Hey. My 2021 RHP son is interested in Brown University. He likes Providence a lot and has been to campus. Does anyone know anything about the coaching staff, recruiting preferences, style, culture, where they recruit other than Showball and HeadFirst? No interest from the school yet in my son. We are trying to narrow down his schools so he can send updated PG/PBR stats/video, summer travel schedule, etc. to about 8-10 schools in early Spring...
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My advice. Have your son contact them ASAP. Send metrics, video, and provide current GPA, test scores (if he has them), and let them know why he is interested in Brown. They didn't appear to have any 2020 commits (from what I could see) until this past summer. That doesn't mean they didn't have any--it just means they weren't posted on the usual sites (PG and PBR). And that also doesn't mean they weren't looking at recruits and didn't have their "list". Quite the opposite. I believe that could be said of all the Ivy's. They are certainly tracking 2021's and know who they want to go after. Some have plenty of 2021 commitments already. Now is the time to let them know you are very interested.
My son talked with the Brown HC at Showball (August date in Medford, NY). He had contacted them at the beginning of summer but at the time Brown was not his first choice. As his choices narrowed he began to give them more thought and spent time looking at the school and thinking about if it would be a fit academically. He decided it was. The Brown HC told him he liked him but they were looking at several others ahead of him at his position. Which said to me my son was a bit late to the party.
It also told me they are not a very good judge of talent! ;-)
Keep in mind choosing Brown is about academics and not baseball. The team has been horrible for ten years. That they would keep the same coach for six years through this run of horrible baseball is a statement on how unimportant baseball is at Brown.
Here are some visuals:
2019 Player Distribution by State
2019 Player Distribution by Position
2019 Team Roster Insights
Team Performance 2015 - 2019
2018 Expense by Sport
Baseball Budget last 10 years
2019 Ivy League Conference Comparison
2018 Ivy League Conference Comparison
Anyone have any idea if there is coach support in admissions or do you have to get in first? Always seems so risky. Many students have numbers in the range of their median scores/GPA that get denied...
There’s support. Others here know more but, basically, if they like you as a player and you hit their academic threshold, coaches work with admissions.
incredibly hard to get in w/o support as you realize.
search hsbbw for threads on ivy admissions and academic index.
Wow, thanks for all the info. Son is 1350 SAT and 4.5 weighted with lots of APs. He probably is within lower part of index threshold. Right now he’s not going to be the stud pitcher recruit but maybe a solid get later in the recruiting game.
ABSORBER posted:My advice. Have your son contact them ASAP. Send metrics, video, and provide current GPA, test scores (if he has them), and let them know why he is interested in Brown. They didn't appear to have any 2020 commits (from what I could see) until this past summer. That doesn't mean they didn't have any--it just means they weren't posted on the usual sites (PG and PBR). And that also doesn't mean they weren't looking at recruits and didn't have their "list". Quite the opposite. I believe that could be said of all the Ivy's. They are certainly tracking 2021's and know who they want to go after. Some have plenty of 2021 commitments already. Now is the time to let them know you are very interested.
My son talked with the Brown HC at Showball (August date in Medford, NY). He had contacted them at the beginning of summer but at the time Brown was not his first choice. As his choices narrowed he began to give them more thought and spent time looking at the school and thinking about if it would be a fit academically. He decided it was. The Brown HC told him he liked him but they were looking at several others ahead of him at his position. Which said to me my son was a bit late to the party.
It also told me they are not a very good judge of talent! ;-)
Absorber, I don't think your son was late to the party. Your son is on their list, which is not fixed in stone. Hopefully they will get more chances to see him play this summer and realize their mistake. From what I'm seeing, most HA schools, including most of the Ivies, are just getting started with the 2021s.
Good luck to him and to BaseballDad72's son!
LuckyCat posted:ABSORBER posted:My advice. Have your son contact them ASAP. Send metrics, video, and provide current GPA, test scores (if he has them), and let them know why he is interested in Brown. They didn't appear to have any 2020 commits (from what I could see) until this past summer. That doesn't mean they didn't have any--it just means they weren't posted on the usual sites (PG and PBR). And that also doesn't mean they weren't looking at recruits and didn't have their "list". Quite the opposite. I believe that could be said of all the Ivy's. They are certainly tracking 2021's and know who they want to go after. Some have plenty of 2021 commitments already. Now is the time to let them know you are very interested.
My son talked with the Brown HC at Showball (August date in Medford, NY). He had contacted them at the beginning of summer but at the time Brown was not his first choice. As his choices narrowed he began to give them more thought and spent time looking at the school and thinking about if it would be a fit academically. He decided it was. The Brown HC told him he liked him but they were looking at several others ahead of him at his position. Which said to me my son was a bit late to the party.
It also told me they are not a very good judge of talent! ;-)
Absorber, I don't think your son was late to the party. Your son is on their list, which is not fixed in stone. Hopefully they will get more chances to see him play this summer and realize their mistake. From what I'm seeing, most HA schools, including most of the Ivies, are just getting started with the 2021s.
Good luck to him and to BaseballDad72's son!
No, he's a 2020 so he was definitely late! I made that comment because I wanted the OP and others to realize how important it is to start communicating with Ivy coaches! Especially true for 2021's!
As for my son, he committed to a different school which I think was a better fit for him.
BaseballDad72 posted:Wow, thanks for all the info. Son is 1350 SAT and 4.5 weighted with lots of APs. He probably is within lower part of index threshold. Right now he’s not going to be the stud pitcher recruit but maybe a solid get later in the recruiting game.
His academic credentials are solid! Of course his SAT could be higher but it is fine for Ivy as long as they want him for baseball. 1350 is about the minimum for Harvard, Princeton and Yale. I say that because my son just went through this process. If he is not one of their top recruits then they may want his SAT a bit higher--to offset one or two of their top recruits. Of course his best bet is to get a better SAT and be the best ballplayer he can be! That of course is true for every kid out there trying to play in college!
BaseballDad72 posted:Wow, thanks for all the info. Son is 1350 SAT and 4.5 weighted with lots of APs. He probably is within lower part of index threshold. Right now he’s not going to be the stud pitcher recruit but maybe a solid get later in the recruiting game.
Not sure what you mean by "solid get later in the recruiting game." Ivies have a pretty fixed schedule; they scout junior year (including PG underclass Ft Myers) and summer before senior year (including going to the big 17U tournaments), make offers at the end of the summer, so that their players can apply ED at the end of October with coach support. There may be a few who get in on their own RD, who end up playing.
Not sure what Brown specifically is looking for; I'm sure they want 6'2"+ and 88mph+ for rhp, but, from looking at PG's commits in the last few years, I'm not sure they are getting that.
BaseballDad72 posted:Wow, thanks for all the info. Son is 1350 SAT and 4.5 weighted with lots of APs. He probably is within lower part of index threshold. Right now he’s not going to be the stud pitcher recruit but maybe a solid get later in the recruiting game.
His scores are close enough as long as the coach really wants him. My son was being recruited by Dartmouth, Brown & Yale and his scores were slightly under yours but after sending them all his transcripts, SAT etc they were confident they could get him in.
Also, as someone else mentioned for RHP's they are looking for min of 88-89 for RHP and I do believe they get that all day long. There are many crazy smart and talented kids out there.
Yeah, aware of high 80s bar for Ivies. If my kids going to get there it’ll be post HS season at earliest. He’s 83-84 at first bullpen today and can put on another 10-15 lbs on frame. We will see. Kid is working his tail off and that’s all he can do. Thanks for all of the support and input. It’s always super helpful.
BaseballDad72 posted:Wow, thanks for all the info. Son is 1350 SAT and 4.5 weighted with lots of APs. He probably is within lower part of index threshold. Right now he’s not going to be the stud pitcher recruit but maybe a solid get later in the recruiting game.
Weighted doesn’t matter. There isn’t a standard. It’s about unweighted gpa and the level of courses. The bar moves on acceptance for athletes depending on how badly they want you and how important the sport is to the school.
BASEBALLDAD72, if your son is sitting 83-85 he is in the ballpark. Sure all the Ivy's want pitchers who are consistently in the upper 80's. Lots of other D1's are looking for the same players! The reality for Ivy coaches is it is very difficult to recruit a pitcher who is sitting upper 80's, low 90's. That kid HAS to want to play Ivy. Because of the recruiting timeline many other D1's come calling for kids sitting in that range. Most kids, unless they are only targeting Ivy, cannot resist an attractive offer from one of these schools. Don't underestimate the pressure these kids feel to commit early; it's reality. If your son wants to play Ivy and is laser-focused he needs to pursue it 100%. If other offers come earlier he needs to put them off as long as he can until he knows the Ivy dream is over. Which is usually too late (late summer before senior year) in the recruiting cycle. Unfortunately, kids usually simply CANNOT wait long enough to receive this offer. Because of that the Ivy schools are taking pitchers who throw low to mid 80's and maybe can touch upper 80's or at least project to be in that range in the future. Emphasis on project.
I now know from firsthand experience how hard it is for a player to commit to an Ivy school. I learned a couple of years ago on this site what a "likely letter" was but what I didn't know is that they CANNOT be given UNTIL an early decision (ED) application is RECEIVED! We are talking October of senior year at the earliest. I will caveat that by saying while there are never any guarantees, and that includes likely letters, when an Ivy coach makes a verbal offer it is extremely likely that player will end up on campus as long as nothing changes on the player's end. You can track this by taking a look at Ivy commitments from previous years and checking current Ivy rosters. Of course to be really meaningful you would have to have been actively checking over the last few years--only then would you see WHEN a player commits (before the ED period) and then make sure he ends up on the roster later. So getting an offer at the early part of the Ivy recruiting cycle (during junior school year or earlier) is the best bet. Still challenging because there are NO GUARANTEES. Your son has to keep up the academics and either already have the requisite test scores or be very confidant he can get them!
If you look at the Ivy commits (2021's and earlier) you will see that very few sit upper 80's. Of course you have to actively search for metrics on these players from multiple sources. A lot are old so it's really hard to say where they were when they committed but my belief is there were NOT sitting upper 80's. If they were then the pressure to commit to other D1 schools would have possibly prevented them from going Ivy. There is a reason very few Ivy commits are highly ranked players (PG, PBR)--it is a very difficult recruiting timeline--exactly what I'm trying to show in the points I've written above.
So my belief is the vast majority players showed something to these coaches at a prospect camp or another high academic showcase. Sure they may have hit the upper 80's threshold but I'd be willing to bet they had not hit it earlier for all the reasons I outlined above. But if they didn't hit it then I believe Ivy coaches think they project to be there eventually.
Of course I'll close by saying this is only my opinion. You will have to do similar research and perhaps you'll reach the same conclusion as I did!
RJM posted:BaseballDad72 posted:Wow, thanks for all the info. Son is 1350 SAT and 4.5 weighted with lots of APs. He probably is within lower part of index threshold. Right now he’s not going to be the stud pitcher recruit but maybe a solid get later in the recruiting game.
Weighted doesn’t matter. There isn’t a standard. It’s about unweighted gpa and the level of courses. The bar moves on acceptance for athletes depending on how badly they want you and how important the sport is to the school.
I agree. My son only posted unweighted GPA scores. This tells the school the student works hard to keep his grades up. And as RJM says above, academic rigor is important. My son's was not the strongest--he never really considered Ivy until his junior year. He had decided he was going to get a chance to play in college so he figured he could take an easier course load. He thought as long as his grades were good (he's a 4.0 unweighted) college coaches would be happy! Now as a senior he's taking 3 more AP courses but of course it's a little late!
I'm pretty sure my son only gave weighted; his high school did not calculate an unweighted GPA. I don't know if coaches ever asked for unweighted - obviously when they got transcripts they could see his grades, and the classes he took. A GPA over 4.0 indicates AP/honors classes, regardless of how a school does it.
I have zero experience with college application process yet but I’m not sure I agree weighted doesn’t matter for HA schools. No offense to anyone but getting A’S in an AP courses is different than less rigorous courses and getting a 4.0. So high weighted would seem to matter a lot, at least IMO. Again, all great and useful info. Going to an interesting summer and fall.
BaseballDad72 posted:I have zero experience with college application process yet but I’m not sure I agree weighted doesn’t matter for HA schools. No offense to anyone but getting A’S in an AP courses is different than less rigorous courses and getting a 4.0. So high weighted would seem to matter a lot, at least IMO. Again, all great and useful info. Going to an interesting summer and fall.
Yeah, not sure if there is a standard on official transcripts. From my experience, GPA (weighted or unweighted) is not asked about on the college application but of course you have to submit official transcripts. But coaches definitely told my son an unweighted 4.0 was more attractive than a weighted GPA. But of course there are plenty of discussions outside of baseball on this--less than 4.0 and very rigorous vs. 4.0 and less rigorous.
All 8 Ivy's use the Common App for admissions. The Common App tells you to submit weighted GPA if your school calculates both. FWIW
