D1 Roster sizes and Cuts.

I know there is a similar thread but I can't seem to find the answer I need!! LOL!!!

My kid had been asked to call a D1 school nearby and one he likes.One of the AAU parents parents said -oh you don't want to look there -they take on over 50 kids then cut down to  30.When I asked how they knew this I didn't get a tangible answer. A different parent said no - that they only cut 2 or 3 kids each year.

SO.... other than asking the college coach - how do you find out which programs take on a lot of freshmen which they then cut and which ones don't?  I am willing to do the research but have no idea where to start. We are so naive going into this that I figured that once you are signed to a school that you play all 4 years!!!! Is there  thread on this board that could help me understand the process?

Thanks for the help! This board is amazing!!!!

Original Post

A lot of schools have their fall rosters online. Here are a couple current examples, just as an illustration:

www.arkansasrazorbacks.com/sport/m-basebl/roster/  (41 on the roster)

http://usctrojans.com/roster.aspx?path=baseball (42 on the roster)

No more than 35 allowed on the Spring roster. First thing you might want to do is research that school and see what its fall roster looks like.

 

You say it's "a nearby D1"....does your son know anyone currently in the program or know anyone that does?  That would be the easiest way to start.  Your location says "north"....there are a lot of D1's in the "north"....lol.  My son is at a D1 and he has a lot of friends playing at D1's.....I'm sure you don't want to name the school.....but if you want to PM me with the name of the school, I will do my best to get you an answer.....there may be someone else here that has knowledge of the school....I'm thinking  we can probably get you an answer without having to post the info publicly. 

Good advice so far.

"We are so naive going into this that I figured that once you are signed to a school that you play all 4 years!!!! "  

Wish that were the case. There are zero guarantees at any school. That's why it's important to do lots of research before selecting the school.

You're in the right place for that research. Take all the help you can get from the experience ones here on this sight. 

Good luck!

BB-Mom,

One way to research a school’s recruiting history over past 5 years or so is to study the PG college commits page.   PG has a wealth of info on their college commits page.  Example, Go to Big State U’s PG commits page for 2015 for example.   They may have had 10 kids committed per PG for that 2015 class.   Next go to Big State’s archive for rosters the past few years (usually found as a tab on same page as Big State’s current roster).  See how many of those 10 commits were on the 2016 roster?  2017 roster?   Etc.   See if or how often they played.  

Takes some time but you can get a feel for a program’s last five years of recruiting history to see how kids fair.   

Many more clarification questions on this PM me.   

Power 5 scholarships are now 4-year guarantees....BUT that is the scholarship money only....no guarantee that you'll be playing baseball.  If they cut you you keep the $$$ if you decide to stay at the school

Other D1's you are guaranteed the scholarship for the first year.  After that it's year to year...no guarantees on if you'll get any money....or how much.

compare posted:

"There are zero guarantees at any school."

There are schools out there that guarantee 4 years.

Starting in 2013 NCAA allowed schools to offer multi year scholarships. You sign your NLI and along with that comes a financial agreement that outlines amounts for years 2,3,4 & 5 if needed. The NLI is for one year. If the coach decides to cut you after the first year, he can and will. The financial part of the agreement still stands until you leave the school or the timeframe ends. 

Very few, if any stay. Most move on to the next school where they are wanted and have a better chance of playing.

Picked Off posted:
compare posted:

"There are zero guarantees at any school."

There are schools out there that guarantee 4 years.

Starting in 2013 NCAA allowed schools to offer multi year scholarships. You sign your NLI and along with that comes a financial agreement that outlines amounts for years 2,3,4 & 5 if needed. The NLI is for one year. If the coach decides to cut you after the first year, he can and will. The financial part of the agreement still stands until you leave the school or the timeframe ends. 

Very few, if any stay. Most move on to the next school where they are wanted and have a better chance of playing.

Not sure what you mean when you state that the NLI is for one year.  The coach can (and do) cut NLI signees in year one.  Have watched this firsthand with freshmen this fall being cut.

Because they signed their NLI, they are "required" to attend the institution for one academic year as a full time student.  If they do not fulfill this, and they enroll in another institution participating in the NLI program, they are required to complete one full academic year at that institution before being eligible to compete in intercollegiate athletics.  This can be appealed, but without appeal and favorable ruling, the student athlete must sit out.

So to that point, the school is under NO obligation to not cut the player in year one.

As for the financial agreement, the school IS obligated to meet the terms provided the student remains in good standing.  As you mention, most want to play and will leave, freeing the institution of the financial agreement at that time.

All the NLI really does is ban any active recruitment of the athlete from other schools and lock the student athlete into penalties should they transfer to another school.  Nothing in the NLI guarantees that the team retain a player in year one.

Nuke83 posted:
Picked Off posted:
compare posted:

"There are zero guarantees at any school."

There are schools out there that guarantee 4 years.

Starting in 2013 NCAA allowed schools to offer multi year scholarships. You sign your NLI and along with that comes a financial agreement that outlines amounts for years 2,3,4 & 5 if needed. The NLI is for one year. If the coach decides to cut you after the first year, he can and will. The financial part of the agreement still stands until you leave the school or the timeframe ends. 

Very few, if any stay. Most move on to the next school where they are wanted and have a better chance of playing.

Not sure what you mean when you state that the NLI is for one year.  The coach can (and do) cut NLI signees in year one.  Have watched this firsthand with freshmen this fall being cut.

Because they signed their NLI, they are "required" to attend the institution for one academic year as a full time student.  If they do not fulfill this, and they enroll in another institution participating in the NLI program, they are required to complete one full academic year at that institution before being eligible to compete in intercollegiate athletics.  This can be appealed, but without appeal and favorable ruling, the student athlete must sit out.

So to that point, the school is under NO obligation to not cut the player in year one.

As for the financial agreement, the school IS obligated to meet the terms provided the student remains in good standing.  As you mention, most want to play and will leave, freeing the institution of the financial agreement at that time.

All the NLI really does is ban any active recruitment of the athlete from other schools and lock the student athlete into penalties should they transfer to another school.  Nothing in the NLI guarantees that the team retain a player in year one.

Like I originally said "zero guarantees".

Nuke83, good call, I did not intend to infer that an NLI player could not be cut. Only that it was for a one year period. 

Picked Off posted:
Nuke83 posted:
Picked Off posted:
compare posted:

"There are zero guarantees at any school."

There are schools out there that guarantee 4 years.

Starting in 2013 NCAA allowed schools to offer multi year scholarships. You sign your NLI and along with that comes a financial agreement that outlines amounts for years 2,3,4 & 5 if needed. The NLI is for one year. If the coach decides to cut you after the first year, he can and will. The financial part of the agreement still stands until you leave the school or the timeframe ends. 

Very few, if any stay. Most move on to the next school where they are wanted and have a better chance of playing.

Not sure what you mean when you state that the NLI is for one year.  The coach can (and do) cut NLI signees in year one.  Have watched this firsthand with freshmen this fall being cut.

Because they signed their NLI, they are "required" to attend the institution for one academic year as a full time student.  If they do not fulfill this, and they enroll in another institution participating in the NLI program, they are required to complete one full academic year at that institution before being eligible to compete in intercollegiate athletics.  This can be appealed, but without appeal and favorable ruling, the student athlete must sit out.

So to that point, the school is under NO obligation to not cut the player in year one.

As for the financial agreement, the school IS obligated to meet the terms provided the student remains in good standing.  As you mention, most want to play and will leave, freeing the institution of the financial agreement at that time.

All the NLI really does is ban any active recruitment of the athlete from other schools and lock the student athlete into penalties should they transfer to another school.  Nothing in the NLI guarantees that the team retain a player in year one.

Like I originally said "zero guarantees".

Nuke83, good call, I did not intend to infer that an NLI player could not be cut. Only that it was for a one year period. 

The only thing that has a "zero guarantee" is the fact that there is NO GUARANTEE that a kid will EVER see the field.  I've seen kids get big $$$$, don't show up ready to work in the fall and leave before spring practice.  The athletic money is GUARANTEED...and it's spelled out for you in the paperwork you get when you sign your NLI.  If the financials say it's $xxxx for four years the kid gets the $$$ for 4 years....even if he gets cut his sophomore year.  If it's a 1 year award...then he's guaranteed that money the first year....nothing more.  You can't say "zero guarantees"....like it's some crapshoot and the kid is blindly signing his life away....everything regarding $$$$  is clearly spelled out.

Signing an NLI does not “guarantee” a coach will not tell a player “We don’t see you fitting into our plans.”  How many kids hear this and stay for the guaranteed four year scholarship? Chances are if this is the talent level the player only received 25%.

RJM posted:

Signing an NLI does not “guarantee” a coach will not tell a player “We don’t see you fitting into our plans.”  How many kids hear this and stay for the guaranteed four year scholarship? Chances are if this is the talent level the player only received 25%.

Agreed, and I doubt that most kids would stay....but who knows...25% for 4 years at a state public school may be enough difference for some kids to be able to afford college.  Leaving a state public school to attend a big $$$ D2 or D3 may not be feasible.....and at that point (maybe after a kid's sophomore year) the kid may just take the $$$ and stay.  I said that the baseball aspect is never guaranteed...but the amount of money a kid can have to  put toward school is in writing.

"The financial part of the agreement still stands until you leave the school or the timeframe ends.

Very few, if any stay. Most move on to the next school where they are wanted and have a better chance of playing".

My zero guarantees comment was regarding being cut. 

 

Not sure of the exact figures or impact but i suspect Power 5 coaches are keenly aware of losing Seniors (players who they recruit assuming if on track will get drafted) to the draft and that $$ is never spent as a part of that 4 year agreement. One more thing to consider.

BackstopDad32 posted:

Pretty sure all NLI guys count towards the 35 whether they are actually rostered or not that first spring  

To the OP.  Have you son find a player on a visit or on Twitter and ask.  Haven’t seen a player yet who won’t answer most any question posed to them. 

An exception can occur in the case of an injured player. Normally all players with athletic scholarships must count toward the 35 roster total, but in our son's case the school was able to apply to the NCAA for a medical hardship waiver to replace him on the roster his freshman season while he rehabbed from TJ incurred during his senior year in HS. He still received his athletic aid and they graciously listed him on the website roster but they weren't prevented from fielding a full team by having him take up a spot when he wouldn't be competing. In addition, he ended up getting paid to run the scoreboard that spring 😊

  Ask the coach.  Different schools have different philosophies on rosters.  When we were going through the recruiting process, we asked every coach how many kids they would bring in during the fall and everyone answered truthfully.  One school said they only bring in 35.  I have checked their fall roster the past couple of years and they only list 35 players.  Most said they will have 40-42 players in the fall.  Players will get hurt.  Players will become academically ineligible and some will not develop and will be redshirted and some kids will quit or move on to another school.  

   During sons last fall playing showcase, he played a tournament at a top 10 program.  Sons team was playing the first game of the night and the school was playing a scrimmage. They had 52 players in uniform and another 4 or 5 walking around in shorts.   This school hasn't posted a fall roster for the past 3 years either.

  

 

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