Difference Between D1 and D2 Baseball

The biggest difference is the the D2 kids don't get to say they are going off to play D1 baseball on Twitter.  

If a player loves playing, nothing.

For the majority the major difference is the level of play is consistently higher game to game in D-I.  You will have one, two and three, at the front end of the lineup who will be consistently better at the D-I level.  Especially when it comes to that 3rd, 4th, ... starter.  Definitely, the stadiums are consistently better.   The top D-II schools can match many of the top D-Is with facilities but if you drop out of that very exclusive group, some facilities at some of the D-II schools are pathetic.  This is a good start at answering your question.

If your player is in the group that is being recruited by both the mid to lower tier D1's and the better D2's, it does no good to ask the broad question.  You have to research case by case, school by school, as there will be the broad range you describe in almost every way... competition, depth, facilities, # of scholly's, size, etc.  By rule, D1's are required to have facilities of certain size and a few other things as Coach B alluded to but there is still overlap.

And, BTW, the top D2 vs bottom D1 would probably be a bit more slanted than 6 of 10.  There is some BAD baseball at the very bottom of D1 and some GOOD baseball at the top of D2.

The difference at each level is depth of talent. Most D1 players belong in D1. Some D2 players could play D1. A late blooming D2 pitcher who could now play D1 might stand a D1 team on its head on a good day. 

The year after Trinity (CT) won the D3 national championship the following conversation came up at a BC - Harvard game. Could D3 champion Trinity compete with a sub .500 Harvard? A dad in the conversation knew Decker (then Trinity coach). The dad’s son played for Harvard. They agreed if Trinity’s late blooming ace (had D1 size and velocity by junior year, drafted in the 20’s, made it to AAA) was pitching they could compete. After that, no. Trinity’s catcher and first baseman also signed as free agents.

@CoachB25 is off to a good start. I have coached college summer league teams that have had D1, D2 & D3 players so I have some perspective on this.  Any comparison between those 3 levels always begins and ends with pitching (overall talent and depth). The very best pitchers are almost always in the best D1 conferences. The SEC is in a class by itself but the ACC, Big 12, PAC 12, AAC and a few others play really good baseball - comparable to class A pro ball. Top 50 D1 programs have depth at every position - but especially on the mound. The level of talent, facilities, fan base, and the experience at these schools can be incredible. It can also be incredibly disappointing and really cut throat. HCs at those schools tend to run their programs like professionals and they make their decisions accordingly - and they can be cold and hard about it. If you have pro potential and the requisite ambition you should be at one of those schools. But if you aren’t in the top 1% - 2% in the nation in your grad class you likely aren’t good enough to play at those schools - even as a Jr or Sr. If that’s the case I don’t see how it matters what number comes after the D.  Academics should be driving the decision anyway and you better be getting a degree that is specific enough that it qualifies you for a job you want. Some D2 schools fit that bill, btw, and top 25 D2 teams are really good. The top pitchers are very good and some of the position players could make a lot of D1 rosters - but they would rather play at D2 than sit at D1. In recent years there has been a lot of attention (and $) paid to upgrading the facilities at a number of D2 schools. Some of them are very nice and are better than a lot of D1 mid-majors. Check out D2 baseball Twitter account for some videos. IMO the vibe at D2 is a little more relaxed and more conducive to having fun than the pressure cooker that exists at top D1 schools. Many schools at both D1 & D2 over-recruit so that’s something that has to be looked at on a school by school basis but it’s damned important. The experience and the fan base at the best D2 programs will not compare to top D1 schools. But it will compare to D1 mid-majors. Personally I think D2 baseball is a good option anytime (but especially now) for players that are tweeners - good enough for some D1 mid-majors but not good enough for SEC, ACC, etc. Depending on the preferred field of study D2 can actually be a better option academically too. If I had to decide between the two, I would rather be at a playing at a good D2 (competing for a conference championship and a regional berth) than at a D1 (sitting or playing for a cellar dweller). All of this predicated on no drop off in academics, of course, and all is JMO. 

Something that hasn't really been touched on too much, but the day to day is going to be different. The locker rooms, the fields, the apparel, the housing situations, laundry, equipment, food for athletes, etc. Sure not all D1s are created equal in that regard, but I can almost guarantee the difference between an average D1 and an average D2 would be night and day as far as amenities and the like go. 

As others have mentioned, there is going to be a talent discrepancy. Take away the D2 outliers and it's really a mixed bag. One of our guys just walked this summer after an exit meeting with the coach. He was pitcher #15 on the roster, but he was still throwing 92. You won't really see a 92 guy get cut from a D2 roster. You really won't see too many 92 guys on D2 rosters to begin with. 

Now D2 baseball can still be good. Felician, like you mentioned, is still above average baseball, they win 30 games pretty much every season and put a guy in the pros every few years. Obviously it is tough with the virus, but I would suggest you get out and watch some games at all different levels. You will still see guys pumping high 80s and kids hit bombs. Just maybe not every kid is capable of that. 

It is also hard to find higher academic D2 schools. Not that they don't exist, but unless you're looking at specialized programs and majors within schools, the universities as a whole aren't exactly elite. I can only name a few off the top of my head that I would consider above average academically. 

How about the daily player schedule between D1 and D2?

I know in any D1s it's 5 AM to 11 PM and very structured - gym, breakfast, class, lunch, class, practice, dinner, study hall, gym/films, etc. 

Do the better D2s also follow a very structured daily routine, as best they can albeit with maybe not having the same amenities?

@PABaseball makes some good points. But I’m not suggesting you look at AVG D2 programs. I’m advising that you look for the outliers that are exceptional.  You may be surprised at what you find. 

@Francis7 posted:

 

But, in general, what's the major difference, in your opinion between playing D1 and D2 baseball?

In general..resources.   Funding, scholarships, academic and athletic opportunities.   

100% agree with Go44Dad that it doesn't matter as long as you are playing college baseball....I would add at any level.

@Francis7 posted:

How about the daily player schedule between D1 and D2?

I know in any D1s it's 5 AM to 11 PM and very structured - gym, breakfast, class, lunch, class, practice, dinner, study hall, gym/films, etc. 

Do the better D2s also follow a very structured daily routine, as best they can albeit with maybe not having the same amenities?

Again, same.  Mileage varies.  I think the only level where time commitment is markedly less (but still significant) is D3.  All others are case by case.

Son has been directly involved with D1's, D2's and NAIA's and can attest.

My son was the pitching coach and recruiter at D2, Floridan Southern, a private institution yearly tuition of 50k, in Lakeland Florida. Now a coach at state school mid  D1 in Boca Raton Floida. 

Without much further explanation, Go44, hit the nail on the head.

What D2 conferences are strongest or is it typically 1-2 strong teams per conference. Put another way who is the SEC of D2?

Not sure about nationwide but I know the west has some pretty good D2 baseball in the Pac West (Azusa pacific, dixie state, etc) and the CCAA. Point Loma (pac west) has, hands down, the most stunning baseball field I've ever seen. it's on a cliff in san diego, looking over the pacific.

CCAA, Peachbelt, Pacwest, Sunshine State (although a bit down last year) are some of the stronger conferences.  

There isn't one that stands out consistently as much as SEC football and there is more likelihood of top teams coming from a wider range of conferences.  CCAA doesn't always have multiple top 5 teams but they consistently are tough top to bottom or at least strong 8-10 teams deep.

http://www.boydsworld.com/baseball/isr/d2_isr.html

@PABaseball posted:

It is also hard to find higher academic D2 schools. Not that they don't exist, but unless you're looking at specialized programs and majors within schools, the universities as a whole aren't exactly elite. I can only name a few off the top of my head that I would consider above average academically. 

This exactly.  My son was being recruited by D1's until a torn labrum derailed all of that.  He was focusing on the HA D1's and had interest from some of the "regular" D1's on the west coast.  He was heavily recruited by many D2 programs in the area but after looking at the academics he said not a chance, I've worked too hard on my grades to go to that school.  So now he's at a HA D3 and loving every minute.  He knows he's not going pro, and as of right now he's the big fish in the small pond.

I’ll throw this question I guess, I have my thoughts but honestly am at a loss to be sold totally either way. Coming up on a decision between A perennial high ranked D3 great facilities and established coach or a D2 rebuild with great facilities and a new respected young coach probably slightly  better academically? Both in Northeast .

have at it, I’m all ears.

You may have to look at private D2 schools for the higher academics, but there are many very good public D2 schools with very good baseball programs.  The majority of kids are not attending "elite" schools as they are "elite" and difficult gain admittance.  Where are the other kids going?   I would say that many mid major D1 baseball schools are not appreciable better academic schools than many D2 schools.  Although they are no longer a D2 school, I would say that UC San Diego would be considered an exceptional school by most accounts.  A review of US News & World Report Best Colleges is a very good source to get a good feel for the academics based  upon their criteria and can be used as part of the recruiting evaluations.  All I am saying is don't rule out D2 schools solely on the basis of academics.  Average academics is not the sole domain of D2 schools as there are many average D1 colleges and universities as well.

Fmr Coach... If up and coming program and school has possibly better academics, I would lean toward D2 school.  Why not be part of a growing program while getting a "better(?)" education along the way.  Of course, that is assuming all other aspects of schools are equal.

This is an interesting topic for me as my son has been in both places. He started in the Southern Conference at a private university with a solid baseball tradition and plenty of money. The program beat the national champions his freshman year, and had the Golden Spikes winner a couple years earlier. In recruiting the HC said something like "we don't really have a budget, we kind of just get whatever we want". 

Son transferred to the Peach Belt Conference and played for a nationally ranked state school. The players and families were required to fund raise. There were questions of whether there would be for money for fairly essential field maintenance and uniforms. Conference teams had the option to play three day weekend series, or two days with a double header to save a day on food and motel. 

Having said that above, what Go44dad said is awesome and true! If the kid loves the game there is no difference! I think my son would say that D1 was more like work or a job than D2. 

I would echo what others have said about the depth of talent, especially pitching. Pretty much all of the pitchers at the D1 school could have found a spot on the D2 roster, and but only a handful of the pitchers at the D2 would seem to fit at the D1. I would say that 4 or 5 of the starting 8 at the D2 could have started at the D1 though.    

Here in FL, the D2 programs are more about defense because there is a need for more pitchers at the D1 level, just like mid D1 programs are also more about defense. Much of the rosters for D2s come from Fl JUCO programs and drop downs from P5 programs.

I don't know how it is in other states.

@Fmr coach now Dad posted:

I’ll throw this question I guess, I have my thoughts but honestly am at a loss to be sold totally either way. Coming up on a decision between A perennial high ranked D3 great facilities and established coach or a D2 rebuild with great facilities and a new respected young coach probably slightly  better academically? Both in Northeast .

have at it, I’m all ears.

Sounds like two good choices, albeit one safer than the other, from a baseball program/facilities standpoint.  But the college choice is so much more than that as has been discussed at length on this site. 

Choice of major, school size, culture, baseball fit, social fit, tuition/room/board cost, proximity to home, coach fit, availability of development tools and coaching, weather, academic/tutoring support, class sizes, your gut feel for best fit, son's gut feel for best fit, mom's gut feel... etc., .. the list goes on.  When you say "slightly better academics", are you referring to his chosen major specifically or overall?  How slight? (questions for yourself, not to answer here on the forum).

You may want to make a list with all these things to include any others you can think of and see which one checks the most boxes.  Then, group the line items by priority/importance and see if that changes anything.  At the end of the day, what environment, academically, socially and athletically, do you see your son most likely to succeed?  And, does he see it the same way?

If you are JUST asking based on the baseball aspect as you described, I have certainly seen more failure with "rebuilds by new respected young coaches" than "perennial high ranked with established coaches".

@TPM posted:

Here in FL, the D2 programs are more about defense because there is a need for more pitchers at the D1 level, just like mid D1 programs are also more about defense. Much of the rosters for D2s come from Fl JUCO programs and drop downs from P5 programs.

I don't know how it is in other states.

 

D2s in Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas, Arkansas & Missouri also have rosters full of JuCo transfers and D1 drop downs.

Don’t judge a school on it’s overall academic reputation. Judge it on your major. PSAC schools (D2) would be considered middle of the road academically. Most started as state teachers colleges. So, if looking for a degree in education they’re excellent schools at a great price. 

Frmr Dad, might be time for the good ole' pro con list or just list of considerations. We made a spreadsheet for PTWoodson that included everything from coaches, education/academic rigor (looked at acceptance and graduation rates, value of degree in expected major, average freshman student profiles, etc.), already committed players (quality and position), record previous three years, distance to away games (how much class would I miss...pro for PTWoodson con for PTWood and spouse), facilities, level of competition/strength of schedule, degree of interest from school, turnover on the team, etc... It laid all the facts out clearly and in black and white. In a lot of ways, it made it easier for PTWoodson to see what really mattered the most to him. At some point, when the decision is so close, it will be a visceral one and not a logical one but having all the details laid out almost gives them the freedom to go with their gut.

That's what worked for us. Good luck!

@RJM posted:

Don’t judge a school on it’s overall academic reputation. Judge it on your major. PSAC schools (D2) would be considered middle of the road academically. Most started as state teachers colleges. So, if looking for a degree in education they’re excellent schools at a great price. 

Bingo! Some D2 schools offer specialty majors that aren’t widely available. The course curriculum in these majors can be as good as anywhere and the price tag is usually less. If your interest lies in one of these majors, and the school happens to play good baseball, it can be a practical (and affordable) option. 

Cabbage and PT, too funny but I had actually worked on this in the AM then posted my question. My idea was for him , my wife ,and I to fill out the grid on the right with set scoring to get a total. I asked because As much as I’ve been around this for years With your own kid it’s different. Thanks, any thing I missed let me know. We should have all the financials after the last visit on Friday.

Love it! I would add in if school social life is a fit (Greek, not Greek, more serious or party, other athletic teams to cheer for, etc...) and his opportunities to play. It was funny how much this showed my son what things mattered most to him. Can’t wait to hear how it goes!

@Fmr coach now Dad posted:

Cabbage and PT, too funny but I had actually worked on this in the AM then posted my question. My idea was for him , my wife ,and I to fill out the grid on the right with set scoring to get a total. I asked because As much as I’ve been around this for years With your own kid it’s different. Thanks, any thing I missed let me know. We should have all the financials after the last visit on Friday.

Glad to see I'm not the only one who does things like this!   I like the scoring idea.  I'm having a little spreadsheet envy right now!

I agree with PTWood, maybe something about the social scene, depending on what matters to your son?

My son did not want to be too far away from civilization, so I had a column for distance to the nearest city/airport.  I also included some data from the schools' common data sets, like what the first year retention rate, 4-year gradation rate, and student/teacher ratio was, but those were things I really cared about.  

After the coaching change at the kid's school, he got approached about being a PO, which he declined. Then it was "not a place for you here". Upon entering the portal he was bombarded with offers from DII'S. Some very good ones and some offering 80% plus scholarship. Going to a DI out of state was not an option because of cost. The DI's in-state we looked at, contacted a couple, but the offers from the DII's were so good, and coupled with the fact he could play right away, we had decided that was the way to go. Then the scout he's worked out with the last few years got in touch to see what was going on and when informed told him absolutely don't do that. He told him if he goes DII he better tear it up, and I mean really tear it up. So he went to a DI and here I am, going from almost a free ride to out no small amount of money and the very real possibility of no baseball. Anyway, FWIW the scout was all boo, hiss DII.

D2 guys get drafted. Obviously not at the clip D1 guys get drafted, but 75-100 guys go every year which is pretty good, especially for position players who really have to prove themselves when not every opposing starter is going to have great stuff.

There is a trend among those drafted though, the top dogs have as many as 5 get picked up every year and a lot of those in the remaining field come from top 25 programs. That would probably be a big indicator that D2 baseball would be considered very top heavy. 

A friend of ours played both D2 and D1.  The D1 was a mid major and the D2 was at an average conference for that division.  He was a 2 way coming out of high school, a really good hitter and was throwing low 90’s which got him into the D1.  Then he had Tommy John and never fully recovered the velocity, topping out in the mid to high 80’s, which led to transferring to the D2. 

I asked him the difference.

He said he hit pretty well at the D2, because usually their opponents only had one great Friday night pitcher who “could’ve been a D1 guy” and the rest of the pitching staff was hittable.  At the D1 he was strictly a PO and he said “I never would have been able to hit .200 in D1, those staffs were filled with filthy pitchers.”

He said also there was less room for mistakes in D1.  Most of the time if a third basemen bobbled the ball in D1, the base runner was gonna be safe, because everybody could fly.  In a similar way, not every 3B in D2 had a cannon, a fast guy could sometimes beat out a routine grounder in ways that you would almost never see in D1.  Same thing with Catchers and Outfielders, it was easier to run on them in D2.  Lots of little things like that add up to it being a totally different game.

Now, of course, there are exceptions.  A D2 powerhouse like Tampa could stomp all over half the D1 teams, if not more.

I have had a lot of players get drafted from both D-I and D-II schools.  I might even give the edge to the D-II schools.  

a few years ago I am watching a game with a D-2 school and the hitter was leading the team with 18 HR's. I mentioned to the pro scout that the player had "power".

The scout said, no Bob " I deduct 40' for the the metal bat".  He has "warning track" power. Lesson learned!!!! The same with D-1, D-3, NAIA,or JC.

You can HIT or you can't!!!

Bob

Size is definitely one difference. My son was recruited to D2 school as a freshman. They transitioned to a D1 conference the following season and his team played a non conference series against Michigan State. Every single one of their players was a giant, whereas my son is one of the biggest kids on his team at 6'3" 210# (with pockets full of rocks). Many talented kids, just not big boys. BTW They took Michigan 3 games out of 4 and lost the fourth in extra innings.😁

@SomeBaseballDad posted:

After the coaching change at the kid's school, he got approached about being a PO, which he declined. Then it was "not a place for you here". Upon entering the portal he was bombarded with offers from DII'S. Some very good ones and some offering 80% plus scholarship. Going to a DI out of state was not an option because of cost. The DI's in-state we looked at, contacted a couple, but the offers from the DII's were so good, and coupled with the fact he could play right away, we had decided that was the way to go. Then the scout he's worked out with the last few years got in touch to see what was going on and when informed told him absolutely don't do that. He told him if he goes DII he better tear it up, and I mean really tear it up. So he went to a DI and here I am, going from almost a free ride to out no small amount of money and the very real possibility of no baseball. Anyway, FWIW the scout was all boo, hiss DII.

So why would going to the D1 be better?  Wouldnt he still need to tear it up at the D1?  Sounds that the scout gave some really poor advice.  Sorry that happened to your son and your checkbook...

@FriarFred posted:

 Sounds that the scout gave some really poor advice.  Sorry that happened to your son and your checkbook...

Maybe, but I doubt it. Given that as a scout there is no higher you can go in a major league baseball organization than the title he holds I'd tend to believe he knows his shiz. Plus he's just been a great person to the kid over the years. He had a good reason to say what he did. 

Funny story. The kid played at Grand Park over the summer. He's about to step into the batters box when he hears a familiar voice behind him,  "hit the f'ing ball to the left side". Is it mom, no. Is it dad, no. Is it coach, no. It's just some guy who holds the title of Director of Scouting. No pressure there, LOL. 

@cabbagedad posted:

Again, same.  Mileage varies.  I think the only level where time commitment is markedly less (but still significant) is D3.  All others are case by case.

Son has been directly involved with D1's, D2's and NAIA's and can attest.

D3 is limited to 6 days a week in season, 4 hours on nongame days, lifting time is not included in the 4 hours....it is still plenty busy. 

Son played on a summer team with players and against players committed to D1, D2 and JUco mostly.  Obviously the biggest difference was in the pitchers on our team and that we faced that were D1 commits. As far as position players there was the occasional stud that stood out but the difference I noticed wasnt as big as the pitching position. I even noticed the D1 commits struggled against good pitching as much as the non D1 commits. My son is committed to a D2 where he was loved, a private D2 that took care of him in every way.  With the covid im glad he's where he's at.  For the most part probably wont be sitting much if at all. The facilities arent near what he'd get at a top D1 but some things are sacrificed. In his case, his finances are taken care of and playing time should be great if he works hard.