the fondness we feel for "America's game." How else could a 9 billion dollar industry get away with importing 1/3 of its workers - despite having more than enough Americans available, paying its "apprentices" (spoiler alert, they're not apprentices) less than minimum wage, and not allow employees to change employers (the capitalistic way)? 

Now we have a PED theory: the whole purpose of the PED testing program is NOT to make the game clean; rather, it is to make the customers convinced that an effort is made to make the game clean. (Heck, I didn't know that a full 10% of the players have therapeutic exemptions - which automatically make 10% of the players legally juicing.) 

http://enewspaper.sandiegounio...3c-a82f-1ab095a198ca

It amazed me that pro ball would simply close its eyes when a guy would report with 30 more pounds of muscle compared to just six months before. It amazed me when a trainer would actually find PEDs in a locker and just tell the player to be more careful (in that one instance, the player was caught a few months later by the testing). It amazed me that players openly compare notes on illicit programs.

Every incentive lines up in favor of taking PEDs; those who don't use it are at a distinct disadvantage (and don't even argue the morality - if a player can land a long term contract with generational money, his family trumps any game integrity). The SD Union writer is convinced that PEDs have returned with a vengeance.

Until the clubs have some type of an incentive to make the game clean, PED use will continue to rear its head and distort individual accomplishments. What would happen if a MLB club would lose a roster spot for a positive test (now the suspension is treated as a stint on the DL list; I would argue that because PED use is voluntary, it is NOT comparable); if the player is on a long term contract, the contract is voided and any new contract would require the player be paid the MLB minimum for the length of the voided contract AND they player CANNOT be released or traded, thereby counting as a roster spot) or lose a single digit round draft pick for a MILB positive test? Once the employers are incentivized to clean up the game, progress may be made so that players unwilling to potentially sacrifice future health to the alter of the game can compete on a level field.

 

Goosegg, are you OK?

Goosegg posted:

One of the issues I have with pro baseball is that it takes advantage of the fondness we feel for "America's game." How else could a 9 billion dollar industry get away with importing 1/3 of its workers - despite having more than enough Americans available, paying its "apprentices" (spoiler alert, they're not apprentices) less than minimum wage, and not allow employees to change employers (the capitalistic way)? 

Now we have a PED theory: the whole purpose of the PED testing program is NOT to make the game clean; rather, it is to make the customers convinced that an effort is made to make the game clean. (Heck, I didn't know that a full 10% of the players have therapeutic exemptions - which automatically make 10% of the players legally juicing.) 

http://enewspaper.sandiegounio...3c-a82f-1ab095a198ca

It amazed me that pro ball would simply close its eyes when a guy would report with 30 more pounds of muscle compared to just six months before. It amazed me when a trainer would actually find PEDs in a locker and just tell the player to be more careful (in that one instance, the player was caught a few months later by the testing). It amazed me that players openly compare notes on illicit programs.

Every incentive lines up in favor of taking PEDs; those who don't use it are at a distinct disadvantage (and don't even argue the morality - if a player can land a long term contract with generational money, his family trumps any game integrity). The SD Union writer is convinced that PEDs have returned with a vengeance.

Until the clubs have some type of an incentive to make the game clean, PED use will continue to rear its head and distort individual accomplishments. What would happen if a MLB club would lose a roster spot for a positive test (now the suspension is treated as a stint on the DL list; I would argue that because PED use is voluntary, it is NOT comparable); if the player is on a long term contract, the contract is voided and any new contract would require the player be paid the MLB minimum for the length of the voided contract AND they player CANNOT be released or traded, thereby counting as a roster spot) or lose a single digit round draft pick for a MILB positive test? Once the employers are incentivized to clean up the game, progress may be made so that players unwilling to potentially sacrifice future health to the alter of the game can compete on a level field.

 

I see peds as a possibility as it is pretty easy to not get caught if you are not stupid (lance Armstrong and Marion jones never got caught- it was always whistle blowers just like canseco in baseball).

However I don't see what is wrong with the international players, baseball no longer is contempt with being the american game, it wants to become a world game like basketball or soccer.

Go44dad posted:
Goosegg posted:

One of the issues I have with pro baseball is that it takes advantage of the fondness we feel for "America's game." How else could a 9 billion dollar industry get away with importing 1/3 of its workers - despite having more than enough Americans available, paying its "apprentices" (spoiler alert, they're not apprentices) less than minimum wage, and not allow employees to change employers (the capitalistic way)? 

Now we have a PED theory: the whole purpose of the PED testing program is NOT to make the game clean; rather, it is to make the customers convinced that an effort is made to make the game clean. (Heck, I didn't know that a full 10% of the players have therapeutic exemptions - which automatically make 10% of the players legally juicing.) 

http://enewspaper.sandiegounio...3c-a82f-1ab095a198ca

It amazed me that pro ball would simply close its eyes when a guy would report with 30 more pounds of muscle compared to just six months before. It amazed me when a trainer would actually find PEDs in a locker and just tell the player to be more careful (in that one instance, the player was caught a few months later by the testing). It amazed me that players openly compare notes on illicit programs.

Every incentive lines up in favor of taking PEDs; those who don't use it are at a distinct disadvantage (and don't even argue the morality - if a player can land a long term contract with generational money, his family trumps any game integrity). The SD Union writer is convinced that PEDs have returned with a vengeance.

Until the clubs have some type of an incentive to make the game clean, PED use will continue to rear its head and distort individual accomplishments. What would happen if a MLB club would lose a roster spot for a positive test (now the suspension is treated as a stint on the DL list; I would argue that because PED use is voluntary, it is NOT comparable); if the player is on a long term contract, the contract is voided and any new contract would require the player be paid the MLB minimum for the length of the voided contract AND they player CANNOT be released or traded, thereby counting as a roster spot) or lose a single digit round draft pick for a MILB positive test? Once the employers are incentivized to clean up the game, progress may be made so that players unwilling to potentially sacrifice future health to the alter of the game can compete on a level field.

 

Goosegg, are you OK?

Go44,

It's very frustrating when you have a son who plays by the rules and others do not.

Of all the wonderful things that you hear or see about the game, there is a dark side to this business that most of you are not aware of unless you have a player in the game or someone close to you who is. PED use will never cease to exist as long as they keep paying players ridiculous amounts of money. 

As far as the answer to Contes question,  I am not surprised at all. 

 

 

I don't think it is so cut & dry.   To suggest the increase in HR's is only because of PED's is as naive as thinking PED's are mostly no longer part of the game.  I seriously doubt that all of the Top 20 HR hitters in the game today are on PED's

What would be more interesting, to me, is finding out how many of the top high school age players are on PED's?  Lots of incentive to get bigger/stronger/faster and get that 1st Round draft pick money with very little testing done prior to the draft.

Shoveit4Ks posted:

I believe the development of PEDs will continue to outpace the ability or desire to detect them my MiLB/MLB.

totally agree but taking it one more step I think Gossegg is close to spot on, IMO the owners don't want to know... I think they believe it is better for the product if guys are juiced and I think that applies to the NFL and the NBA as well. It may apply to the NHL but I don't follow hockey enough to have an opinion on it.

if they wanted it stopped it would be a priority and obviously it is not at this time.

 

 

old_school posted:
Shoveit4Ks posted:

I believe the development of PEDs will continue to outpace the ability or desire to detect them my MiLB/MLB.

totally agree but taking it one more step I think Gossegg is close to spot on, IMO the owners don't want to know... I think they believe it is better for the product if guys are juiced and I think that applies to the NFL and the NBA as well. It may apply to the NHL but I don't follow hockey enough to have an opinion on it.

if they wanted it stopped it would be a priority and obviously it is not at this time.

 

 

Plausible deniability is the ability for persons (typically senior officials in a formal or informal chain of command) to deny knowledge of or responsibility for any damnable actions committed by others in an organizational hierarchy because of a lack of evidence that can confirm their participation, even if they were personally involved in or at least willfully ignorant of the actions.

hsbaseball101 posted:

They never left.  http://www.baseballamerica.com...#LdsszR3Kl4lHA4Zi.97

About 50 minor leaguers have already tested positive this year alone.  Obviously the testing isn't strict enough to deter them.  

Drug of abuse is not a PED so actually the count for PED use in milb is down.  Many of those players are foreign, and where it's easy for one to send you steroids meant for animal use only.

My son goes to a school that is ranked nationally in multiple sports annually . Most of the kids that attend are serious athletes. That said, we see very little steroid use and or allegations at the school. In fact, a bigger problem, specifically on the baseball team, is the tobacco issue.

Most kids have never even considered steroids but all have tried chewing tobacco. Not many use regularly, or maybe I should say that not many are obvious users but all have said they tried it. My son included, who has had expensive braces. He confessed and wonders aloud why some of his teammates still use, because "it is really nasty". We have had talks as well as watching Curt Schilling and  Tony Gwinn struggle publicly. Despite all of the health risks and mounds of information he still tried it. The kids love to immolate Big Leaguers. They dip so kids dip too. 

If we cant stop tobacco use that neither gets you the big contract or keeps you in the Big League, how can anyone expect to stop PEDs? I dont think the recent power surge is due to PED use. Look at the baseballs in use today and compare them side by side with balls from other years and I am sure that will answer the question.

The balls are juiced and not most of the players. The MLB has sanctioned the use of the juiced balls.  Fans love watching Mookie, Altuve and some other "smaller players" jack out home runs.  It is obvious they love watching the physically imposing players hit bombs too.......

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