StrainedOblique posted:

Do you get outs? Always a roster spot in college baseball for a LHP that gets outs regardless of size or velo. D1 baseball? Sure. But focusing on D1 ball is the wrong approach to college baseball recruiting.

The trick to college baseball recruiting , if the there is any such trickery is that players need to cast a WIDE NET and most don't.

D1, D2, D3, JUCO.

All the above. Try to play in front of as many College coaches as you can. Coaches from all different levels. Players and parents are WAY too caught up in D1 ball. If you're a good fit for D1 ball you'll know. This whole thing is about finding the 'Right fit' on the field, the classroom, socially and economically. Some of the finest learning institutions in country field NCAA D3 baseball teams. While some of the worst diploma mill dumb bell colleges field NCAA D1 teams. I watched 9 players draft last year out of a JUCO conference and also watched as only 3 drafted out of a D1 conference.

For pitchers more than hitters , the Division isn't as important. If it's 98 mph on the left side from 60FT 6 Inches , it doesn't matter if it's on a HS mound a JUCO mound or a D1 mound. 98 is 98. Period. It's the same for Spin.

Important measurables for pitchers can be tracked regardless of competition.

I know countless parents and players that were 'D1 or bust' in the recruiting process and for some it worked out well. However, for more than I care to mention it didn't turn out well at all. Guys doing 4 yrs at the D1 level with a grand total of 12 AB's over 4 years. or pitchers graduating w/ a NCAA career total of 12 Innings pitched.

Do you wanna play baseball in College or do you want to be on a D1 roster? You need to think about that. Because they are not one in the same.

My son was a 2016 D1 LHP commit. I understand the recruiting process well. He was an early committ to school in the south. He was also obsessed with velocity and subsequently got hurt and had major shoulder surgery as a Freshman. His rehab was plagued w/ set backs and problems. After 2 years he left the D1 and came home to southern california and decided to reinvent himself as a hitter. He played at the JUCO level last year and was outstanding as a hitter. But most importantly , he was happy and healthy. JUCO ball was a blast. A lot of fun for him and me.

Now, as he's weighing transfer options, it's not about D1. It's about the right school from a social , academic, financial and baseball standpoint. He's spoken with coaches at the D1, D2, D3 and NAIA level and he'll make his decision based on the aforementioned criteria.

Back to you, right now, just get outs! do it w/ velo, Spin, Change. Whatever. As a 2023, That's all you need to focus on right now. And take care of your arm. Listen to it. If you're feeling sore, Don't throw. In the next year or two you'll get a good idea of where you fit in College baseball. Try not to worry about that right now. Just play the game. Focus on getting outs and helping your team win.

Young man, by all means heed this advice because it is very very wise advice  all around.  Great guidance here.  Against best of fortune to you on your journey, and it IS a journey.  You have years of ups and downs, and all of the emotions that come with both, in front of you.  Be prepared, be diligent, be ready to push forward when things are hard, but smart enough to adjust when need be.  All of which is reflected in the post above.  Most of all, bet on yourself and believe in yourself.  While you want to be a good Son, teammate and player, your journey isn’t for your parents, your teammates or your coach...ultimately this is for yourself.  

plherleth posted:

I am a 2023 left-handed pitcher, and I was wondering what my chances are of playing division1 baseball. I sit around 78 on the mound and top out at 80. I also throw a curve and changeup well and use a slider occasionally.

My son is a 2020 LHP that recently signed a NLI to play D1 in a mid-major type conference. As a freshman, he was about 6'0" and 150 lb, probably sat 75-78, T80. The end of summer before his senior year, he was 6'3" 180 lb, sitting 82-85, T87. This is probably the low end of what a D1 would accept velo-wise from a LHP, but his size made him projectable.

Had we been able to go through this process again, I would have made him make physical development a bigger priority his sophomore and junior years. We instead dumped a lot of money and time into 15u and 16u travel teams and camps/showcases... in retrospect, I would not want my son to verbal as a sophomore anyway.

D1s will make you pass an "eyeball" test. Gotta eat... start a nutrition plan and a workout plan with professional help, and follow it. My son did not really do this in earnest until the end of his junior year (and added 20 lb from 160-180 over his rising senior summer). Being over 6' and lefty throwing in the 80s will open a lot of doors, but my son had a very skinny, lanky frame compared to many other D1 commits.  

Showball$ posted:

RJM,

But you just described the top tier .005/1% athlete. And that athlete is going to get trained and connected, because.....well because its advertising to the academy to put his plaque on the committed wall.  You are 110% right on his path.

Hows that work for the rest of the 1 to 3%?

Nobody really wants to touch this real topic.  Just bash the general thought that excess money to throw at this process matters a whole lot.. And throw bombs at those who can't keep up with the baseball showcase expense world or dare to call it what it is.

 

 

I know of other kids perceived as potential D1 prospects getting help with travel teams and instruction. 

Money is a relative term. What may seem like a lot to one person may be pocket change to another. Some people with a lot of money will go over the top. I know a dad who left no dollar unspent on training getting his kid to a P5. The kid never started. 

Between soph and junior year I spent $1500 to alter my son’s swing. I paid an expert to convince him of something I had been telling him for a year. As dad I had lost my expert title when my son turned fifteen. At that point I told him I needed to find someone to kick his arse to the next level. Until fifteen I had provided all my son’s hitting instruction. My daughter (college softball) listened and never needed a paid lesson. 

The only other money I spent was on SAT prep.

SomeBaseballDad posted:
plherleth posted:
Brensdad posted:

And what is your size?

6 foot 175

What is your parent's size? If mom and dad are 5' 11" and 6' 4" respectfully as opposed to 5' 1" and 5' 9" that's going to matter. Being a lefty is a big plus but puberity is going to have the most say going forward. My son took pitching lessons with a kid who was throwing 83 in the 6/7th grade. He was throwing 88 jr year. That said as a lefty 88 with control of offspeed/fastball will get you DI. 93 plus with little to no control will get you drafted.

Just an honest question. I have a 2025 lefty who already just wants to pitch.  He is 12 1/2 and 5ft 8; 133lbs.  He projects to be 6ft 1 per pediatrician.  Mom is 5ft 5. Im only 5ft 8.   The original poster is already 6ft as 2022.  Doesnt he already check the box as someone who likely to be 6ft2 plus?  As long as he can pitch. 

EastCO posted:
SomeBaseballDad posted:
plherleth posted:
Brensdad posted:

And what is your size?

6 foot 175

What is your parent's size? If mom and dad are 5' 11" and 6' 4" respectfully as opposed to 5' 1" and 5' 9" that's going to matter. Being a lefty is a big plus but puberity is going to have the most say going forward. My son took pitching lessons with a kid who was throwing 83 in the 6/7th grade. He was throwing 88 jr year. That said as a lefty 88 with control of offspeed/fastball will get you DI. 93 plus with little to no control will get you drafted.

Just an honest question. I have a 2025 lefty who already just wants to pitch.  He is 12 1/2 and 5ft 8; 133lbs.  He projects to be 6ft 1 per pediatrician.  Mom is 5ft 5. Im only 5ft 8.   The original poster is already 6ft as 2022.  Doesnt he already check the box as someone who likely to be 6ft2 plus?  As long as he can pitch. 

Kids mature physically at all different ages.  Some stop growing in 8th grade and others put on a couple of inches in college.  When it comes to pitching these days, taller is better for recruiting.  

Not to put doubt in your mind but your pediatrician's guess about your son's future height is simply that, a pure guess based on percentiles at his current age.  His genetics will do more to determine his final height than his stature at any point along the way.  For this reason, coaches will absolutely look at mom and dad to get an idea of final height potential for prospects.  Fair or not, that's reality.  I have even seen parents joke about hiring tall actors to accompany their kid on campus visits, lol.

EastCO posted:
SomeBaseballDad posted:
plherleth posted:
Brensdad posted:

And what is your size?

6 foot 175

What is your parent's size? If mom and dad are 5' 11" and 6' 4" respectfully as opposed to 5' 1" and 5' 9" that's going to matter. Being a lefty is a big plus but puberity is going to have the most say going forward. My son took pitching lessons with a kid who was throwing 83 in the 6/7th grade. He was throwing 88 jr year. That said as a lefty 88 with control of offspeed/fastball will get you DI. 93 plus with little to no control will get you drafted.

Just an honest question. I have a 2025 lefty who already just wants to pitch.  He is 12 1/2 and 5ft 8; 133lbs.  He projects to be 6ft 1 per pediatrician.  Mom is 5ft 5. Im only 5ft 8.   The original poster is already 6ft as 2022.  Doesnt he already check the box as someone who likely to be 6ft2 plus?  As long as he can pitch. 

Parent height is not always the best predictor. For my 6'3" son, I am 5'10" and his mother is 5'7". His freshman little bro is already 6'0". I believe the typical growth over high school ages is around 2-4", but everyone is different. Doctors reviewing growth plates probably give the best guesses.

Also, college coaches don't want to project more than they have to... my son was low 80s as a soph already over six foot, but still "too" projectable/unpredictable for serious D1 interest.  

At the next level, whether it be college, pro, or agents, I had the feeling that we as parents were also being evaluated.  They would measure us up physically (height, body type, etc) as well as "interviewing" us along with son.  Much can be learned observing/listening to parent's behaviors and answers, they get a glimpse into how the kid was raised and morals.  Not only do they want good athletes and players, they also want someone who will be a team player, stay out of trouble, give it their all, etc.   

Re: projected height

i asked our pediatrician if the following wive’s tale is true ... A boy will grow to be 6-8 inches taller than his mother.

She said it was more true than not true. But it doesn’t account for outliers. I have a friend with short parents. He grew to be 6’2”. His aunt (mother’s sister was 5’10”. His brother is 5’7 which is more in line with his 5’8” father and 5’ mother. 

I’m 6’1”. My ex is 5’8” My son is 6’2”. Two of his uncles and his grandfathers are 6’3” and 6’2”. One uncle is 5’10”.

One if my son’s high school teammates was 6’ by soph year. He stopped there. His father is 5’10”. The mother is 5’4”. The father joked he should stay away from his kid at showcases for the purpose of projection. 

I'm 5'4.75" (I always make sure I add the 3/4s) and my husband is 5'11". My brother is 6'3", his brother is 6'3". our grandfathers were 6' plus.  son is 5'11" and VERY angry! He feels like those Uncles were his ticket to great height! His Dad also happens to be a pediatrician and has told him he's done.....it's all relative (pun intended)

Kimb27 posted:

I'm 5'4.75" (I always make sure I add the 3/4s) and my husband is 5'11". My brother is 6'3", his brother is 6'3". our grandfathers were 6' plus.  son is 5'11" and VERY angry! He feels like those Uncles were his ticket to great height! His Dad also happens to be a pediatrician and has told him he's done.....it's all relative (pun intended)

Ha! Great stuff.  My oldest is 15yo. 5ft 8.  Told he will be 5ft9 maybeeeeeew 10.  Really mad his younger bro is going to be taller.

Kimb27 posted:

I'm 5'4.75" (I always make sure I add the 3/4s) and my husband is 5'11". My brother is 6'3", his brother is 6'3". our grandfathers were 6' plus.  son is 5'11" and VERY angry! He feels like those Uncles were his ticket to great height! His Dad also happens to be a pediatrician and has told him he's done.....it's all relative (pun intended)

I'm 5'6", husband is 5'8", my brother is 6'0".  We could see my baseball-son is built exactly like his uncle, so while he was growing we told him he would get to 6' - and fortunately, he did.  Older son, built like husband, seems to have stopped at 5'10".  Youngest son (15) is already 6'2", not built like any relatives we know.  But, he doesn't play any sports where height matters.

My 6’2” son was late to grow. He was 5’4” in 8th grade before he started growing in the summer. When we walked by a tall, unathletic looking person he would mutter, “That’s a waste of good height.”

TheRightScuff posted:
EastCO posted:
SomeBaseballDad posted:
plherleth posted:
Brensdad posted:

And what is your size?

6 foot 175

What is your parent's size? If mom and dad are 5' 11" and 6' 4" respectfully as opposed to 5' 1" and 5' 9" that's going to matter. Being a lefty is a big plus but puberity is going to have the most say going forward. My son took pitching lessons with a kid who was throwing 83 in the 6/7th grade. He was throwing 88 jr year. That said as a lefty 88 with control of offspeed/fastball will get you DI. 93 plus with little to no control will get you drafted.

Just an honest question. I have a 2025 lefty who already just wants to pitch.  He is 12 1/2 and 5ft 8; 133lbs.  He projects to be 6ft 1 per pediatrician.  Mom is 5ft 5. Im only 5ft 8.   The original poster is already 6ft as 2022.  Doesnt he already check the box as someone who likely to be 6ft2 plus?  As long as he can pitch. 

Parent height is not always the best predictor. For my 6'3" son, I am 5'10" and his mother is 5'7". His freshman little bro is already 6'0". I believe the typical growth over high school ages is around 2-4", but everyone is different. Doctors reviewing growth plates probably give the best guesses.

Also, college coaches don't want to project more than they have to... my son was low 80s as a soph already over six foot, but still "too" projectable/unpredictable for serious D1 interest.  

It's all the growth hormones in the meat you've been feeding him. Just ask the internet.

Fun dialog - I'm 6'2" (and fear I'm starting to shrink), wife is 5'8", 16 yr old daughter is 5'9", and 13 yr old son is already 6'4" … worried that he will grow too tall for his favorite sport (baseball).   We tell him he cannot give up basketball until he stops growing and he shows he can consistently avoid a having a big hole in his swing.  He dislikes the idea of becoming PO.

I've worked on a lot of child development publications over the years, and I would say the best estimate for future height is double the child's height at age 2. Nothing works every time, but it's a solid guideline assuming no other later health issues affect growth.

Trust In Him posted:

At the next level, whether it be college, pro, or agents, I had the feeling that we as parents were also being evaluated.  They would measure us up physically (height, body type, etc) as well as "interviewing" us along with son.  Much can be learned observing/listening to parent's behaviors and answers, they get a glimpse into how the kid was raised and morals.  Not only do they want good athletes and players, they also want someone who will be a team player, stay out of trouble, give it their all, etc.   

I can't hit the like button enough.

stranded1 posted:

I've worked on a lot of child development publications over the years, and I would say the best estimate for future height is double the child's height at age 2. Nothing works every time, but it's a solid guideline assuming no other later health issues affect growth.

I heard this when my son was 2, turns out it was very accurate for him.  The measurements said he would end up being 6’ 2”- 6’3” and he is 6’3”now.

I've finally found a good use for these online medical records. Attached is a image of my son's growth chart that debunks the "double the child's height at age 2" … just having fun with the subject … as you all can see, my kid is a freakish outlier on the chart.  My boy is 13.5 yrs old and now stands 76", projected to be completely off this growth chart when he is 18.  As parents, we were happy to use Rhys Hoskins as my son's reference model, I guess we can suggest he consider PO and become a hybrid blend the likes of Randy Johnson and CC Sabathia .

Enough about my kid … back to the attachment -  It is a nice quick glance, national reference for average boys growth from 2 to 20 yrs old with percentile sub groups.  Very easy to find your own son's projections on this chart.

 

Attachments

Photos (1)

I think height is a factor but just part of the projection process.  My son is 5'11"-6' LHP at a SEC school.  He does not throw 95 but is expected to contribute this spring because he has great command of 4/5pitches in any count.  There have been tall guys who don't throw hard and short guys who throw bullets.  Plus there are short guys who throw with great command so I don't think you can put a height on what it takes.  It is just part of the make-up when they are looking at players and trying to figure out how they will develop.

From a recruiting perspective it seems to me, anecdotally based on comparing committed HS players height and velo, that if you are 6' and under you need to be throwing harder in HS than a kid that is 6'4" who coaches seem to be projecting to add velo once on campus.

That is to say, most kids around 6' that are committed to top 25 school per PG are throwing 91 plus while I see plenty of 6'4 kids committed to the same schools who are throwing upper 80's.

To that point, when I am looking at committed classes for a specific school with my son, we typically skip over the profiles of the 6'4-6'8 kids as they seem to be graded on a different scale.

Size matters in sports. It is an advantage whether you believe it or not. How many "studs" do you know who are 5'9" a buck 40. My guess is not many. Usually they are more likely 6'2" 190ish

From another angle: I've always heard that missing on 6' plus is more easily explained than missing on a guy that is 5' something. Not saying it is right, just seems to be reality of the game

However, this thread has seemed to veer off topic a little. Getting back to OP question. You have time and size on your side (along with being left-handed). Just work hard on strengthen and conditioning. Keep smiling and having fun doing it. If it becomes only a job at your age, chances are your going to quit sooner than later. Keep up your grades and take school serious (academic scholarships are more valuable). Don't worry yourself about the money thing. To think someone can buy their way onto a top D1 program is just not true. Connections do help (real world), but you gotta be able to hold your own. Also don't fool yourself into believing D1 is the only (or best) option. Plenty of good baseball out there if you let yourself see it. Seen various Juco teams over the years be truly legit. There are some guys who use these programs to try and boost there draft status for the Majors. Not to mention a lot of D1 players have transferred from various Juco programs. Hope this helps, just remember to keep up your grades, train hard, and keep a positive attitude!!! (These things will serve you well for years to come)

In case anyone is interested....

I found a site ( a college of kinesiology and science based ) that calculates your child's predicted height and started using it when our son was around 13 I think.  I would plug in his numbers and it turned out to be very accurate. He is 18 now and prediction was spot on. We have height on both sides of the family, but not everyone is tall. My husbands 1st cousin is 6'9, so we really didn't know how tall out son would be? He is not 6'9 Lol! 

I tested it on a couple of his friends as well along the way....and same result, very accurate to within a half inch. It uses just your child's measurements, sitting and standing and their weight along with their date of birth and date of the test. Test subject must be between 9-18 yrs old for males. It seems to be most accurate for boys 12-16 yrs old when measured. I will post a link and hopefully it is not against the HSBW rules to do so?

https://www.usask.ca/kin-growthutility/ahp_ui.php

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