SS/SP

Around here I've only seen two way players play OF or first if they r P too.

My son committed in late July.  When the RC first called him this summer, he told my son he was looking at him as a pitcher.  After seeing my son play the next 3 weeks...both at P and SS/2B, he was impressed enough that when he made the offer he said "I still like you as a P, but you'll get every chance to earn an IF spot if that's what you want"....so I guess they aren't completely against it.  We'll see next fall how it works out.  He does play SS and P in HS...but his time at P has been limited the past 2 seasons.  He'll be at SS again next year...but also counted on more as a P than he has been in the past, so we'll have to talk to the HS coach to make sure he's going to be willing to make sure he isn't overused by playing both spots.

Most coaches worry about to the toll on the player's arm.  It's hard to make those throws from the hole the day after pitching, and you risk injury whenever you ask your body to go above and beyond.  Most of the 2-way guys I've seen end up at 1B or DH.

 

But it's been done at SS.  Buster Posey's years at FSU come to mind.

When my oldest was in HS, the last four years, all of the SP's were starters at another position.  They only had 1 PO.  This year, the team has 3 PO's but all of the other starters are starting/playing another position.  It is very common in HS, but changes for the upper level travel teams during summer.

 

My son was a pitcher shortstop in high school until he was switched to the outfield. The third baseman was also a pitcher. Another outfielder pitched. The rest were pitchers only. This was over three years and three classes of baseball players. What the coach wouldn't do is remove a pitcher from the game and put him back in the field. He didn't want him cooling down then cutting loose a hard, and possibly off balance throw from their position. 

Assuming you're talking as a HS parent, I wouldn't have a big issue with it. If I was a HS coach I would avoid it if I could.  The SS gets so many more chances than anybody else on the field (ah, finally, a use for Stat's HS numbers) so I think you do better if the same player is there every game rather than your #1 SS spending half his time on the bump, plus he's getting all his practice time there rather than doing pens and running foulpoles with the pitchers.

 

Edited to say that I do agree that putting a kid at SS in the 7th after he's pitched 6 innings is not smart, and that I agree that a kid who pitched Weds may not be ready to play SS on Friday, so for that reason a coach might want to flip-flop his starters accordingly.

As far as HS, I see starting pitchers play the field often. For lot and lots of schools those that are best pitchers are best hitters and fielders as well. Not for all, of course, but for the majority I would bet those SP are in top 8 and both the coach and the player want player to be on the field when not pitching.

 

For my son he played 3B when not pitching but our SP his senior year were 1B, CF, PO and him, year before it was him (3B), PO, RF, 2B. Lots of teams we played the SS was one of main pitchers.

 

As for college, totally different story. Much like Buckeye son, mine was told he would have an opportunity to be a 2 way player or at least prove he could hit as well as being a pitcher. They did tell him it was very very difficult to do both and thier experience was that those that did never reached full potential at either one, but they had had a 2 way player who graduated 2 years ago, that it did work out. He is a freshman just figuring it out and his coaches figuring him out. I asked him this weekend how it was going and he was very excited about how his pitching was going and what they were working on and how he was getting better in those areas. I asked him about hitting and he said there just isn't time unless he wanted to do it much after for a long time (1-2 hr a day) and he needed to study then.

 

Have to say I am proud of him for coming to that realization so quickly. Going into this he was set on proving he could go 2 way .

 

So in short answer for HS, I see a lot of 2 way players including SS/SP. After research of others and experience of D1 for my son after a whopping 3 weeks, I would say it is much more rare in college.

 

Passion4baseball,

 

I have no problem with a high school player doing it, if he knows what he is doing and their are boundaries set.

 

In terms of college recruiting, it would give him an extra boost of exposure.  Many college coaches start with those positions on their recruiting shopping lists. 

 

In terms of playing both ways (SS/SP) in college that would be another matter entirely.  I can only think of one player (in 4 years) who played SS/SP when my son was in college.  While it was D1, it was not the full 56 games normally played by D1 schools.   He was drafted as a junior in 2012 and the MLB team converted him to a pitcher.   I think it is a much more likely scenario in college (although still rare) to be a SS and relief pitcher.

 

JMO.

Passion 4;

P/SS is an injury waiting to happen. The arm angle is different.

 

When the SS is the pitcher the second level SS will make an error and the Pitcher will need to throw an additional 10 pitches that inning.

 

P/3b, P/!b, P/Of is acceptable. If your OF/P is in relief, then have your extra catcher warm him up from LF or RF between innings before he is too pitch in relief.

 

Bob

<www.goodwillseries.org>

Mine was a 2 way in HS and in college. They moved him from 3rd to OF in HS and was one of the team's three main starters. I saw a number of IF/P in HS and since most teams play three games a week it is generally workable. If there was a double header the P usually threw the second game. I would be cautious with a Friday/Sat game for a P (starter throwing lots of pitches)  to play SS the next day. In general most HS coaches know how to work the logistics to keep the player safe. 

 

In college he was going to be the DH and back end bullpen pitcher, broke his finger and switched to P only for the season. 

For HS ball it's fairly common for P's to be infielders as well. 

 

For college ball, pitcher's are just that - pitchers.  While I have seen some college rosters list a player with multiple positions, say P/INF, they usually only pitch or they play the position. 

 

Just my observation.

My sons 14U coach does. Last year at 13U my son was short stop and pitcher. He was invited back to the 14U team this year. So the coach knew of him and what position he played. After tryouts my son and two other kids were invited back without a tryout. 5 kids returned to the team after tryouts and 4 new kids were added. Fast forward to first practice and coach sends my son to right field. I assumed one of the new kids was a SS and was relieved because my son has a long throwing motion when pitching and it always seen to mess up his pitching for a few days after a lot of reps at short.

So after practice I'm sitting and talking with my son while he is changing his shoes and the coach comes over to us. He told me how much he appreciated my sons attitude when he told him to go to right field. I said thank you and would have left it at that but son asked why he wasn't at short. The coach said he would be his number 1 or number 2 pitcher and didn't want him playing short because of the stress on his arm and the fact he probably wouldn't play the game after he pitched. It was easier to put another kid in the out field than one on short. He wants his starting SS in every game.

So I guess at least he has a problem with pitchers playing SS. Personally I'm glad. The main reason I moved my son to travel last year was for him to get some out field experience.

Scotty; your coach is correct. When the SS pitches, the #2 SS is in the field.

The ball will find him and a maybe an error. This increase the pitchers pitch count to an additional 10 pitches.

 

Playing OF is like "long toss" no effort on the arm.

Drill your regular SS 100 extra ground balls each day [field with the left ear, no back hand]. Backhanding a ball in front of you = showcase mentality.

 

Bob

 

"When the SS pitches, the #2 SS is in the field.

The ball will find him and a maybe an error. This increase the pitchers pitch count to an additional 10 pitches."

 

This made me laugh, because it's so true.  In our area, one of the top pitchers (committed to UVA strictly as a pitcher) is a guy that most of his HS team's opponents never even face because the coach is terrified of what happens when he leaves SS to pitch.  As for the extra 10 pitches, I assume you mean PER INNING!  And that may be conservative.  Especially for (with the guy I'm referring to) a sinker/slider guy who relies on ground outs.

My son senior year he was the #1 on mound and when wasnt pitching,  he started a game at 3rd, 1st, LF, RF and batted in 3-4 hole all season.
Now a freshman in juco and had fall game where he started 1st game at 1st and pitched couple innings in 2nd.
Couple nights later played 3rd and pitched couple innings.

In HS mine was the #1 pitcher and CF when he wasn't pitching. He also filled in at SS when the SS closed and occasionally played 1B when the 1B started (#4 starter). Coach was very good about pitch counts and had a steady 3-4 man rotation.

 

In college (mid to low D1) he initially split the RF job as the lefty batter, then beat out the righty batter and still closed, sometimes just warming up a couple of innings before he would pitch, with a backup catcher down the RF or LF line.(I would say there were games where he was not properly warmed up). An arm injury prevented him from pitching much during his sophomore year, but he was able to play 1B and DH. His junior year he was in CF and closing (a fractured wrist cut that season short). His senior year he was in the rotation as the Sunday starter/DH. He would play RF on Friday and Saturday and DH most of the mid-week games (with an occasional start at 1B). He was also the #3 batter. 

 

Lots has been said about being a "true" 2-way player (being in the rotation and starting at a field position). IMO it can be done, at certain field positions, but it can also be extremely taxing. I still question if he had "robbed from Peter to pay Paul" by playing 2-way and if things might have turned out different for him if he had concentrated one.

 

On the other hand, being an infielder, especially a SS/P, IMHO would be pretty difficult on the D1 level.

Most of this is ancient history as son has been out of college baseball for three plus years now.

 

In high school, he was looked at as primarily a pitcher, and an occasional 1B/OF freshman year, until he hurt his arm pitching.  He wound up having some surgery in the fall of his sophmore year trying to fix it, we moved in the middle of his sophmore year, so new school/coach, and physically limited as he recovered, sophmore year wasn't very productive.  The new school though had a SS who also pitched, and a 1B that pitched.  Junior and Senior years, son moved to the OF, arm was better, but not complete.  Started a couple games as P, but as the season went on moved into closer role both junior and especially senior year.  Different SS, but he was number 1 P and 1B was number 2, he and the other 1B rotated DH.

 

In college, one school had a P who DH'd when he wasn't pitching and occasionally played 1B.  Son's freshman year was mostly as a relief pitcher, much to his dismay, only 10 ABs.  Sophmore year, primarily DH/OF with only 3 pitching appearances.  Transferred then, junior year, OF only, except he was pulled into an emergency relief appearance in a midweek game.  Got the only batter he faced to pop up.  That was the only pitching appearance by a position player that entire year.  His senior year, there was no crossover.  Which was pretty common.

 

Locally, a few years ago, SIU had a SS who was the closer as well.  He wound up being drafted as a P, spent a couple years in the minors, and is back a pitching coach now.  

 

High schools around here usually have few PO, just not enough kids.