Can competitive athletes be developed this way?

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So, would you guys agree that a player would walk off a football field at halftime to get ready for the homecoming dance afterwards. What is the difference?

Nothing about the homecoming dance occurs before the game is over. There's a lot more involved with a prom. We (when my daughter was in high school) had a pre prom picture taking party at our house that started at 5:30pm before the kids went out to dinner before the prom. It would be impossible to play a game that starts at 3:30 and be dressed and at someone's house at 5:30. A prom may also involve limo arrangements. Some kids get picked up one by one. We had limos waiting at our house for everyone.

The key is the AD shouldn't schedule a baseball game on the day of or after the prom. The prom is a big deal.

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What's the point putting all that time in when they'll never see the field while they could be working after school making some loot or just doing something else other than ride the pine and watch others play.

It was the year the new coach turned it around. Everyone knew it was coming. The player wanted to be around for the fun. He played in a handful of one sided games. He started a non conference game. He also wants to be a teacher and a coach.

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
So, would you guys agree that a player would walk off a football field at halftime to get ready for the homecoming dance afterwards. What is the difference? If you are committed to playing and I think this is the problem between those who want it and those who are playing for the fun of it, then you would make it work.
Again, I could see if it was in lieu of prom but this was hours before.
The coach let them go but I would have had them sit the next game. There has to be some retribution for walking out on your teammates for most circumstances.
I don't think the coach has as big a problem as the players who were left there to play when their teammates walked out on them.

My son wanted "it" and he has worked very hard at baseball since he was a kid. But he went to his Sr. prom..
Those players did not walk out on their team, they and the coach made arrangements so they could attend the prom.
What if there was a game during graduation (I know it wouldn't happen but) should they miss that also? What if a players brother was getting married on a game day ? There is also nothing wrong with playing for fun.


(Had son missed the prom he never would have played baseball again because his date (now his wife) would have killed him)

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What if there was a game during graduation (I know it wouldn't happen but) should they miss that also?

My son is missing a game to attend his sister's college graduation one thousand miles away. His coach doesn't have an issue the situation.

I know several guys that missed their graduation to attend a playoff game.
I and many of the other parents and teammates do see it as walking out on their teammates. They walked out of the dugout in the middle of a game. What is that if it is not walking out on your teammates? I know it is still affecting their season today a month later.
Again, maybe it is just me but I don't see how missing a game is okay. It is a lack of dedication to the team. I understand it is priorities difference but it doesn't make it right.
And no, my son would not miss a game for a graduation, his or his siblings.

Or you can do like the Mamaroneck HS coach did a few years back---the team was in the State Finals the weekend of the school prom---players were forbidden to attend the prom and HAD TO be with the team---instead coach rented a hall for the following weekend, hired a DJ and a caterer and the team had their prom--OH ! And Yes they won the state title

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I didn't know you could rent the hall...



Good for the coach and congratulations to the team!




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What if there was a game during graduation (I know it wouldn't happen but) should they miss that also?

Absolutely. Anything related to the school academically always comes first. The whole purpose of going to school for 12 years is to get that HS diploma. Nothing is bigger than that day to this point in their school life. Certainly not a baseball game. Baseball is an extra-curricular activity in school, not the primary function. IMO, if somebody thinks a baseball game is bigger than a graduation or some major family event, their priorities seem to be really mixed up.

Does your kid compete? You seem like a guy who's kid definitely plays for fun. My kid goes to school to play ball. (not completely but he would say so). I think there are kids who play ball for the fun of it and for the letters on their school jackets then there are those who see high school as a step in the ladder of the whole aspect.
But it comes from priorities. I did not walk in my college graduation and went to school for the degree not the experience.
I reckon it is what you are wanting to get out of it. The party and fun or the future.

HS baseball for most kids is a "social event"---there are very few that take it that seriously---sure they want to win but if there , in their minds is somthing better to do--they bail out

Not every kid is a devoted to the game as your kid but there is such a thing as team loyalty--this is where I get concerned---what do they they do the next time a "party' arises?

This is where our country is going

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My kid goes to school to play ball.

My kids are competitive athletes as much as anyone. If they ever told me they go to school to play ball I'd take sports away from them until they get their priorities in order. The only time this statement would be reasonably acceptible would be in a major college program with an opportunity to be a top twenty round draft choice. But the education would still be very important.

My son will be missing one high school game to attend his sister's college graduation. He doesn't have a choice. He cleared it with his coach. Had it been a playoff game we probably would have let him stay home. If you think I don't get it from lack of experience, I played college ball. Education will always come first until someone is dangling as much baseball money in his face (most likely won't happen) than an education will help him earn.

My daughter had to chose playing senior year of college versus a prestigious internship in DC. Had she chosen to play softball I would have had her head examined. The internship will provide advantages early in her career until she proves herself professionally.

I fault high school AD's for some of the problems. Some don't check the school schedule or work out accommodations. Our AD once got a district playoff game rescheduled to accommodate graduation.

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My kids are competitive athletes as much as anyone. If they ever told me they go to school to play ball I'd take sports away from them until they get their priorities in order.

Agree 100%....

We are not talking about missing class. We are talking about missing a party, that is what Prom is. I don't even see the big deal of graduation. It is just walking up an aisle and getting a piece of paper. I would have a problem if my child was not making the grades but he does. I have no problem when he is excited about playing ball. That is what he lives for and has worked hard for. That is what will pay for college and possibly pay him large sums later in life. Again, the difference in casual ball and sold out.
That is what makes this site interesting. Many of you who have no problem with the players missing a game also say your kids have no chance of getting paid to play or going top D1. Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious. That is why things are discussed and we learn from each other.

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
Does your kid compete? You seem like a guy who's kid definitely plays for fun.

My son played baseball competitively for 12 years starting from t-ball, rec, all-stars, aau-travel, played in national tournaments American Legion and HS ball. As a HS player, he was a starting outfielder for his varsity team. He was extemely competitive, hated to lose and worked as hard as anybody in practice so that he was ready and prepared every game. He was a two-sport athlete (team captain in one sport)and a former legion team captain and third team all-conference in his HS winter sport. Not only was he competitive, he was a team leader.

And yes, he played for fun. Both sports he played for fun. I don't know how anybody can play and not have fun at that age. That's what it's all about. Isn't it? But don't confuse that with being a competitor. He was as competitive as anybody being sought after by D1 schools. The only difference was that baseball was a part of who he is, not all of who he is.

And when he went looking for colleges, along with his grades, it didn't hurt having an athletic background and being able to show he can not only make the grade but also doing it with a busy after school schedule lettering in two sports. He got accepted into the college of his choice so it worked out for him.

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
We are not talking about missing class. We are talking about missing a party, that is what Prom is. I don't even see the big deal of graduation. It is just walking up an aisle and getting a piece of paper.

I think you have to put your feet in the shoes who are doing the walking. As we get older our opinion of what is important to a 17/18 year old becomes fuzzy and many times wearing extra large blinders demanding answers that fit our opinions. At that age I hated when my Dad tried to do that. JMO

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious.

That is insulting to those not perched on the D1 and/or draft pedestal, and probably embarrassing to many that are. But then again the air can get thin up there when looking down on the masses.

I see the word "us" used and wonder whos dream/life is it anyway, and whos driving this bus?

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Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious. That is why things are discussed and we learn from each other.

What is it they take more serious?. When they're on the field, other than maybe the skill level, how does one determine who takes the game more serious. By time these players are in HS, they're the best players from their respective towns/cities and didn't get there by goofing around to get to that level.

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Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious.

What a condescending comment! There are a lot of kids in high school and college ball working as hard as anyone playing the game who won't make a living playing ball. There are a lot of college players and minor leaguers who think they are going to earn a living playing ball who won't.

How would you feel if it was turned around to "Those of us whose kids are National Honor Society take school more seriously than kids like yours?" I know the odds are huge in favor of a kid's education taking him further in life than sports. The D'backs GM once said there's a 1% chance a minor league baseball player will earn a living playing pro ball. There are D1's interested in my son. Education is still more important. I'll hang my son's chances on education. If anything big happens in baseball it will be a plus.

I believe in balance. I don't want my kids to think they've lost their identity when sports ends. I've seen it happen. It's not pretty. And sports will end whether it's LL, high school, college or pro. At that time there will be a lot of life left to live where being an athlete will not be the personal identity.

Do you believe Myron Rolle has his priorities out of order?

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
We are not talking about missing class. We are talking about missing a party, that is what Prom is. I don't even see the big deal of graduation. It is just walking up an aisle and getting a piece of paper. I would have a problem if my child was not making the grades but he does. I have no problem when he is excited about playing ball. That is what he lives for and has worked hard for. That is what will pay for college and possibly pay him large sums later in life. Again, the difference in casual ball and sold out.
That is what makes this site interesting. Many of you who have no problem with the players missing a game also say your kids have no chance of getting paid to play or going top D1. Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious. That is why things are discussed and we learn from each other.

Wow.

I'm one of the parents who doesn't have a problem with players being excused by the coach to attend certain school functions and my son makes a living playing baseball. so yea we took baseball seriously.but I also don't think HS baseball is about being a stepping stone for future pro players.

To me there is no clear cut answer that fits everyone. It's not a matter of which one a person feels is most important. Everyone should understand that in most cases in order to succeed you gotta get the job done both ways. If someone is all out dedicated to baseball and it helps them get an education, that seems alright to me.

I'm sure there are many differing opinions as to the importance of prom night vs a baseball game! That is an individual thing, so how can we tell someone else what is most important to them? There is no "sin" involved either way.

All that said, Scheduling a baseball game on prom night had to be a mistake. However, we do that every year. Some miss the games, some don't. Some figure out how to do both.

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I'm sure there are many differing opinions as to the importance of prom night vs a baseball game! That is an individual thing, so how can we tell someone else what is most important to them?

Difference is, the playoff game represents a commitment made to the coach and other players, to be there and to contribute. The kid and parents need to recognize how that commitment might play out toward the end of the season, and realize that they are signing up for those possibilities the minute they accept the jersey.

It's not even really about whether you'd rather be at the game.

No one said it was a play off game.. It was a tournament. Was it even part of the HS schedule.

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
I know several guys that missed their graduation to attend a playoff game.

This dude did.

But the other cases are worth talking about. The principal of understanding the commitment is the guideline to me. If the coach agrees that he's good without you, or that the game might not be that critical, then I think it doesn't matter.

But if coach thinks they'll need you, then hey, you signed up.

If your girl wouldn't rather be at the game then prancing around in Taffeta, I'd say get rid of her anyway.

**If you go to coach to tell him you want to miss a game to go to prom, maybe you should consider wearing the Taffeta when you ask...

Granted, this guy was talking about play-off game vs. graduation, not prom.

You're right, Graduation vs the game is much trickier, because in some families, HS graduation represents the pinnacle of their intellectual career. The whole family comes from all parts to sit in the hot auditorium for two hours, just for that that one 5 second moment where they scream out "way to go, Billy!!!" That can be pretty important to some people.

By contrast in some families, HS graduation is kind of a given lowest-common denominator, and they only really go so they won't feel guilty later.

Regular season HS game vs. graduation is a non-conversation, because if you go to a school dumb enough to schedule both on the same day, then you probably don't really want the diploma.

Tournament Team game vs. Graduation is the tough one. Was the tournament scheduled at the start of the season, or was it a pop-up?