MLB Post Season Thread

TPM posted:

justbaseball posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

Can Dusty Baker survive this postseason without being fired?  The Nats still have yet to win a postseason series!

I think so.  Big time players' manager, it would be pretty upsetting to the players to lose him.  I don't know about this series (I didn't watch much of it), but Dusty historically makes tactical decisions that don't work out so well in the playoffs.  They may be related to his being loyal to his players...at times.

Also, as things start going bad, his demeanor (i.e. anxiety, frustration) in the dugout is very apparent, as opposed to Madden who seems cool as a cucumber no matter what.

I agree. Madden is so chill. That makes a big difference. 

 

I don't think maddon is a good in game manager either. Maybe not as bad a dusty but he makes plenty questionable decisions too. Last year bringing chapman in to close out game 6 with a 5 run lead after a multi inning appearance in game 5 was terrible. 2017 Jared weaver could have closed that game and chapman was gassed and almost blew game 7.

Also pitching a rightly to harper in the game they lost was quite strange.

But dusty might be one of the worst. Now that doesn't mean they lost because of him. Such a series is totally random. That series was super evenly matched (20-17 runs) and in the end the cubs were a little bit luckier.

Lets all keep believing you can teach blocking and framing.  I guess that's not fair, you can teach all you want, but having someone do it is another story.  Your should not believe that it will occur after it's taught.  Live and die by the ball velocity.

Dominik85 posted:

TPM posted:

justbaseball posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

Can Dusty Baker survive this postseason without being fired?  The Nats still have yet to win a postseason series!

I think so.  Big time players' manager, it would be pretty upsetting to the players to lose him.  I don't know about this series (I didn't watch much of it), but Dusty historically makes tactical decisions that don't work out so well in the playoffs.  They may be related to his being loyal to his players...at times.

Also, as things start going bad, his demeanor (i.e. anxiety, frustration) in the dugout is very apparent, as opposed to Madden who seems cool as a cucumber no matter what.

I agree. Madden is so chill. That makes a big difference. 

 

I don't think maddon is a good in game manager either. Maybe not as bad a dusty but he makes plenty questionable decisions too. Last year bringing chapman in to close out game 6 with a 5 run lead after a multi inning appearance in game 5 was terrible. 2017 Jared weaver could have closed that game and chapman was gassed and almost blew game 7.

Also pitching a rightly to harper in the game they lost was quite strange.

But dusty might be one of the worst. Now that doesn't mean they lost because of him. Such a series is totally random. That series was super evenly matched (20-17 runs) and in the end the cubs were a little bit luckier.

All I said was he was chill. His demeanor remains the same, Dusty showed too much negative body language.

They werent pitching to Harper, or Rizzo. Thats expected.  Pitching was done for both teams basically but it was about stepping up. You cant be at ease when your manager is not looking happy.

My fav player last night...Jon Jay.

Either way it doesnt matter, but I think the Nats need to go back to the drawing board. 

And make Jason Werth get a haircut!

yes, I think from the human perspective maddon is a pretty good manager. good at motivating people.

I don't think the nats can do much, just try it another time next year and hope for better luck and then probably start to rebuild in 2019 or 2020.

TPM posted:

And make Jason Werth get a haircut!

As of today, Jayson Werth is an unrestricted free agent. Maybe the Yankees will sign him just to make him shave.

"My fav player last night...Jon Jay."

He was instrumental in getting the Constitution ratified as well.  Truly valuable all-around guy.

Not a free agent until the championship season is over. 

3and2Fastball posted:

Can Dusty Baker survive this postseason without being fired?  The Nats still have yet to win a postseason series!

JustBaseball may have the inside scoop, but I think Dusty is done in Washington.   A players manager only gets you so far. The players actually have to do something and managers actually have to manage.  I watched a lot of Nats games this year.   The Nats are loaded with talent and they should have gone farther.   

I see a lot of parallels with the Red Sox.  Managers are "people chemists" trying to find the right mix and get the most out of their players.....getting the team to perform beyond their potential.  I think John Farrell and Dusty Baker failed to get the most out of their players despite being somewhat short changed by their GMs.   The Red Sox didn't want to invest in a power slugger to replace Ortiz (should have gone with Encarnacion) because they didn't want to go over the luxury cap and the Nat's didn't want to invest in a bullpen (because they are cheap) which they were eventually forced to.  I think Dusty will follow John Farrell in looking for a new gig.   As BOF said...it is a cruel game.

As always, JMO.     

Teaching Elder posted:

"My fav player last night...Jon Jay."

 

He was instrumental in getting the Constitution ratified as well.  Truly valuable all-around guy.

The Federalist did his job!

TPM posted:

And make Jason Werth get a haircut!

Or, as he is known in my house....Captain Caveman!

NLDS ends at 1am, and ALCS begins at 8pm. Another great day of baseball!!!

fenwaysouth posted:

TPM posted:

And make Jason Werth get a haircut!

Or, as he is known in my house....Captain Caveman!

Great show.

Dusty's done.

I expect the Nat's will go after Yasmani Grandal as I think he is a FA after this season and the Dodgers have two solid replacements and will be reluctant to spend on him like the Nat's might. 

I love the Cubs / Dodger rematch. Dodgers in 6.  

Astro's / Yankees I am not sure. Astro's should win it, but Yankees are peaking at the right time, and Judge did nothing, so if he gets hot look out. 

MLB players get paid lots of money to get the job done, professionally.

Wieders-big time failure with a PB, throwing error, CI, etc.

Werth-seems to lose a lot of balls in the lights

Runner picked off in the 8th.

Gio-didn't get the job done

Max-didn't get the job done.

Are those GM issues or Dusty issues?

Dusty will pay the price, probably, but any player with a conscience knows Dusty did not lose that game. The players lost that game.

If MLB does not do something about the Cubs and trips to the mound, they will lose more and more fans.  While it was a 9-8 game, there was no pace, and it was terribly sloppy play. Frankly, it was boring to watch.

infielddad posted:

MLB players get paid lots of money to get the job done, professionally.

Wieders-big time failure with a PB, throwing error, CI, etc.

Werth-seems to lose a lot of balls in the lights

Runner picked off in the 8th.

Gio-didn't get the job done

Max-didn't get the job done.

Are those GM issues or Dusty issues?

Dusty will pay the price, probably, but any player with a conscience knows Dusty did not lose that game. The players lost that game.

If MLB does not do something about the Cubs and trips to the mound, they will lose more and more fans.  While it was a 9-8 game, there was no pace, and it was terribly sloppy play. Frankly, it was boring to watch.

 

If all of that is true, and it is, then why do Managers get paid Big $$ & get hired & fired all the time??? The margin is extremely thin & it makes a subtle difference....like in a 1 run game.....

What manager gets paid Big $$$ on a comparative scale with the players?  Wieders is getting paid $10,500 per year. Does Dusty take responsibility for his PB, CI, throwing error to 1st, etc?  Girardi was the goat about 3 days ago and now???  Did he get to be a better manager in game 5 than game 4?

Managers get hired and fired because they don't fire the players and usually don't fire the GM who gave the manager the roster.

I will use Bochy as an example.  I think the Giants have the worst record in baseball since the All Star game in 2016. (before that All Star game, they had the best record in baseball in 2016.)  Contrasted with 3 World Series rings, is the decline because of Bochy?

infielddad posted:

What manager gets paid Big $$$ on a comparative scale with the players?  Wieders is getting paid $10,500 per year. Does Dusty take responsibility for his PB, CI, throwing error to 1st, etc?  Girardi was the goat about 3 days ago and now???  Did he get to be a better manager in game 5 than game 4?

Managers get hired and fired because they don't fire the players and usually don't fire the GM who gave the manager the roster.

I will use Bochy as an example.  I think the Giants have the worst record in baseball since the All Star game in 2016. (before that All Star game, they had the best record in baseball in 2016.)  Contrasted with 3 World Series rings, is the decline because of Bochy?

I stand corrected. Have Dusty's wife manage the team next year. It's all the same...... Bill Belicheck has had no impact on the success of the New England Patriots....... What are you talking about? I agree it's on the players. They get paid to get it done & they did not get it done. The manager's job is to put them in the best position, spot, opportunity to have success. Dusty was a long way from doing that in Game 5. It's just my opinion. It mattered & if you feel his actions had no effect whatsoever you are delusional. 

" It mattered & if you feel his actions had no effect whatsoever you are delusional. "

Personally I think your getting on your "high" horse and calling others who don't agree with you "delusional" is the epitome of "Monday Morning" arrogance.  This is especially true when you don't address any of the issues pointed out with player performance in that game.  One catcher gets picked off 1b in a critical situation. The other...his lack of performance doesn't matter?

Dusty has managed at a very high level for a very long period of time. He has made mistakes for sure. Since I am a Giants fan, the removing Russ Ortiz when the Giants had the 2002 WS in a vice grip is still a vivid memory. However, the plain fact is the guys in the pen did not get their job done.

With that said, I really don't have time for arrogant and dismissive know it all types who take the fun out of the HSBBW.

infielddad posted:

" It mattered & if you feel his actions had no effect whatsoever you are delusional. "

Personally I think your getting on your "high" horse and calling others who don't agree with you "delusional" is the epitome of "Monday Morning" arrogance.  This is especially true when you don't address any of the issues pointed out with player performance in that game.  One catcher gets picked off 1b in a critical situation. The other...his lack of performance doesn't matter?

Dusty has managed at a very high level for a very long period of time. He has made mistakes for sure. Since I am a Giants fan, the removing Russ Ortiz when the Giants had the 2002 WS in a vice grip is still a vivid memory. However, the plain fact is the guys in the pen did not get their job done.

With that said, I really don't have time for arrogant and dismissive know it all types who take the fun out of the HSBBW.

 

If you would actually take the time to read the thread & my prior posts I address all of the issues with player performance you cite. I talk about Gio, Zimmerman, Werth, Wieters etc. All of them. I am simply challenging you to back up your assertion that basically, the manager has no impact & your response is that Bochy had a bad team this year & that does not make him a bad manager.. OK, we agree.

Sorry I hurt your feelings. I like to mix it up sometimes. But if you still feel that the Manager has no impact in a game like that then, yes, you are delusional. 

PS: "Delusional"; Holding impressions that are contradicted by reality or rational argument.

"If Maddon Manages the Cubs last night, they win. If Maddon Manages the Nats last night, the Nats win."

Since you are such a Maddon fan (easy to do) I guess you remember 2016 and how most felt his use of his bullpen and especially the closer managed the Cubbies right out of the WS (until  a rain delay saved them).  Maddon made judgements that got second guessed plenty. If his players don't overcome his "judgements" the Cubs are still looking for their WS rings.

Of course managers can impact games.  Umpires can impact games.  Players impact games far more than either of them.  You seem bent on making Dusty into a chump, which he isn't.  He is far too loyal to his players (a "fault" Bochy has also). He is a good manager who has won every place he has been with every type of player he is given.

Maddon is a genius today because he got a 7 out save from Wade Davis, the same approach which failed in 2016 with that closer.  Players have to perform when managers make key decisions.  The two are interconnected  

Without Wieders not getting his job done and Max not getting his job done, Dusty isn't managing from a 3-4 run deficit.  If they both get their job done, the Nats likely win and Dusty is Maddon.

Steve A. posted:

PS: "Delusional"; Holding impressions that are contradicted by reality or rational argument.

Want the definition of "arrogant?"

Looks like they should've sent Gio and Max on ahead. 

As a Nats fan, all I can say is, arrrggghhhh.

Also, I'm over Matt Wieters.  He calls a good game but is subpar defensively, and he really doesn't do all that much offensively.  Between him and .170 Jose Lobaton, I think I know the Nats' # 1 off season need.  The pair actually put up 3 singles last night, I know, but during Scherzer's inning, Wieters just killed them.  He also cost a run on Gio's wild pitch by trying to backhand a ball that has to be blocked. 

I would be interested in Dusty's explanation for why "Hey, hey, hey, it's Matt Albers" had to come out after a strong 1-2-3 inning.  I could have watched a few more of those before we started emptying the bullpen.  Plus, Matt needs the exercise.

They missed some opportunities, to be sure, but ... 8 runs is supposed to be enough to win.

Midlo Dad posted:

Looks like they should've sent Gio and Max on ahead. 

As a Nats fan, all I can say is, arrrggghhhh.

Also, I'm over Matt Wieters.  He calls a good game but is subpar defensively, and he really doesn't do all that much offensively.  Between him and .170 Jose Lobaton, I think I know the Nats' # 1 off season need.  The pair actually put up 3 singles last night, I know, but during Scherzer's inning, Wieters just killed them.  He also cost a run on Gio's wild pitch by trying to backhand a ball that has to be blocked. 

I would be interested in Dusty's explanation for why "Hey, hey, hey, it's Matt Albers" had to come out after a strong 1-2-3 inning.  I could have watched a few more of those before we started emptying the bullpen.  Plus, Matt needs the exercise.

They missed some opportunities, to be sure, but ... 8 runs is supposed to be enough to win.

I think the Albers aspect relates to Gio not getting things done before.  They had the pitchers spot coming up 1st after Albers inning and Dusty decided to pinch hit rather than let Albers hit. Pretty sure Dusty said that in one of those "wonderful" in game interviews.

infielddad posted:

"If Maddon Manages the Cubs last night, they win. If Maddon Manages the Nats last night, the Nats win."

Since you are such a Maddon fan (easy to do) I guess you remember 2016 and how most felt his use of his bullpen and especially the closer managed the Cubbies right out of the WS (until  a rain delay saved them).  Maddon made judgements that got second guessed plenty. If his players don't overcome his "judgements" the Cubs are still looking for their WS rings.

Of course managers can impact games.  Umpires can impact games.  Players impact games far more than either of them.  You seem bent on making Dusty into a chump, which he isn't.  He is far too loyal to his players (a "fault" Bochy has also). He is a good manager who has won every place he has been with every type of player he is given.

Maddon is a genius today because he got a 7 out save from Wade Davis, the same approach which failed in 2016 with that closer.  Players have to perform when managers make key decisions.  The two are interconnected  

Without Wieders not getting his job done and Max not getting his job done, Dusty isn't managing from a 3-4 run deficit.  If they both get their job done, the Nats likely win and Dusty is Maddon.

Now you are talking my friend! Absolutely correct! You are not accurate, however,  in suggesting that I am trying to lay this all on Dusty or trash Dusty & / or love Maddon. I just feel that Maddon is more instinct driven & that plays better in these big games. Does it always work?, no. If the Nats win are we talking about Dusty?, no. This is what makes the game so cool. You can always pull it apart after the fact & it has soooo many dimensions.

Does Wieters feel like he is 100% responsible this AM for the loss? Yes. Does Scherzer? yes. Does Gio? yes. Does Werth wish he caught the liner,? Yes. Does Dusty wish he started Roark? Yes

If Dusty does a couple obvious things differently ( Start Roark, not Gio; Pull Gio after 2; hit Murphy cleanup after Harper) & would it have made the difference? Probably, but we will never really know.

Is 95% of the game the players? Yes! Chip in 5% for the Manager & the Home plate umpire strike zone. If they lose by 10 runs the 5% is irrelevant, but by 1 run it is often the difference.

"Arrogant": Having an exaggerated sense of one's own importance or abilities .........Well I don't feel all that important when I post anonymous messages on this site but I am confident that I have thought through my position.

Gloves off. Have a good weekend. Tell Bumgarner to lay off the motocross in the offseason.

"Well I don't feel all that important when I post anonymous messages on this site but I am confident that I have thought through my position."

My view is if you had thought your position through, you wouldn't have posted the Nats win with Maddon or that anything you say is "probable.".  Is it possible they would? Sure because anything is possible. However, he almost managed his team into the toilet in 2016, also, just as some posted Girardi did earlier this week.

Nothing about sitting in the easy chair, not having been with that team and those players since February, makes anything we say on this board "probable."

For those watching the ALCS tonight, Astros have a lot of young stars.  Of course, Altuve, Correa, Springer, Keuchel, Mccullers, Bregman.

Bregman may be a better defensive SS than Correa.  

But watch Marwin Gonzalez.  Led team in RBI's. Switch hitter.  A better Ben Zobrist.  Multiple positions. Allows a team to go after an available free agent b/c of his flexibility.  Also allows a team to carry an extra pitcher.

Games by position

As I've said before, if you are at the end of your rope with your team's performance, Astros have a 10 year run in them.  Plenty of room.

And remember the names Forrest Whitley and Kyle Tucker.

The Milwaukee Brewers wave "thank you" to the Astros for Brett Phillips, Josh Hader, Domingo Santana, and Adrian Houser.  Hope you enjoy Mike Fiers and enjoyed your one sub/par season of Carlos Gomez.

oh, and thanks for David Stearns, too....

3and2Fastball posted:

The Milwaukee Brewers wave "thank you" to the Astros for Brett Phillips, Josh Hader, Domingo Santana, and Adrian Houser.  Hope you enjoy Mike Fiers and enjoyed your one sub/par season of Carlos Gomez.

oh, and thanks for David Stearns, too....

 

Those guys were just in the way in the minors.

But the no hitter tho...

3and2Fastball posted:

The Milwaukee Brewers wave "thank you" to the Astros for Brett Phillips, Josh Hader, Domingo Santana, and Adrian Houser.  Hope you enjoy Mike Fiers and enjoyed your one sub/par season of Carlos Gomez.

oh, and thanks for David Stearns, too....

 

You mean David "I can guess your password" Stearns?

Wow.

Steve A. posted:

infielddad posted:

"If Maddon Manages the Cubs last night, they win. If Maddon Manages the Nats last night, the Nats win."

Since you are such a Maddon fan (easy to do) I guess you remember 2016 and how most felt his use of his bullpen and especially the closer managed the Cubbies right out of the WS (until  a rain delay saved them).  Maddon made judgements that got second guessed plenty. If his players don't overcome his "judgements" the Cubs are still looking for their WS rings.

Of course managers can impact games.  Umpires can impact games.  Players impact games far more than either of them.  You seem bent on making Dusty into a chump, which he isn't.  He is far too loyal to his players (a "fault" Bochy has also). He is a good manager who has won every place he has been with every type of player he is given.

Maddon is a genius today because he got a 7 out save from Wade Davis, the same approach which failed in 2016 with that closer.  Players have to perform when managers make key decisions.  The two are interconnected  

Without Wieders not getting his job done and Max not getting his job done, Dusty isn't managing from a 3-4 run deficit.  If they both get their job done, the Nats likely win and Dusty is Maddon.

Now you are talking my friend! Absolutely correct! You are not accurate, however,  in suggesting that I am trying to lay this all on Dusty or trash Dusty & / or love Maddon. I just feel that Maddon is more instinct driven & that plays better in these big games. Does it always work?, no. If the Nats win are we talking about Dusty?, no. This is what makes the game so cool. You can always pull it apart after the fact & it has soooo many dimensions.

Does Wieters feel like he is 100% responsible this AM for the loss? Yes. Does Scherzer? yes. Does Gio? yes. Does Werth wish he caught the liner,? Yes. Does Dusty wish he started Roark? Yes

If Dusty does a couple obvious things differently ( Start Roark, not Gio; Pull Gio after 2; hit Murphy cleanup after Harper) & would it have made the difference? Probably, but we will never really know.

Is 95% of the game the players? Yes! Chip in 5% for the Manager & the Home plate umpire strike zone. If they lose by 10 runs the 5% is irrelevant, but by 1 run it is often the difference.

"Arrogant": Having an exaggerated sense of one's own importance or abilities .........Well I don't feel all that important when I post anonymous messages on this site but I am confident that I have thought through my position.

Gloves off. Have a good weekend. Tell Bumgarner to lay off the motocross in the offseason.

How is starting roark obvious? He probably is a worse pitcher than gonzalez (who isn't great either)

Problem of the nats is depth. They have great stars but then they run out scrubs  like difo, wieters or taylor (and a cheap bullpen). The trend is going towards depth and not stars and scrubs.

Hitters are currently cheap as dirt in mlb (compared to pitchers) and the nats should have capitalized on that.

But also people shouldn't overstate a playoff series by interpreting it with stuff like will to win bla bla. A playoff series is mostly random and winning it is mostly pure chance with  only a tiny edge.

Lots of game left....

but Keuchel pretty

Go44dad posted:

Lots of game left....

but Keuchel pretty

And Altuve with a web gem! Wow

As we say in Houston...

MarWIN!  

Same exact play vs Red Sox

Go44dad posted:

As we say in Houston...

MarWIN!  

Same exact play vs Red Sox

That was a laser to the GA boy McCann!

East Coast, your welcome. 3:20 game. You're in bed earlier than EST 7:00 starts. 

Stros v Dodgers would be nice... tired of Maddon this and Maddon that! 

Or Yankees v Dodgers?