Tagged With "Legion"
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
I'll say this having watched the video: the kid is an interesting ballplayer who looks like he has potential. There is talent & athleticism there
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
"You'd be surprised at how many coaches want every pitch in the dirt to be blocked and will penalize catchers for picking rather than blocking." To each his own level of understanding and/or comfort. There don't seem to be a lot of college or hs catching coaches that truly appreciate the need to develop a young catcher by allowing him to be aggressive with his throwing which in turns builds confidence, which in turns builds a lot of key outs rather then just letting the opposition take a...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
CPNM, I would argue that the percentages are better with the block than the pick but that goes back to which pitches the catcher attempts to pick. If C has a knack for recognizing depth properly and knowing his pitchers' movement, I'm with you. There is certainly some "chicken or the egg" to this.
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
CURRYNC: I watched your son's video with my son, who is also a catcher. He immediately had several comments about the throw down portion to second base. First, he said that he hates those high feeds like the one in the video. As a catcher you have to choose the lesser of two evils, either you reach for the ball and keep your legs flexed or you come completely out of your crouch and lose the ability to quickly load the lower half, but you receive the pitch closer to your transfer point. My...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Regarding pop time: if you upload it to the hudl app there is a time function, you can go throw in slow motion and get the time (need to subtract start from stop time).
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Regarding velo: it is probably most important but I know that coaches love a polished catcher, gives you more time to worry about other stuff. Velo is king but two guys with the same or similar velo and one can catch the coach will always prefer the catcher. So best is having both but of course if you don't have the velo technique wont save you either. But no reason to not work on both and make the coaches job easier.
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Interesting to see where this topic has evolved. As for picks vs. blocks, I'd say it is a continually moving fine line of when to do one or the other when runners are on. In GENERAL, I'm a fan of blocking, especially when it is hot and humid because tired catchers are more likely to keep the ball in front of them with a block than relying on an athletic pick (and that's when the balls seem to get to the backstop). Mistakes are still made on occasion by veteran catchers, and even a cleanly...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Batty is 100% correct. I gripe at my son if he picks a ball that clearly should have been a block. There are some that are border line and he will pick those. But there are catchers who will back hand pick cause they cannot block or are being lazy. I remind my son he's a catcher, not a first baseman. And if he does pick it is almost always with empty bases. He typically blocks everything, even when no one is on base. Guess it's habit but it also looks good if someone is watching. As for...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
2forU, You've calculated AVERAGE velocity, not MAX velocity. Over a distance of 127 feet I would guess that velocity drops somewhere in the neighborhood of 15mph, so a throw averaging 86mph requires probably close to 95mph max velo. I don't think anyone, even Yadi gets this from a crouch. As an example, in some of Yadi's ~1.8s throws that I've seen broken down by Statcast, his exchange time (catch, transfer, footwork, release) is ~.65s or even better, allowing more time for ball in flight,...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
A ball traveling 79.4 MPH will travel 116.4533 feet in 1.1 second. Runner is safe unless the ball travels 86.6 MPH
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
No bench mark, just an example. The quicker you get rid of the ball, the slower you can throw it, simple math. But a throw from home to second is still 127 ft. A ball needs to travel at 86.6 MPH to go 127 ft in one second. So a faster catch and release means he can throw slower, but the ball wont travel 127 feet in one second or 1.1 seconds. A ball thrown at 79.4 MPH only travels 116.453333 feet in 1.1 seconds. It will take 1.599 (1.6) seconds to go 127 feet, add 1.3 and .7 and your complete...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Well, my math skills don't include gravity. That is where I draw the line - lol. I'm sure that is someone way better at math than I am.
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
My point is that a catcher getting a ball down to 2nd base with flight time of 1.2s is really good and will result in a 1.9ish pop time if the other mechanics are good, and this would be an average velo of low 70s, and a max velo in the high 70s. A lot of people don't understand that throwing from the crouch makes it very difficult to get the kind of velo numbers you see off the mound or across the infield or outfield, and even the most elite studs are hitting max velos of low to mid 80s. I...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
If you go to the perfectgame homepage, on the bottom left there is a showcase leaderboard for each class. Max C velocity by Grad year: 2017: 88 2018: 86 2019:82 2020:77 Looking back at history, a couple of hit 90+. Seeing the progression by age, I guess you can assume they will get a little faster in college. So yes, 88-90 happens every year, but at least for PG showcases, you can still have a top 20 C velo with low-mid 80's.
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
I don't think any catcher can throw 86 on average. you easily would need to be 92 at release which would equal to at least upper 90s from the mound. last year the hardest throw by a catcher was gary sanchez at 88.9 AT RELEASE which probably means an arrive velo of 69 MPH (pitcher loses 10 MPH to home so it should be about twice due to the double distance). that means his throw averaged at best 80 mph. I doubt anyone can make the throw in 1 second flat. this article here from 2012 claimed 83...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Just a thought about PG and their "historical" Numbers. You need to look at sampling size too. 2017 will have a much larger sampling size than 2018...2018 than 2019 and so on. 2020 probably has only a handful of athletes listed and the reason a 2020 is already on their board is cause he is the best around. What my point is, my hypothesis is 2017 numbers are made up of more "averages" then a 2020. This make sense or am I way off!!?? My 2020 threw off a mound and he's 5'8 and 135 (listed him...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Kevin, You are right about the sample sizes, but the velo range of the top 20 or so stays consistent year after year. I was just pointing out that both the above points were correct. Some people can indeed hit 90, but for the most part if you are low to mid 80's, you would still be in the top 20 of PG, which is good enough to get a look from coaches if you are doing everything else right. And keeping a catching thread alive for 3 days is pretty cool as well...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
lol- I soak up what ever I can on catchers...LOL... I was checking out some of the guys bio's who done 2017 show cases but are 2020 grads...Its throwing and hitting. Not a single remark that a catcher has or doesn't have polished receiving skills....
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
@ CabbageDad, CPNM, Batty67, KevinA, et al: I think someone on this thread wrote that any player who wants to play catcher has to be a little "off" in the first place. I agree with that assessment. It's a physically and mentally grueling position to play. It also is a position that tends to be really hard on the body. Anyone who has blocked an 80+ MPH fastball knows that it can hurt like hell. Blocking pitches in the dirt is a skill that successful catchers must master, that's a given.
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Yup, nice post JDB. Of course. the problem is "a little off" and "situationally aware" don't always match up.
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Ok 2forU, I think that others have already addressed this, so I'll be brief. I also acknowledge that these are averages not initial velocities, so they aren't perfectly equivalent to real world velocities. They do show how required velocities decrease as upstream processes get faster. You said, "A ball traveling 79.4 MPH will travel 116.4533 feet in 1.1 second. Runner is safe unless the ball travels 86.6 MPH." - and "Well, my math skills don't include gravity. That is where I draw the line -...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Any thread where people debate math when the point is to improve an argument lose their way, in general. Yes, a good catcher knows when to block and when to pick. On a beautiful day with defense making outs and pitching rarely putting one in the dirt, it might complete sense for the catcher to try and block virtually everything (since there is not much and that's good form). On a hot and humid day, a long day with extra outs due to errors, and/or lots of balls in the dirt, a good catcher...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
"Any thread where people debate math when the point is to improve an argument lose their way, in general." Point taken, and yes I did feel like I lost my way. I will redirect in the future, hopefully. My apologies to you too, CURRYNC.
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Yeah, that's probably why I always got B's in math. Thanks for the correction. Velocity is king, I will not change that!
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
I found this from 2011 on HSBBW: Credit to Catching101 If a player has a release time of .70 and they throw the ball 75mph their pop time would be 1.85. The distance from the back point of home plate to the middle of 2B is 127.28ft (or 90*the square root of 2 for you geometry guys!). When the ball is thrown 75mph it is traveling 110fps (feet per second), which means it would travel the 127.28ft in 1.157s. So...if a player has a release of .7s and is throwing 75mph, the ball will get there in...
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Re: Travel Ball- Legion level
First have a plan and communicate that plan to the players. Then stick with it. If for some reason you change your plan, communicate that to your players. With proper communication, most players will buy in. And make sure they know which games they will play in case Grandma wants to come. I have seen a few things work. Splitting time 50/50 can work. Would even allow the non-playing player to skip a game if needed. If a kid is going to pitch, treat him like a pitcher only for that day. Also,...
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Re: Travel Ball- Legion level
When I played Legion years ago the coach scheduled non conference games to keep the bench and pitchers playing, happy and ready for more critical situations. We traveled as far as two hours away to play teams in other zones.
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
Thanks to all for helping prove my point - Velo is king. I think Ironhorse is correct. Max velo at 90 is where you need to be or upper 80's so that your average ball speed combined with release provides decent pop time. By the time the ball slows down at 2b, your velo average is in the 70's (please insert something here on how fast the ball slows down or the faster you throw it the less it slows down - I'm sure there is more to it). Quicker release means you can have a lower max and average.
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Re: American Legion Ball
Some coaches swap out players every 3 innings and or have one kid start game 1 go 3-4 innings then swap him out. Game 2 have the second kid start then swap him out with kid 1 after 3-4 innings. This way both kids get to play the only difference is who gets to start. You may also take into account the team you're playing. I'd want the stronger kid against the stronger team. The dh role is also available. Kid 1 can dh for the pitcher the entire game. On game 2, kid 2 then dhs the entire game...
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Re: POP Time, 1.88 good?
I haven't been able to find a single HS catcher in PG database that hit 90. Austin Hedges hit 85 with a 1.75 pop, that's the best I've seen. Maybe they are there but I think it is WAY overstating it to say that 90 is where you need to be.
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Re: American Legion Ball
MACSDAD; Do you live near Cooperstown? How many of your players work? Can you use the "double" DH? How many left hand hitters? In my 6 years of coaching the Legion team in N-California, we had similar situation. Every player later played at a strong college program &/or in pro baseball. Bob
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Re: American Legion Ball
On a legion team this problem will partially take care of itself, as family vacations, jobs, girls, etc. limit the number of players who show up for each game.
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Re: American Legion Ball
When I played Legion the coach schedule extra games against teams in other zones. We played 28 regular season games and about 14 non conference games before the post season. The non conference games kept everyone ready to contribute when it mattered.