Article and Book on Chinese Parents

They had a review of the book on NPR's Fresh Air today.

I do like this line: "They assume strength, not fragility, and as a result they behave very differently."

But I think I'll stick with the 2Bmom method.

Another great book along the same lines is called Top of the Class: How Asian Parents Raise High Achievers. I use it in my sociology classes.

I'm going to have my son's chinese(Hong Kong born) mother read this woman's bull***t and give me her opinion. People can't cast a broad brush on a culture just because they belong to that culture, and everybody must believe. My wife does expect academic success, but not to the degree of mental distress she has seen in her culture. She also expects her son's to be as good as possible on the field with their TEAMS. This woman married an American and has been here since she was 1, and has little clue how it is back in the homeland. But I do agree that we make way to many excuses for our children's shortcomings in this country. In my opinion we are becoming too soft, and that can lead to us losing more ground on other cultures that are gaining ground way to fast for my liking. I will comment again later after I consult with the Wife.

Can kids be raised soft? Absolutely. I see it in our community. Can they be raised too rigidly? Of course. There may be a model for success in the posted story. But there should be a happy medium.

CELTDAD - Can't wait to hear back from your resident expert. I also thought the author used a mile-wide brush and made many sweeping generalizations about how Chinese raise their kids.

So what this lady is saying is that every mother among the 1,341,690,000 people living in China parents EXACTLY the same way, and that is the 100% exact right way to parent. And what she is also saying is that every mother among the 311,933,000 people living in the United States parents EXACTLY the same way, and that is the 100% wrong way to parent.

Just because you might have raised your kids this way doesn't mean its the right way. And just because you raised your kids this way doesn't mean its the only way.

I'd be very interested to sit in on the law classes that she teaches at Yale. I'd be curious about the extent of exaggeration that lies within everything she has to say.

We have already lost, irrecoverably I believe, the scientific battle.

The real difference maker, I feel, is that their government is more dedicated to public education.

Our government in the public education system is more dedicated to social entitlements than education.

The author's children, apparently typical of most "chinese" children were never allowed to (among other things) "play any instrument other than piano or violin."

My kid plays drums. I guess I lose in the gifted child sweepstakes.

Of course I am just kidding, and as obnoxious as some of the piece is, there are some excellent take homes that are readily applicable to baseball such as the importance of commitment and repetition in practice.

On the other hand, I am reading "The Talent Code" by Daniel Coyle at the suggestion of another forum posted. In that book, Coyle suggests that shear rote repetition is less productive as a mode of practice than what he describes as deep practice, or the process of working through mistakes until a skill is more or less "fully acquired" and in his research he found examples of "deep practice" in all cultures in many places around the world, in sports, literature, music, among other things.

It's a shame the author chose to write in a strident tone that's not likely to be well-received by readers that don't identify with the methods she describes. She's more likely to affront than inform as a result and that's too bad because it seems like there's something to learn there for anyone raising children in a competitive society.

quote:

Originally posted by playfair:
The real difference maker, I feel, is that their government is more dedicated to public education.

Governments don't set expectations for kids, parents do. Expectations are set in a given culture.

For those who think she made sweeping generalizations should look at the list of the top 50 GPAs in a given high school.

"deep practice"... When the Soviets were very dominant in wrestling a kid practiced for 3 years before his first match.

This is an interesting discussion and I can spend 5 minutes or 5 hours.

Twenty-eight years in International Baseball [Japan, China, Korea and Australia] reveals the inner-working of the culture and the dynamics of the environment and the social dynamics of the people.

There are individuals expressions in each nation, however it may time to discover this trait, as it may be open to critical comment by group leaders.

This discussion was apparent a few hours ago with a Scout for a Japanese Pro team. We should train our children in "Social Psychology".

Bob

My wife is Chinese, and very highly educated. She imparted onto my children a very serious emphasis on school work and I am thankful that she did. My older boy (LHP), a history major, has made honor roll every semester in college, earning a perfect 4.0 this past semester. My younger boy is taking mathematics at West Point. My daughter (17) is talking about becoming reconstructive surgeon and passed the SAT in the top 20% of h.s. seniors when she was only 12.

As for me, I was the first in my family to ever get a college degree!

I can tell you there's nothing mysterious about Chinese culture. My wife's family stays connected with each other's lives. They are always there for each other, very involved in the lives of their children, and they all are living very American lives with tons of American friends. Amongst them are Microsoft engineers, school teachers and symphony artists. All with advanced degrees.

The secret is this: Sacrifice for your children.

Bob,

The groups of Japanese ballplayers in the stands were among the most memorable aspects of our time with your team on Kyushu (one among many). I can still see and hear them cheering wildly in unison as a block for their baseball academy's best players, who were representing their prefecture on the field against our visiting team of U.S. players.

All of us were struck by the fact that they would leave their homes for the baseball academies as early in life as they would to devote themselves to hours of baseball each day wrapped around their classes. If I recall correctly, they would come home one week a year to visit.

While one can debate forever the appropriateness of the approach from the standpoint of adolescent development and family relationships, one thing was obvious: it produced players who were rather remarkable in their ability to execute on the field.

quote:

Originally posted by RJM:
Can kids be raised soft? Absolutely. I see it in our community. Can they be raised too rigidly? Of course. There may be a model for success in the posted story. But there should be a happy medium.

Good post.

This quote from the WSJ article caught my eye:

"That's why the solution to substandard performance is always to excoriate, punish and shame the child. The Chinese parent believes that their child will be strong enough to take the shaming and to improve from it."

Having counseled people of Asian heritage who grew up under this kind of shaming, I can tell you the long-term effects are not pretty or insignificant.

I told my 13yo daughter about this while bringing her home from dance. Needless to say the approach didn't hold much appeal for her.

quote:

Originally posted by CADad:
I told my 13yo daughter about this while bringing her home from dance. Needless to say the approach didn't hold much appeal for her.

Obviously you didn't tell her in nearly strong enough terms, or she would have liked it.


One of my favorite sayings to this day, remains...

The beatings will continue until morale improves.

Don't buy the results of the so called study. Too small a sampling for one thing. My wife & I both are friends with many Asian (including naturalized Chinese) couples with children, & the upbringing of their children is far from this rigorous. As an American law professor of Asian decent, sure one can sit in the splendor of New Haven, CT academia and come up with such a study, but is it newsworthy with anyone other than elitists?

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Corner Dad:
This quote from the WSJ article caught my eye:

"That's why the solution to substandard performance is always to excoriate, punish and shame the child. The Chinese parent believes that their child will be strong enough to take the shaming and to improve from it."

Having counseled people of Asian heritage who grew up under this kind of shaming, I can tell you the long-term effects are not pretty or insignificant.

I was going to ask, for every brilliant kid pushed hard to the upper end of brilliance, how many kids end up emotionally damaged. I remember when people pointed to Tiger Woods as a positive example of being pushed from early childhood. How's that story going now? How about Todd Marinovich? Jennifer Capriatti? Brittney Spears?