What is a good HS hitters stats in your area?

Goosegg posted:

The overwhelming majority of scouts/recruiters have relationships with local HS, travel, and showcase/camp organizers. Those local sources tell the scouts who that coach believes has potential to play at the next level; stats have nothing really to do with that - the recommending coaches understand what the scout/recruiter is looking for.

HS stats have tremendous meaning - to parents, players and to the HS coach; only the outlier - the kid hitting 30 HRs (eg) - would get a notice. And, the initial look on a kid like that (who had slipped his coaches notice despite hitting 30 dingers) would most likely be from an "assistant" (e.g., associate scout). No scout/recruiter would base his recruiting plan upon MAXPREPS.

The primary reason for that is the inconsistent talent levels and inconsistent score keeping. The former means that a hitter (eg) could be stymied by an opponents #1 pitcher (heading to the next level) but go 8 for 8 against the other pitchers who won't be moving in to the next level; the latter is self-explanatory - no recruiter/scout is making plans based upon the results of a parent scorekeeper.

Recruiting is not haphazard; every look is planned out in advance. And while a recruiter/scout watches a game to see certain players - ANYONE else who shows skills to succeed at the next level will get noted and asked about.

As a parent who had a kid whose local records may never be broken (decent player in an awful, small school league), I loved those stats, loved sorting MAXPREPS, loved fielding the calls from local reporters and reading the articles. But, it meant nothing to recruiters. Recruiters at the HS level are not looking for past results; they are looking for future projections which are really not related to HS results (for the most part).

Goosegg pretty much nailed it here

StrainedOblique, it sounds as though you’re saying no matter how great or how poor a player’s stats are, no scout ever looks at them.

Stats4Gnats posted:

StrainedOblique, it sounds as though you’re saying no matter how great or how poor a player’s stats are, no scout ever looks at them.

No, I didn't say that. I was quite clear in what I wrote. As were other members.

Stats

You really like to twist words and thoughts into conclusions far away from the intent.

HS stats don't get you drafted; HS stats don't get you recruited. Projections by professionals/experts  (or close to it) that a kid can play at the next level get you drafted and/or recruited. 

Good stats, bad stats, no stats, it doesn't matter. If HS would play without stats, there would be no change in who gets drafted and/or recruited.

No scout sits/telephone in the draft room and justifies his pick: "hey, the kid struck out 181 in 80 innings last year! Let's draft him."

HS stats are a blast; I spent years trying to figure out the magic fairy dust of projecting results at the next level. Then I spoke to scouts and, while I continued to enjoy HS stats (got a great scrapbook), I just enjoyed them from that point out.

Goosegg posted:

Stats

'Good stats, bad stats, no stats, it doesn't matter. If HS would play without stats, there would be no change in who gets drafted and/or recruited'.

....Excellent point here

Goosegg posted:

Stats

You really like to twist words and thoughts into conclusions far away from the intent.

...

Good stats, bad stats, no stats, it doesn't matter. If HS would play without stats, there would be no change in who gets drafted and/or recruited.

 

...

Uhhh, yeah.  Has anyone else noticed that the OLD Stats is starting to resurface lately?  

Here we go again...  Stats agenda time...  

HS coaches are all dinosaurs who don't have a clue.  Catchers should call pitches. The eye test from experienced baseball people is worthless.  Stats/Statisticians are REALLY important, even at the HS level.  HS pitchers have no ability to hit locations.  (I think I'm missing one or two)

Words will be twisted.  Threads will be hijacked.  Some newer HSBBW posters will get sucked in.  There will be futile efforts at reasoning and other viewpoints.  Ugliness will ensue.

Unfortunately, this place just becomes several shades darker when we go through this cycle.  It may be getting close to time for a break.  It was a nice year and a half or so while it lasted.   Unfortunately, I know of more than a few great contributors who took permanent breaks here because of the ugliness that ensues.

Sorry, to the OP - In our league ( mid-pack Calif HS), There is a handful of guys with BA over .400 and just a few with OBP over .500.  Rarely more than a few HR's.  Usually 7-10 guys with ERA under 2, maybe one or two hovering right around 1.

StrainedOblique posted:

No, I didn't say that. I was quite clear in what I wrote. As were other members.

Obviously you weren’t clear or I wouldn’t have taken away what I did. Let me try it this way. Are a player’s height, weight, grade, footspeed, lineage etc. statistics?

Goosegg posted:

Stats

You really like to twist words and thoughts into conclusions far away from the intent.

HS stats don't get you drafted; HS stats don't get you recruited. Projections by professionals/experts  (or close to it) that a kid can play at the next level get you drafted and/or recruited. 

Good stats, bad stats, no stats, it doesn't matter. If HS would play without stats, there would be no change in who gets drafted and/or recruited.

No scout sits/telephone in the draft room and justifies his pick: "hey, the kid struck out 181 in 80 innings last year! Let's draft him."

HS stats are a blast; I spent years trying to figure out the magic fairy dust of projecting results at the next level. Then I spoke to scouts and, while I continued to enjoy HS stats (got a great scrapbook), I just enjoyed them from that point out.

 How is it I twisted anything? Look at the title of the thread and try reading the OP! Is there a damn thing in either one that talks even remotely about what scouts look for?

 You guys get all PO’d at me, but I’m not the one claiming how players are chosen for the next level above HS is all wrong or that those making the choices don’t know what they’re doing!

 I’ve tried for many years to get it across that stats are far more than the numbers used to measure a player’s performance, but it doesn’t seem to get through that blind bias. Performance statistics are used by every baseball coach making up a lineup on the face of the earth whether they want to believe it or not! If they aren’t using real numbers to make decisions they’re using perceptions or memories.

 If you choose to argue performance statistics don’t get anyone drafted, I’d agree to a point. But something gets players on the “radar”. But in the end, I don’t now nor have I ever cared about the next level! I use the numbers to compare players on the same team and have never said anything different.

cabbagedad posted:

Uhhh, yeah.  Has anyone else noticed that the OLD Stats is starting to resurface lately?  

Here we go again...  Stats agenda time...  

HS coaches are all dinosaurs who don't have a clue.  Catchers should call pitches.  Stats/Statisticians are REALLY important, even at the HS level.  HS pitchers have no ability to hit locations.  (I think I'm missing one or two)

Words will be twisted.  Threads will be hijacked.  Some newer HSBBW posters will get sucked in.  There will be futile efforts at reasoning and other viewpoints.  Ugliness will ensue.

Unfortunately, this place just becomes several shades darker when we go through this cycle.  It may be getting close to time for a break.  It was a nice year and a half or so while it lasted.   Unfortunately, I know of more than a few great contributors who took permanent breaks here because of the ugliness that ensues.

Sorry, to the OP - In our league ( mid-pack Calif HS), There is a handful of guys with BA over .400 and just a few with OBP over .500.  Rarely more than a few HR's.  Usually 7-10 guys with ERA under 2, maybe one or two hovering right around 1.

 Yeah, here we go again. Everything bad that’s ever happened on HSBBW is because of Stats. But I’ll tell ya what. If you can find where I ever said HS coaches are all dinosaurs who don't have a clue, Stats/Statisticians are REALLY important, even at the HS level and HS pitchers have no ability to hit locations, I’ll leave right now!

 If you can’t find where I’ve said those things, will you admit you’re a liar, or at least someone who uses innuendo and exaggeration trying to trying to cast a shadow on me for your own reasons?

 Do I believe catchers should call pitches? You’re dang right I do, and I’m sure not the only person who does! So why is it only me who believes that?

 Just to be clear, where did you get those numbers? Are they pure fiction or are they real numbers? Looks to me that you did exactly what I suggested he do when I posted the link to MaxPreps stat leaders. But I’m a trouble maker and bringer of all things dark, while you’re someone who should be admired for doing exactly what I suggested!

 Maybe one day you’ll understand that there’s a vast difference between using performance statistics to manage a team and trying to use them to project what a player will do when he’s 4-6 years older. I’ve always believed the 1^st is a valid use and never believed the 2^nd was.

Thanks for all of the answers, this thread has obviously taken care of some boredom at work.