PABaseball, by my reading of the D1 manual, both of your examples are violations of the contact and/or unofficial visit rules. Those two methods aren't getting around the rules, they're just being more subtle about breaking the rules.
I'm not saying these things don't happen all the time, I know they do... and much worse. However, when a D1 coach is saying anything to you about recruiting before you start junior year, he is breaking the rules. The exception being as noted above when the recruit calls the coach, or a third party acts as an intermediary.
It's also worth noting that the high school kid isn't breaking any rules, it's only the coach. If a school is willing to take that risk, by all means talk to them.