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Visitors at bat in 5th inning, bases loaded, one out.  Batter hits bloop fly ball into shallow left for an apparent hit.  Runner on third scores, but runner on second (for whatever reason) stays on second.  Runner from first approaches second base and for a moment, both runners are standing on 2nd.  At this point, the runner from first becomes confused and heads back to in the direction of first base, where the batter baserunner is just rounding the bag.  Meanwhile, the left fielder picks up the ball and fires to 3rd base for a force out, (out #2).  The third baseman then throws to 2nd to record the force out (out #3) on the runner who is now approaching 2nd base for the SECOND time.  I call her out to end the inning.  The offensive coach comes out to argue, claiming since the runner (who started the play on first) had already touched second base once, there was NO force and she had to be tagged to execute the out. I told her that since the runner had abandoned second base and retreated toward first, the force play re-attached, and she was out on that basis.  After a prolonged debate, the coach finally gave up the argument.

 

As the players changed sides after the third out, I resumed my position behind first base, and I noticed that the visitors had been credited with one run.  I jogged in to talk to my partner who said the run counted since it was a "timing play."  I told him, "no, the inning ended on two force plays, one at third and one at second."  He did not buy my argument at first, but I insisted that the run cannot score if the last out is a force play."  Finally, he agreed and I had to go to the visitor's coach and explain why their run was coming off the board.  Needless to say, she was not happy!

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I'm not convinced that you had the force out at second correct.  The runner never abandoned baserunning, they merely vacated a base that they had previously occupied.

 

Since the force was recorded at third prior to a play at second, the runner who previously occupied second when the ball was hit, is no longer entitled to any base, so that person becomes non-existent for the rest of the discussion.  As soon as that occurred, the runner (who had occupied first at the time of the hit) is entitled to second, and if they were on second when the force out at third was recorded, has removed the force at second.

 

I see this as no different than a person sliding into second safely (with a force on), taking their foot off the bag (even with the fielder on the bag with the ball), then retouching the bag before being tagged.  I can't imagine any umpire would rule that the force was back on when the runner removed his/her foot.  You would insist a tag be made before ruling an out because the force were no longer in effect.  It seems that this is irrespective to which side (first base side or third base side) of second that the runner were physically standing.

 

Am I wrong?

Originally Posted by Nuke83:

I'm not convinced that you had the force out at second correct.  The runner never abandoned baserunning, they merely vacated a base that they had previously occupied.

 

Since the force was recorded at third prior to a play at second, the runner who previously occupied second when the ball was hit, is no longer entitled to any base, so that person becomes non-existent for the rest of the discussion.  As soon as that occurred, the runner (who had occupied first at the time of the hit) is entitled to second, and if they were on second when the force out at third was recorded, has removed the force at second.

 

I see this as no different than a person sliding into second safely (with a force on), taking their foot off the bag (even with the fielder on the bag with the ball), then retouching the bag before being tagged.  I can't imagine any umpire would rule that the force was back on when the runner removed his/her foot.  You would insist a tag be made before ruling an out because the force were no longer in effect.  It seems that this is irrespective to which side (first base side or third base side) of second that the runner were physically standing.

 

Am I wrong?

Yes.

 

Once a runner retreats in the direction of their prior base, the force is reinstated (assuming no succeeding runners have been put out.)

It's a double play.  You got it right.  It took you awhile, but that's understandable.  If the runner's don't help you, well then you gotta fix what they shoulda never broke.

 

Double Play, three outs, the run does NOT score.

 

Good job.  If the coach doesn't like it have him read the rule book.  He can start in rule 7 and also read rule 8 for NFHS.

 

MLB is rule 6 then rule 7.

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