Lifting Correlations

coachld posted:

Dominik - Respectfully, I know you share some good information but I struggle with your generalizations and percentages. Where do you get 90% and 10% from? What about the deadlift numbers? If there is something more to your numbers and you are just trying to simplify things for people, I think you may be misleading them at the same time. I do simplify my responses sometimes because if I didn't, I would be putting people to sleep, so I get it.

I am not an expert nor do I claim to be one. What I do know how to do is follow the lead of the best in the business. I don't know one of them who does not believe that all baseball players of training age, should work to improve strength, power, speed, mobility, stability, etc., so as to improve performance and prevent injury.

Everybody knows of a player or players who do none of the above and still excel but I will continue to trust those do this for living and whose living is dependent on results.

 

The numbers are totally made up, just to make a point. My knowledge is mostly in hitting so take that with a grain of salt.

But I have seen many huge guys who hit 450 foot bombs who can't throw at all (like frank thomas) and there are many super small kids who have a laser arm.

But of course there are also huge hulking guys who throw 100.

Note that coachld speaks of taking his cues from "the best in the business" and not just any generic, so-called "professional." So, I think he means those who have shown proven results with their methods. As to the correlation with strength numbers, while I'm not sure you can make a strict correlation with individual strength stats and velocity numbers, I no longer doubt at all that strength gains through lifting can accentuate other pitching work and aid in velocity increases. Now, you're not going to just bulk a kid up who isn't also working on pitching and turn him into a fireballer, but take a pitcher and put him on a good lifting program and it will accelerate increases he will already see. Not to mention very probable durability and health assistance.

I, for decades, bought into the whole "pitchers should stay away from weights" thing. I no longer ascribe to that now that I see the results. When I first moved to this small town I now live in four years ago, things started changing for me in that respect. I live in Lamar, Co - population less than 8,000 and not another town that big within a two hour drive. This is truly the sticks. However, the first thing I noted was that this little school had put more players in the major leagues than all but two schools in the state - most notably Doug Brocail (current Rangers PC) and Scott Elarton. When I did a little research, I came across an article from 1991 concerning the coach's (Jesse Downey) success with developing pitchers who threw hard. What baseball magazine did I find this in? None. It wasn't a baseball magazine, but rather a weightlifting publication. This guy, while almost every coach at the time - including me - was teaching that weightlifting was horrible for pitchers and mobility - had his pitcher doing Olympic weightlifting. Hmm. Thought it was worth a shot. Since that time, pitchers I work with have been healthy, thrown harder, etc. I see velocity gains into the low/mid 80's that I sincerely believe 15 years ago I would have struggled to get to the high 70's. Just my experience.

SultanofSwat posted:

coachld posted:

 will continue to trust those do this for living and whose living is dependent on results.

 

Based on my experience, most instructors do more to hinder, than help improve technique.  How many of us know people that tell kids to balance over the rubber to start with?

I am talking about performance training, not pitching instructors. However, I agree with your thoughts regarding instructors.

Scotty83 posted:

coachld posted:

Everybody knows of a player or players who do none of the above and still excel but I will continue to trust those do this for living and whose living is dependent on results.

 

A huge problem in the entire health and fitness industry is your last sentence. When someone's living is dependent on results they can kinda tend to make things seem more like they had a direct influence on the results. 

For example my son's velocity went form 76 freshman year to 83 sophomore year. All he did was eat to many potato chips haha. However during the winter we started throwing bullpens to get his arm ready for the season because I knew he'd be over used and the coaches wouldn't do anything preseason to get him ready. So this year I had one parent after another ask me for lessons and if their kid could come to workouts this winter. If my living was dependent on the results it would have been "my program" that caused the velocity gains. Since I don't charge for lessons I told the parents their kids were welcome but made sure the parents knew I had nothing to do with the increase. 

There are wonderful trainers out there but there are a lot of trainers that don't mind fudging a little to pay the rent either. Not to mention the ones that will flat out lie. 

Agree 100% which is why there are only a couple of trainers/facilities locally that I trust. I have said it before but I am a big Eric Cressey fan when it comes to anything related to performance training with baseball. Also follow guys like Mike Boyle, Bob Alejo, Tony Gentilcore, Mike Robertson, Joe Bonyai, Bruce Kelly, Mike Reinold, etc. There is so much information available on the web today which includes podcasts, exercise videos, etc.