Distance Between Home and College

Interesting....we have talked about how close a lot of the kids on my son's team are to home.  He is at a mid-major here in Ohio.  1 kid from Florida....903 miles,  1 from Indiana....203 miles and the rest are less than 100 miles.  When the freshmen get here this fall, we'll probably have a dozen that are less than 50 miles.  2 of them less than 3 minutes

Wow, very interesting.   I mentioned this as an often overlooked factor the other day in the thread about the necessity of travel ball.   If the majority of players end up in their own back yard, this lessens the need to join a travel club that bounces all over the country.

The gymnastics number just blows me away.  I mean, the country is only a little more than 2,000 miles across.  On average, those student athletes go half way?  I'm sure someone here has more insight.  I would guess that the location/density of training facilities and of competing schools have to be a big factor but I can't help think of the "Dance moms" show and how maybe those kids are dying to get far, far away  

cabbagedad posted:

The gymnastics number just blows me away.  I mean, the country is only a little more than 2,000 miles across.  On average, those student athletes go half way?  I'm sure someone here has more insight.  I would guess that the location/density of training facilities and of competing schools have to be a big factor but I can't help think of the "Dance moms" show and how maybe those kids are dying to get far, far away  

I'll take a shot. There are only 15 D1 men's gymnastics teams, so it's a much smaller sample size than other sports. Three are military academies; those kids are from all over the country. Plus Stanford, who recruits nationally.

Cabbage has a great point, and what would likely reinforce his position even further would be to take out the California and Florida players data, who probably skew the results  as those players are all over the country. Great add to the HSSBW recruiting theorem(s): "Look hard in your backyard first."   

BOF posted:

Cabbage has a great point, and what would likely reinforce his position even further would be to take out the California and Florida players data, who probably skew the results  as those players are all over the country. Great add to the HSSBW recruiting theorem(s): "Look hard in your backyard first."   

True, but CA reinforces the position too.  I just looked at the rosters of UCLA and CAL - 4 out-of-state and 1 Canadian kid total between two.  The rest are home grown.

JCG posted:
BOF posted:

Cabbage has a great point, and what would likely reinforce his position even further would be to take out the California and Florida players data, who probably skew the results  as those players are all over the country. Great add to the HSSBW recruiting theorem(s): "Look hard in your backyard first."   

True, but CA reinforces the position too.  I just looked at the rosters of UCLA and CAL - 4 out-of-state and 1 Canadian kid total between two.  The rest are home grown.

And on the opposite end of the spectrum....Vandy

Florida - 4,  Tennessee - 11,  Illinois - 2,  Ohio 2,  Georgia 2,  Massachusetts 2, and 1 each from Texas, Michigan, California, Indiana, North Carolina, Kansas, Wisconsin, Alabama and Washington

College coach said during a lecture hall type meeting "Open up a map, find your house, now draw a circle approximately 2 hours away from your house. Get a list of all colleges that are within that circle because there is a 95% chance your kid is going to college within that circle."

I think this is really an interesting topic.  So other than top programs (Vandy for example), how much of this is driven by recruiting budgets (or lack there of) as well as financial constraints of families to travel outside close geographic region.  I think you also have to factor in population density (such as JCG pointed out with Cali kids at UCLA and Cal) and number of colleges in those locations etc.  Could break this down in many different ways but is interesting for sure. 

FriarFred posted:

I think this is really an interesting topic.  So other than top programs (Vandy for example), how much of this is driven by recruiting budgets (or lack there of) as well as financial constraints of families to travel outside close geographic region.  I think you also have to factor in population density (such as JCG pointed out with Cali kids at UCLA and Cal) and number of colleges in those locations etc.  Could break this down in many different ways but is interesting for sure. 

Great point.....consider Vandy....a 3 hour drive from Lake Point.  Heck, their coaches could run down for a day of any of the WWBA tourneys and be back in their own bed that night.  Not an option for schools too much further than that.  I'm not sure my son's school has a recruiting budget lol.  This year's incoming class includes 5 kids who are all within 50 miles or so of the school (2 are 3 miles away).....and a JUCO kid that one of our current players knew.

3and2Fastball posted:

In-State vs Out of State Tuition is a huge difference maker

The same is true, at least in CA. for the public universities.  25% for an out of State tuition in the UC system is over twice the allocation for a .25 for a California player. Especially at a school like Cal, with athletic budgets under very close scrutiny, they are rarely going out of State because of the cost hit to their baseball budget.

CaCO3Girl posted:
3and2Fastball posted:

In-State vs Out of State Tuition is a huge difference maker

Many neighboring states have deals with each other to give kids in-state tuition pricing. 

https://www.hercampus.com/high...ts-get-state-tuition

Very true.  Minnesota & Wisconsin have that in place.   You tend to see a vast majority of D3 & Juco players from Wisconsin playing in either Wisconsin or Minnesota for that very reason

JCG posted:
BOF posted:

Cabbage has a great point, and what would likely reinforce his position even further would be to take out the California and Florida players data, who probably skew the results  as those players are all over the country. Great add to the HSSBW recruiting theorem(s): "Look hard in your backyard first."   

True, but CA reinforces the position too.  I just looked at the rosters of UCLA and CAL - 4 out-of-state and 1 Canadian kid total between two.  The rest are home grown.

Strong programs in a large metropolitan area like Southern California (also a baseball hotbed) makes it easy on the recruiting budget for a team like UCLA. As I stated in another thread, I am currently at Headfirst in Long Island with my son. Vandy is here and so is Texas. Vandy I get, they recruit nationally. But Texas is a different story, they only have like 4-5 guys from outside Texas on the roster (California, Nevada, Florida, Louisiana and even one Mexico player). We scratched our head seeing Texas here. 

cabbagedad posted:

Wow, very interesting.   I mentioned this as an often overlooked factor the other day in the thread about the necessity of travel ball.   If the majority of players end up in their own back yard, this lessens the need to join a travel club that bounces all over the country.

The gymnastics number just blows me away.  I mean, the country is only a little more than 2,000 miles across.  On average, those student athletes go half way?  I'm sure someone here has more insight.  I would guess that the location/density of training facilities and of competing schools have to be a big factor but I can't help think of the "Dance moms" show and how maybe those kids are dying to get far, far away  

There are very few men's gymnastics teams -- only about 15 in D1. I think that's the biggest factor. Same with the other sports at the top of the list.

3and2Fastball posted:
CaCO3Girl posted:
3and2Fastball posted:

In-State vs Out of State Tuition is a huge difference maker

Many neighboring states have deals with each other to give kids in-state tuition pricing. 

https://www.hercampus.com/high...ts-get-state-tuition

Very true.  Minnesota & Wisconsin have that in place.   You tend to see a vast majority of D3 & Juco players from Wisconsin playing in either Wisconsin or Minnesota for that very reason

Also the D3 schools in the WISC system are big state schools. You can have the Big State U experience but still play Baseball. 

Over the years there had been much Division between these schools and the rest of D3. Issues such as Grey shirting. The big state schools in D3 are usually for it, while many of the schools with a different charter (think smaller schools), that serve a different population are against such matters. 

At one point there was a discussion of Division 4. Thank god it never was approved. 

SanDiegoRealist posted:
JCG posted:
BOF posted:

Cabbage has a great point, and what would likely reinforce his position even further would be to take out the California and Florida players data, who probably skew the results  as those players are all over the country. Great add to the HSSBW recruiting theorem(s): "Look hard in your backyard first."   

True, but CA reinforces the position too.  I just looked at the rosters of UCLA and CAL - 4 out-of-state and 1 Canadian kid total between two.  The rest are home grown.

Strong programs in a large metropolitan area like Southern California (also a baseball hotbed) makes it easy on the recruiting budget for a team like UCLA. As I stated in another thread, I am currently at Headfirst in Long Island with my son. Vandy is here and so is Texas. Vandy I get, they recruit nationally. But Texas is a different story, they only have like 4-5 guys from outside Texas on the roster (California, Nevada, Florida, Louisiana and even one Mexico player). We scratched our head seeing Texas here. 

One of our local CA players made a big splash playing for Houston this year.  Talent is talent.

FriarFred posted:

I think this is really an interesting topic.  So other than top programs (Vandy for example), how much of this is driven by recruiting budgets (or lack there of) as well as financial constraints of families to travel outside close geographic region.  I think you also have to factor in population density (such as JCG pointed out with Cali kids at UCLA and Cal) and number of colleges in those locations etc.  Could break this down in many different ways but is interesting for sure. 

Yeah, Fred, there are lots of good past threads on this.  I'll try to summarize.  Of course, in-state and neighboring tuition are the biggy.  College coaches being able to actually see the recruits more than once and otherwise become familiar with them via area coaches, scouts, instructors is another.  Kids wanting to stay reasonably close to home due to ability to come home for holidays, meals, laundry, etc, having HS friends that will also go to the college, grew up rooting for/familiar with the in-state colleges, social and climate comfort, logistical and financial inability to get to schools for visits prior to committing, etc.  I'll add another of my own that I haven't heard here before - the tendency to wait too long to pick a direction, therefore taking the path of least resistance.

High academic privates (like Vany) tend to be the exception since there is no difference in tuition (in-state vs out-of-state) and the value of the academics makes it worth while.  The other exception, of course, is when a really good player is recruited by a really good baseball program.

CaCO3Girl posted:

College coach said during a lecture hall type meeting "Open up a map, find your house, now draw a circle approximately 2 hours away from your house. Get a list of all colleges that are within that circle because there is a 95% chance your kid is going to college within that circle."

Maybe true for Eastern states, where there are a lot of college options within a 2 hour circle. The western states are so big, a 2 hour drive will only cover one metropolitan area. When we attended a U Washington event, the college rep proudly say that "UW is the best within a 500 miles circle around Seattle." You'll have to drive 12 hours to SF to find better schools.

Bogeyorpar posted:
CaCO3Girl posted:

College coach said during a lecture hall type meeting "Open up a map, find your house, now draw a circle approximately 2 hours away from your house. Get a list of all colleges that are within that circle because there is a 95% chance your kid is going to college within that circle."

Maybe true for Eastern states, where there are a lot of college options within a 2 hour circle. The western states are so big, a 2 hour drive will only cover one metropolitan area. When we attended a U Washington event, the college rep proudly say that "UW is the best within a 500 miles circle around Seattle." You'll have to drive 12 hours to SF to find better schools.

Lol, that's kind of funny, his "circle" really should be more of a rectangle that's about 100 miles wide and 500 miles south   Considering that to the North and West you only have 50 miles before you're in Canada or taking classes on an Island and to the east/southeast 500 miles puts you somewhere in the middle of Montana, Idaho and Wyoming....not exactly a hotbed of great colleges   but it sounds good for his story

I think Cabbage is has a really good point, however there are programs that recruit nationally to stay competitive.

Here is where players were from on my son's former program his Sr year; which is  a perennially nationally ranked TX based D3. Even though they get about 1/3 of their players from TX, there were days without a single player from TX in the lineup his Sr year. 

CA

Canada - Two provinces, BC and Ontario

CO

MT

Mexico City

NC

NV

OK

TX

WA

 

cabbagedad posted:
FriarFred posted:

I think this is really an interesting topic.  So other than top programs (Vandy for example), how much of this is driven by recruiting budgets (or lack there of) as well as financial constraints of families to travel outside close geographic region.  I think you also have to factor in population density (such as JCG pointed out with Cali kids at UCLA and Cal) and number of colleges in those locations etc.  Could break this down in many different ways but is interesting for sure. 

Yeah, Fred, there are lots of good past threads on this.  I'll try to summarize.  Of course, in-state and neighboring tuition are the biggy.  College coaches being able to actually see the recruits more than once and otherwise become familiar with them via area coaches, scouts, instructors is another.  Kids wanting to stay reasonably close to home due to ability to come home for holidays, meals, laundry, etc, having HS friends that will also go to the college, grew up rooting for/familiar with the in-state colleges, social and climate comfort, logistical and financial inability to get to schools for visits prior to committing, etc.  I'll add another of my own that I haven't heard here before - the tendency to wait too long to pick a direction, therefore taking the path of least resistance.

High academic privates (like Vany) tend to be the exception since there is no difference in tuition (in-state vs out-of-state) and the value of the academics makes it worth while.  The other exception, of course, is when a really good player is recruited by a really good baseball program.

Another driver is the timing of official visits.  Most of your higher demand prospects have committed long before they're even eligible for OV's.  So many have cast their net based on the time and expense of making unofficial visits, which tends to limit distance parents are willing to travel for a "chance" there might be some offer.

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