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Data is only as good as the individual inputting it.  This is the way of the future.  Companies are depending on statistical data more and more.  PG is entering a very manual human touch area.  It will have issues.  It will be interesting to see where it goes in the future.  How will they eliminate the errors of the human keeping score.  Can they eliminate some or all.  It will be very expensive to try and control the x's that have an impact on the y desired output.  But when it gets there it will be very useful to all if the hey want to understand it.  

old_school posted:
Shoveit4Ks posted:

Our fields at Kennesaw Mountain got beat up in the summer but i think was staffed appropriately and the scoreboard was on ( i hope) for all games. Our kids got paid to do their jobs while there. That PG money was nice for the program and the kids in the summer. Another cool thing about playing NBS baseball back then was we always played our remote games there and didn't have to travel to other fields with lacking conditions. 

I think it's fine for folks to complain on here, just don't get too personal and no attacks. It's the internet, lots of tough guys around. People will be blocked and banned if they aren't playing nice.

Oh yeah, i saw my son hit 95 at Lakepoint in a HS tourney (i think) and they only put in 94 for the event. I didn't email anyone. Had they, i think he would have had the highest velo there that week. I don't believe that would have mattered at all even in his Percentile ranking for velo.

That's a large bucket of water being carried CaCo.....don't sprain your arm. 

The hardest part about managing is managing your people, some folks care more about their jobs than others and the quality of work reflects that. I hope PG is working on improving the scoring, after all you cannot pitch and sell the benefits of data if you cannot enter the data correctly. 

if only I knew how to add the clapping hands emoji here. this is well said and fair.

Shoveit4Ks posted:

Our fields at Kennesaw Mountain got beat up in the summer but i think was staffed appropriately and the scoreboard was on ( i hope) for all games. Our kids got paid to do their jobs while there. That PG money was nice for the program and the kids in the summer. Another cool thing about playing NBS baseball back then was we always played our remote games there and didn't have to travel to other fields with lacking conditions. 

I think it's fine for folks to complain on here, just don't get too personal and no attacks. It's the internet, lots of tough guys around. People will be blocked and banned if they aren't playing nice.

Oh yeah, i saw my son hit 95 at Lakepoint in a HS tourney (i think) and they only put in 94 for the event. I didn't email anyone. Had they, i think he would have had the highest velo there that week. I don't believe that would have mattered at all even in his Percentile ranking for velo.

That's a large bucket of water being carried CaCo.....don't sprain your arm. 

The hardest part about managing is managing your people, some folks care more about their jobs than others and the quality of work reflects that. I hope PG is working on improving the scoring, after all you cannot pitch and sell the benefits of data if you cannot enter the data correctly. 

Shoveit4ks, great points.  One thing: Would you have emailed someone (or been upset) if your son got 83 mphs for an entire half inning when his actual velo was 95?  That's basically the differential that happened.  

McLoven, love the handle. 

Probably. Back then (insert Old Geezer talk here) i cared alot more about velo, pitches, Ks and what other people thought about my kid. Now i focus on supporting him 100% and doing a sh*&ton of listening...frankly only talking baseball when he wants to talk baseball.

83 could implicate injury, pain or a tired arm if it was the high velo for the event and he was typically 93-95. I would try to clear that up. Those things could snowball. 

 

Shoveit4Ks posted:

McLoven, love the handle. 

Probably. Back then (insert Old Geezer talk here) i cared alot more about velo, pitches, Ks and what other people thought about my kid. Now i focus on supporting him 100% and doing a sh*&ton of listening...frankly only talking baseball when he wants to talk baseball.

83 could implicate injury, pain or a tired arm if it was the high velo for the event and he was typically 93-95. I would try to clear that up. Those things could snowball. 

 

Thanks man!  Yep, totally agree.  I had friends texting me during the game, asking me what was wrong.  Very frustrating.  

mcloven posted:
Shoveit4Ks posted:

Our fields at Kennesaw Mountain got beat up in the summer but i think was staffed appropriately and the scoreboard was on ( i hope) for all games. Our kids got paid to do their jobs while there. That PG money was nice for the program and the kids in the summer. Another cool thing about playing NBS baseball back then was we always played our remote games there and didn't have to travel to other fields with lacking conditions. 

I think it's fine for folks to complain on here, just don't get too personal and no attacks. It's the internet, lots of tough guys around. People will be blocked and banned if they aren't playing nice.

Oh yeah, i saw my son hit 95 at Lakepoint in a HS tourney (i think) and they only put in 94 for the event. I didn't email anyone. Had they, i think he would have had the highest velo there that week. I don't believe that would have mattered at all even in his Percentile ranking for velo.

That's a large bucket of water being carried CaCo.....don't sprain your arm. 

The hardest part about managing is managing your people, some folks care more about their jobs than others and the quality of work reflects that. I hope PG is working on improving the scoring, after all you cannot pitch and sell the benefits of data if you cannot enter the data correctly. 

Shoveit4ks, great points.  One thing: Would you have emailed someone (or been upset) if your son got 83 mphs for an entire half inning when his actual velo was 95?  That's basically the differential that happened.  

This was not at LP but I got to witness a pitcher, cruising at 80-83, get credit for a FB at 93. The result of a perfectly placed foul ball into the radar. Everyone, including the pitcher got a good laugh.

Nobody is getting recruited solely on their PG profile or one outing. The coaches trust their own eyes and instincts as their livelihood depends on it.

Will they take referrals from coaches or scouts? Do they use data from showcases? Sure, most have no idea how much information college coaches actually share! If they like someone and don't have room, they will pass the info to other coaches at all levels of college ball. 

It's really up to the player and the parents to get the players information and desire to play college baseball out to the schools they are interested in. You have no idea just how many showcase players actually have no desire to play ball in college......................it seems strange but some are ready to become engineers, doctors, ect.

Furthermore, college coaches know the difference between a scouting report and a news article. News articles are to make the players and parents feel warm and fuzzy. Take stats and data with a grain of salt as it's all in production supported by amateurs.

I’m finding this entire thread amusing. For many years some of the posters to this thread have repeatedly said things about how useless HS stats were, the reasons for it, and how they meant nothing to scouts. All of a sudden the stats aren’t so useless to scouts even though the same reasons they weren’t to be trusted are there.

 All that’s happened is PG is suffering from the same thing every organization that goes from a small local one to a huge national one suffers from. It’s impossible to maintain the quality no matter how hard they try.

 As far as statistics go, we’re right in the middle of a big change in attitudes. All of a sudden the numbers that meant nothing, now mean something. Unfortunately, while the means to gather the data necessary to create those numbers has come a long way, the wrench in the gears is still the same as before, and that’s the person doing the scoring. Unlike umpires who generally belong to some kind of association that trains and tests them, SKs are hit and miss with any training and oversight being hit and miss as well.

 People are beginning to figger out that just because someone played or coached the game at a high level, they aren’t qualified to accurately score a game and make sure the data gets correctly input into whatever system is being used. Where the umpire’s time invested in a game is pretty much restricted to the time between starting and ending the game, if the scorer’s trying to do a really good job, s/he’s got to not only verify the game was scored correctly, s/he’s got to verify the data has been entered correctly. Lemme tell ya, that takes time! So to me it’s not surprising there’s issues with the numbers.

STATS,

I agree with almost everything you have to say, except for two things.  We do expect to maintain quality.  The stats on player profiles is done more for the parents and players.  They may choose to use them or not.  Yes we do need to make sure they are as accurate as possible.  However, there is not a college coach or MLB scout that will make a decision based on stats.  That doesn't mean the stats are unimportant, but we have seen future first rounders go 0 for tournament and we have seen tournament MVP's that had trouble finding a DI program that is interested.  Then again, we are the largest scouting service in baseball and we do keep track of stats, so we do think it can be important at times.

Still, if we are going to display them they need to be accurate.  That for sure is important and we are making too many mistakes.  Our goal is to fix that and we have a plan.  Also there is no excuse for entering the wrong velocity.  That is extremely important to scouts and coaches.  We simply won't allow that to happen.  No recorded velocity is better than the wrong velocity.

BackPick,

You make some good points, but we sure are far from amateur.  We have and have had many former MLB scouts and College Coaches that work for us.  We have also trained and lost many of our scouts to MLB Clubs.  We take great pride in our player rankings which have proven to be very accurate for some two decades.  Not sure you meant it that way, but I think the industry considers us something more than amateurs. We do have nearly every MLB club that subscribes to our scouting service as do most of the DI programs. 

I'm sure it is possible, but I am surprised by a foul ball being listed when it was much higher than normal.  That is extremely rare.  Actually have spent many hours explaining that "son" didn't really throw one pitch 10 mph better than all other pitches, it was off the bat.  Also at LP we have trackman and it doesn't usually make mistakes.  Is that pitcher listed FB range 80-93?  That alone would tell me something is wrong.  Same goes for 80-83/93.  Something is definitely wrong.  Usually these things get corrected before they are actually posted.  Anyway, we do have some work to do finding more good scorekeepers.  

I'm not here to make excuses, we need to improve.  We need to do better.  We expect better.  Some of these complaints are legitimate.  Some seem more like... here is an opportunity to pile on.

BTW, I don't consider the two posts I just responded to as piling on at all.  Just wanted to give my opinion.  Which on here these days seems to not be worth a whole lot.

I have to agree with Jerry,  stats in tournaments is more important for parents than scouts and coaches. Thats why they use radar guns and stop watches. Thats why they come to watch yoy play.

Will tell you what happened to a coach that I know. This summer he went to watch a player that he was told had pretty good velocity. This was info given by the coach he contacted before the tourney.  It wasnt true. Although it was a delayed game, he could tell that the player really didnt even have the stuff that would justify further interest. And it wasn't all about velocity.

Coaches know what they are looking for and know it when they see it. 

If you are unhappy with the product, dont buy it. Jerry has told you that he knows they have to do better. 

In all my years here I have never seen a bigger bunch of unhappy campers. The problems brought up here arent new ones, but for some strange reason most get pretty good opportunities to play college ball, despite issues.

Give coaches and scouts credit, most know what they are lokking for and dont need all of that fancy stuff to spot a good player.

 

Here's the thing: while Perfect Game is not perfect, and the industry is indeed expensive, it is a far better format than what existed 20 years ago. Kids back then from non-Baseball hotbeds were hopelessly behind. Even more disturbing was that, especially in non-Baseball hotbeds, you had to go through an area scout middle man to get recruited or drafted and while not all of those area scouts were corrupt, a whole bunch of them were.

Now, yes it is true in 1997 just like in 1987 and 1927, if you were a slam dunk stud who threw 90+ you were gonna get drafted whether or not you wanted to kiss the scout's you know what or pay him off or promise a piece of your signing bonus (yes that kinda thing happened, I was there, saw it plenty and more). But if you were a mid-major D1 prospect or a potential 11th Round pick, you had to play ball with the middle man or get left behind.

Perfect Game eliminated the middle man. If you throw 93 or can run 6.7 you can show up, prove it and use your PG profile to contact colleges yourself. That is completely different than the way it used to be.

"Perfect Game" and the models that sprung up around it (PBR, Area Codes, Etc) are far far better than what existed before.

my Kid has his strengths and weaknesses. He has a lot he needs to improve on. But I feel confident that by doing PG, PBR, and travel ball he has a much better chance of winding up where he deserves than if it was 1995 and I had to hope and role the dice that the one middle man dude that I had to pay off actually liked him or didn't hate me or had some other rich guy or five who paid him off more.

if there are mistakes with DiamondKast, they'll correct them.  In 1993 if the middle man in Wisconsin or Idaho or Wyoming didn't like you for whatever reason you were mostly you know what out of luck.

I think it is good to push people and companies to do better, but let's have some perspective here please... Things are much better than they used to be....

PGStaff posted:

Stats,

Have any idea where we could find a couple hundred scorekeepers like you?

What about umpires?  Wouldn't they know the rules?  Some can't physically do the job anymore but they still love the game.  $50 a game to sweat and get hit by foul balls or $30 a game to input plays?  I know what I would pick.

TPM: In all my years here I have never seen a bigger bunch of unhappy campers. The problems brought up here arent new ones, but for some strange reason most get pretty good opportunities to play college ball, despite issues.

I haven't been around here long enough to have witnessed the changes in posters' attitudes that I  read about from the vets who've attained Free Agent status, so I can't tell you every possible reason why you're sensing so many "unhappy campers."

I think, though, that there is one overarching reason for folks' unhappiness re: recruiting, and I don't think it's ANYONE'S FAULT.

What frustrates me and, I think, a lot of others: the $$$$$ end of the recruiting "game," especially for kids who fancy themselves D1 players, but may not be.  I'm sure I'm not going over any new ground here, so forgive me for rehashing this stuff.  (I appreciate the advice of finding someone objective to evaluate my kid, but in my neck of the woods, that's a lot easier said than done.)

However, as I pay my bills each month, I think about recruiting costs a lot and whenever PG bashing comes up, or parking fees at Lakepoint are dissed, or $600/day showcases are bemoaned, I think about it even more, and I try to understand my own behaviors and reaction.

At the risk of annoying everyone, I want to use PG as an example.  AGAIN.  PG has a business model that works, apparently, and is constantly tweaking its product to try to make it better and, whatever anyone thinks about its quality, it's the biggest game in town.  Fair enough.

What contributes to my frustration, however, is the sense I have that if my kid doesn't do a PG Showcase, then I'm somehow endangering his baseball options, NO MATTER WHAT LEVEL OF PLAY I think he's at. My rational self says that's doubtful, but my emotional self asks, "Don't you love your kid?"

I think Jerry has several times said on this board that PG was really designed for D-1 and draftable guys.  What happens, though, is a lot of wannabe D1 guys use it as a direct attempt to get in the D1 door, even if their skills may not be at that level, i.e., can I get a high enough rating, maybe even a 9, to jumpstart my college search?  And, I suspect, a lot of guys use PG, if not to get a shot at the keys to the D-1 kingdom, then just to really see where they stand.  It's an expensive way to determine that, but so is HF, Showball, and Stanford, etc.  And PG has the distinct advantage of posting objective info for all to see.

So, to be almost completely transparent (this is a blog, after all), my oldest decided HF, Stanford, and AZ Fall Classics were better uses of time and $ than PG, primarily because coaches from schools he wanted to attend were guaranteed to be at those events. They may have also been at PG events but he couldn't tell.  But at the events he went to, the coaches could see him play with their own eyes, and could gather the measurables if they wanted them.   Not doing PG has always nagged at me because I will always wonder what his rating might have been, and I will also wonder if some random coach, looking randomly through the stats, might randomly pick his name out from a lot of other random names.  I have no way of knowing.

And now my 2019 is at the beginning of the recruiting reel and this whole square dance of self doubt begins all over again.  No one is to blame but the $ is painful.  No one is making us do any of this recruiting stuff, except that he wants to play college ball and he's not  6'4" and throwing 95.  If spending all the $ doesn't work out, I can imagine the disappointment, even anger, a family might feel.

 

smokeminside posted:

TPM: In all my years here I have never seen a bigger bunch of unhappy campers. The problems brought up here arent new ones, but for some strange reason most get pretty good opportunities to play college ball, despite issues.

I haven't been around here long enough to have witnessed the changes in posters' attitudes that I  read about from the vets who've attained Free Agent status, so I can't tell you every possible reason why you're sensing so many "unhappy campers."

I think, though, that there is one overarching reason for folks' unhappiness re: recruiting, and I don't think it's ANYONE'S FAULT.

What frustrates me and, I think, a lot of others: the $$$$$ end of the recruiting "game," especially for kids who fancy themselves D1 players, but may not be.  I'm sure I'm not going over any new ground here, so forgive me for rehashing this stuff.  (I appreciate the advice of finding someone objective to evaluate my kid, but in my neck of the woods, that's a lot easier said than done.)

However, as I pay my bills each month, I think about recruiting costs a lot and whenever PG bashing comes up, or parking fees at Lakepoint are dissed, or $600/day showcases are bemoaned, I think about it even more, and I try to understand my own behaviors and reaction.

At the risk of annoying everyone, I want to use PG as an example.  AGAIN.  PG has a business model that works, apparently, and is constantly tweaking its product to try to make it better and, whatever anyone thinks about its quality, it's the biggest game in town.  Fair enough.

What contributes to my frustration, however, is the sense I have that if my kid doesn't do a PG Showcase, then I'm somehow endangering his baseball options, NO MATTER WHAT LEVEL OF PLAY I think he's at. My rational self says that's doubtful, but my emotional self asks, "Don't you love your kid?"

I think Jerry has several times said on this board that PG was really designed for D-1 and draftable guys.  What happens, though, is a lot of wannabe D1 guys use it as a direct attempt to get in the D1 door, even if their skills may not be at that level, i.e., can I get a high enough rating, maybe even a 9, to jumpstart my college search?  And, I suspect, a lot of guys use PG, if not to get a shot at the keys to the D-1 kingdom, then just to really see where they stand.  It's an expensive way to determine that, but so is HF, Showball, and Stanford, etc.  And PG has the distinct advantage of posting objective info for all to see.

So, to be almost completely transparent (this is a blog, after all), my oldest decided HF, Stanford, and AZ Fall Classics were better uses of time and $ than PG, primarily because coaches from schools he wanted to attend were guaranteed to be at those events. They may have also been at PG events but he couldn't tell.  But at the events he went to, the coaches could see him play with their own eyes, and could gather the measurables if they wanted them.   Not doing PG has always nagged at me because I will always wonder what his rating might have been, and I will also wonder if some random coach, looking randomly through the stats, might randomly pick his name out from a lot of other random names.  I have no way of knowing.

And now my 2019 is at the beginning of the recruiting reel and this whole square dance of self doubt begins all over again.  No one is to blame but the $ is painful.  No one is making us do any of this recruiting stuff, except that he wants to play college ball and he's not  6'4" and throwing 95.  If spending all the $ doesn't work out, I can imagine the disappointment, even anger, a family might feel.

 

First, you hit on a good point. These events are not for everyone.  You don't have to attend to get a college scholarship, what you do have to do is target the right programs for your ability, degree and economic needs.  That requires work.

Of course if your son is a stud, draftable, it's easier. Everyone wants a stud. But that doesn't always mean success. 

Definetly attend a showcase, but only when you are ready. You don't need to attend every year or everyone. Attend a prospect camp after you establish relationships. You dont have to attend every one you get invites to.

People are complaining about score keepers not taking down the right scores, velo not recorded properly, paying too much for parking and concession stand prices.  It's all relevant, everyone has done it, but I hear more complaining than ever and I have been here for a very long time. These things come with the territory. Attend smaller events. Talk to your travel coaches with your concerns.  

If anyone thinks that this stupid stuff is going to stop a coach or scout from identifying talent, they are wrong. Unfortunately it may not be the coach you want to love you.  Be realistic.

People spend way too much money they don't have. Save your money for college, it's expensive. Very. For what? 25%? Go where they will give you 60, 70 even 100% in athletic or combined merit based or just on merit.  Be the big fish in the small pond, rather than the small fish in the big pond.

Not everyone is 6'4" and throws 95, I agree, but everyone wants to play for the best programs in the country. More than likely it isnt going to happen. Try to steer them in the right direction from the get go, not target programs that don't apply before it's too late,  now folks find reason to find that it's someone else's fault because no one is knocking down your door.  Do your homework and share it with your player. Be realistic. Dont blame poor scorekeeping on lack of interest.

Teach your kids the importance of  getting a college education, not going to the CWS. Sure that's nice, but it's not all that important in the grand scheme of things.

JMO

Last edited by TPM

I am new to this board, and it appears that there is good discourse occurring and that perhaps my point of view may be valued. 

Clearly it appears that there are grievances by people with the money that seems to be a necessity to spend in the process of getting your son recruited or drafted. I don't have a daughter, but I am sure it is the same in women's sports as well, but we are on a baseball forum and appear to have the ear of the industry leader, so perhaps this feedback will resonate.

What I am hearing on this particular thread is that there are problems with the statistics being input correctly into a system, or lack of knowledge on scorekeepers part in getting this information correct. If that is the case, and there is any potential for that misleading or erroneous information in some way to impact a young athlete's future, I would hope that any financial gains a company may have forecast by doing this is measured against the potential harm (and perhaps financial loss) an athlete could potentially suffer as a result of it being made part of a publicly available record. I'm not a lawyer, but I have to think there is a measure of vulnerability on Perfect Games part here. Again, not a lawyer, but I am pragmatic and risk averse in my profession.

I am not sure who said it above, but it appears the old school days of recruiting and draft included basic corruption (see Adidas and NCAA basketball). Pay the middle man to get looks. I guess I see that the middle man has taken on a different form now. Not that the services provided aren't legitimate or lacking of value, but these services like Headfirst, Showball, Prospectwire, PBR, and Perfect Game all fill the same role: pay for opportunities to be seen and to have your chances improve to get looks. So, the middleman did not go away, he got a business plan, a Tax ID and rich.

Another poster wrote that as parents we have an emotional need to try to provide the most/best opportunities for our children to find success. I agree on this, and if I had a dollar for every dollar I spent on Power Rangers toys and laser tag I would be even mathematically. If I denied my kid those things, I would feel that I cheated them on an emotional level. The creme always rises to the top, easy to discern the best of the best. But that leaves Thousand and Thousand of parents and children to basically battle for the left overs,

I see both sides of this argument, I truly do. I don't blame these companies for seeing a market ripe for the picking and taking advantage of that. But I also don't blame people for getting sick of it, and in turn complaining. It's natural, it's part of life to complain about a boss, a spouse, or a system that takes considerable resources to participate in. I've seen some posts on here chastise those who bring their complaints into this forum. Then I see the discuss evolve and now we are really communicating. We don't all have the same level of disposable income. I have never been to Lakepoint, but I question why a parent has to pay to park and then pay to enter to see their own child participate in a game that they already paid a fairly steep entry fee for. I can understand that criticism, I don't chastise it. Is it necessary to charge these fees? Is it the industry standard? I have no arguments paying to see the Cubs at Wrigley. They are professionals. I do think paying to see my own child someday before they graduate high school, get a license or shave is "piling on."

This is probably not the way to go with my first post, I understand that Perfect Game is a large part of these forums. But I just feel that there is communication occurring and it is being ignored in a regard. College recruiting is out of control, from college camps to showcases and tournaments. You hear more people complaining because more people are over it. 

Last edited by Chicago643
CaCO3Girl posted:
PGStaff posted:

Stats,

Have any idea where we could find a couple hundred scorekeepers like you?

What about umpires?  Wouldn't they know the rules?  Some can't physically do the job anymore but they still love the game.  $50 a game to sweat and get hit by foul balls or $30 a game to input plays?  I know what I would pick.

I can't speak for all, but many are like me--I don't concern myself with scoring rules. I may have read them end-to-end exactly once, and only look at them when someone asks me a question out of courtesy. They aren't taught in any umpire curriculum because, frankly, they have no importance in umpiring.

That being said, if for some reason I were to find myself unable to umpire, I would love to replace it with something like this and would have no problem diving into that chapter of the book.

Matt13, I think that maybe the fact that people can see the same thing and interpret it two different ways is what makes baseball so frustrating, yet so wonderful at the same time. The strategy involved in baseball is among the most complex of any sport. The decisions of coaches will always be questioned if they aren't successful. A call by an umpire is always wrong, depending which dugout you are sitting in. A scorekeeper has a guideline that leaves many scoring calls open to the scorer's interpretation. It's precisely imprecise, and maddeningly addictive.

Chicago643 posted:

Matt13, I think that maybe the fact that people can see the same thing and interpret it two different ways is what makes baseball so frustrating, yet so wonderful at the same time. The strategy involved in baseball is among the most complex of any sport. The decisions of coaches will always be questioned if they aren't successful. A call by an umpire is always wrong, depending which dugout you are sitting in. A scorekeeper has a guideline that leaves many scoring calls open to the scorer's interpretation. It's precisely imprecise, and maddeningly addictive.

I have often said it's a sport for masochists. It's a game defined by failure.

I think what is frustrating to so many parents is the level of separation from mid level D1's to high level D3's is much smaller then most people realize until after they have been through it once. I throw out the top 50 or even 75 because I think that kind of separates.

I know many kids from the 15, 16, 17 classes and much of what separates many of them is a coaches perspective. In my area there are at least 2 D2 schools who hands down would be favorites over every D1 in the state minus one or 2. There are several D3 schools that are just better then plenty of D2 schools...it varies from programs to program.

Parents aren't ready for that, they don't understand it and honestly can't comprehend it but IMO it is pretty accurate. Then they watch little jimmy down the street is getting offered D1 by so an so and they get bitter at the process. PG is at the forefront of the process for many people...they collect a tremendous amount of money for being at the forefront....criticism, even is not always fair goes with the territory.

smokeminside posted:

 

What contributes to my frustration, however, is the sense I have that if my kid doesn't do a PG Showcase, then I'm somehow endangering his baseball options, NO MATTER WHAT LEVEL OF PLAY I think he's at. My rational self says that's doubtful, but my emotional self asks, "Don't you love your kid?"

What happens, though, is a lot of wannabe D1 guys use it as a direct attempt to get in the D1 door, even if their skills may not be at that level, i.e., can I get a high enough rating, maybe even a 9, to jumpstart my college search?   

This.

The Showcases are the thing to do, i just couldn't fathom spending $695 when i knew my son wasn't fast, tall or a power hitter. 

The moaners & complainers on here so remind me of the Jr high girls in the lunchroom bi***ing abt little Johnny dancing with Betty Sue, then making out with Lucy Lou! FOLKS, TAKE OFF THE ROSE COLORED GLASSES! Yep, I'm shouting! Get out of the EGO, be realistic! Your son in all likelihood is NOT the next Aaron Judge or Nolan Ryan, or I sharo Suzukl, or ... He likely is NOT that ELITE College player, either.  Perfect Game or any other recruiting service may not be the way to go. Do your homework,  folks.  But all you "7th grade gals" need to grow up. A much more professional approach on ANY scoring issues would be directly with the source. PG is able and willing to make the adjustment. They're human!      'nough said. 

I hate that I contributed to this thread early on. It took a sour tone  

I love PG and will continue to fund my son’s team participation the next couple years.  Growing up in New England, I’ve seen 100s of fields WAY better than my former high school field, and most HS fields in N. GA are better than the Div II & III fields I was on.

Yes, occasionally the satillite fields are relatively,  sub par, however the least desireable field we’ve played on was vs a TX team with B Witt Jr.  A working scoreboards would be nice and the ability to buy a drink, but not a deal breaker. Maybe PG should only use fields with working scoreboards and tell coaches scoreboards are available   and may be operated by either team supplying a opererator.  I know I’d volunteer just to get away from the blowhards in the stands.

I love the season and game stats added on player profiles, and having followed PG for a couple years on GC, I’m confident the scorers will get it right, as GC was scored well enough.  The primary issue I hear from other parents is $40 per year for inaccurate stats is dissapointing, but very few care about requesting scoring edits or taking the time to request an info change from PG. I think if DK was free the complaints and expectations would be much less, IMO.  I don’t mind paying the $40, as I know it will get better.

 

When there were scoring problems at my son's games they were associated with substitutions that were probably not sufficiently communicated to the scorer (in one instance there were consecutive pinch hitters and then a pinch runner for one of the hitters...this caused the rest of the inning to get out of synch).  I think that part of the solution is that the coaches and umpire have to take the time to make sure that substitutions are clearly communicated and deal with the fact that this will slow the game down just a bit.

baseballmom posted:

The moaners & complainers on here so remind me of the Jr high girls in the lunchroom bi***ing abt little Johnny dancing with Betty Sue, then making out with Lucy Lou! FOLKS, TAKE OFF THE ROSE COLORED GLASSES! Yep, I'm shouting! Get out of the EGO, be realistic! Your son in all likelihood is NOT the next Aaron Judge or Nolan Ryan, or I sharo Suzukl, or ... He likely is NOT that ELITE College player, either.  Perfect Game or any other recruiting service may not be the way to go. Do your homework,  folks.  But all you "7th grade gals" need to grow up. A much more professional approach on ANY scoring issues would be directly with the source. PG is able and willing to make the adjustment. They're human!      'nough said. 

Baseballmom, I appreciate your willingness to continue the conversation, but let's keep it civil. Your son was one of the creme of the crop, seems to have had a great deal of success in baseball according to your profile. The fact of the matter is a very small percentage of players meet the definition of elite. But there are more opportunities to play at the college level than just the top programs like TCU, Florida, etc. I just think that trying to shout down dissenting point of views because that wasn't your experience is not helpful. Your son probably had a radically different experience with college recruiting based on the years he was being recruited (sounds like he may have been recruited around early 2000's). It is a different game now, and to discount people's feelings and opinions about a process that is cash intensive is not fair just because that wasn't your experience.

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