The sad thing is that I have noticed a huge dropoff in players from poor families at the Area Code Games. Not just black players, but Hispanic and White players too.
With the high cost travel teams taking over summer ball and many players just following the costly showcase circut, the player from a poor family is left at home and heads toward a different sport. Baseball is starting to be like golf......a rich mans game, and it shows in the dropoff of talent that I have seen in just 10 years.
In 1994-95 my starting lineup at the Area Code Games featured 2 white players, 1 Hispanic and 6 blacks. It was also far and away the best teams that I ever had. We just smoked everybody. My last year running the team was 2001 and I had 1 black player, and he was a reserve.
As far as the colleges go, I have very little respect for how they have recruited over the years. A poor kid who keeps his grades up can get full financial aid, which in many cases is much more than the scholarship money given to most players. They are just not being recruited. CC Sabathia was on my team, and he ended up signing a football scholarship to the "great football power Hawaii", because the college baseball powers were ignoring him.
When my son played AAU we made many a trip to Orlando for championship games...on several occasions we had afternoon showers that forced us inside...what was happening inside was AAU basketball...teams made up of nearly 95% black young men...now how did they get to Orlando...probably the same way we did...through sponsorship, donations, etc...
Here in Boston there has been a thrust to incorporate and make fields and facilities accessible to all who reside within the inner city...the choice has been made available to all...if the decision is made to play another sport other than baseball it is not done due to lack of attempts made by the Red Sox and many other organizations...personally I feel if the choice is made to play basketball, football, hockey, lacrosse, s****r etc what difference does it make...as long as the kids enjoy what they are doing and are not hanging on some street corner or taking drugs
Here in Boston there has been a thrust to incorporate and make fields and facilities accessible to all who reside within the inner city...the choice has been made available to all...if the decision is made to play another sport other than baseball it is not done due to lack of attempts made by the Red Sox and many other organizations...personally I feel if the choice is made to play basketball, football, hockey, lacrosse, s****r etc what difference does it make...as long as the kids enjoy what they are doing and are not hanging on some street corner or taking drugs
bbscout,
I would agree with that sentiment - and others expressed here.
With each passing year - it becomes more expensive to participate in the game.
IMO - Many excellent young players - very simply - cannot afford it. Of all races.
The old saying in business - "Money attracts money" - is an apt one for what is occurring on the youth baseball scene.
I would agree with that sentiment - and others expressed here.
With each passing year - it becomes more expensive to participate in the game.
IMO - Many excellent young players - very simply - cannot afford it. Of all races.
The old saying in business - "Money attracts money" - is an apt one for what is occurring on the youth baseball scene.
Hank Aaron (who has also been speaking to this subject) went through death threats during his run on Ruth's record. Joe Morgan was closer to the triumphs of both Robinson and Aaron (for example) than young players today, obviously.
Do we have a situation here wherein young black ballplayers are being passed over...or is it much more likely to be a money issue or that their interests are simply elsewhere?
Probably because of the respect Morgan has for the early black players, and for what Aaron went through himself, it's difficult to now see fewer black ballplayers following on the trail blazed. It was discrimination then; but that doesn't mean it is discrimination now.
This subject comes up a few times a ball season, with much righteous indignation. I know MLB has the RBI program, although I have no idea the extent or success of same. But doesn't Joe make a pretty good living, and even though Hank certainly wasn't playing in the multimillion dollar years, mightn't he have some pull with current bleck players who are (Bonds springs to mind)? What are they doing themselves to generate interest by and in young black athletes, as opposed to pointing fingers and bemoaning the situation?
If you don't like what you see, do something about it, Joe; you're of an age to remember the line about, "If you're not part of the solution...."
But I must say I get very confused by race and Hispanic players. American-born-black-players-without-parents-of-hispanic-origin are, evidently, the only players that can be called African Americans. Well, there's a limitation to the field. Ted Williams had a Mexican Mom, but was left off the recent Latin Legends Ballot, apparently for not being Latin enough. If being Latin means that a player originates from a country in the New World that was originally settled by the Spanish, isn't that a culture rather than a race? And in that culture might there be a range of races and mixes of races? So why is Edgar Rentaria Latin but not black? Wouldn't that be like my son (born in England, carries the passport), saying he's not white, he's English?
Seems like a lot of labels are being pasted on from a whole variety of sources.
Do we have a situation here wherein young black ballplayers are being passed over...or is it much more likely to be a money issue or that their interests are simply elsewhere?
Probably because of the respect Morgan has for the early black players, and for what Aaron went through himself, it's difficult to now see fewer black ballplayers following on the trail blazed. It was discrimination then; but that doesn't mean it is discrimination now.
This subject comes up a few times a ball season, with much righteous indignation. I know MLB has the RBI program, although I have no idea the extent or success of same. But doesn't Joe make a pretty good living, and even though Hank certainly wasn't playing in the multimillion dollar years, mightn't he have some pull with current bleck players who are (Bonds springs to mind)? What are they doing themselves to generate interest by and in young black athletes, as opposed to pointing fingers and bemoaning the situation?
If you don't like what you see, do something about it, Joe; you're of an age to remember the line about, "If you're not part of the solution...."
But I must say I get very confused by race and Hispanic players. American-born-black-players-without-parents-of-hispanic-origin are, evidently, the only players that can be called African Americans. Well, there's a limitation to the field. Ted Williams had a Mexican Mom, but was left off the recent Latin Legends Ballot, apparently for not being Latin enough. If being Latin means that a player originates from a country in the New World that was originally settled by the Spanish, isn't that a culture rather than a race? And in that culture might there be a range of races and mixes of races? So why is Edgar Rentaria Latin but not black? Wouldn't that be like my son (born in England, carries the passport), saying he's not white, he's English?
Seems like a lot of labels are being pasted on from a whole variety of sources.
quote:I don't think it is deliberate, but it is happening due the lack of opportunities for young Afro-Americans to get a chance to play this game.
With basketball a kid can go down to a local rec with hoops and shoot for hours...by himself. With baseball you that is not so easy. Most fields don't even allow youngsters to use them without permission, pay fees, or belong to some organization that has access priveleges. The open field, for young Afro-Americans is not a realistic option.
I have to take issue with this as this certainly isn’t the case in my area of North Carolina. Our town, just north of Charlotte, has 7 public baseball fields that are open for use by anyone whenever they are not scheduled by a league and that is a good bit of the time. Three of these fields are across from sections of the town that are a majority black & latino. We also have batting cages that are unlocked with L screens (for safety) that were paid for by the local league. The local league has scholarships set up to support players that do not have the financial resources to pay to play – no matter what the race. The local league also provides equipment, including some used bats, and catchers gear. Our percentage of blacks participating has dropped for years. Our percentage of latinos participating is on a slow rise. White participation is also on a slow rise. The three fields and cages that I mentioned earlier, I use often to work out with my son. I have yet to see black children or adults practicing or playing pickup baseball. I do run into other white dads. I also watch pickup latino games.
There are HAS to be something other than money and opportunity at work here because it certainly isn’t a lack of facilities or funds.
We have a large immigrant mexican population that mostly works in the construction industry. On the weekends they use 90' fields all over the place for pick-up games and adult leagues, all day long.
Interesting point on the labeling of players and society Orlando! When does a race line become a cultural line or the inverse.
During game four of the W.S. when introducing the Latino Legends team, Edward James Olmos introduced Alex Rodriguez as "from the Dominican Republic." I for one know that ARod was born in NY making him a US citizen. Sure he may be a latino culturally and racially, but shouldn't we also have an all Italian Legends team or an Irish legends team? If we are going to create all-star teams based on DESCENT, we should included all forms. I don't think we needed to make a cutural/racial spectacle out of labeling players. Nationality is a different subject and more easily guidelined.
I wonder what the ramifications would be if an all Anglo Legends team were displayed?
There have been many latin players that have enriched the game of baseball since they began to play at the grand stage of the MLB, but why do we still have to create these distinctions between cultural/racial/ethnical groups? Why can't they just be great baseball players and leave it at that. The labeling just expands the race/culture/ethnic gap.
JMO and sorry for rambling.
During game four of the W.S. when introducing the Latino Legends team, Edward James Olmos introduced Alex Rodriguez as "from the Dominican Republic." I for one know that ARod was born in NY making him a US citizen. Sure he may be a latino culturally and racially, but shouldn't we also have an all Italian Legends team or an Irish legends team? If we are going to create all-star teams based on DESCENT, we should included all forms. I don't think we needed to make a cutural/racial spectacle out of labeling players. Nationality is a different subject and more easily guidelined.
I wonder what the ramifications would be if an all Anglo Legends team were displayed?
There have been many latin players that have enriched the game of baseball since they began to play at the grand stage of the MLB, but why do we still have to create these distinctions between cultural/racial/ethnical groups? Why can't they just be great baseball players and leave it at that. The labeling just expands the race/culture/ethnic gap.
JMO and sorry for rambling.
I'll have to admit there have been some thought provoking opinions expressed here that may well have changed my views
until now, whether coaching or watching I had always just seen a group of kids/guys playing a great game, learning, and having fun
but - in the future I'll prolly be viewing them by their race, figuring ratios - then feel compelled to run some "majorities" off and/or intimidate some "minorities" into playing to achieve a better balance
Thanks - -
- - ya set me back 50 yrs - - - & I'm only 52
OK - OK - - I'm 54 1/2, but feel 49 1/2 . . . . sometimes . . . .
.
until now, whether coaching or watching I had always just seen a group of kids/guys playing a great game, learning, and having fun
but - in the future I'll prolly be viewing them by their race, figuring ratios - then feel compelled to run some "majorities" off and/or intimidate some "minorities" into playing to achieve a better balance
Thanks - -
- - ya set me back 50 yrs - - - & I'm only 52OK - OK - - I'm 54 1/2, but feel 49 1/2 . . . . sometimes . . . .
.
SON
Sad to say we have a country that now has to be what they term "politically correct" , whatever that may mean--I am still trying to get a true definition
My sons grew up in a town that was very diverse--I had more non white kids in the house, boys and girls, than white kids during their HS years
and they always said thank you when they left--
I also ran the youth leagues in town and we made sure that any youngster with a family/financial situation and needed an "assist" we gave it them-- and it had nothing to do with race---we felt that the youngster need not be penalized because of his parents situation(s)
I think too many people try to find excuses--
Take a look at our roster for Jupiter and see the diversity we have and we are not unlike other travel teams-- we want the best players and we strive to make it work. no matter how-- I am sure the other teams do as well
Stop making excuses for it all-- if a kid wants it to happen it can happen---all too much of this ethnic talk is a COP OUT and it only makes good copy for the press
Sad to say we have a country that now has to be what they term "politically correct" , whatever that may mean--I am still trying to get a true definition
My sons grew up in a town that was very diverse--I had more non white kids in the house, boys and girls, than white kids during their HS years
and they always said thank you when they left--
I also ran the youth leagues in town and we made sure that any youngster with a family/financial situation and needed an "assist" we gave it them-- and it had nothing to do with race---we felt that the youngster need not be penalized because of his parents situation(s)
I think too many people try to find excuses--
Take a look at our roster for Jupiter and see the diversity we have and we are not unlike other travel teams-- we want the best players and we strive to make it work. no matter how-- I am sure the other teams do as well
Stop making excuses for it all-- if a kid wants it to happen it can happen---all too much of this ethnic talk is a COP OUT and it only makes good copy for the press
Bee
BEE
When they wear our uniform they are all College Select Players and nothing else---they are part of a team which is the way it should be
When they wear our uniform they are all College Select Players and nothing else---they are part of a team which is the way it should be
Bee and TR,
It's sad to say that a lot of the political correctness that is trying to take us away from racism (by making us more sensitive) is the one thing that is inspiring the divide between races and cultures.
Luckily, I have had the priveledge of playing on teams where the majority (no pun intended) of minority ballplayers view themselves as baseball players first, not as a Black/latino/minority when on the field.
It's sad to say that a lot of the political correctness that is trying to take us away from racism (by making us more sensitive) is the one thing that is inspiring the divide between races and cultures.
Luckily, I have had the priveledge of playing on teams where the majority (no pun intended) of minority ballplayers view themselves as baseball players first, not as a Black/latino/minority when on the field.
son
and that is exactly how it should be
and that is exactly how it should be
there IS hope if someone so orange could also be so wise 
so, S-o-Moc, could ya possibly wise your way into a DIFFERENT
super regional in '06??
tanks in advance,
B>
.
so, S-o-Moc, could ya possibly wise your way into a DIFFERENT
super regional in '06??
tanks in advance,
B>
.
Is it possible this racial thing involving baseball is different from one part of the country to the next?
For example... We see such a large number of people of various ethnic backgrounds playing baseball in Florida vs other parts of the country. Other places we go... it doesn't seem to be quite the same.
Does it bother latin people when someone says...
"we need to go get a latin american recruit because they are the best shortstops!"
Or do they see that statement as a source of pride and truthfulness?
What is the difference between the above statement and others that are said to be racial issues?
Just curious!
For example... We see such a large number of people of various ethnic backgrounds playing baseball in Florida vs other parts of the country. Other places we go... it doesn't seem to be quite the same.
Does it bother latin people when someone says...
"we need to go get a latin american recruit because they are the best shortstops!"
Or do they see that statement as a source of pride and truthfulness?
What is the difference between the above statement and others that are said to be racial issues?
Just curious!
pG
I take it as a compliment to my race and background --not a slap in the face
I take it as a compliment to my race and background --not a slap in the face
The above post is just an example. Not necessarily making the claim that Latin Americans are the only good shortstops! People can judge that for themselves!
Or can they????
Maybe they will need to keep their opinions to themselves!!! Or face the racial crowd!!!
A person would have to be hidden in a cave to not realize there exists racial problems and unfairness.
Shouldn't we get rid of all the REAL racists rather than pick apart isolated comments made by the good people.
By the way, the football coach at Air Force has a son who played professional baseball.
Or can they????
Maybe they will need to keep their opinions to themselves!!! Or face the racial crowd!!!
A person would have to be hidden in a cave to not realize there exists racial problems and unfairness.
Shouldn't we get rid of all the REAL racists rather than pick apart isolated comments made by the good people.
By the way, the football coach at Air Force has a son who played professional baseball.
I gotta go with what MOM taught us - - - -
always "favor" your own race
THE "HUMAN RACE"
it IS sometimes difficult to discern tho - - -
.
always "favor" your own race
THE "HUMAN RACE"
it IS sometimes difficult to discern tho - - -
.
bbscout,
Don't know if you followed CC Sabathia this year, but I believe this was a break out year for him. He was getting crushed early in the year throwing mostly 97 mph fastballs. It seemed like all of a sudden the light bulb went off, he dropped his velocity to about 94 but became more of a pitcher and became almost unhittable. I guess it has worked out well for him even though all those college guys weren't going crazy over him when he was in hs.
Don't know if you followed CC Sabathia this year, but I believe this was a break out year for him. He was getting crushed early in the year throwing mostly 97 mph fastballs. It seemed like all of a sudden the light bulb went off, he dropped his velocity to about 94 but became more of a pitcher and became almost unhittable. I guess it has worked out well for him even though all those college guys weren't going crazy over him when he was in hs.
Bee-
I agree that it would be wise to avoid Tech this year in the Super Regional
We can't get lucky two years in a row, can we? 
. But luckily we will have a rematch during the regular season, maybe a preview of what's to come!
See ya at the beach!!
I agree that it would be wise to avoid Tech this year in the Super Regional
We can't get lucky two years in a row, can we? . But luckily we will have a rematch during the regular season, maybe a preview of what's to come!See ya at the beach!!