B.A.'s top 25..more of the same

2009 Preseason Top 25

1. Texas A&M
2. Louisiana State
3. North Carolina
4. Texas
5. Cal State Fullerton
6. Mississippi
7. Rice
8. Baylor
9. UC Irvine
10. Missouri
11. San Diego
12. UCLA
13. Arizona State
14. Georgia
15. Stanford
16. Oklahoma
17. Pepperdine
18. Kent State
19. Clemson
20. Georgia Tech
21. Alabama
22. Arkansas
23. Louisville
24. Florida State
25. Oregon State

Baseball America Pre Season Top 25

There are quite a few west coast teams in BA pre season poll...2 in top 10.

Nice start...but in Baseball we prove who is the best by playing on the field.

OK, here comes my completely biased comment...

I cannot take a BA poll terribly seriously ever since they ranked Stanford behind Miami at the end of last year...despite Stanford's 8-3 win over Miami in their only meeting...on neutral turf in Omaha.

Thats not letting it be decided on the playing field.

Watch out for Santa Clara, UC Davis, Cal, USC, Arizona...and oh yeah, Fresno State (again) this year.

As for rankings I see it this way;

Did you win your conference?
Did you get to the regionals?
Did you get to the Super Regionals?
Did you make it to the CWS?

Other than that it is all conjecture especially at this point in time in the season

JBB, I could not understand how Miami got ranked higher than Stanford after you had just beat them!

BA and Rivals are not polls but rather opinions of Fitt and Rogers who are not really West Coast fans unless it is too obvious that they have to rank them over them, even at that they still don't, which really makes them look bad.

Was wondering if anybody knew if BA ranked Div. #2 as well or just Div. #1?

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Stop your Left Coast whining will you?...

...four DI wins in five years by West Coast teams was a statistical anomolie...an aberration...particularly when you consider that we stuffed you all together in the same regionals to get rid of you and your kind early......

Furthermore...I don't want to talk to you no more, you empty headed animal food trough wipers. I **** in your general direction. Your mothers were hamsters and your fathers smelt of elderberries.

44
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Polls are fun but the telling is in the playing.
Who will be the last team on the field in Omaha ?

Fitt and Rogers can't see every team on a weekly basis...they have to rely on coaching inputs and scout inputs...we all have our bias...I can spin any discussion into my bias I have as well...

O44: How's your coffee there bullwinkle?
Bullwinkle: Are you implying that your dunkin' donuts coffee is better than my starbucks?
O44: What?
Bullwinkle: Just look at the SOS and ISR's...starbucks is higher ranked than your dunkin' donuts. You got no grounds to stand on. (that's a pun for the dim witted)
O44: Bull....I'm from California.
Bullwinkle: yeah...east California.

BA is just for giggles my friends....NCAA baseball invites the 64 for a real tournament...not like the BCS bowl system...have fun and head's up!

quote:

Originally posted by Bullwinkle:
....NCAA baseball invites the 64 for a real tournament...not like the BCS bowl system...have fun and head's up!

Problem is, the NCAA gets their 64 a bit wrong too. Fresno State a 4-seed in a regional?

No Oregon State, Santa Clara, etc... at all? Double -

quote:

Originally posted by justbaseball:

quote:

Originally posted by Bullwinkle:
....NCAA baseball invites the 64 for a real tournament...not like the BCS bowl system...have fun and head's up!

Problem is, the NCAA gets their 64 a bit wrong too. Fresno State a 4-seed in a regional?

No Oregon State, Santa Clara, etc... at all? Double -

I don't really think it was all that ridiculous that Fresno State was a four seed....by my count they were 33-27 before their conference tourney, and 37-27 after winning four in a row to take the WAC title. They were a solid team who got hot at the right time and couldn't be stopped. Maybe you could have made a case for a three seed, but a four certainly wasn't absurd, as you're making it seem.

If you lived out here and got to see them play, believe me...it was absurd, very absurd. Every team out here knew they did NOT want them in their regional. That opinion was well-known out West before they went on their great run. No one, let me repeat, no one who knew...ever wanted them in their regional.

And that point/opinion was ultimately driven home very hard to LBSU/ASU/Rice/LSU/UNC and UGa.

I understand preseason rankings are tough, but leaving out Oklahoma State is pretty questionable. They are going to get their ace back at some point in the season. If he is there to start the season, they are worthy of a top-10 ranking. If the courts' decision holds up and he returns about 70% into the season, they are still a top-25 team.

I've heard publications talk about their lack of offense, and while they did lose some key offensive weapons, reloading the bats has NEVER been a problem in Stillwater. They will be just fine on offense, and they will have possibly the best 1-2 punch on the mound.

If you want a true preseason ranking, check out Rivals. Kendall Rogers knows his stuff.

These rankings are a lot of fun to see who is ranked preseason top 25 and who ends up in the actual 25. Lot of it based on who has more experienced players and who is coaching.

I try not to put too much stock or thought into the BA poll. I instead choose to look at the Collegiate Baseball Poll.

http://www.baseball-news.com/polls/divI/currentpolldivI.htm

I still think Boyds World gets it closer to right than anyone else...once the season gets rolling. Can't believe his stuff is still free.

I once emailed back-and-forth with him on something and he's a pretty interesting guy.

I agree with you justbaseball, that guy has it over all of them (for free), but you do have to follow it all season.

quote:

Originally posted by plash3:
Was wondering if anybody knew if BA ranked Div. #2 as well or just Div. #1?

Plash, here is a source for DII polls:

Baseball News

This guy has been putting in some work as well, he has the side by side comparisons of the rankings/polls:

SE Baseball

quote:

Originally posted by justbaseball:
I still think Boyds World gets it closer to right than anyone else...once the season gets rolling. Can't believe his stuff is still free.

I once emailed back-and-forth with him on something and he's a pretty interesting guy.

His stuff is fun, statistically sound, and a place you can look at numbers without regional bias. Some of his formulas are "interesting" and they guy would be fun to sit with at a computer with a 12 pack of cokes and big bag of seeds.

quote:

Originally posted by observer44:
...I don't want to talk to you no more, you empty headed animal food trough wipers. I **** in your general direction. Your mothers were hamsters and your fathers smelt of elderberries.
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OBS, this made me lauff (that's British laughing) BECAUSE.....I just directed a 'sanitized celebration' of MP and the HG here at the school I work at. AND I got to play the Head Kinight Who Says Ni! My daughter was Roger the Shrubber and the Villager who allegedly got turned into a newt ... but got bettuh.

O44: Is this Korea?

Krak: No it's Heaven, see I got to play the Head Kinight Who Says Ni! My daughter was Roger the Shrubber and the Villager who allegedly got turned into a newt ... but got bettuh. .

O44: My God, this IS Heaven.

Krak: Never mind....it's still just Korea.

OBS44... you have a PM......

Preseason rankings are kinda like the first inning of a baseball game - interesting but it doesn't mean that much. The score after the game is played, or Omaha is done, is all that matters in the end.

Just for kicks, perhaps we should start an over/under on how many western teams get invited to the dance in June, and how many make it to Omaha. I'm betting that at least three of the teams in Omaha will hail from the Pac-10, Big West, WCC or WAC this year, and I won't be surprised if it is more than that despite the committe stacking the odds against them.

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Ah, yes Krak, technical difficulties...

The rest of my post...

JB...You got that right...Boyd is THE college baseball statistical God. For the record, and I am sure that you know this, I remember when Boyd also had some pretty amazing individual player stats. So amazing that MLB scooped them up for themselves...likley allows him to continue...and thankfully considering my "Boyd's addiction....already loving the ISS numbers!

Thrash...DO really appreciate the effort that Kendall puts in...even if he got my designated conference a bit off...no matter seasons end will tell!

Winkle...North, South, East or West...makes no difference...this country "runs" on Dunkin...and I aint talking about your high end Starbucks Bullwinkle blend Swill...aint no half-Bullwinkle-Calf, slim-shady-latte, avacado-Macchiato, mucho-mocha, pasta-Con-Panne, cuppa-Cappuccino. No, this is the official coffee of Dirty Jobs "Brown". The kind that makes you look like this after you down a cup.. 44

.

Yeah!

Avocado-Macchiato is back!

I’ll have a vente skinny zuanto macchiato with an extra shot no whip.

Thanks O44…here’s a tip for you my barista baseball buddy.

Look for fours team out of the Big West to make the regionals. As you said on another site...mark my words.

Ever read a newspaper article about something you know a lot about...for example...about something related to your job? Ever notice how it has a number of inaccuracies that kinda irk you? But yet when we read something we don't know a ton about, we sort of assume its accurate.

This isn't much different. We all respect BA (I do), get mad at it a little from time-to-time (hey, we're fans!) , and read it nearly every day...trusting what they say. But how much work goes into one of these polls? My assumption is was a lot...and that they get information from scouts and coaches. But I guess I don't know.

Then today I saw this...which may well be very true(?) and yes, I admit made me feel a little sad...

quote:

Stanford Starting Pitching: The Cardinal reached Omaha last year with a rotation that included one power arm (Inman), two innings-eaters without dominant stuff (Erik Davis and Austin Yount) and an electric lefty who served as a reinforcement down the stretch (Jeremy Bleich).....

...and I figured thats what the scouts say and said to myself, 'OK pops!, check your emotions at the door!'

But then I started (with an assist from a friend reading the same article and in particular the Stanford summary) and there were several significant errors...

* Identified one of the probable starting pitchers as an LHP when in fact he is an RHP (typo? maybe? But he played a key role in the CWS run down the stretch and its the type of error on a returning key player that shouldn't be there IMO).
* Identified a key senior player as a 'solid left-handed bat.' Problem is, he's a right-handed bat (and been hitting from that side all 4 years)!
* And there were a few other *opinions* about other key players that don't jibe too well with what most would believe...positive or negative

Additionally....

* BA identified a key player for another team...problem is that key player left school 3 months ago or so...gone. Will not be a factor...anywhere this season. When was the article written?

These are just facts about two programs I know an awful lot about. Two of these facts are really easily known...no scout necessary...just look at the roster. Do the sum of the mistakes (pluses and minuses) add up to the same rating in the end? Don't know. Are there an equal number of mistakes on every other team? If so, that adds up to at least 50-60 mistakes for the top-25!

And so how much research really goes into these polls? Probably a fair amount, but its kinda like that newspaper article about something everyone else assumes is true...but you know it just isn't so...Joe!

Polls are for kicks...we all know that. Even at my advancing age I pay too much attention to them. But I just got another reminder with just two teams in this article that the real facts are evasive. Just something to think about.

OS8 - I just saw your post after hitting the "Post" button on mine. Yes, I had seen your son mentioned nicely and I will choose to believe the accolades are completely accurate and well-deserved!

Have a great and fun season!

I am completely on board with justbb on this one as it relates to the Stanford scouting report.
First, there isn't/wasn't any reason for BA to make the reference they did about Erik Davis. It was downright obnoxious. More importantly, it was/is FALSE.
Until he began to wear down in late May from heavy innings and several straight complete games, Erik was the foundation for Stanford's resurgence into a top 10 program. He did this when the pitcher BA puts on a pedestal was unable to pitch. Erik picked up his team. He did not eat innings. He pitched brilliantly. He pitched complete games. He gave Stanford a chance to win in every game he pitched. He got the big outs when they needed them and he created a sense they could not/would not lose...and they didn't.
BA is considered by many to be the foremost authority when it comes to college baseball. Almost every one will read that review and feel BA must be right. Well, BA owes it to their readership. They charge handsomely. If they don't know the obvious, which hand a kid uses to pitch and the side he uses to swing the bat, what validity should we give their opinions on items relating to how the game is played.
Personally, I think BA opened major questions about the quality of their work with that Stanford summary.
I will not hide that justbb is my friend. I have great respect for him. When Erik struggled early in his college career, he didn't hide from it. When Erik had such great success last season, he didn't gloat in that.
I have season tickets behind home plate at Sunken and saw Erik pitch each week they were at home.
I watched his 90-92mph fastball, followed by the 76-78 change, that looked exactly the same coming out of his hand.
There isn't anyone close to Stanford baseball who does not agree they made it to Omaha last Spring because Erik Davis put them on his shoulders. He didn't just pitch them there, he emotionally led them there.
If BA cannot do a better job with its scouting and reports, it does not deserve our money, support or readership.
There, now I feel better.

That's one of the reasons I don't pay anything to Baseball America. I'm glad they cover college baseball, but honestly, they aren't even close to Rivals when it comes to the content. Add to that the fact Rivals is free now, and it makes it a no-brainer.

quote:

Then today I saw this...which may well be very true(?) and yes, I admit made me feel a little sad...


quote:
Stanford Starting Pitching: The Cardinal reached Omaha last year with a rotation that included one power arm (Inman), two innings-eaters without dominant stuff (Erik Davis and Austin Yount) and an electric lefty who served as a reinforcement down the stretch (Jeremy Bleich).....

That would make me sad also.

quote:

Stanford Starting Pitching: The Cardinal reached Omaha last year with a rotation that included one power arm (Inman), two innings-eaters without dominant stuff (Erik Davis and Austin Yount) and an electric lefty who served as a reinforcement down the stretch (Jeremy Bleich).....

That is total bullsh*t imho justbb. I was stupified when I read that because I knew how dominant Erik was last year against the top competition in the nation. Anybody who follows college baseball knows Stanford would not have made it to Omaha last year without Erik's outstanding contribution. That tells me they don't know that much about college baseball - Aaron and John that is. Actually, I am more suspicious about Aaron than of John.

Question:

Do you baseball fans know how to tell which poll is the most accurate?

Answer:

It is the one that ranks "your" team the highest

That is total BS.

Infielddad already said it all, so I feel much better to. Thanks

quote:

Justbaseball quote"
Additionally....

* BA identified a key player for another team...problem is that key player left school 3 months ago or so...gone. Will not be a factor...anywhere this season. When was the article written?

These are just facts about two programs I know an awful lot about. Two of these facts are really easily known...no scout necessary...just look at the roster. Do the sum of the mistakes (pluses and minuses) add up to the same rating in the end? Don't know. Are there an equal number of mistakes on every other team? If so, that adds up to at least 50-60 mistakes for the top-25! Eek

And so how much research really goes into these polls? Probably a fair amount, but its kinda like that newspaper article about something everyone else assumes is true...but you know it just isn't so...Joe

IMO the poll issues are only a result of the BIG problem. College baseball media, because of it's ineptness may be a big reason the sport is not as popular nation wide. BA is supposed to be one of the best. I'm not talking about geographical readership numbers I'm talking writers and staff. While the main writers can handle their own we all know that the contributing writers, editors, and proofers is what makes a magazine special and authoritative. My money says that many in those positions for at BA are young people who didn't get hired for a football job. Not a personal rip on them only an opinion based on quality.

Is it a popular magazine nation wide? Here's an interesting poll.

Who sees the BA magazine in stores, other than the chain book stores?

This is another reason this web site is the best, knowledgeable people correcting an injustice by a supposedly reputable magazine. Although I know very little about Stanford Baseball, I know and trust my friends here on the hsbw. Great Job and best of luck to Eric Davis.

Another stupid thing about that poll is....Arkansas. I know college teams can change a lot from year to year, BUT! Arkansas had no business being among the 64 teams invited to the regionals last year, and here they are among the top 25 pre-season. A joke, IMO.

Watch out for Oklahoma State this year

go pokes

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I've heard they've got a 48ct. in their dugout. How is their overall team speed?