Bogeyorpar's D3 Academic-Baseball College Ranking

I had too much turkey and nothing else to do during the Thanksgiving weekend, so I decided to create a college ranking system that reflect both academic and baseball strength. The formula is very simple:

1. Take academic ranking from WSJ/Times 2017 College Ranking. The reason: this list ranks universities and LACs and Regionals together, so we don't have the problem of Williams/Amherst ranking the same as Princeton/Harvard.

2. Take D3 ranking from Massey Rating system. It ranks 380 D3 programs based on 2016 season win-lose record and strength of schedule.

3. Use 70% academic and 30% of baseball, based on the popular "40 years vs 4 years" argument, to rank the colleges.

Personally I think this list makes a lot of sense to me. Let me know what you think. I can tweak the formula easily if there's a better way to calculate (e.g. 60-40 or 80-20? Any other factors to add?)

Anyway, here are the top 100 D3 Academic-Baseball colleges resulting from the calculations:

 

Ranking          College          Academic Baseball Index

1Emory University17613.7
2Washington University in St Louis114721.8
3Tufts University271724
4Massachusetts Institute of Technology27824.8
5Johns Hopkins University117730.8
6Case Western Reserve University323031.4
7Pomona College287040.6
8Haverford College377648.7
9Amherst College2310948.8
10Trinity University73151.4
11University of Chicago1316257.7
12Occidental College84460
13Wesleyan University4510462.7
14Bowdoin College4413270.4
15Grinnell College785370.5
16Denison University836176.4
17Williams College2220677.2
18Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology924377.3
19Swarthmore College3418278.4
20Claremont McKenna College4617484.4
21Worcester Polytechnic Institute7012686.8
22The College of Wooster1172288.5
23Stevens Institute of Technology997491.5
24DePauw University9110093.7
25University of Rochester5818094.6
26Washington and Lee University1097598.8
27Hamilton College6019399.9
28New York University33278106.5
29Middlebury College36272106.8
30Trinity College65205107
31Macalester College67202107.5
32Carleton College37274108.1
33California Institute of Technology10350112
34Union College102137112.5
35Babson College114118115.2
36Brandeis University89185117.8
37Oberlin College62260121.4
38Franklin & Marshall College100173121.9
39Willamette University15939123
40Rhodes College15062123.6
41Colby College66279129.9
42Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute78254130.8
43Allegheny College144110133.8
44Vassar College75273134.4
45Wheaton College (Massachusetts)16663135.1
46Ohio Northern University147112136.5
47Bates College102218136.8
48Kenyon College94240137.8
49University of Puget Sound17066138.8
50Dickinson College123179139.8
51Susquehanna University17071140.3
52Illinois Wesleyan University159103142.2
53Gettysburg College125183142.4
54Clarkson University136175147.7
55Rutgers University-Newark141176151.5
56Rochester Institute of Technology128212153.2
57Gustavus Adolphus College144181155.1
58Ithaca College19482160.4
59Chapman University22324163.3
60Ohio Wesleyan University20087166.1
61Marietta College22140166.7
62Kalamazoo College172156167.2
63The College of New Jersey23826174.4
64Whitman College185150174.5
65Earlham College204108175.2
66Centre College147249177.6
67Washington College207117180
68St Olaf College155247182.6
69Lewis & Clark College182190184.4
70Augustana College (Illinois)24156185.5
71Wheaton College (Illinois)215121186.8
72Skidmore College139303188.2
73Southwestern University24072189.6
74Wabash College186199189.9
75Washington & Jefferson College210143189.9
76Muhlenberg College186207192.3
77Rutgers University-Camden26246197.2
78Sewanee-The University of the South162297202.5
79Ursinus College174271203.1
80Beloit College226165207.7
81Suffolk University25697208.3
82Albion College182276210.2
83Luther College27369211.8
84Hope College235158211.9
85Widener University252119212.1
86Yeshiva University141379212.4
87Austin College207231214.2
88Pacific Lutheran University30311215.4
89St Mary's University28858219
90St Lawrence University186299219.9
91Catholic University of America233194221.3
92University of Scranton210257224.1
93Alma College267128225.3
94John Carroll University273123228
95University of Redlands31525228
96Hampden-Sydney College30552229.1
97Cornell College254177230.9
98Hendrix College29096231.8
99Knox College202317236.5
100Pacific University33120237.7
 (Updated with missing data fixes)
Original Post

Awesome indexed list Bogeyorpar. 

There is a certain poster on this website who asked me for some "mentoring" back in November 2015.   Initially interested in Ivys, I kept telling him to hammer away at the upper echelon of D3 schools on Bogeyorpar's list (before it came out).  The index has validated my thoughts and recommendations.  This young man has overwhelming grades and he's a pretty good & versatile baseball player too.  While some schools (in the same conference) went cold on him, he kept at it and coming back to me for more thoughts.   Finally, late in the Fall 2016 recruiting cycle one of those top schools contacted him (they are always consistently & historically late in the recruiting game) and they told him they wanted him.  He committed.  With a 70% academic weighting, I think Bogerorpar's list it weighted about right for the right balance with baseball....however this young man's school would be higher if academics were weighted more.  This school was most interested in his academics and I see HUGE things ahead for him in life.  When I saw this list, I thought of him.  He is mature, humble beyond his years and a pretty good baseball player whether he is catching, playing MIF or OF.  Steal some bases for me J!

Great list.  Thanks for making the effort and time.  When you balance the quantitative (stats and facts and data) with the qualitative (fit, feel, "going where loved") -- a our kids have a great chance at success both in baseball and in life.  

Cool stuff!  You made better use of your time than me. All I have to show for my efforts is some leftover Turkey Pho with stuffing balls.

At a glance, at the very least, this is a more sensible list than the one you linked to a few weeks ago.  One could quibble about this school or that, but there are no obvious groaners.  It would be a great list to use as a starting point for further research by prospective D3 players and families. I suggest that the admins find a home for it so that newbies can easily find it or be directed to it.

I want to reiterate my appreciation for Bogey's work!  Bishop Lefty  and I have been discussing another, complicating thought for a list like this, and one that may be impossible to quantify without first hand knowledge:  Admin support for athletics in general, and baseball in particular.  Some schools on my son's original list are on Bogey's list but do not seem to provide a lot of support for their athletes.  Some provide a lot. 

Smoke, I was having similar thoughts  about how the baseball rankings skew toward current winning percentage, which will fluctuate quite a lot, and which doesn't necessarily translate into the overall baseball experience.  Things like the field, the fans, the athletic center, transportation, weather, coaching are not addressed. And on the other side of the ledger, affordability, aid, etc.  So I think it's a great list, but it's going to churn a bit, so unless BogiePar updates it,  it will be out of date in a year.  

But as a starting point for families looking to research D3 baseball opportunities, I think this list is as good as I have seen.

Bogie, maybe while you're digesting your Christmas dinner you could come up with a high-academic D1 Baseball list to replace that dang Tier 1 list.

Bogeyorpar posted:

...so I decided to create a college ranking system that reflect both academic and baseball strength. ...

Very cool.  For the sake of discussion...  Since the chart is designed (I think) to help those who are seeking the best options that include both academics and baseball, maybe it would make sense to have a disqualifier for those schools that are ranked particularly low in either category.  For example, if either the academic or baseball score is in the bottom 30%, they would not qualify.  So, a rank of 265 or lower in either would eliminate them from being listed.

smokeminside posted:

I want to reiterate my appreciation for Bogey's work!  Bishop Lefty  and I have been discussing another, complicating thought for a list like this, and one that may be impossible to quantify without first hand knowledge:  Admin support for athletics in general, and baseball in particular.  Some schools on BP's list were on my son's original list are on Bogey's list but do not seem to provide a lot of support for their athletes.  Some provide a lot. 

Yes. However, to make the list work, we'll have to quantify the qualitative side of things. If we can add columns of "facility/support/coaching" ranking, it will be great.

JCG posted:

Smoke, I was having similar thoughts  about how the baseball rankings skew toward current winning percentage, which will fluctuate quite a lot, and which doesn't necessarily translate into the overall baseball experience.  Things like the field, the fans, the athletic center, transportation, weather, coaching are not addressed. And on the other side of the ledger, affordability, aid, etc.  So I think it's a great list, but it's going to churn a bit, so unless BogiePar updates it,  it will be out of date in a year.  

But as a starting point for families looking to research D3 baseball opportunities, I think this list is as good as I have seen.

Bogie, maybe while you're digesting your Christmas dinner you could come up with a high-academic D1 Baseball list to replace that dang Tier 1 list.

The academic ranking changes once a year, and Massey rating changes once new season underway. With the updates, some schools will go up/down a few spots, but I don't think any school can jump more than 10 spots.

Yes, the D1 list is on my to-do list. With D1, though, do you think it makes sense to weigh baseball more, such as 60-40 or 50-50? After all, most people go to D1 to turn Pro, right?

cabbagedad posted:
Bogeyorpar posted:

...so I decided to create a college ranking system that reflect both academic and baseball strength. ...

Very cool.  For the sake of discussion...  Since the chart is designed (I think) to help those who are seeking the best options that include both academics and baseball, maybe it would make sense to have a disqualifier for those schools that are ranked particularly low in either category.  For example, if either the academic or baseball score is in the bottom 30%, they would not qualify.  So, a rank of 265 or lower in either would eliminate them from being listed.

That seems to makes sense, but you would eliminate a lot of good schools.  Let's start with Middlebury and Cal Tech.  I don't know if the  latter does any recruiting,  and I know the team stinks, but c'mon, it's Cal Tech!  Middlebury is a top LAC that is spending some serious money to turn things around on the baseball field so I wouldn't rule it out if I was looking for a high academic school for baseball.  How about Skidmore?  Nice school.  They recruited my son heavily.  Coach is a great guy.  Carlton?   Another fine school; met coach and he seemed sharp.  Some other good schools that I don't know much about in regards to baseball.  NYU?  Vassar?  Too many babies out with the bathwater IMO.

cabbagedad posted:
Bogeyorpar posted:

...so I decided to create a college ranking system that reflect both academic and baseball strength. ...

Very cool.  For the sake of discussion...  Since the chart is designed (I think) to help those who are seeking the best options that include both academics and baseball, maybe it would make sense to have a disqualifier for those schools that are ranked particularly low in either category.  For example, if either the academic or baseball score is in the bottom 30%, they would not qualify.  So, a rank of 265 or lower in either would eliminate them from being listed.

Interesting idea, except that it will eliminate some great high academics colleges, such as Caltech, NYU, Middlebury, Colby, and Carleton.

Bogeyorpar posted:
JCG posted:

Smoke, I was having similar thoughts  about how the baseball rankings skew toward current winning percentage, which will fluctuate quite a lot, and which doesn't necessarily translate into the overall baseball experience.  Things like the field, the fans, the athletic center, transportation, weather, coaching are not addressed. And on the other side of the ledger, affordability, aid, etc.  So I think it's a great list, but it's going to churn a bit, so unless BogiePar updates it,  it will be out of date in a year.  

But as a starting point for families looking to research D3 baseball opportunities, I think this list is as good as I have seen.

Bogie, maybe while you're digesting your Christmas dinner you could come up with a high-academic D1 Baseball list to replace that dang Tier 1 list.

The academic ranking changes once a year, and Massey rating changes once new season underway. With the updates, some schools will go up/down a few spots, but I don't think any school can jump more than 10 spots.

Yes, the D1 list is on my to-do list. With D1, though, do you think it makes sense to weigh baseball more, such as 60-40 or 50-50? After all, most people go to D1 to turn Pro, right?

It's going to change a bit - not all that much.  For example Oxy is higher than its natural level should be right now.

As for D1 weighting, that's a difficult question.  Is a top player looking at UCLA or Cal thinking pro ball? Probably.  What if he's looking at Dartmouth?  Probably not so much, unless he's a pitcher, then maybe.  I think 60-40 is about right.  Maybe 65-35.

Fantastic work. And a great starting place. I am very familiar with many of the schools on this list, as my son played against many of them regularly, and the school he is now an Alum of is on the list. I will second Smokes comment, Several of the schools on this list get very little support from the administration. One school on this list, I would no longer recommend to a player. Several Players I know who went there were disappointed in their experience. Not only from support from the administration, but almost outright hostility from the student body. The student body at this institution do not understand D3. They think the athletes are either on scholarship or received unwarranted help in attending the school.

It is a great starting point and I large enough that few schools get left out. Better than all the other lists I have seen. All players and parents still need to do there homework.

Bogeyorpar,

I love the concept.  It can bring a lot of value to many people.  Where I think the most value can be derived is in the weighting, metrics, and research....my two cents is to let the person driving the tool change the weightings.  Everybody's idea of value is very different especially when you start weighting academics and baseball.  That can become somewhat of a Holy War, as it does sometimes on HSBBWeb.  So, let people assign their own weightings is my feedback.  My son is a prime example from that weightings perspective....baseball had very little to do in his decision making whether it was D1 or D3 offers.  Baseball offered him leverage and choice with high academic schools. I think with the D3 schools this may be more the case.   With the D1 schools it is going to be more about the baseball and the next level. 

JMO.

Outstanding list. Wish I had it years ago.

One notable point about Emory is that they are usually very competitive in all of the sports they participate in. They really are a academic and athletic powerhouse in the D3 world IMO.  The other list that was posted several weeks ago was a joke and this really gives a parent/player a pretty good feel for their options. Nice work BOGEYORPAR!

One of the moderators should pin this to the top of the D3 thread as it is a really useful post.  One minor note on Claremont in that they are "CMS" which includes Harvey Mudd, one of the top engineering programs in the country. 

I think the list works as it is.  Let people decide for themselves if one aspect or the other is under or over-weighted and either include or dismiss schools accordingly.  As far as a D1 list, all kids (and likely their parents) THINK they are pro prospects when they start, and most will probably overweight the baseball aspect in their decision process.  I think some outright ignore the academics in their decisions, even if they were good HS students. 

As far as adding a factor for coaching or administrative support - that would be great, but it seems pretty subjective.  Who decides what good support or facilities are and ranks them?  I think any list, whether it's this one or any other, points you in a direction.  After that, it's up to the families to do their homework and make the best decision possible for their individual situation. 

It's just a guide - and it looks like a pretty good one at that. 

BOF posted:

Outstanding list. Wish I had it years ago.

One notable point about Emory is that they are usually very competitive in all of the sports they participate in. They really are a academic and athletic powerhouse in the D3 world IMO.  The other list that was posted several weeks ago was a joke and this really gives a parent/player a pretty good feel for their options. Nice work BOGEYORPAR!

One of the moderators should pin this to the top of the D3 thread as it is a really useful post.  One minor note on Claremont in that they are "CMS" which includes Harvey Mudd, one of the top engineering programs in the country. 

Mudd is not on the WSJ list. Kinda odd....

solid list, from the research I have done there are some holes in it, in my opinion but still a real nice job!

my son was recruited or contacted by 6 of the schools on the list, visited 2 and ended up going to one not on the list...I honestly believe there is a lot of hair splitting when we talk about ranking colleges.

old_school posted:

solid list, from the research I have done there are some holes in it, in my opinion but still a real nice job!

my son was recruited or contacted by 6 of the schools on the list, visited 2 and ended up going to one not on the list...I honestly believe there is a lot of hair splitting when we talk about ranking colleges.

In general I agree. There are plenty of very good schools not on this list. For instance I would include Wabash in 'MY" list. It is an all male school in Indiana. They have struggled the last couple of years in baseball, so Massey might have them rated pretty low. But they just hired a Wabash alum away from DePauw. I believe he will do very well quickly. They have a large sophomore class, that saw a lot of playing time last year. They finished 17-23, they will be very good in the near future. They do not show up in WSJ list, not sure why. 

BishopLeftiesDad posted:
old_school posted:

solid list, from the research I have done there are some holes in it, in my opinion but still a real nice job!

my son was recruited or contacted by 6 of the schools on the list, visited 2 and ended up going to one not on the list...I honestly believe there is a lot of hair splitting when we talk about ranking colleges.

In general I agree. There are plenty of very good schools not on this list. For instance I would include Wabash in 'MY" list. It is an all male school in Indiana. They have struggled the last couple of years in baseball, so Massey might have them rated pretty low. But they just hired a Wabash alum away from DePauw. I believe he will do very well quickly. They have a large sophomore class, that saw a lot of playing time last year. They finished 17-23, they will be very good in the near future. They do not show up in WSJ list, not sure why. 

Indeed!

As JCG pointed out, for some unknown reason, the WSJ college ranking excludes some very good academic schools. Mudd is one (but Claremont McKenna is high up there, so it's OK). They missed Wabash. And to my surprise, they missed ALL service academies, Air Force, Army, Marine, Coast Guard... (I would assume this is intentional -- how do you miss West Point accidentally?) 

So here's what I'm gonna do. For the missing colleges, I'll use US News ranks, then find a similar ranked school in WSJ list, and use that rank. For example, Wabash is ranked #65 LAC on US News, the same as Muhlenberg. Muhlenberg is ranked 186 on WSJ list, so I'll put in 186 for Wabash as well. The result -- Wabash now ranked #74 on Academic-Baseball list!

Please let me know if you see a good Academic-Baseball school missing from the list. It's probably caused by data issues like this.

old_school posted:

solid list, from the research I have done there are some holes in it, in my opinion but still a real nice job!

my son was recruited or contacted by 6 of the schools on the list, visited 2 and ended up going to one not on the list...I honestly believe there is a lot of hair splitting when we talk about ranking colleges.

old-school, which school is missing? Let me check the data.

Bogeyorpar posted:
JCG posted:

Smoke, I was having similar thoughts  about how the baseball rankings skew toward current winning percentage, which will fluctuate quite a lot, and which doesn't necessarily translate into the overall baseball experience.  Things like the field, the fans, the athletic center, transportation, weather, coaching are not addressed. And on the other side of the ledger, affordability, aid, etc.  So I think it's a great list, but it's going to churn a bit, so unless BogiePar updates it,  it will be out of date in a year.  

But as a starting point for families looking to research D3 baseball opportunities, I think this list is as good as I have seen.

Bogie, maybe while you're digesting your Christmas dinner you could come up with a high-academic D1 Baseball list to replace that dang Tier 1 list.

The academic ranking changes once a year, and Massey rating changes once new season underway. With the updates, some schools will go up/down a few spots, but I don't think any school can jump more than 10 spots.

Yes, the D1 list is on my to-do list. With D1, though, do you think it makes sense to weigh baseball more, such as 60-40 or 50-50? After all, most people go to D1 to turn Pro, right?

If you're interested, I threw together a list from Massey that averages the ratings for the last 5 years.

http://community.hsbaseballweb...averat2012-2016-xlsx

It's easy to dispute any list. People's priorities aren't the same. My daughter's undergrad university isn't a top 100. But it's a top five in her major.

But here's another consideration for selecting a college. When my daughter applied to top ten law schools, despite graduating PBK she was rejected by all probably due to the overall ranking of the university. She worked for two years at a top worldwide law firm, built contacts/references and got accepted to more than one.

When she verballed at age fifteen she had no idea she would want to go to law school seven years later.

MidAtlanticDad posted:
Bogeyorpar posted:
JCG posted:

Smoke, I was having similar thoughts  about how the baseball rankings skew toward current winning percentage, which will fluctuate quite a lot, and which doesn't necessarily translate into the overall baseball experience.  Things like the field, the fans, the athletic center, transportation, weather, coaching are not addressed. And on the other side of the ledger, affordability, aid, etc.  So I think it's a great list, but it's going to churn a bit, so unless BogiePar updates it,  it will be out of date in a year.  

But as a starting point for families looking to research D3 baseball opportunities, I think this list is as good as I have seen.

Bogie, maybe while you're digesting your Christmas dinner you could come up with a high-academic D1 Baseball list to replace that dang Tier 1 list.

The academic ranking changes once a year, and Massey rating changes once new season underway. With the updates, some schools will go up/down a few spots, but I don't think any school can jump more than 10 spots.

Yes, the D1 list is on my to-do list. With D1, though, do you think it makes sense to weigh baseball more, such as 60-40 or 50-50? After all, most people go to D1 to turn Pro, right?

If you're interested, I threw together a list from Massey that averages the ratings for the last 5 years.

http://community.hsbaseballweb...averat2012-2016-xlsx

Great! I have downloaded the list. It's a good weekend project.

It's a great list as long as you remember that it's just a ballpark estimate (it would be quite a bit different if USNews or Forbes rankings were used) and schools need to be looked at individually.  For example, there are two schools ranked one after the other -- one my son chose to attend, and one he strongly considered. Both are wonderful LAC's, but at one we got the sense that athletes were an integral part of the student community, while at the other, we saw indications that athletes are kind of their own group outside the general student body.   The comments in the thread from Smoke and BishopLeftyDad about admin support, facilities, etc are also really on point.

JCG posted:

It's a great list as long as you remember that it's just a ballpark estimate (it would be quite a bit different if USNews or Forbes rankings were used) and schools need to be looked at individually.  For example, there are two schools ranked one after the other -- one my son chose to attend, and one he strongly considered. Both are wonderful LAC's, but at one we got the sense that athletes were an integral part of the student community, while at the other, we saw indications that athletes are kind of their own group outside the general student body.   The comments in the thread from Smoke and BishopLeftyDad about admin support, facilities, etc are also really on point.

The WSJ/Times list seems to skew toward private schools. I think class size and spending push it in that direction. My son's school (public) didn't make BOP's top 100 because of a low WSJ/Times ranking, even though his school is ranked much higher than a dozen of the schools above on other ranking lists with different methodologies. Once you get past the HA schools, there are many different types of D3 schools to choose from.

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