Central Region Playoff thread

Freeman over Cosby:

I thought both pitchers came out strong.  Unfortunately Bickford is a true sinker guy who has to have defense behind him to do well and Cosby just started kicking the ball all over by the third inning.  Riley Wilson relieved Bickford but had a similar fate; I thought he looked strong, too, and in fact Cosby had other pitchers it never really went to until Flanagan got the very last out, and that's because pitching was just not the problem tonight.  Bickford and Wilson each had an E, SS had 2 (one on a DP ball), 2B had 1, C threw one away, and CF lost a pop out in the sun.  Even with all that, Cosby came within a hair of coming back when H.J. Ellis just missed a grand slam or at least a bases-clearing double on a very tough catch by DSF's CF.  (Good view of this on the VirginiaPreps video highlights.)  For Cosby Hunter Williams had a 2B and a 3B, and A.J. Nicely had two hits on 4 times smoking the ball plus he added a tough diving catch in LF as well.  Freeman really just played a fundamentally sound game from start to finish.  They hit consistently all up and down the lineup, but in the end 7 of their 8 runs were unearned.  I do have to say that Logan Harvey continues to impress behind the plate and it's fun to think he will be around here for 2 more years before he goes to some top college program somewhere.

Hanover over James River:

Talk about an ugly game.  Hanover had a clean single and a bomb HR by Knizner to jump out to a 2-0 lead, then got to 3-0 with Denton also looking strong on the hill.  Austin Arnold started for JR and after he got in trouble, Austin McClellan relieved and escaped a jam when a shot hit by Knizner was turned into a DP on a nice play by Mac Caples. 

Then all of a sudden, Denton lost the strike zone in the top of the 3d and walked SIX while Hanover seemed to take its sweet time getting a new arm ready.  JR ended up with a 6-run inning despite getting only one hit that inning. 

After that it was just a question of whether JR could find anyone to get enough outs to finish the game.  Hanover got 1 in the 3d so it was 6-4 going to the bottom of the 4th and after a walk, Griffin Roberts came in for McClellan and unfortunately could not throw strikes.  Justin White, who's been struggling with a hip problem (otherwise he probably would've started) came in then and tried but also could not get it done.  Caples finally came in to get three outs but by then it was 11-6 and JR did next to nothing offensively the rest of the way.  Casey threw his max eligibility 2 innings in the 5th and 6th and was really on despite the short rest, while apparently Roberts had just thrown too many pitches Monday to be able to come in this evening. 

Hanover clearly played the better ballgame.  Both teams suffered one ugly inning but aside from that Hanover controlled the rest of the game.  I think JR only had 3 hits in the entire game and in fact there weren't but a couple of hard hit outs.

Seems to me Freeman has more arms ready to go Friday, as Hanover used a lot of guys tonight.  But part of me would like to see Hanover win, just to see a Casey v. Jones matchup at Hanover on Tuesday, since Great Bridge lost tonight and will come to Richmond to play the winner of Friday's game.

That second game aged me in dog years.  

Twenty walks.  TWENTY walks.

RF&P was awesome last night!  

Anyone have a guess at attendance?  Place looked like standing room only from where I was sitting.  But I also heard someone say that the same number of fans at the Diamond would have felt like an empty stadium.

Only 1 disappointment.  I only saw 1 home run.  It was a no doubter that probably would have been gone at the Diamond too.  Other then that not 1 ball was hit even 350 feet.  Oh well.

On to the next subject, winner of the DSF vs Hanover game gets the pleasure of hosting GB with Connor Jones as probable starter.  Ouch.  So, will we be seeing a "Bad News Bears" style game in attempt to go on the road to Kellam?  I guess there are no easy tasks at this point in the year.

Rich

www.PlayInSchool.com/bus_tour

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I agree with you. It's been fun to see his improvement from last year. 

CRT - Thanks for the twitter feed.  It is very much appreciated. I kept updated while in a late business meeting last night.  The video feed had serious issues, but you get what you pay for .  You may have aged in the 2nd game, but I aged in the first game with 6 errors, and only one earned run (?).  Wow is all I can come up with.  Best of luck to Hanover and Freeman in the next round.

the first game was much more entertaining than the second even with the errors.  The home plate ump decided to make himself the star of the show with a matchbook sized strike zone and two hbp where he called the hitter back to the plate.  Both teams struggled with control but the home plate ump did noone any favors with that ridiculous zone.  Let's go, make the kids swing a little bit

I presume your comments about the HPU are directed to the second game.

It's true, the zone was tight.  But if you watch that VirginiaPreps footage, you'll see that it wasn't the culprit for the walks.  Lots of pitches missed by a LOT.

The two HBP's called back indicated that this particular HPU is one of those who completely misunderstands the rule.  Some guys interpret the rule to mean you have to get out of the way.  That is not correct.  The rule only prohibits profiting from sticking yourself out into the path of a ball that otherwise might not have hit you.  When a kid turns his shoulder -- as they are trained to do -- to protect his hands and chest from a ball coming in, that's not anything wrong, that is correct baseball and the batters in those two cases absolutely should have been awarded first base. 

Just what that game needed, right?  More free passes!

It did give me flashbacks to the HBP that played a pivotal role in the James River defeat of Hanover in the 2007 regional semifinal, also played at RF&P.  Now THAT was a game for the ages.  I wondered if Coach Dragum was sharing my flashbacks and wondering why the calls went against him in both games.

NOT so fast Rich..... I won't disagree with the thought behind the comment, but you never know what BIG surprises are in store for you !!!  Stayed tuned my good friend....   

Game should be very interesting tonight. I'm not sure what Hanover has left to throw (judging from the boxscore last night the answer is not much) but if DSF holds Crowder (who pitched Monday) out for Tuesday then they have no regular pitching remaining and will have to turn to arms who haven't pitched in regular non blowout games this season. Looks like we could have a very high scoring game on our hands with the two very good offenses.

Driller - 

You know I'm a big fan of your Kellam boys.  My comment was in no way a jab at them.  

The reality is 1 team has a guy that has 1st round stuff.  And he would probably pitch against the winner of the Central.  Thats a tough draw.

If you guys have been hiding a potential 1st rounder for the first rounds of states then that will be a "BIG surprise" for everybody!

Rich

www.PlayInSchool.com/bus_tour

www.twitter.com/PlayInSchool

The zone was beyond tight; it was ridiculous and inconsistent.  The pitchers on both sides seemed frustrated with the zone which led to more balls (a number of which were legit calls) especially in a ballpark where most anyone in the lineup can park a pitch right down the middle.  To add fuel to the fire, it seemed that a number of high, out of the zone strikes were sprinkled in which created more confusion.  The worst of it, is that in-between all of the walks and the HBP calls, the kids made a number of good plays and had good at bats on both sides.

What I'm reading sounds like poor officiating, plain and simple.  If the strike zone is as tight as people are inferring, then that would suggest that the HBPs were in the batters box.  You cannot turn in your shoulder to protect yourself, stay in the box, get hit by the pitch, and not be awarded first base.  (assuming no loosey goosey elbows).  It is an absolute atrocity if the umpire has a matchbox strike zone.  At that point, he loses all credibility.  There is no argument that an umpire can make if he hasn't been calling the inside strike off the plate.  He cannot argue that the batter attempted to get hit.

IMO, the first HBP call was correct.  The batter clearly stuck his left evoshield guarded elbow into the path of the pitch.  The second call was incorrect as the player attempted to evade the pitch.  As far as the HPU's strike zone, smaller than most regular season games I witnessed this year. 

I agree that the 1st batter at the least left his left elbow sticking out and did not make any attempt to avoid 'Permit a pitched ball to touch him'.  While the 2nd batter HBP was not as apparent, I think when the ball hit his elbow shield and made a very loud noise and he immediately bolted for 1st base, it looked very much like a strategy of using protective gear to 'take one for the team'.  The above rule of 'not permit pitched ball, etc' translates into the common phrase of 'made no attempt to avoid the pitch' and this is where it is completely the umpire's call.  I've seen it rarely used, and never twice in one game.  But again, the fact that both hitters took the impact on their protected elbow, made little to no effort to move, and bolted for first base without any hint of injury, probably influenced the umpire...both calls ended up being balls as they were high in the strike zone as evidenced by them getting hit in the left elbows....I agreed with the 1st call and the 2nd call was on the fence.

HPU went way overboard to indicate who was in-charge.  In the first inning, Caples tossed the bat toward the dugout and advances to 1b on what should have been ball four, but it was a called strike; he then strikes out swinging at the next pitch which was high but who could blame him for swinging after the previous call...and I'm a Hanover fan. 

Blaming umps on a tight zone may work for a few walks.  But there were 20.  6 in a row at 1 point.  There might have been a few close pitches.  But there were plenty way out of the zone.

But.... did anyone see the 3B ump fall asleep?  He totally missed a play when the home plate ump was looking for help on a check swing.  Actually pretty funny moment for everyone that saw it.  That was in game 2.

In game 1 with bases loaded I'm confident that Cosby's pitcher balked and it took everyone by surprise.  With bases loaded (or maybe 1st & 2nd...can't remember) the 1B was not holding the runner.  Pitcher wheels to fire a pick off to 1B but holds on to the ball when he realized there was no 1B there.  Looked like the 3B ump was ready to call balk, but after all the umps spoke they must have concluded the pitcher "stepped off".  My question is when was the last time a pitcher "stepped off" intentionally to full arm fake to 1B with nobody covering the bag?  Any umps able to give clarification on that for us?  

As for the HBP, both looked like legit HBP to me.  Ump blew both.  

On a sort of related note, I hate all the armor these players wear now.  Totally changes the game.  Pitchers need hitters to fear an inside pitch.  And anyway, how bad does a 79 mph FB from a HS pitcher hurt?  99 from Chapman... yeah I get the Evowhatever gear.  I dont think I know anyone that has missed time on the field from getting HBP on elbow, ever.  Yet every kid now wears an elbow protector.  Crazy.  Isn't that "performance enhancing"?  Outlaw the body armor!  

Rich

www.PlayInSchool.com/bus_tour

www.twitter.com/PlayInSchool

Freeman wins regional title 5-1 over Hanover.  You know the drill - highlights and a report will be up at VirginiaPreps shortly.  Eric O'Brien, making his first start, goes the distance and holds Hanover to one run.  Great job by the Rebels to win their first-ever regional baseball crown.  Rebels get Great Bridge on Tuesday, Hanover plays Kellam.

on tuesday, where and what time is the gb vs dsf game?

The Freeman / Great Bridge game is scheduled for Tuesday at 7:00pm and will be played at Douglas Freeman HS, 8701 Three Chopt Rd, Henrico, VA 23229.

Rich,

I agree that many calls were legit balls but when you start squeezing the zone especially on a field with short fences it can get into a pitcher's head making it more difficult to throw strikes.  I don't like the armor either but I disagree that a HS fastball on the elbow doesn't hurt and could not cause an injury.  I suggest that while you're filming some of your HS pitchers you let one of them hit you square on the elbow.  It hurts.  I know of at least one HS player who was hit on the elbow during an intrasquad game that could not throw for the next week. They would never do this but my suggestion is to not award first base if the batter is hit with pitch on the armor (maybe that was the HPU's own little rule). 

Mike

Sorry to add to the post...once the pitcher steps back he can fake a throw to first base just like he can turn his front shoulder to first base without throwing. 

I disagree with the idea that the evoshield should be done away with.  As a hitter, it is my job to take away one side of the plate.  Meanwhile, pitchers have made a living over the last many years throwing low and away. 

To that end, the good hitter attempts to take away the outside pitch by getting up on the plate.  The elbow guard simply protects him in the process.

What hasn't happend YET, is the adjustment by the pitcher, who then needs to live inside and below the hands.  Hitters will take one on the elbow guard.  They will hesitate to the extent that their ribs, knee, or head get in the way.

I think a big shift in approach will occur in the years to come, as pitchers learn to pitch inside again.  Rendering the elbow guard less advantageous to the hitter.

Evoshield is being used by more defensive players too!  Now it allows third basemen more confidence to play 35 feet from home, therefore taking away the bunt and cutting off angles through the infield.

This is a photo of 3B using it in last nights game!

Where does it end?

Rich

www.PlayInSchool.com/bus_tour

www.twitter.com/PlayInSchool

Id have to agree that wearing the armor takes away a pitchers ability to pitch inside to a degree; and alters the game.

Then the only way to really be effective is to throw chin music; which no one advocates... But you cant let a guy sit on top of the plate. Bonds was a terror because of this...

I do think the umpires could go a little overboard and not award first as often if there is any doubt as to "attempt to get out of the way"... I've always taught kids to pitch inside. To throw at the hands...

Is more effective today than ever with the overdone movement to hit the ball the other way...

Wow...this thread has degraded into worrying about wearing EvoShield?  It is protective equipment to prevent injury.  Some hitters use it to an advantage...big deal.  Learn to effectively throw inside and all of the EvoShield in the world won't matter.  

And for those that think a HS fastball would hurt you if it hit your elbow, I have the bone chips in my elbow to prove it.  It was an 80-81 FB.  If you'd like to perform your own experiment, I'll set up a bullpen session with one of our EvoShield Canes 2015's.

Pitchout31 - That was the point of my original tangent into this topic.  Sorry the thread has digressed so far away from the original topic.  How can a pitcher "learn to effectively pitch inside" as Redbird says if the hitter literally has no fear of being plunked?  The psychological warfare is so important to the pitcher vs hitter competition.  The protection worn by hitters is removing the inherent fear of the inside pitch.  

If a hitter can wear guards all over, why cant a pitcher take an L screen out to the mound?

Good hitters don't stick their elbow out.  Not that I was considered a good hitter but I can tell you I was never afraid of getting hit when I was in the box regardless of who was pitching.

So only bad hitters are covering elbows with pads then?

Or is it possible that these things are simply a fashion fad?  No.  That definitely couldn't be the case!

That's not what I said.  I said "Good hitters don't stick their elbow out".  This means good hitters don't typically stick their elbow out to get hit on purpose.  

As stated previously, pitchers have been taught over the years to keep the ball down and away, and have effectively lost the ability to pitch inside.  I wholeheartedly agree with Redbird.  As kids re-learn the art of taking away the inside third of the plate (and a couple balls in), hitters will have a decision to make.  Standing with their toes on the inside white of the batters box, isn't the most likely outcome at that point.

The bottom line is that the game evolves.  Pitchers throw inside, hitters stand off the plate.  Then pitchers caught on, learned to paint the outside black.  Now hitters stand on the plate.  This too shall pass!

I would disagree with any premise that suggests that player without the ball has the upper hand.  In every sport, the player with the ball knows what he/she will do with it.  The player without, simply has to react.  Because of this simple rule, pitchers have always had the upper hand.