Bible study after practice?

Will I would rather the coach use that extra time after practice to get in some extra work with the players who want it and also need it. And that extra work would be baseball related since this is baseball and not church.

The coach to the players "Anyone wanting to attend the FCA "Fellowship of Christian Athletes" meetings can contact _______ and they meet __________. Now practice is over and anyone wanting some extra baseball instruction feel free to stay and work with coach ________. Everyone else drive home safely and I will see you tomorrow."

When I got out of basic training as a young man no older than some of these HS baseball players I was assigned to tech training. I reported there with a more than healthy respect for officers having just come out of basic training. I was ushered into the commanders office (normally this would be done by the first sergeant) where he welcomed me to the squadron and then asked me if I'd like to buy some girl scout cookies. You better believe I bought some. It was "optional".

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where he welcomed me to the squadron and then asked me if I'd like to buy some girl scout cookies.

Thin Mints are the best followed by Samoa's imho

Trouble is, like the times we live in, Girl scout cookies are not the same as they used to be--there is less mint in the Thin Mint Cookies--still good but not quite the same

TR,
True, but back then even though I couldn't afford them from a financial standpoint, I could afford them from a calories standpoint. Now, I can afford them from a financial standpoint but can't from a calories standpoint. (I still eat them.)

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since this is baseball and not church.

Just reminded me of a funny line... a kid slides into second base and this necklace he's wearing pops out from under his jersey. The umps says, 'hey is that a religious medal?" the kid says, 'no, it's a baseball thing,' he starts to take it off. the ump says, 'it's pretty much the same thing, just tuck it under your shirt there would you.'

I'm not all about the Bible Study thing BUT nothing wrong with the Coach inserting some religion from time to time.

It's a good thing! And everyone needs to remember why we are all here!

I will reiterate--religion has no place on the baseball field

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Originally posted by Coach Milburn:
I'm not all about the Bible Study thing BUT nothing wrong with the Coach inserting some religion from time to time.

It's a good thing! And everyone needs to remember why we are all here!

And whose religion would you insert Coach?

Agree with the above comment, there's no need for it.

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I will reiterate--religion has no place on the baseball field

How about inserting 4 letter words in everyother sentence....no place for that on the baseball field either? Or is that "part of the game" as I've been frequently told.

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Originally posted by Coach Milburn:
I'm not all about the Bible Study thing BUT nothing wrong with the Coach inserting some religion from time to time.

It's a good thing! And everyone needs to remember why we are all here!

Which religion would you insert? What would you say in relation to religion? I'm curious just so I know who will be offended. Maybe you could teach the players about creationism versus evolution.

If you insert religion into the team at most public schools you will be fired the second time you do it. My son is there to play baseball. He can attend religious services where playing baseball during the service is frowned on.

RJM, maybe Coach Milburn is talking about religious values and virtues that are common to many different religions? I didn't see where he said he was pushing one particular religion.

Exactly who would be offended if Coach Milburn is talking about the value of honesty and sincerity, compassion and love, sacrifice and selflessness, a sense of justice and a sense of fairness, patience and perseverance, human dignity and mutual respect, modesty and humility, moderation and restraint, a sense of balance, and a sense of propriety?

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Exactly who would be offended if Coach Milburn is talking about the value of honesty and sincerity, compassion and love, sacrifice and selflessness, a sense of justice and a sense of fairness, patience and perseverance, human dignity and mutual respect, modesty and humility, moderation and restraint, a sense of balance, and a sense of propriety?

Now we're getting into morality. Who's sense of morality is the right one? The sense of morality may be far different based on religious and political persuasions. A baseball coach needs to stick to coaching baseball. A player can learn plenty about life just watching his coach lead, being part of a team and playing the game. Let's stick to my family teaching my kids religious and moral values.

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Exactly who would be offended if Coach Milburn is talking about the value of honesty and sincerity, compassion and love, sacrifice and selflessness, a sense of justice and a sense of fairness, patience and perseverance, human dignity and mutual respect, modesty and humility, moderation and restraint, a sense of balance, and a sense of propriety?

Actually that is a parents job. If we have done our job, a coach should not have to deal with these issues.
Every team my son played with had a set of rules. You had them explained to you and you followed them or paid a price. No need for a coach to do anything other than enforce the stated rules.
I can't remember a coach ever inflicting religion on players other than college.
Pray to your God but stay out of our face. This issue has been dealt with in the courts years ago. We who don't believe have the right to not be preached to optional or not.

What of that could possibly offend you or anyone you are hypothetically protecting? Are you really saying you don't think team performance and chemistry isn't better on the field if everyone on the team buys into honesty and sincerity, sacrifice and selflessness, sense of fairness, patience and perseverance, human dignity and mutual respect, humility,and restraint being shared values amoung teammates? You can't teach baseball in a vacuum. Basic, shared values are essential to team performance.

Like it or not, real life goes on in, around and on the baseball field. I understand your point Bobblehead. I wasn't suggesting inflicting religion on anyone. But, we see examples all the time where key things like that are missing. Watch the nightly news for a week. If you go back and read my posts, I said I thought the way this was gone about was a bad idea. It's shocking to me any parent would be offended if a coach talked to his team about honesty, sincerity, compassion, sacrifice, justice, fairness, patience, perseverance being good things that will make your life and the lives of those you are around better.

TX that is a parents job period.

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TX that is a parents job period.

Parents say they like professional coaches for their select teams because their kid won't listen to them but will listen to a professional coach. Same with pitching lessons, same with hitting lessons. I didn't realize that didn't apply to life lessons. I appreciate the reinforcement from my son's coach. I don't think he's out to undermine me.

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Originally posted by Tx-Husker:

Exactly who would be offended if Coach Milburn is talking about the value of honesty and sincerity, compassion and love, sacrifice and selflessness, a sense of justice and a sense of fairness, patience and perseverance, human dignity and mutual respect, modesty and humility, moderation and restraint, a sense of balance, and a sense of propriety?

All good virtues Tx but everyone of those values can be addressed and implemented without the mention or involvement of a god. Especially by a coach at a public school. God, religion or the bible do not have monopoly of teaching good behavior and principles. Those values without the prejudice of a particular religion have more meaning IMO. Living by those standards because you believe them rather than because a person or book tell you to leaves less chance of hypocrisy.

Play ball at the field. Do religion at the mosque, synagogue or church. Or private school if it's important to pray on the field.

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All good virtues Tx but everyone of those values can be addressed and implemented without the mention or involvement of a god. God, religion or the bible do not have monopoly of teaching good behavior and principles.

That was exactly my point. Glad you agree. No where will you see I have said a public school coach should be pushing a specific religion over others. People throw the term "bible study" around a lot when it's not really the bible or a specific religion belief being studied.

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Originally posted by Tx-Husker:
honesty and sincerity, sacrifice and selflessness, sense of fairness, patience and perseverance, human dignity and mutual respect, humility,and restraint

Tx-Husker, I think these virtues are wonderful things for a coach or anyone else in authority to teach and model. In fact, for a team to succeed I think many of these virtues must be present. Looks like there is much for us to agree upon in this discussion.

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I didn't realize that didn't apply to life lessons.

My son and 3 daughters listen to us,their parents. None of them are religious, non of them were married in a church and non of them ever got into even minor trouble. All of them are close and tell each other they love each other. No fights , no calls from people saying they did something they shouldn't. Nothing but glowing compliments.

Congratulations

My son's high school baseball coach is a professional baseball coach. He is paid to coach baseball. My son's pastor (son is a Christian) is a professional pastor. He's paid to preach morals and values. I don't want the baseball coaching preaching values to my son. I don't want the pastor teaching him baseball.

Besides, who says coaches get it right. Read this statement. “First I want to make it clear that I did nothing wrong and this resignation should in no way infer to anyone an admission of improper actions."

Now read the article. The charges in the article brought the coach down. There was also an affair with the married mother of a high school player and several alledged inappropriate advances at female athletes.

story

You're not reading anything I'm writing, RJM. But, you're doing a great job reading things into what I'm writing. Exactly where did I say all coaches are good or all religions are good (or bad)? No one is perfect. If that were a requirement, none of us are qualified to parent our own kids, let alone coach a team.

So based on your statement there needs to be a vetting process of which coaches are moral enough to be involved in the moral teachings of the players. I prefer baseball coaches stick to coaching baseball. It avoids all the problems. It avoids offending anyone's religious and moral beliefs that conflict with the coach's belief system. The players sign up to be coached in baseball, not for the baseball coach to preach morals and values. The only thing parents are looking for other than coaching is the coach conduct himself properly based on the rules and expectations set forth by the school board, not god.

Hey TX -- You asked about 4-letter words being a part of the game. Here are a few choice ones I love to hear around the ball field:

Play, Hard, Team, Hits, Bunt, Runs, Outs, BALL!, RBIs, C'mon!, Gooo!,

I agree there are some others we could probably use to hear less frequently


"You know, once you get that 3rd strike on you, it gets awfully hard to battle back." Mr. Baseball

Save your breath, RJM. I'm done with your jesuit debate. Later.

I think good and bad coaches is a diffeent issue.
The virtues mentioned are not exclusive to any particular religion.

Have you noticed every high school baseball coach who weighed in on this thread said the same thing? "Keep religion out of baseball."

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Originally posted by RJM:
"Keep religion out of baseball."

Probably not going to happen, you'd be taking players rights away. Some like making the Catholic prayer sign at times, some take off their baseball hats and pray, some look up to the Heavens and give God the glory while others thank him in their live post game interviews.

That's personal. I'm talking about open team situations led by the coach.

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Originally posted by Tx-Husker:
RJM, maybe Coach Milburn is talking about religious values and virtues that are common to many different religions? I didn't see where he said he was pushing one particular religion.

There are values and virtues and then there are religious values and virtues, correct? BTW, Coach Milburn didn't answer the question asked, so unless he does answer I am going to assume he meant the religion he may practice.

I don't want any coach teaching my son the 10 commandments, the same as I wouldn't expect his math teacher (or any other)to do the same. I want them to teach him how to pitch, hit, field, mental toughness (which may include some life lessons along the way) and how to be a better player and teammate. I expect if he hands out rules about drinking and drugs it will pertain to that in relation to baseball. As far as morals, values and virtues, unless I know the morals, values and virtues (and I don't trust many) of that person, that's left to us.

Now I know that every so often there are circumstances where a player needs some guidance, how many athletes have we heard say that if it wasn't for one particular coach they would have lost their way. That happens and that's ok. But I want my son's coaches to coach, not parent.

IB,
I don't think that is what RJM meant. JMO.

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Originally posted by Tx-Husker:
RJM, maybe Coach Milburn is talking about religious values and virtues that are common to many different religions? I didn't see where he said he was pushing one particular religion.

Exactly who would be offended if Coach Milburn is talking about the value of honesty and sincerity, compassion and love, sacrifice and selflessness, a sense of justice and a sense of fairness, patience and perseverance, human dignity and mutual respect, modesty and humility, moderation and restraint, a sense of balance, and a sense of propriety?

Good deal Tx-Husker, that's pretty simple stuff that you shared, is it not?

If everyone followed those basic principals, would not this world be a better place?

Seems to me like it is. Like it or not, ALL coaches teach their teams morality. Following signs, laying down bunts, executing plays, shaking hands after the game, allowing fights to break out, throwing at hitters, etc, etc.

I never said the coach should teach about Jesus, Budda, or anyone else. Dinner time!

Final thought ...

There are some major religions out there and they all have their leaders (Buddah, Muslin etc) but you can go to their grave sites to find their bodies but when you go to the tomb of Jesus Christ he is not there because "He has Risen".

quote:

Originally posted by Coach Milburn:
I'm not all about the Bible Study thing BUT nothing wrong with the Coach inserting some religion from time to time.

It's a good thing! And everyone needs to remember why we are all here!

Coach,
Not so easy there, you did say religion, or did you not mean to say that?

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Originally posted by Coach Milburn:
Final thought ...

There are some major religions out there and they all have their leaders (Buddah, Muslin etc) but you can go to their grave sites to find their bodies but when you go to the tomb of Jesus Christ he is not there because "He has Risen".

What exactly does this have to do with the topic coach?

Actually you just brought a religious belief into the topic, everyone else has been pretty good about not bringing up anything specific in regards to religion.

I think, IMO, this is a very good example of why there should be a seperation between sports and religion, wouldn't you agree?

quote:

Originally posted by Coach Milburn:
Final thought ...

There are some major religions out there and they all have their leaders (Buddah, Muslin etc) but you can go to their grave sites to find their bodies but when you go to the tomb of Jesus Christ he is not there because "He has Risen".

Right here is where it gets OFFENSIVE and INTOLERANT if you bring that into the dugout and force it on those who don't believe it. To believe it yourself is religious. To push it on someone else (players) who don't believe it is arrogant.

I think you purposely made this post either to get a rise out of some poster or to offend someone. If you're pushing "He has risen" on me, I'm offended. It means you're intolerant and lack respect for my religious beliefs. The difference between us is I respect what you believe and your right to believe it. Your religion is not one bit better than mine. Nor is mine better than yours.

Anytime you bring relgion and politics into it your asking for trouble. Its a game. It should be about the game. And this site it much better when we are spending our time talking about the game and those who play it instead of venturing off into these type of topics that bring in so much emotion.

Amen