This is truly a fascinating thread. If I were the parent of a high school player, I would carefully read each and every post(other than this one.). The information, the sources of the information and the experience of the posters is remarkable.
For me, having a son who finished with college in 4 years and got lucky enough to continue playing, while I recognize and appreciate the importance of the recruiting process, one could conclude by some of the information that the journey "ends" with the committment to college. In fact it is only the beginning.
To illustrate my point, I went to the website of a local college and extracted a quote from the head coach on his recruiting class from a few years back.
""I think this is a talented recruiting class," said #@%#@%. "We addressed the issues we needed to address, considering we could potentially lose several players to the draft after this season. We feel we got a group of athletes who will be able to come in and help us right away. All of all our signees were people who were highly regarded by other schools. We feel good about this group."
I thought this was relevent because the school is one of the top 40 mentioned by name.
Each player is described in detail incorporating specific reference to prestigious national rankings.
Of the 8, 2 ended up leaving the program by the end of their sophomore year having hardly ever having played. One had a career that deteriorated productivity wise from a projected high draft pick after a season in the Cape to rarely playing. One pitched less than 30 innings in 3 years, and when he did was never effective but had 94mph velocity and was drafted and left after his junior year.
Three are still playing, one in MLB and 2 in AA ball. All three have actually performed better in professional baseball than they did productivity wise in college.
Unfortunately, the importance and the mystique of the recruiting process can cloud what happens after that point. If I were the parent of a high school player, I would be far more interested in what happens during the 3-4 years in college, and beyond.
I am not at all certain if the college class I am highlighting is common. What it does suggest to me is success in showcases/recruiting does not "guarantee" anything from that point forward. For this particular class, 1/2 of these nationally ranked players rarely, if ever, played after the hoopla ceased.
It isn't how you start, it is how you end. Unfortunately, that is the hardest information to obtain since the college coaches and showcases are not likely to provide statistics of that type.
ClevelandDad alluded earlier to the dilemma of recruiting from showcases in football. I believe it is an equally if not more legitimate question as it relates to baseball.
I have been "lurking" around this site for a couple months now. I have found it to be invaluable. What a generous group of people! This topic has hit home in our house. Our 17 yr.old son is a "late bloomer" 6'1", 160lbs -not shaving. He attends an all-boys' private high school where baseball is huge. After struggling through a disappointing JV season, this past season he worked very hard and earned a starting spot halfway through the season in the outfield as a junior. The team won the championship and he had a terrific season. He attended his first showcase this summer before a tournament. He ranked in the top five for outfielders in all categories out of about 200 players. The showcase was put on by a recruiting service. It was a good way for him to see where he fit in, etc. He has since attended a regional showcase and one at a college-where he performed well, but did not get any formal evaluation. All minimal expenses. Now we are beginning to get a lot of letters, most are for attending Showcase camps or Prospect camps at colleges. Is this generated because he is on some list or because they saw him play? He has received other letters and questionaires as well. So far, we have decided that he will attend only those at schools that we think will fit his academic interests and ability. A few questions- do you think this is a good approach? He did not pitch for his HS team except freshman year, but the varsity pitching coach loves his strong arm and is looking to get him on the mound for his senior season. Should he showcase for pitching as well as oufield? He has pitched for his summer team and throws around 85 MPH.
He gave up football this year to only work for baseball. He is looking for a fall team and a few caoches have asked him to let them know where he will be playing so they can se him play. He loves baseball and wants to play in college-has already hand written letters to several coaches. His grades are great and tests score above avg. We want to support his dream, but also want to know the right things to do, especially when it comes to these showcases. We have two younger teenagers and definitely have budget considerations.
Sorry for the rambling- but I guess after all the "lurking," I have a lot of pent-up questions!!
He gave up football this year to only work for baseball. He is looking for a fall team and a few caoches have asked him to let them know where he will be playing so they can se him play. He loves baseball and wants to play in college-has already hand written letters to several coaches. His grades are great and tests score above avg. We want to support his dream, but also want to know the right things to do, especially when it comes to these showcases. We have two younger teenagers and definitely have budget considerations.
Sorry for the rambling- but I guess after all the "lurking," I have a lot of pent-up questions!!
[QUOTE]Originally posted by PGStaff:
Grateful. I have read enough of your stuff to understand your opinion should be valued. I respect your opinion and knowledge very much. I agree that national showcases have altered the playing field and recruiting, I just honestly believe it’s in the best interest of the players. And very helpful to both MLB scouting departments and scholarship school recruiting. I do agree that unfortunately it does affect the non scholarship colleges to a degree. However, I think even the DIII schools are proving that they can find more players who can help their programs these days. There is simply more information available about potential players these days.
QUOTE]
PG, I also have tremendous respect for what you do and the services that you provide for players, college coaches, and ML scouts.
My comments were not at all meant as a knock against showcases of any sort. But I know from being out there with the scouts and coaches, from networking with so many other college coaches, that it has become much more difficult for many of the NAIA and DIII schools to recruit pro prospects.
For lack of a better example, no longer will Gordie Gillespie at the College of St. Francis in Illinois be able to bring in guys like Don Peters, who was a first round draft pick in 1990.....if Don Peters was in high school now, he would most likely end up at a very competitive DI program someplace with a large scholarship.
I am no longer a college head coach, having 'retired' so to speak in 2003, the same year that my son graduated from HS. As an NAIA head coach, with considerable success, at that time I never received information from companies such as PG, Area Codes, TeamOne, etc., even though those organizations were holding showcases. My knowledge of such programs came from having a son who was a good player.
When my son was invited to an Area Code tryout in Chicago in 2002, I sat there with about 100 other coaches and ML scouts. Only myself and another NAIA coach (and the coach of the DIII school which hosted the event) represented non-Division I programs. The rest of the coaches were from DI schools across the country.
This is an example of decreased parity. Some of you may believe that there is now more parity among Division I schools, but that is not what I was referring to. Division I schools only represent a relatively small percentage of colleges. I was referring to parity in college baseball at all levels. The best players that I was once able to recruit no longer play at small NAIA schools. Those guys play DI baseball, or perhaps sit the bench at DI schools. That is the lack of parity that I mean.
By no means am I intending to say that there are no longer pro prospects at smaller schools in the lower divisions; there are still several of them and I see them every year. But I can foresee a time when a higher percentage of kids attend these showcases and even fewer pro prospects play ball at the lower levels.
Grateful. I have read enough of your stuff to understand your opinion should be valued. I respect your opinion and knowledge very much. I agree that national showcases have altered the playing field and recruiting, I just honestly believe it’s in the best interest of the players. And very helpful to both MLB scouting departments and scholarship school recruiting. I do agree that unfortunately it does affect the non scholarship colleges to a degree. However, I think even the DIII schools are proving that they can find more players who can help their programs these days. There is simply more information available about potential players these days.
QUOTE]
PG, I also have tremendous respect for what you do and the services that you provide for players, college coaches, and ML scouts.
My comments were not at all meant as a knock against showcases of any sort. But I know from being out there with the scouts and coaches, from networking with so many other college coaches, that it has become much more difficult for many of the NAIA and DIII schools to recruit pro prospects.
For lack of a better example, no longer will Gordie Gillespie at the College of St. Francis in Illinois be able to bring in guys like Don Peters, who was a first round draft pick in 1990.....if Don Peters was in high school now, he would most likely end up at a very competitive DI program someplace with a large scholarship.
I am no longer a college head coach, having 'retired' so to speak in 2003, the same year that my son graduated from HS. As an NAIA head coach, with considerable success, at that time I never received information from companies such as PG, Area Codes, TeamOne, etc., even though those organizations were holding showcases. My knowledge of such programs came from having a son who was a good player.
When my son was invited to an Area Code tryout in Chicago in 2002, I sat there with about 100 other coaches and ML scouts. Only myself and another NAIA coach (and the coach of the DIII school which hosted the event) represented non-Division I programs. The rest of the coaches were from DI schools across the country.
This is an example of decreased parity. Some of you may believe that there is now more parity among Division I schools, but that is not what I was referring to. Division I schools only represent a relatively small percentage of colleges. I was referring to parity in college baseball at all levels. The best players that I was once able to recruit no longer play at small NAIA schools. Those guys play DI baseball, or perhaps sit the bench at DI schools. That is the lack of parity that I mean.
By no means am I intending to say that there are no longer pro prospects at smaller schools in the lower divisions; there are still several of them and I see them every year. But I can foresee a time when a higher percentage of kids attend these showcases and even fewer pro prospects play ball at the lower levels.
quote:Originally posted by justbaseball:
...but I see parents of 13-year olds starting to consider paying $$ for showcases for their sons. WHY!?!? Can we just let kids be kids a little while longer?!
JBB - I haven't read the rest of the posts yet but I just wanted to comment on this excellent question as the parent on a 13u player.
I'm not sure I have an answer per se, but some ideas why this happens. For one, everything in the recruiting process is starting earlier and earlier. Kids who are giving verbal commitments are now juniors, with many Sophomores "on the radar". How'd they get there?
Another problem is that several organizations rank these young players. For exapmle, Baseball America ranks the top youth players every year. I'm not sure how young they go but I know it's as low as 12u. There are also some organizations that categorize these kids as "All Americans". Granted, there are many parents who are posturing to get their son named as a 12u, 13u, 14u All American. But probably just as prevalent, the kids see it as a goal and want to be named on the AA team. So in order to see how they compare, they go to a showcase. To be honest, I'm curious to see how my son compares. Does it mean anything? Not really. I know it doesn't matter what he's throwing at 13 or how tall he is. It's more important that he's throwing 85-90 or higher when he's 17 and that he's projectable. BUT if he's throwing 80-82 now, it's a heck of a lot closer to 90 than if he was throwing 70-72. And he wouldn't know how he compared to others his age unless he goes to a showcase or something along those lines. Again, it doesn't mean he will throw 90+, it just shows him how he stacks up.
Another problem is the snowball effect. With the colleges recruiting earlier and the exposure more prevalent for the younger players, the pressure is there to perform at a younger age. The parents feel they need to have their son play on the "best" teams so they can get exposure, play in the big tourneys, etc.
quote:quote:
How many of those players would have ended up where they did or in an equivalent program if PG did not exist? My guess would be most of them. The overhelming majority of the schools you listed are cream of the crop. The players they are recruiting would obviously be the very top of those available each year. If a player being looked at by Miami did not actually get selected to attend Miami, I am sure any of the other schools you listed would be very interested in him.
NH,
We simply do not know that. Are we presuming that all these players would have ended up at the top colleges, no matter what they did?
PG,
I did not say ALL, I said most. And yes, I believe that is a very fair assesment.
The schools you listed, are mostly the ones we excpect would be competeing heavily for CWS berths. A player that any of those schools is recruiting would obviously be a very high caliber player. Therefore it is not a stretch to assume if he was not offered a spot on one of the teams you listed, he would certainly stand a very very good chance to get a spot on one of the other schools.
Beezer - I get everything you are saying. But can't you assess all of the same stuff by just having your son play on a decent travel team against good competition? Even as a novice I feel I can get a pretty good idea from that. Why is a showcase or a rating needed other than to feed an ego?
There are some players that you can tell at age 13 they are going to be really good. Robert Stock is a good example of that. I saw Robert play when he was 12 and it was clear he was headed for a wonderful future. But for every Robert, I can name 5 others we would have all gotten wrong (plus and minus). And even in Robert's case...why would he need to go to a showcase at that age? It isn't going to change where he ulitmately ends up is it? Everyone knew about Robert anyways.
I am in the trenches of youth baseball. I work with kids and programs age 5-14. Unfortunately where I see all this 'younger-and-younger' and 'earlier-and-earlier' trend headed is adding a lot of pressure to young parents and young kids. I have lots of stories. But among other things...I see it tearing at the fabric of community youth baseball. I hear from a dad of a 10-year old that wants to know what "throwing program" his son should be on so he can get a scholarship down the line. I had a parent get very upset with me for hurting his 7th grade son's scholarship possibilities by not putting him on the 8th grade team (his son DID get a scholarship 5 years later after all). I know a kid (now 19) who was the biggest doggone stud hitter you could imagine at age 13...hit bombs everywhere he went from both sides of the plate...now he struggles at a local JC hitting below .200 and it doesn't look like it will get much better. A 13-year old showcase rating on him would have been off the charts I can assure you. And I know a parent of a very talented 13-year old pitcher who wonders if his son should even bother with playing HS baseball because it might be a waste of time. GEEZ!
I realize that the way we (my parent-peers and me) did things probably scared the parents of kids 10 years before me. They probably thought my group was pushing too hard or too early...so I use that perspective in trying to temper my thoughts on this. But you're only a kid once...just one time! Why not make that one time last as long as it can?
There are some players that you can tell at age 13 they are going to be really good. Robert Stock is a good example of that. I saw Robert play when he was 12 and it was clear he was headed for a wonderful future. But for every Robert, I can name 5 others we would have all gotten wrong (plus and minus). And even in Robert's case...why would he need to go to a showcase at that age? It isn't going to change where he ulitmately ends up is it? Everyone knew about Robert anyways.
I am in the trenches of youth baseball. I work with kids and programs age 5-14. Unfortunately where I see all this 'younger-and-younger' and 'earlier-and-earlier' trend headed is adding a lot of pressure to young parents and young kids. I have lots of stories. But among other things...I see it tearing at the fabric of community youth baseball. I hear from a dad of a 10-year old that wants to know what "throwing program" his son should be on so he can get a scholarship down the line. I had a parent get very upset with me for hurting his 7th grade son's scholarship possibilities by not putting him on the 8th grade team (his son DID get a scholarship 5 years later after all). I know a kid (now 19) who was the biggest doggone stud hitter you could imagine at age 13...hit bombs everywhere he went from both sides of the plate...now he struggles at a local JC hitting below .200 and it doesn't look like it will get much better. A 13-year old showcase rating on him would have been off the charts I can assure you. And I know a parent of a very talented 13-year old pitcher who wonders if his son should even bother with playing HS baseball because it might be a waste of time. GEEZ!
I realize that the way we (my parent-peers and me) did things probably scared the parents of kids 10 years before me. They probably thought my group was pushing too hard or too early...so I use that perspective in trying to temper my thoughts on this. But you're only a kid once...just one time! Why not make that one time last as long as it can?
quote:Originally posted by justbaseball:
Why is a showcase or a rating needed other than to feed an ego?
Let me plant my tounge firmly in my cheek....
Obviously JBB, you're totally clueless and out of touch!!! Don't you realize that if I don't take my son Joey to XYZ Showcase, he won't know how he stacks up against little Timmy Smith out of Southern Cali? If I take Joey and he does well (as I fully expect he will) then he can play for the Acme Bandits next year, who qualified for the Super 12 tournament, which will get him on the national scene. Once that happens, his coach will hopefully nominate him for the coveted Wheaties Junior Baseball All American team. With that trophy on his shelf, he's most likely to get picked up for the following season by the Commandos out of Georgia who are nationally ranked annually. Many of the top colleges recruit Commando players and would logically take lil Joey. Sheesh, JBB, must I explain everything???
.....removed tounge from cheek.
....................... 
I have spent more money on my son playing baseball than it would have cost me to pay four years at Texas, Texas A&M or Texas Tech.
It's not about the money, it's about allowing him to chase HIS dream. My son is a Senior in HS and has yet to attend a PG event, but will attend two this fall. One a team event and one a Showcase.
I should have had him attend earlier.
Why?
My son is a 5' 9" outfielder with pretty good skills, but he's 5'9" tall. And if you just watch him play a game with his summer team, he blends in. They are looking at the 6'4" guy.
He attended the Stanford Camp and the coaches there were impressed, enough that he is getting a lot of phone calls.
But that camp exposed him to a lot of the Ivey's and Div III schools.
He'd like to see a scholarship offer, anything over books, so the school has at least a little monitary committment to him. Something he won't get at the Ivey's or DIII.
I think at PG, he'll get that exposure to those smaller D1's and D2's. Time will tell.
If he doesn't, then my son will have the memory of he and I travelling to Georgia and Florida together. We are making his first unofficial visit while in Atlanta, so we are killing two birds with one stone, so to speak.
If I had it all to do over again, I'd spend every single dollar. I'd forgo getting a new car as I have done in order to pay for it.
He's only young once, and I have enjoyed watching him play every single game he's played.
It's not about the money, it's about allowing him to chase HIS dream. My son is a Senior in HS and has yet to attend a PG event, but will attend two this fall. One a team event and one a Showcase.
I should have had him attend earlier.
Why?
My son is a 5' 9" outfielder with pretty good skills, but he's 5'9" tall. And if you just watch him play a game with his summer team, he blends in. They are looking at the 6'4" guy.
He attended the Stanford Camp and the coaches there were impressed, enough that he is getting a lot of phone calls.
But that camp exposed him to a lot of the Ivey's and Div III schools.
He'd like to see a scholarship offer, anything over books, so the school has at least a little monitary committment to him. Something he won't get at the Ivey's or DIII.
I think at PG, he'll get that exposure to those smaller D1's and D2's. Time will tell.
If he doesn't, then my son will have the memory of he and I travelling to Georgia and Florida together. We are making his first unofficial visit while in Atlanta, so we are killing two birds with one stone, so to speak.
If I had it all to do over again, I'd spend every single dollar. I'd forgo getting a new car as I have done in order to pay for it.
He's only young once, and I have enjoyed watching him play every single game he's played.
After having been through this loop already - and doing it again - I much prefer the travel tournaments over the showcases.
My own personal experience with showcase events has been sort of mind boggling.
The eldest went to about 5 over a 2 year period.
Showcase #1 - says - a definite pro prospect.
Showcase #2 - says fringe draft pick- definite high D1 prospect
Showcase #3 - says maybe a D1 prospect
Showcase #4 - says a D2/D3 prospect
Showacse #5 - basically says he stinks. LOL
After reflecting on it when it was all over - I realized - alot of these dudes must be dead wrong - or worse. I think that is a reasonable assumption to make. LOL
The tournaments were far more exciting - and well attended by scouts - and alot of fun.
I have followed many highly touted showcase players over the years - and then - when I would go see them - they stunk. Just flat out stunk. Coudlnt even chew gum and walk at the same time.
In some cases I would see the player 4 or 5 times. Each time I just shook my head and wondered what the heck was going on. Stunk just as bad as ever.
And it worked the other way too - great players - that noone paid attention to or mentioned.
Anybody with half a brain can pick the super stud - 1st rounder - out of a crowd. You dont need 50 years of baseball experience to do that. But the vast majority of the rest of the stuff doesnt have very much to do with actual performance IMO.
My youngest will be doing the tournament thing - as he has the last few years - he loves it and so do we. Especially the PG events.
The last thing in the world he needs right now is to go to a showcase - perform well - and then be told he stinks anyway.
Just doesnt cut it for me anymore.
To each his own I guess.
My own personal experience with showcase events has been sort of mind boggling.
The eldest went to about 5 over a 2 year period.
Showcase #1 - says - a definite pro prospect.
Showcase #2 - says fringe draft pick- definite high D1 prospect
Showcase #3 - says maybe a D1 prospect
Showcase #4 - says a D2/D3 prospect
Showacse #5 - basically says he stinks. LOL
After reflecting on it when it was all over - I realized - alot of these dudes must be dead wrong - or worse. I think that is a reasonable assumption to make. LOL
The tournaments were far more exciting - and well attended by scouts - and alot of fun.
I have followed many highly touted showcase players over the years - and then - when I would go see them - they stunk. Just flat out stunk. Coudlnt even chew gum and walk at the same time.
In some cases I would see the player 4 or 5 times. Each time I just shook my head and wondered what the heck was going on. Stunk just as bad as ever.
And it worked the other way too - great players - that noone paid attention to or mentioned.
Anybody with half a brain can pick the super stud - 1st rounder - out of a crowd. You dont need 50 years of baseball experience to do that. But the vast majority of the rest of the stuff doesnt have very much to do with actual performance IMO.
My youngest will be doing the tournament thing - as he has the last few years - he loves it and so do we. Especially the PG events.
The last thing in the world he needs right now is to go to a showcase - perform well - and then be told he stinks anyway.
Just doesnt cut it for me anymore.
To each his own I guess.
Wow what a great discussion by coaches, PG, and parents!
Let me comment. I am a parent of a recruited player. I've spent money on elite travel teams, roadtrips, showcases, hotels, championship rings, coaches, trainers, etc., and it has been quite a learning experience. He will probably get a scholarship. But as more than a few of you have commented, the real benefit is the time with your son, seeing him develop and grow and pursuing his dream. If he plays college ball, I'll get to see some more. Either way, it won't be wasted and I would do it all again.
So here's what I learned. Your son will get better by playing against the best competition. Therefore, get him on the best summer team you can afford once he gets to high school - don't waste your money before that. The summer after his junior year is when you spend the most money - before that you are only stimulating the economy. PG is worth the money as are the Area Codes - but take care in doing anything more than that. It is a business and you are their prey. Elite summer teams are great if your boy is a starter - but no one gets recruited sitting on a bench. Get yourself invited to Junior Days, and go to the college camps of the schools that fit your son academically and athletically - but get some advice from a pro scout (if you think you may be delusional about your son's ability level). Don't just go because you got invited. Don't depend on someone like a high school coach or travel team coach to promote your son - it may or may not happen - you were put on God's green earth to do that. If you treat people with respect, others may help you along the way. Good luck to everyone, and thanks for a great discussion.
Let me comment. I am a parent of a recruited player. I've spent money on elite travel teams, roadtrips, showcases, hotels, championship rings, coaches, trainers, etc., and it has been quite a learning experience. He will probably get a scholarship. But as more than a few of you have commented, the real benefit is the time with your son, seeing him develop and grow and pursuing his dream. If he plays college ball, I'll get to see some more. Either way, it won't be wasted and I would do it all again.
So here's what I learned. Your son will get better by playing against the best competition. Therefore, get him on the best summer team you can afford once he gets to high school - don't waste your money before that. The summer after his junior year is when you spend the most money - before that you are only stimulating the economy. PG is worth the money as are the Area Codes - but take care in doing anything more than that. It is a business and you are their prey. Elite summer teams are great if your boy is a starter - but no one gets recruited sitting on a bench. Get yourself invited to Junior Days, and go to the college camps of the schools that fit your son academically and athletically - but get some advice from a pro scout (if you think you may be delusional about your son's ability level). Don't just go because you got invited. Don't depend on someone like a high school coach or travel team coach to promote your son - it may or may not happen - you were put on God's green earth to do that. If you treat people with respect, others may help you along the way. Good luck to everyone, and thanks for a great discussion.
Good post Brod! Welcome 
quote:He did not pitch for his HS team except freshman year, but the varsity pitching coach loves his strong arm and is looking to get him on the mound for his senior season. Should he showcase for pitching as well as oufield? He has pitched for his summer team and throws around 85 MPH.
First, as Dad04 mentioned, nice post and welcome to the hsbbweb brod from California
Secondly, the question quoted above was taken from MD21's well written post above. Welcome as well MD21
Here is my two cents on your question and I have no idea if it is the right answer for you or not. If your son's hs coach wants to have him pitch and this is something your son wants to do - I say go for it.
Beyond that, and in my humble opinion, he probably doesn't have much of a chance pitching at the next level. I am sure there are exceptions to this but go look at just about any college roster and read the respective bio's of the pitching staff. In most cases the bio's read like an all-star sheet where you have hs All-Americans, all state players, all county/all league players, and so forth. Kids who have practiced the craft over a number of years.
I think your son would be better served by getting better at what he does best and thus showcasing those things he does best.
I am sure there are probably late bloomers out there who arrive on the scene later in their careers for a given position but I wonder how many.
Grateful,
I enjoyed reading your post and understand what you are saying.
I don't think however, it is showcases and tournaments that have changed the parity for D2,D3. Why would one want to go to a D3 school, where no money is available for scholarships and there is less exposure if they can get into a D1 school. As someone suggested, the process doesn't stop once you get to college, most players are looking for a career beyond college. How many D2, D3 prospects are actually drafted each year and how many actually play MLB? Why is that? There are many talented players that go to these schools (ex. infielddad's son), but why do most not go further than college?
This is no way a slam on any division, but frankly I would prefer my player to try to get a small piece of the scholarship pie than none at all (D3 does not give athletic scholarships, right) and have a fair shot at playing for or either against larger schools, if anything for exposure.
I enjoyed reading your post and understand what you are saying.
I don't think however, it is showcases and tournaments that have changed the parity for D2,D3. Why would one want to go to a D3 school, where no money is available for scholarships and there is less exposure if they can get into a D1 school. As someone suggested, the process doesn't stop once you get to college, most players are looking for a career beyond college. How many D2, D3 prospects are actually drafted each year and how many actually play MLB? Why is that? There are many talented players that go to these schools (ex. infielddad's son), but why do most not go further than college?
This is no way a slam on any division, but frankly I would prefer my player to try to get a small piece of the scholarship pie than none at all (D3 does not give athletic scholarships, right) and have a fair shot at playing for or either against larger schools, if anything for exposure.
TPM,
Interesting point about the money - but quite frankly - many many D-1 programs are not very good at all in baseball.
And remember - MLB rosters are chock full of players that attended JUCO's - or didnt attend college at all.
In fact - they exceed the number of players that played at D-1's.
Interesting point about the money - but quite frankly - many many D-1 programs are not very good at all in baseball.
And remember - MLB rosters are chock full of players that attended JUCO's - or didnt attend college at all.
In fact - they exceed the number of players that played at D-1's.
quote:Originally posted by OLDSLUGGER8:
I truly admire guys like PG Jerry who provide venues for kids.
Not to turn this into a lovefest - but he does alot more than that.
As do guys like TRHit and some other good guys in this aspect of the game.
I think they do it for the love of the game and to help the kids. I really do.
And make no mistake - there are alot of guys out there nowadays that do it just for the money - but they are pretty easy to spot. It wasnt so easy to spot them 5 years ago - but it is now.
The evolution - on a regional and national basis - continues - and ultimately IMO - I think it helps the kids.
TPM, you raise some intriguing and appropriate questions. In general, I think the view of having a small scholarship at a mid to lower level DI as opposed to no athletic scholarship at a DIII is the majority view.
I also think it is why there is a boom in the recruiting/showcase business.
Since ours went to a DIII, let me provide some opposite commentary.
For us, Trinity(TX) was superior academically to any of the DI programs where Jason was admitted and had the opportunity to walk on. He received an academic scholarship which also helped. At the time he chose Trinity and at the time he had to decide to remain at Trinity or transfer to an ACC program, academics were very important in his decision.
Secondly, he visited and confirmed in his own mine what he had been told...if he worked hard, he would play from day one. He did.
Thirdly, the issue of playing and proving himself with the best was a major factor. Luckily, there are summer wood bat leagues. At Trinity, they are spectacular at placement. The effort the coaches expended at getting our son into the Cape was beyond belief. That is the one circumstance where, very honestly, DIII itself was a roadblock. However, he ended up in Newport, RI where he had an experience second to none on the field...and off, from what I hear.
He proved a lot to himself and others that summer and that likely made a huge difference in his getting drafted.
Another component was was the recruiting process itself. When you get calls every Monday for about 20 or so weeks from one coach and compare that with a DI program that overnights 6 packages of materials and questionaires..all the same..before they finally come to see you in July after your senior year and make an offer on the spot, it makes a difference. The DI's who said they had some interest did just that..showed "some" interest. Trinity said they were interested, demonstrated the interest, and provided an outline of where he would play in the summer, and the level of progression it would follow. They planted the seed he could play beyond college. I guess they sold a good line but they delivered on every element of the academics and athletics.
For our son, that package was far more attractive than the possibility of a small scholarship at a mid/low level DI.
I also think it is why there is a boom in the recruiting/showcase business.
Since ours went to a DIII, let me provide some opposite commentary.
For us, Trinity(TX) was superior academically to any of the DI programs where Jason was admitted and had the opportunity to walk on. He received an academic scholarship which also helped. At the time he chose Trinity and at the time he had to decide to remain at Trinity or transfer to an ACC program, academics were very important in his decision.
Secondly, he visited and confirmed in his own mine what he had been told...if he worked hard, he would play from day one. He did.
Thirdly, the issue of playing and proving himself with the best was a major factor. Luckily, there are summer wood bat leagues. At Trinity, they are spectacular at placement. The effort the coaches expended at getting our son into the Cape was beyond belief. That is the one circumstance where, very honestly, DIII itself was a roadblock. However, he ended up in Newport, RI where he had an experience second to none on the field...and off, from what I hear.
He proved a lot to himself and others that summer and that likely made a huge difference in his getting drafted.Another component was was the recruiting process itself. When you get calls every Monday for about 20 or so weeks from one coach and compare that with a DI program that overnights 6 packages of materials and questionaires..all the same..before they finally come to see you in July after your senior year and make an offer on the spot, it makes a difference. The DI's who said they had some interest did just that..showed "some" interest. Trinity said they were interested, demonstrated the interest, and provided an outline of where he would play in the summer, and the level of progression it would follow. They planted the seed he could play beyond college. I guess they sold a good line but they delivered on every element of the academics and athletics.
For our son, that package was far more attractive than the possibility of a small scholarship at a mid/low level DI.
My son went the mid-major D1 scholly route (A top 50 type team) - as opposed to other excellent D-1's, Ivies and D2/D3 schools.
It was an unmitigated disaster.
Every possible thing a parent worries about in a baseball program occurred. It was like a blueprint for complete failure. (The Hindenburg of college baseball recruiting - LOL)
All I can say is - if you think D-1 is the only way to go - you are sadly mistaken.
Luckily - he was able to transfer and wind up in a nice situation - still got the opportunity to play in the summer - against excellent competition - and get the job done.
Is there a stigma playing D-2 and D3 - You betcha. Dont kid yourself - whether implicit or explicit - you will get an earful.
But if the kid can play - the right people will notice.
Remember - the majority of MLB players never even set foot in a 4 year college - D1 D2 or D3.
It was an unmitigated disaster.
Every possible thing a parent worries about in a baseball program occurred. It was like a blueprint for complete failure. (The Hindenburg of college baseball recruiting - LOL)
All I can say is - if you think D-1 is the only way to go - you are sadly mistaken.
Luckily - he was able to transfer and wind up in a nice situation - still got the opportunity to play in the summer - against excellent competition - and get the job done.
Is there a stigma playing D-2 and D3 - You betcha. Dont kid yourself - whether implicit or explicit - you will get an earful.
But if the kid can play - the right people will notice.
Remember - the majority of MLB players never even set foot in a 4 year college - D1 D2 or D3.
Thanks for your reply ClevelandDad. I am really taking in all of the posts in this discussion. Fortunately, the showcases that he has attended thus far has allowed him to showcase at both outfield and pitching. He is looking at it as a learning experience for pitching. You are right that he would not even be considered at this position with his lack of experience for a D1 program, but he has spoken with a few DIII coaches that love that he can play various positions. His HS coach thinks if he can gain some weight-he is pretty skinny yet- he can put some more speed on his ball.
He is a really hard-working kid, and we will support him in his dream the best we can. I think we will stick with picking showcases and camps at the schools where he fits. He has been getting letters and questionaires from schools he has not even considered yet. We will see where this all leads and because of this site we are better prepared to take some control of the process. The "Be Patient" forum discussion was a great one for parents new to this process.
He is a really hard-working kid, and we will support him in his dream the best we can. I think we will stick with picking showcases and camps at the schools where he fits. He has been getting letters and questionaires from schools he has not even considered yet. We will see where this all leads and because of this site we are better prepared to take some control of the process. The "Be Patient" forum discussion was a great one for parents new to this process.
MD21, Welcome!!! Good luck to you and to your son.
With your son heading into his senior year, not being fully developed physically, and, it seems, very much just coming into his own in baseball, you may need to be very adaptable. The college recruiting process is highly unpredictable and the road can be very winding. I say this only because of your comment on picking camps and showcases at schools where he fits. I know what you are saying but, to be honest, the issue often times isn't whether it is a fit for you but rather a fit for the college coach. For most of us, we don't dictate where our son attends and plays, especially late bloomers. I would recommend having your son call the coaches of the "fit schools" and start to understand whether he fits...with them. The responses may well give you confirmation you are on the right track or lead you to start responding to the other programs where you don't see a current fit.
Also, I would recommend you read about Chris Lambert who ended up going to BC and became a #1 pick of St. Louis. About 3 weeks before he was going to college, he wasn't even going to play baseball. One showcase changed that...but he also threw 92 in front of a number of coaches.
As you read more on the site, I think you will learn of the number of players attending college at a school they didn't have any idea about as late as the beginning of the senior year, and sometimes even later.
Also, I would focus your showcasing/camp efforts on what he does best. Realize he is going to be anxious. If he has a very strong arm, that will be noticed whether he pitches or not. When he leaves these opportunities, you want the coaches to remember what he did best. I agree with CD on the pitching side.
With your son heading into his senior year, not being fully developed physically, and, it seems, very much just coming into his own in baseball, you may need to be very adaptable. The college recruiting process is highly unpredictable and the road can be very winding. I say this only because of your comment on picking camps and showcases at schools where he fits. I know what you are saying but, to be honest, the issue often times isn't whether it is a fit for you but rather a fit for the college coach. For most of us, we don't dictate where our son attends and plays, especially late bloomers. I would recommend having your son call the coaches of the "fit schools" and start to understand whether he fits...with them. The responses may well give you confirmation you are on the right track or lead you to start responding to the other programs where you don't see a current fit.
Also, I would recommend you read about Chris Lambert who ended up going to BC and became a #1 pick of St. Louis. About 3 weeks before he was going to college, he wasn't even going to play baseball. One showcase changed that...but he also threw 92 in front of a number of coaches.
As you read more on the site, I think you will learn of the number of players attending college at a school they didn't have any idea about as late as the beginning of the senior year, and sometimes even later.
Also, I would focus your showcasing/camp efforts on what he does best. Realize he is going to be anxious. If he has a very strong arm, that will be noticed whether he pitches or not. When he leaves these opportunities, you want the coaches to remember what he did best. I agree with CD on the pitching side.
If anyone is interested in an old Chris Lambert story. He later became a first round pick.
By John Tomase
May 26, 2004
CHESTNUT HILL, Mass.--The hockey sticks were stowed for the 60-mile drive north into New Hampshire's White Mountains.
In just a couple of weeks, Chris Lambert would begin a postgraduate year at the Holderness School in Plymouth. Maybe the defenseman would earn a scholarship to UMass or UNH. Maybe his juniors career would explode. Maybe he'd emerge as an NHL prospect.
But Lambert had another love, and he figured he'd give it one last shot. So on Aug. 17, 2001, he attended the Perfect Game Northeast Showcase in Wareham, Mass.
Lambert arrived at Spillane Field an unknown. The shortstop had captained Manchester Memorial as a senior, then won an American Legion batting title and MVP that summer.
New Hampshire baseball awards mean about as much as Florida ice fishing trophies, so Lambert the baseball player went undrafted and unrecruited.
But he had a secret. And when he finished sharing it, he became the most sought after amateur baseball player in the country.
Chris Lambert, it turns out, could pitch. His fastball topped 95 mph. His curveball had bite. The high school sophomores and juniors trying to hit him with wood bats had no chance.
"I pretty much went into it saying, 'I'm either going to throw my arm out because I'm never going to use it again, or nothing's going to happen,' " Lambert recalls. "I was going to play hockey anyway."
Cue sound of needle scratching off phonograph. Just days before the start of fall semesters, Lambert found himself at the center of a recruiting war. Clemson wanted him. LSU wanted him. Vanderbilt wanted him.
"It was like nothing I've ever seen," Tim Corbin, the Vanderbilt coach who was then Clemson's recruiting coordinator, told BA last summer. "I've never seen an unsigned senior who was that good that late in the summer."
Lambert's hometown Boston College Eagles won the battle. He enrolled at the Heights on Aug. 24, started classes in January, and joined the baseball team that spring. Out of nowhere as a freshman, he beat Rutgers' Bobby Brownlie for Big East Pitcher of the Year honors.
"I had two and a half weeks to make my decision and it wasn't like I could visit the schools," Lambert says. "Pack your bags, pick an airline, and where you land is where you're going to spend the next four years. It was a scary decision."
Two years later, he's wrapping up a college career that requires a full page in the media guide just for his awards. Despite an inconsistent junior season, he's likely to go no worse than early in the second round of the June draft. He could easily become the first Eagle ever selected in the first round.
Not bad for a New Hampshire native who pitched three innings in high school ("My coach thought I was more valuable to the team at shortstop") and only played baseball on the few days that didn't include ice, snow and temperatures on the wrong side of freezing.
"I think I'm just starting," Lambert says. "As far as baseball goes, I'm just a baby."
Here’s another short article
Chris Lambert has had some interesting turn of events since attending the Perfect Game Northeast Showcase late last August.
Chris had planned on attending Prep School in order to increase his chances of playing college or professional baseball. He had gone undrafted after his senior year at Manchester Memorial High School.
Worse yet, Chris who was an honor student wasn't really offered any outstanding college scholarships. A good athlete, he spent most of his time in high school playing a position.
Lambert decided he would attend the PG Showcase held in the Cape Cod area in Wareham, MA. The rest is well...History.
Lambert was rated by PG, the #1 prospect in the Wareham event that was loaded with talent. The reason...He threw live fastballs in the low 90s, topping at 94 mph. His breaking ball was equally impressive, if not more so.
College coaches in attendance perked up quickly. National powers Clemson and LSU were among the many who made a play for the well built right-hander.
Major League scouts were on their cell phones, trying to OK money to make an offer. Shortly there after, Boston College entered the picture and signed the star pitcher. B.C. had been Lambert's favorite school all along and he wasn't going to pass up the opportunity.
By John Tomase
May 26, 2004
CHESTNUT HILL, Mass.--The hockey sticks were stowed for the 60-mile drive north into New Hampshire's White Mountains.
In just a couple of weeks, Chris Lambert would begin a postgraduate year at the Holderness School in Plymouth. Maybe the defenseman would earn a scholarship to UMass or UNH. Maybe his juniors career would explode. Maybe he'd emerge as an NHL prospect.
But Lambert had another love, and he figured he'd give it one last shot. So on Aug. 17, 2001, he attended the Perfect Game Northeast Showcase in Wareham, Mass.
Lambert arrived at Spillane Field an unknown. The shortstop had captained Manchester Memorial as a senior, then won an American Legion batting title and MVP that summer.
New Hampshire baseball awards mean about as much as Florida ice fishing trophies, so Lambert the baseball player went undrafted and unrecruited.
But he had a secret. And when he finished sharing it, he became the most sought after amateur baseball player in the country.
Chris Lambert, it turns out, could pitch. His fastball topped 95 mph. His curveball had bite. The high school sophomores and juniors trying to hit him with wood bats had no chance.
"I pretty much went into it saying, 'I'm either going to throw my arm out because I'm never going to use it again, or nothing's going to happen,' " Lambert recalls. "I was going to play hockey anyway."
Cue sound of needle scratching off phonograph. Just days before the start of fall semesters, Lambert found himself at the center of a recruiting war. Clemson wanted him. LSU wanted him. Vanderbilt wanted him.
"It was like nothing I've ever seen," Tim Corbin, the Vanderbilt coach who was then Clemson's recruiting coordinator, told BA last summer. "I've never seen an unsigned senior who was that good that late in the summer."
Lambert's hometown Boston College Eagles won the battle. He enrolled at the Heights on Aug. 24, started classes in January, and joined the baseball team that spring. Out of nowhere as a freshman, he beat Rutgers' Bobby Brownlie for Big East Pitcher of the Year honors.
"I had two and a half weeks to make my decision and it wasn't like I could visit the schools," Lambert says. "Pack your bags, pick an airline, and where you land is where you're going to spend the next four years. It was a scary decision."
Two years later, he's wrapping up a college career that requires a full page in the media guide just for his awards. Despite an inconsistent junior season, he's likely to go no worse than early in the second round of the June draft. He could easily become the first Eagle ever selected in the first round.
Not bad for a New Hampshire native who pitched three innings in high school ("My coach thought I was more valuable to the team at shortstop") and only played baseball on the few days that didn't include ice, snow and temperatures on the wrong side of freezing.
"I think I'm just starting," Lambert says. "As far as baseball goes, I'm just a baby."
Here’s another short article
Chris Lambert has had some interesting turn of events since attending the Perfect Game Northeast Showcase late last August.
Chris had planned on attending Prep School in order to increase his chances of playing college or professional baseball. He had gone undrafted after his senior year at Manchester Memorial High School.
Worse yet, Chris who was an honor student wasn't really offered any outstanding college scholarships. A good athlete, he spent most of his time in high school playing a position.
Lambert decided he would attend the PG Showcase held in the Cape Cod area in Wareham, MA. The rest is well...History.
Lambert was rated by PG, the #1 prospect in the Wareham event that was loaded with talent. The reason...He threw live fastballs in the low 90s, topping at 94 mph. His breaking ball was equally impressive, if not more so.
College coaches in attendance perked up quickly. National powers Clemson and LSU were among the many who made a play for the well built right-hander.
Major League scouts were on their cell phones, trying to OK money to make an offer. Shortly there after, Boston College entered the picture and signed the star pitcher. B.C. had been Lambert's favorite school all along and he wasn't going to pass up the opportunity.
Thanks. I just printed it off for my son to read. Should be a good source of inspiration-anything is possible!
Infielddad,
Thanks for the reply to my post.
iitg,
You are absolutely correct, not all D1 schools are created equal. In fact, so many mid D1's have become so competitive with desire to win, I do not feel they always offer the best opportunities for every player. And as I have always stated, programs at the top D1 schools are NOT for everyone.
This is a great topic and will be placed eventually in the golden topic thread.
Thanks for the reply to my post.
iitg,
You are absolutely correct, not all D1 schools are created equal. In fact, so many mid D1's have become so competitive with desire to win, I do not feel they always offer the best opportunities for every player. And as I have always stated, programs at the top D1 schools are NOT for everyone.
This is a great topic and will be placed eventually in the golden topic thread.
I think this is a great topic, as my heart really goes out to parents who fear their limited financial resources will negatively impact their son's future in baseball, as this is how we felt when our boys were in high school.
We put our money towards good area select teams the last two summers of high school, a few lessons in the off season, and one showcase. Both sons also attended anything free that came their way...MLB tryouts, Scouting Bureau showcases, etc.
In the end, both were mid rounds draft picks out of high school and received excellent scholarships to college programs that provided solid opportunities for their development.
Over the years I've learned that the best recruiting approach is probably faith combined with an open mind. God has a plan for our guys and can guide them to it within any budget.
We put our money towards good area select teams the last two summers of high school, a few lessons in the off season, and one showcase. Both sons also attended anything free that came their way...MLB tryouts, Scouting Bureau showcases, etc.
In the end, both were mid rounds draft picks out of high school and received excellent scholarships to college programs that provided solid opportunities for their development.
Over the years I've learned that the best recruiting approach is probably faith combined with an open mind. God has a plan for our guys and can guide them to it within any budget.
PG has become the gorilla in college showcases and I would like to add a negative to some of the positives being discussed here. I am certain my son, who participated in a major PG event, was significantly hurt in recruiting by the experience.
At the showcase he attended, he received a total of 4 innings at his position over two days, because the "coach" assigned by PG insisted on playing the individuals from his team who he brought to the showcase. PG evaluators had little or nothing to look at when attempting to evaluate my son's performance.
At another showcase, where my son was given equal playing time, he fared both very well on the field and with evaluations.
PG, as well as other showcases, should understand that a relatively negative evaluation of a player in very limited circumstances carries far more weight than is warranted.
I regret having exposed my son to the PG experience.
At the showcase he attended, he received a total of 4 innings at his position over two days, because the "coach" assigned by PG insisted on playing the individuals from his team who he brought to the showcase. PG evaluators had little or nothing to look at when attempting to evaluate my son's performance.
At another showcase, where my son was given equal playing time, he fared both very well on the field and with evaluations.
PG, as well as other showcases, should understand that a relatively negative evaluation of a player in very limited circumstances carries far more weight than is warranted.
I regret having exposed my son to the PG experience.
quote:Originally posted by Tiger Paw Mom:
And as I have always stated, programs at the top D1 schools are NOT for everyone.
This is a great topic and will be placed eventually in the golden topic thread.
TPM,
I agree with you 100%. You have always been consistent on this point - and it is something many parents should think about. Regardless of how good their son's may be at the game.
Top programs - like the ones your son plays for - demand a heck of a lot on the field and off the field. In many cases - incoming freshman to these programs will be very surprised at how difficult it really is.
I think that although some people may be put off by your advice - it is truly something every player and his parents should consider before choosing a college.
quote:Over the years I've learned that the best recruiting approach is probably faith combined with an open mind. God has a plan for our guys and can guide them to it within any budget.
TXMom - The best advice yet!
Getting back to the recruiting youngers players.....
I was watching the Team One / Baseball Factory all star game again last night (I've never seen the complete game yet) but at some point, the announcers interviewed Max Siebert of Baseball Factory. I forget how the one discussion started but they asked him how early they start recruiting players. He said they start looking at them "as early as 14 or 15".
I just think it's a snowball effect. If you go back 10 years, how many players verballed as a Junior? How many do now? How long before a Sophomore gives a verbal....if they haven't already?
And TPM and some others have suggested the showcases have changed the face of recruiting. Actually, I think it's the ever increasing amount of travel teams, training facilities and private instructors who are the catalysts. I don't know for a fact but would imagine that the skill sets of the players showcasing over the past 5 - 10 years have increased dramatically. I highly doubt the number of available scholarships have changed significantly over a 10 year period but do think the number of talented kids competing for the limited number of spots has significantly increased. I would suggest that this phenomenon is what has triggered the early recruiting. Kids and parents know the number of spots are limited and they know the competition is fierce and they know the good players verbal as a Junior, so they do what they can to position little Timmy to be seen by Clemson, LSU, USC, Cal State at an earlier age. Are they going to offer him as a Freshman? No but the hope is that he got their attention so that when it IS time to offer, he's already on their list, and hopefully at the top of the list.
I was watching the Team One / Baseball Factory all star game again last night (I've never seen the complete game yet) but at some point, the announcers interviewed Max Siebert of Baseball Factory. I forget how the one discussion started but they asked him how early they start recruiting players. He said they start looking at them "as early as 14 or 15".
I just think it's a snowball effect. If you go back 10 years, how many players verballed as a Junior? How many do now? How long before a Sophomore gives a verbal....if they haven't already?
And TPM and some others have suggested the showcases have changed the face of recruiting. Actually, I think it's the ever increasing amount of travel teams, training facilities and private instructors who are the catalysts. I don't know for a fact but would imagine that the skill sets of the players showcasing over the past 5 - 10 years have increased dramatically. I highly doubt the number of available scholarships have changed significantly over a 10 year period but do think the number of talented kids competing for the limited number of spots has significantly increased. I would suggest that this phenomenon is what has triggered the early recruiting. Kids and parents know the number of spots are limited and they know the competition is fierce and they know the good players verbal as a Junior, so they do what they can to position little Timmy to be seen by Clemson, LSU, USC, Cal State at an earlier age. Are they going to offer him as a Freshman? No but the hope is that he got their attention so that when it IS time to offer, he's already on their list, and hopefully at the top of the list.
Dear Fungo,
Thank you,...my breathing has eased,..my head is not spinning as fast as it was all summer.
I found peace in your posting.
I feel relieved.
We have a highschool jr who plays baseball. His lifetime dream is to play baseball.
We move from Hawaii to Kansas two years ago. POOF POW,...EVERYONE and their brother started telling us that we needed to get our son " showcased " and if we didnt hit the ground flying at warp speed, attending 100 miles per hour in multiple states, then we were ruining his chance of being seen and recruited by colleges. Huh?? What?? Wasn't him making Little League All-Stars every year he's ever played enough? Made Varsity his highschool freshman year, ...even started,...we were quite proud,.....got a 6A League Honor,..nope? Still not enough??? Some said we needed a scout to get us an invite? Others said we should have started this years ago? They cost hoooow much??? Gas has gone up to what price??? EEEEK!!!! Pant pant pant,...I have a migraine, perhaps because my head is spinning out of control. They have to run how fast for the 60 and throw how fast??? PING PING PING!!!! Perhaps I need to get a part time job to finance all of this,...perhaps my son can double the number of yards he mows.
Hmmmm,....logically I suppose it all makes sense,..especially because we are living in a little frog pond,...waaaay out Kansas,....what are the chances someone would see him while he plays summer ball in town? Who of big baseball college importance actually reads our little Mayberry town newspaper and sees his freckly-face and accomplishments highlighted in the sports section plastered all over my frig?
Perhaps my son has been a big baseball fish in only little ponds? How do we know? Worry*worry* worry. Whats the REAL talent out there, his age in other states? Ok,..I'm buying,...where do I sign him up?
Scan the www,...found HSBBW,...ok good,...recruiting,...showcasing,..tons of info,..where am I gonna get a scout??? Heyyy,..lookie there,..got some invites by splashing my sons face and stats on every site known to man kind,.( hhmmm,..is this safe?) Retract it all,...take him to only a few showcases,...he does average,...put him on a summer tournament traveling team,..he does really good.
Know some boys who did well, alot better than my son at the showcases, yet when we watched them play during the season we saw multiple errors and problems, even some painful not so desireable attitudes. Woops,...see,..there goes my head,..its starting to spin again!!!!
To be honest,...I have no idea what this all means,...its just been our life lately. My gutt keeps jumping in and telling my head,..hey ya know what?,..perhaps we are trying to bend fate into too many directions. Maybe we are dancing too fast to the routine? No one wants to be left out or miss out on an important opportunity,...but I think perhaps,..we should as many many HSBBW Old Timers keep saying,"Let the process happen". I think we've spent alot of time/money/& as someone else said before, lack of yardwork/etc. etc. trying to figure out what exactly THAT process is.
So to those who have helped us along the way,..and to those who wont cut us loose after this posting, we say thank youuuu sincerely!!!
Knowledge is key.
We have decided to do what feels right to us, at our pace, and try to find a balance. If the kids got talent,..he's gotta fit in somewhere!!
Thanks FUNGO,....it feels peaceful to know others have said this approach is ok.
Thank you,...my breathing has eased,..my head is not spinning as fast as it was all summer.
I found peace in your posting.
I feel relieved.
We have a highschool jr who plays baseball. His lifetime dream is to play baseball.
We move from Hawaii to Kansas two years ago. POOF POW,...EVERYONE and their brother started telling us that we needed to get our son " showcased " and if we didnt hit the ground flying at warp speed, attending 100 miles per hour in multiple states, then we were ruining his chance of being seen and recruited by colleges. Huh?? What?? Wasn't him making Little League All-Stars every year he's ever played enough? Made Varsity his highschool freshman year, ...even started,...we were quite proud,.....got a 6A League Honor,..nope? Still not enough??? Some said we needed a scout to get us an invite? Others said we should have started this years ago? They cost hoooow much??? Gas has gone up to what price??? EEEEK!!!! Pant pant pant,...I have a migraine, perhaps because my head is spinning out of control. They have to run how fast for the 60 and throw how fast??? PING PING PING!!!! Perhaps I need to get a part time job to finance all of this,...perhaps my son can double the number of yards he mows.
Hmmmm,....logically I suppose it all makes sense,..especially because we are living in a little frog pond,...waaaay out Kansas,....what are the chances someone would see him while he plays summer ball in town? Who of big baseball college importance actually reads our little Mayberry town newspaper and sees his freckly-face and accomplishments highlighted in the sports section plastered all over my frig?
Perhaps my son has been a big baseball fish in only little ponds? How do we know? Worry*worry* worry. Whats the REAL talent out there, his age in other states? Ok,..I'm buying,...where do I sign him up?
Scan the www,...found HSBBW,...ok good,...recruiting,...showcasing,..tons of info,..where am I gonna get a scout??? Heyyy,..lookie there,..got some invites by splashing my sons face and stats on every site known to man kind,.( hhmmm,..is this safe?) Retract it all,...take him to only a few showcases,...he does average,...put him on a summer tournament traveling team,..he does really good.
Know some boys who did well, alot better than my son at the showcases, yet when we watched them play during the season we saw multiple errors and problems, even some painful not so desireable attitudes. Woops,...see,..there goes my head,..its starting to spin again!!!!
To be honest,...I have no idea what this all means,...its just been our life lately. My gutt keeps jumping in and telling my head,..hey ya know what?,..perhaps we are trying to bend fate into too many directions. Maybe we are dancing too fast to the routine? No one wants to be left out or miss out on an important opportunity,...but I think perhaps,..we should as many many HSBBW Old Timers keep saying,"Let the process happen". I think we've spent alot of time/money/& as someone else said before, lack of yardwork/etc. etc. trying to figure out what exactly THAT process is.
So to those who have helped us along the way,..and to those who wont cut us loose after this posting, we say thank youuuu sincerely!!!
Knowledge is key.
We have decided to do what feels right to us, at our pace, and try to find a balance. If the kids got talent,..he's gotta fit in somewhere!!
Thanks FUNGO,....it feels peaceful to know others have said this approach is ok.
quote:Originally posted by shortstopmom:
We move from Hawaii to Kansas two years ago..
What were you thinking????
Hheee HHHee,...sounds crazy huh? ha!
Military needs,...er uh,...demands of the Army.
Military needs,...er uh,...demands of the Army.
MD21
Welcome, as well! I agree completely with ClevelandDad. Learning to pitch effectively later in (baseball) life, 16 or 17 is not easy. The bottom line is that his talent with determine how well he does, as most everyone will work hard at the next level. Starting on the mound late mean catching up quick.
Your son's situation quickly reminded me of one of my sons teamates this year. He was a juco transfer and was a weekend starter all year. The Oakland A's drafted him in the 11th round in June. He turned pro in this, his 3rd year as a pitcher. He was converted from SS his freshman year in college. Jason did not pitch in high school.
Jason Fernandez in College
Jason in pro ball
Welcome, as well! I agree completely with ClevelandDad. Learning to pitch effectively later in (baseball) life, 16 or 17 is not easy. The bottom line is that his talent with determine how well he does, as most everyone will work hard at the next level. Starting on the mound late mean catching up quick.
Your son's situation quickly reminded me of one of my sons teamates this year. He was a juco transfer and was a weekend starter all year. The Oakland A's drafted him in the 11th round in June. He turned pro in this, his 3rd year as a pitcher. He was converted from SS his freshman year in college. Jason did not pitch in high school.
Jason Fernandez in College
Jason in pro ball
MD21 - I agree with others that say it's difficult to become a pitcher later in career. HOWEVER, my son is a perfect example of one who's doing it. He was a CF in HS (pitched when he was young). His coach put him back on the mound for limited innings his senior year of HS. Ended up with a .52 ERA. He went to a JUCO for freshman year where he was recruited as an OF, but they ended up decided he would be a pitcher. Learned a tremendous amount there and used that year as a RS year. Went to a summer league this summer where he continued to grow in that role.
I think because pitchers are so in demand, many coaches are willing to give a kid a try in that position if they feel he warrants it, more so than any other spot on the field IMO. It might be a difficult thing to do, but can certainly be done!
Showcasing and camps may be more effective for a kid that's trying to convert into a pitcher because they can get a quick idea of how they stack up or interest that might be there.
I think because pitchers are so in demand, many coaches are willing to give a kid a try in that position if they feel he warrants it, more so than any other spot on the field IMO. It might be a difficult thing to do, but can certainly be done!
Showcasing and camps may be more effective for a kid that's trying to convert into a pitcher because they can get a quick idea of how they stack up or interest that might be there.
Showcases definitely have value. In my view, the biggest advantage gained by them is becoming eligible for the high prospect teams such as AFLAC, Team One/Baseball Factory Cape Cod, Area Code and I'm sure a few others.
I would venture that attendance at at least one of each organizations showcases is mandatory for consideration.
I see far more value in the tournaments, especially the PG and WWBA events.
I have always said that potential does not score runs or win games. Showcases can determine potential, but do little to highlight game savy. I have noticed more times than not that the kid who does not fit the profile, but knows how to win is overlooked at showcase events.
PG and WWBA have started tournaments as young as 13. This in my view will give the players who make the transition to the 90 foot bases a stage at the earliest opportunity. This will have the added effect of discovering talent for national teams such as USA Baseball, especially if the 14 year old division is included in international play.
The other national and regional organizations can again promote themselves a bit more to attract the attention of parents and young players. I have noticed such organizations as PAL and others promoting themselves on professional games, maybe public service announcements.
I would venture that attendance at at least one of each organizations showcases is mandatory for consideration.
I see far more value in the tournaments, especially the PG and WWBA events.
I have always said that potential does not score runs or win games. Showcases can determine potential, but do little to highlight game savy. I have noticed more times than not that the kid who does not fit the profile, but knows how to win is overlooked at showcase events.
PG and WWBA have started tournaments as young as 13. This in my view will give the players who make the transition to the 90 foot bases a stage at the earliest opportunity. This will have the added effect of discovering talent for national teams such as USA Baseball, especially if the 14 year old division is included in international play.
The other national and regional organizations can again promote themselves a bit more to attract the attention of parents and young players. I have noticed such organizations as PAL and others promoting themselves on professional games, maybe public service announcements.
Quote:
"We have decided to do what feels right for us, at our pace, and try to find a balance. If the kids got talent,..he's gotta fit in somewhere."
I think this was our attitude and it worked well for us. And mentioning the word "fit" is what it really is all about.
Beezer,
As far as showcases changing the face of recruiting, I think the tourneys have changed the face of recruiting more. More teams gathered in one place over a 4-5 day period is very economical for coaches.
In my opinion,one should approach individual showcases for skills assessment only. My son is going to play better for a team he has been with all summer than for one that was put together for that particular day. He's there for one purpose, pitch to the gun.
Again, the showcase should be an oportunity for your son to access himself, at an age when it is meaningful, which I don't see at 13,14. My son's first out of 2, was junior year and we never even attended with him. He went with a coach who took a few he thought should showcase for their own personal interests. Learning to adjust to the field dimensions should be learned as a player moves up at appropriate age.
I have always said your exposure to others should be in relation to your geographic location. Why does a talented player from Florida or California or Texas have to be seen in every venue throughout the country multiple times? These are the places the top recruits come from. I think the story about Lambert is a perfect example of what can happen when living in the north, where many will argue less talented players reside. I just think there is less opportunity. Those are the ones that need to be where the scouts and coaches are. The more you are isolated, the more you need exposure. You can't rely on HS (in most cases). I don't think this means running to every showcase or tourney in the country, but finding a balance for your pockets (unless they are deep) and where your son desires to play eventually.
I think what gets out of hand is when a parent takes their player to a showcase and determines their son needs "work". Now it's time for lessons, pitching, hitting, back to the showcase to see if money was well spent or not, higher rating. Thinking, the higher the rating the bigger program he will get into.
Sometimes it doesn't work that way, as in the case of Lambert, he pitched 3 innings in HS. He was obviously recruited on his potential and raw talent.
iitg,
I do sincerely hope that parents do listen to what I have posted time and time again. While attending a top program has it's definite upside, it has it's downsides.
As for the schools on PG's list, I am sure most of them do not even have to recruit by attending any event, they must get hundreds of letters a year from players wanting to attend their program. But instead of asking 40 to show up in the fall, they obviously use events to scrutinize the best players for their program. I am not usre it is always about skills either, but just watching a player from a distance as to his routine, his attitude, etc.
In conclusion,let me just be clear on one thing, I am not a strong proponant of individual showcases, in excess. For us, we used it as a tool for our son, for him to judge himself as I stated above. Also determined for him what division he most likely could play for, where he might fall in the draft. This way it gave HIM a direction as to where he might want to go to school or whether he wanted to go pro, at an age that was meaningful for him, not for us to see how good he was or wasn't. JMO
"We have decided to do what feels right for us, at our pace, and try to find a balance. If the kids got talent,..he's gotta fit in somewhere."
I think this was our attitude and it worked well for us. And mentioning the word "fit" is what it really is all about.
Beezer,
As far as showcases changing the face of recruiting, I think the tourneys have changed the face of recruiting more. More teams gathered in one place over a 4-5 day period is very economical for coaches.
In my opinion,one should approach individual showcases for skills assessment only. My son is going to play better for a team he has been with all summer than for one that was put together for that particular day. He's there for one purpose, pitch to the gun.
Again, the showcase should be an oportunity for your son to access himself, at an age when it is meaningful, which I don't see at 13,14. My son's first out of 2, was junior year and we never even attended with him. He went with a coach who took a few he thought should showcase for their own personal interests. Learning to adjust to the field dimensions should be learned as a player moves up at appropriate age.
I have always said your exposure to others should be in relation to your geographic location. Why does a talented player from Florida or California or Texas have to be seen in every venue throughout the country multiple times? These are the places the top recruits come from. I think the story about Lambert is a perfect example of what can happen when living in the north, where many will argue less talented players reside. I just think there is less opportunity. Those are the ones that need to be where the scouts and coaches are. The more you are isolated, the more you need exposure. You can't rely on HS (in most cases). I don't think this means running to every showcase or tourney in the country, but finding a balance for your pockets (unless they are deep) and where your son desires to play eventually.
I think what gets out of hand is when a parent takes their player to a showcase and determines their son needs "work". Now it's time for lessons, pitching, hitting, back to the showcase to see if money was well spent or not, higher rating. Thinking, the higher the rating the bigger program he will get into.
Sometimes it doesn't work that way, as in the case of Lambert, he pitched 3 innings in HS. He was obviously recruited on his potential and raw talent.
iitg,
I do sincerely hope that parents do listen to what I have posted time and time again. While attending a top program has it's definite upside, it has it's downsides.
As for the schools on PG's list, I am sure most of them do not even have to recruit by attending any event, they must get hundreds of letters a year from players wanting to attend their program. But instead of asking 40 to show up in the fall, they obviously use events to scrutinize the best players for their program. I am not usre it is always about skills either, but just watching a player from a distance as to his routine, his attitude, etc.
In conclusion,let me just be clear on one thing, I am not a strong proponant of individual showcases, in excess. For us, we used it as a tool for our son, for him to judge himself as I stated above. Also determined for him what division he most likely could play for, where he might fall in the draft. This way it gave HIM a direction as to where he might want to go to school or whether he wanted to go pro, at an age that was meaningful for him, not for us to see how good he was or wasn't. JMO
Hi, Fungo
I am a baseball mom in Texas and I do agree with parents investing alot of money into their child athlete's; however, with those investments you want to see your child succeed, and not fall short because they are not at a school with a high recruiting budget, or they are not the PG players, or even #1 or 2 on their team. We are happily investing into a brand new company, collegeballorbust.com, for a minimal cost of $500, to put my son into the grasp of college coaches that we have chosen. They give you a personal webpage, and update it accordingly throughout the season/year while he progresses. I know that it has been an awesome tool for his friends in football as well, because they want to promote kids who are not being seen, and expose them to the best of their abilities to increase their chances of going to college not only through scholarship, but also to play their sport that they have invested so much time, and energy into. Collegeballorbust.com is a site worth viewing for those of you with kids whose dream is to play ball of any kind, female and male alike, because the end result is your athlete making his/her own showcase to present to the college coaches not the recruiters.
I am a baseball mom in Texas and I do agree with parents investing alot of money into their child athlete's; however, with those investments you want to see your child succeed, and not fall short because they are not at a school with a high recruiting budget, or they are not the PG players, or even #1 or 2 on their team. We are happily investing into a brand new company, collegeballorbust.com, for a minimal cost of $500, to put my son into the grasp of college coaches that we have chosen. They give you a personal webpage, and update it accordingly throughout the season/year while he progresses. I know that it has been an awesome tool for his friends in football as well, because they want to promote kids who are not being seen, and expose them to the best of their abilities to increase their chances of going to college not only through scholarship, but also to play their sport that they have invested so much time, and energy into. Collegeballorbust.com is a site worth viewing for those of you with kids whose dream is to play ball of any kind, female and male alike, because the end result is your athlete making his/her own showcase to present to the college coaches not the recruiters.
I am just wondering if for free you could have gathered the info needed to promote your son to teh college coaches you have chosen and spent the money playing on a team or a showcase down there in Texas. I think coaches prefer to see players in action. Kind of hard to tell one's ability and talent from facts on a webpage. If you intend only to use this as a means of exposure, let us know the final results.
I think this was the original intention of Fungo's post, to spend one's money wisely.
Football recruiting is a lot different than baseball, JMO.
I think this was the original intention of Fungo's post, to spend one's money wisely.
Football recruiting is a lot different than baseball, JMO.
There is a free site where one can list their specs or have their coaches list their specs as well as a running log of their season's performance in various sports.
http://www.maxpreps.com/
This can be an invaluable site if HS coaches involve themselves in it.
http://www.maxpreps.com/
This can be an invaluable site if HS coaches involve themselves in it.
It seems the theme or message here is players do not need to attend showcase events to be successful. I believe that is more true for those who do not have outstanding ability. There are just way too many cases of showcase events helping young talented players. I would bore everyone to death if I started giving the thousands of examples of players who benefited greatly.
I read about the players who have become very successful without attending many of these events. We know that it happens because it’s our job to know. We know that we received calls from Clemson about a young pitcher from Florida a few years ago. It was the fact that we saw that young pitcher in a showcase in Lincoln, Nebraska that we started following him closely (started a file on him) and really liked his potential. Without us seeing him at that time, we wouldn’t have been able to answer the questions from the recruiter at Clemson. Of course it was his ability and future performances that was the final determining factor. There is no doubt in our mind that this young man was going to be a successful pitcher in college and possibly professional baseball. No doubt he was going to be recruited by DI schools. It was just a matter of which ones.
Now here is the thing about successful players who have not attended showcase events. How do we know that their path was the very best path. Those who have been drafted and signed professional contracts… How do we know that they wouldn’t have been drafted in an earlier round and received a higher signing bonus had they done things differently? How do we know the player who has a small low level DI scholarship could have had a bigger scholarship at a higher level DI? The truth is… We don’t know. I don’t know and neither does anyone else. There are many cross roads a player can take. The only big money in baseball is when you sign your first contract and if you make it to the Big Leagues. If you look at the professional players these days there are some similarities.
Let’s look at some…
Carl Crawford – Extremely talented high school athlete in Houston. Scouts knew about him, but Scouting Directors and Cross Checkers never saw him play high level competition. He attended a winter showcase in Florida and over night became a potential first rounder. He then went to a Pre Draft showcase in Iowa and later became the first pick of the second round. Dan Jennings then the scouting director for the D’Rays tola us the showcases in Florida and Iowa was what sold them on Carl. Someone needs to askl Carl Crawford what HE thinks about showcases.
Scott Kazmir – Another Houston area player. I won’t get into the details, but if anyone knows Scott or his dad Eddie (who has posted here before), please ask them what they think of showcases.
Chris Lubanski – from Schwenksville, PA started going to PG showcases when he was a freshman in high school. He was a skinny kid with one tool at the time. He later became the 5th pick of the draft. Ask Chris or his dad Wally (who also posts here at times) what they think? You probably don’t have to because the proof is that younger brother Mike Lubanski has already started attending the same showcases.
Anyway, I could go on and on with thousands of examples. Some might say, players like Chris, Scott and Carl were going to be successful anyway. And they could be correct! But can we really know that Carl would have received 1.5 million to sign or Chris would have been drafted with the 5th pick had they not been so visible.
Lastings Milledge – Again we first saw Lastings when he was a 9th grader. He didn’t need us but he went to every PG Showcase he could. Someone should ask Lastings if he thought the showcases were good for him.
Brian McCann – From Georgia attended several events including the Pre Draft. He was selected in the second round by Atlanta by the scouting director that was completely sold on him after seeing him perform in Cedar Rapids, IA. The scouting director lives in Georgia.
To be honest the college recruits are some of the very best stories. The kids like Chris Lambert, Jim Negrych, Zach Schreiber, Lance Broadway, Trevor Crowe, Wade Townsend, Thomas Diamond, Shane Robinson, Jason Berken, Matt Antonelli, and thousands of others. Someone needs to ask Jason Berken what HE thinks of showcases!
High Level Showcases are not for everyone, that’s for sure. There are cases of those (Colt Griffin) who never attended any. But each year when you look at those being recruited by DI, DII and top Jucos you will see a VERY high percentage of players who have attended showcase events. When you look at the draft each year, you will see a very high percentage of players who have attended showcase events. Players do not need to go to these events, but they sure do need to know the facts.
It’s not just the event, it is the information. We have over 50 people who take calls and receive emails daily from college coaches and scouts who want information. I’m sure people can imagine the cost involved in this. We can only give the information if we have it. It’s not just a Perfect Game thing… We gather lots of information from other top events and organizations like East Coast Pro, Area Codes. USA Baseball, Connie Mack, North Carolina Games, etc. etc.
For those who might be interested here are several links that might shed some light on this subject… Some entertaining stuff! Sorry for the length of this post
The Draft
Draft Coverage
Scott Kazmir
Pre Draft
Why Attend
Winter Showcase
Scouts in the NE
2005 draft and more
3rd pick
Aflac Classic
Top High School Program
Former MLB Pitcher
Roger Clemens
Chris Lubanski Story
The Upton Family
A past PG National
The 2nd pick
A Scouting Director Interview
Reading for those who think our rankings are so incorrect
Outfielders ranked in 2003
Scout of the Year Award
An old HS report on Kazmir
More Player rankings to debate
MLB Executive
I read about the players who have become very successful without attending many of these events. We know that it happens because it’s our job to know. We know that we received calls from Clemson about a young pitcher from Florida a few years ago. It was the fact that we saw that young pitcher in a showcase in Lincoln, Nebraska that we started following him closely (started a file on him) and really liked his potential. Without us seeing him at that time, we wouldn’t have been able to answer the questions from the recruiter at Clemson. Of course it was his ability and future performances that was the final determining factor. There is no doubt in our mind that this young man was going to be a successful pitcher in college and possibly professional baseball. No doubt he was going to be recruited by DI schools. It was just a matter of which ones.
Now here is the thing about successful players who have not attended showcase events. How do we know that their path was the very best path. Those who have been drafted and signed professional contracts… How do we know that they wouldn’t have been drafted in an earlier round and received a higher signing bonus had they done things differently? How do we know the player who has a small low level DI scholarship could have had a bigger scholarship at a higher level DI? The truth is… We don’t know. I don’t know and neither does anyone else. There are many cross roads a player can take. The only big money in baseball is when you sign your first contract and if you make it to the Big Leagues. If you look at the professional players these days there are some similarities.
Let’s look at some…
Carl Crawford – Extremely talented high school athlete in Houston. Scouts knew about him, but Scouting Directors and Cross Checkers never saw him play high level competition. He attended a winter showcase in Florida and over night became a potential first rounder. He then went to a Pre Draft showcase in Iowa and later became the first pick of the second round. Dan Jennings then the scouting director for the D’Rays tola us the showcases in Florida and Iowa was what sold them on Carl. Someone needs to askl Carl Crawford what HE thinks about showcases.
Scott Kazmir – Another Houston area player. I won’t get into the details, but if anyone knows Scott or his dad Eddie (who has posted here before), please ask them what they think of showcases.
Chris Lubanski – from Schwenksville, PA started going to PG showcases when he was a freshman in high school. He was a skinny kid with one tool at the time. He later became the 5th pick of the draft. Ask Chris or his dad Wally (who also posts here at times) what they think? You probably don’t have to because the proof is that younger brother Mike Lubanski has already started attending the same showcases.
Anyway, I could go on and on with thousands of examples. Some might say, players like Chris, Scott and Carl were going to be successful anyway. And they could be correct! But can we really know that Carl would have received 1.5 million to sign or Chris would have been drafted with the 5th pick had they not been so visible.
Lastings Milledge – Again we first saw Lastings when he was a 9th grader. He didn’t need us but he went to every PG Showcase he could. Someone should ask Lastings if he thought the showcases were good for him.
Brian McCann – From Georgia attended several events including the Pre Draft. He was selected in the second round by Atlanta by the scouting director that was completely sold on him after seeing him perform in Cedar Rapids, IA. The scouting director lives in Georgia.
To be honest the college recruits are some of the very best stories. The kids like Chris Lambert, Jim Negrych, Zach Schreiber, Lance Broadway, Trevor Crowe, Wade Townsend, Thomas Diamond, Shane Robinson, Jason Berken, Matt Antonelli, and thousands of others. Someone needs to ask Jason Berken what HE thinks of showcases!
High Level Showcases are not for everyone, that’s for sure. There are cases of those (Colt Griffin) who never attended any. But each year when you look at those being recruited by DI, DII and top Jucos you will see a VERY high percentage of players who have attended showcase events. When you look at the draft each year, you will see a very high percentage of players who have attended showcase events. Players do not need to go to these events, but they sure do need to know the facts.
It’s not just the event, it is the information. We have over 50 people who take calls and receive emails daily from college coaches and scouts who want information. I’m sure people can imagine the cost involved in this. We can only give the information if we have it. It’s not just a Perfect Game thing… We gather lots of information from other top events and organizations like East Coast Pro, Area Codes. USA Baseball, Connie Mack, North Carolina Games, etc. etc.
For those who might be interested here are several links that might shed some light on this subject… Some entertaining stuff! Sorry for the length of this post
The Draft
Draft Coverage
Scott Kazmir
Pre Draft
Why Attend
Winter Showcase
Scouts in the NE
2005 draft and more
3rd pick
Aflac Classic
Top High School Program
Former MLB Pitcher
Roger Clemens
Chris Lubanski Story
The Upton Family
A past PG National
The 2nd pick
A Scouting Director Interview
Reading for those who think our rankings are so incorrect
Outfielders ranked in 2003
Scout of the Year Award
An old HS report on Kazmir
More Player rankings to debate
MLB Executive
Fungo,
Thank you for starting this thread and I completely agree with you. There has to be perspective on the whole recruiting process. The showcases are just one part of the process and can be very important, but parents have to understand that it's only one part. The most important part is deciding where you want to go to school, why you want to attend that school and can you compete on the team at that level. The old saying "if your good enough they will find you" doesn't work. Your at the mercy of who finds you and is that the school that you really want to attend and play ball at? We learned very quickly that we had to do the target marketing and knocking on doors ourselves. I believe it's the parent and student's responsibility for creating their our own opportunities and any help we get along the way is an added bonus.
My son is an 06 LHP and will be going to school in a week at a mid level D1 that is an Honors University. He was recruited to play ball after attending their camp last summer, although there is no scholorship only the opportunity. He was also accepted at 2 D3's and these schools actively recruited him but there was no academic money and the cost was much higher for each school so we had a tough choice to make when finally selecting a school. We very happy with his choice and the opportunity he has for both academics and baseball.
My son did 2 showcases and 4 camps. We found the camps to be the most productive and informative. By attending the camps he created some good choices for school because the coach could watch him more closely. As we went through this process the list of schools narrowed down quickly because my son only wanted to apply to schools with engineering programs. We chose the camp route over showcases because these were the schools he was interested in and that showed interest in him. My son is a tall and lanky and throws in the low 80's, but knows how to pitch. The feed back we received from several D1's was that he didn't throw hard enough and they don't like to project. This year my son had a combined 16-1 record in HS/Legion ball and his only loss was in the Legion tournament. He was voted by opposing coaches, class LL Allstate for HS and for Legion Zone Outstanding Pitcher. In the 2 previous years he was 9-3 as a varsity starter and 11-2 on Legion. The recruiting process takes alot of time and effort and will have big highs and lows. We all just have to keep plugging along and try our best to maintain sanity.
We talk about the cost of recruiting and having a budget versus going crazy on spending, but the best thing that I have spent my money on for my kids over the past several years has nothing to do with baseball. I also have a daughter that will graduate from HS next year. In August 2004, we took a family vacation to Wales and London, 1st time for the kids and 2nd time for my wife and I. The 1st was our honeymoon 25 years ago. This past February, both my kids went to Rome with the Latin/History clubs at their HS. Without a doubt I have never spent money on anything better than these 2 trips (except for the honeymoon). I would do it again and go into debt if I had too, because I know 10 years from now they'll still remember these trips. The baseball experiences have been good but these 2 trips were life memories.
Thank you for starting this thread and I completely agree with you. There has to be perspective on the whole recruiting process. The showcases are just one part of the process and can be very important, but parents have to understand that it's only one part. The most important part is deciding where you want to go to school, why you want to attend that school and can you compete on the team at that level. The old saying "if your good enough they will find you" doesn't work. Your at the mercy of who finds you and is that the school that you really want to attend and play ball at? We learned very quickly that we had to do the target marketing and knocking on doors ourselves. I believe it's the parent and student's responsibility for creating their our own opportunities and any help we get along the way is an added bonus.
My son is an 06 LHP and will be going to school in a week at a mid level D1 that is an Honors University. He was recruited to play ball after attending their camp last summer, although there is no scholorship only the opportunity. He was also accepted at 2 D3's and these schools actively recruited him but there was no academic money and the cost was much higher for each school so we had a tough choice to make when finally selecting a school. We very happy with his choice and the opportunity he has for both academics and baseball.
My son did 2 showcases and 4 camps. We found the camps to be the most productive and informative. By attending the camps he created some good choices for school because the coach could watch him more closely. As we went through this process the list of schools narrowed down quickly because my son only wanted to apply to schools with engineering programs. We chose the camp route over showcases because these were the schools he was interested in and that showed interest in him. My son is a tall and lanky and throws in the low 80's, but knows how to pitch. The feed back we received from several D1's was that he didn't throw hard enough and they don't like to project. This year my son had a combined 16-1 record in HS/Legion ball and his only loss was in the Legion tournament. He was voted by opposing coaches, class LL Allstate for HS and for Legion Zone Outstanding Pitcher. In the 2 previous years he was 9-3 as a varsity starter and 11-2 on Legion. The recruiting process takes alot of time and effort and will have big highs and lows. We all just have to keep plugging along and try our best to maintain sanity.
We talk about the cost of recruiting and having a budget versus going crazy on spending, but the best thing that I have spent my money on for my kids over the past several years has nothing to do with baseball. I also have a daughter that will graduate from HS next year. In August 2004, we took a family vacation to Wales and London, 1st time for the kids and 2nd time for my wife and I. The 1st was our honeymoon 25 years ago. This past February, both my kids went to Rome with the Latin/History clubs at their HS. Without a doubt I have never spent money on anything better than these 2 trips (except for the honeymoon). I would do it again and go into debt if I had too, because I know 10 years from now they'll still remember these trips. The baseball experiences have been good but these 2 trips were life memories.