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I am new to this forum and very appreciative to have found it. My son is a 2020 and will be our first to go through the recruiting process. Both his mother and I played collegiate sports but that was too long ago and it appears the recruiting process has evolved over the years. My question is this; If coaches are not allowed to contact players how are they entering into a verbal commitment with Freshman, Sophomores etc? Do the players initiate and make all of the contact? My son is outgoing for his age but I cannot see him networking and making strategic decisions on who to contact and when and manage all that goes along with this type of negotiation. Are the parents expected to contact the coaches initially and vet out the situation then have the player do the rest? I do not want to come across as one of "those" parents to a coach but I also don't want my son left behind.

I do realize he has time, just want to get a plan together to help him through the process. I am certainly not pushing him to try to get a commitment now nor do I think he is in any way ready to make a decision as to where he would like to go to college. He is still in the stage that if you ask him where he would like to go the four teams he mentions just happen to be the last four teams in the CWS.

 

Thanks in advance for the information and I appreciate all of the information that is on this forum.

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As a parent getting to this site early in your son's recruiting will benefit your son and provide reason & sanity in your household.  You'll be able to gather intel to help guide your motivated son.  Please know that your son is early in the process; any kids you see committing as a Freshman or Sophomore are taking themselves off the "recruiting market" at the advantage of the college who "verbally" offered. There are exceptions.

Early communication by a college coach is typically channeled through the travel coach/travel program (as 9an7 mentioned above)  If your son attends a specific colleges camp the coaches are able to talk directly to your son or you.  They'll follow up their interest through your son's coaches.  

Keep your son involved with multiple sports as long as you can, get him stronger, if he's a solid player, find out about the top reputation baseball programs in your area: solid coaching, quality instruction, age/skill level appropriate tournaments, and look at the baseball program 16 & 17U age groups - who is getting recruited by which colleges.  It's a nice tell as to how connected a lot of the program coaches are.  But eventually the process starts with your son:  his dream, objective assessments of his ability, work ethic on the field and in the classroom.  Our job is to guide our players and provide doses of probability & reality.  

Lots of terrific people with experience at every stage on this site.  ALSO, the search button on the top right of the page will be a great resource for you.

(edited - typo)

Last edited by Gov

TONS of great information on the board.  If you have time, please search through some old threads (hopefully some folks can recall some good ones off the top of their head and post links) and these will walk you through how contact usually gets made (travel coach), but also on how to get your kid ready for the first outgoing call they make and how to prepare for some of the basic questions (things like how to respond when asked what other colleges you are looking at or speaking with).  Some folks have done actual rehearsals whereas others simply make sure the kid has some solid ideas on how to answer instead of going cold (sometimes "I'm not real sure at this point" honesty works just fine).  Some of the posts will also discuss the ongoing communications (assuming the coach stays interested) and what to expect as far as keeping the coach up to speed with information (primarily summer schedule).

My son's favorite coach for quite awhile was the last one he spoke with (loved the attention).  Kept trying to impress upon him that the coach's job was to make sure the kid liked the coach/program IF the coach wanted to pursue further.  Most coaches are great, but they all seem to be good on the phone when they are trying to get a kid to start warming up to a program.

On the travel coach front, do some double checking with the person or the organization and see if they do have contacts.  All major programs do have contacts, but some independent coaches may have a more limited contact list.  They don't have to know other schools, but it helps if they have long term credibility in the area.  If you have concerns in that area, you may have to adjust your strategy slightly.  If you want to get some more focused suggestions on how to proceed, you can always come back and provide a little detail as to your circumstances (geography, travel team "rank", proposed 2017 summer scheduling, etc.).  

Thanks for the replies, I will definitely use the search tool. As for his circumstances; we are in Southern Missouri and have a well known travel program in our area. He has played on a "Majors" level independent team for the last couple years (11U AAA, 12U AAA, 13U majors, 14U majors USSSA).

My son is very lucky to have an experienced and knowledgeable high school coach.  I have confidence in his development ability and he schedules showcase type tournaments if the ability level of the boys fits the situation in the summer time. If he continues to progress and wants to continue on the path of playing at the next level we will look for a good fit with an academy type travel team for his summer after his Sophomore year.

He has above average hitting ability from what I see. Exit velo was 96 last week (tee, BBCOR). His fastball is average or slightly above, 82mph also last week. He has a decent glove but is lacking in speed. His latest 60 time was 7.8 I think. Of course he thinks the timekeeper was wrong!

Like I originally posted, my wife and I are wanting to position him to achieve his dream of playing D1 baseball but don't really want him caught up in the hype of the PBR or PG rankings, recruiting sites etc.. All of that will come but for now we would rather he not focus on where he is ranked (Not bashing those site's, I think they are a great tool) but have fun and enjoy getting better.  I feel like it is my job for now to facilitate the process.

Again, thanks for all of the information. I would imagine there are a great many who use this forum without ever posting and the knowledge that is passed on does give one a sense of the landscape and others unique experiences.

Grades, study skills, lots of reading are equally important.  Start getting a handle on the quality of the HS guidance counselor.  Make sure your son is taking the hardest classes he can successfully navigate.

Begin to get a handle on the colleges you can afford and which may interest you (the list will evolve up until the end).  Use every family trip to drop by a college (any college will do) so your son can begin to get a feel.

A 2020 has the chance to really push his academics; the higher the better - so many more options.

My son and I wrote his initial email to coaches together and we worked on sending them together (to almost 200 coaches at all levels). We talked about what coaches might want to know about him, and did what we called "practice visits" to local colleges to get a sense of what he wanted to know about schools and programs. He had a couple of coaches contact him through his high school coach (son is a 2018) before they could officially talk to him, but he has pretty much handled all conversations himself. The only thing that has thrown him since coaches could talk to him directly was the guy who flat out said "what do you need to come to school here?"

He compared that to getting a marriage proposal before you even go on the first date. :-)

Jlr58 posted:

Thanks for the replies, I will definitely use the search tool. As for his circumstances; we are in Southern Missouri and have a well known travel program in our area. He has played on a "Majors" level independent team for the last couple years (11U AAA, 12U AAA, 13U majors, 14U majors USSSA).

My son is very lucky to have an experienced and knowledgeable high school coach.  I have confidence in his development ability and he schedules showcase type tournaments if the ability level of the boys fits the situation in the summer time. If he continues to progress and wants to continue on the path of playing at the next level we will look for a good fit with an academy type travel team for his summer after his Sophomore year.

He has above average hitting ability from what I see. Exit velo was 96 last week (tee, BBCOR). His fastball is average or slightly above, 82mph also last week. He has a decent glove but is lacking in speed. His latest 60 time was 7.8 I think. Of course he thinks the timekeeper was wrong!

Like I originally posted, my wife and I are wanting to position him to achieve his dream of playing D1 baseball but don't really want him caught up in the hype of the PBR or PG rankings, recruiting sites etc.. All of that will come but for now we would rather he not focus on where he is ranked (Not bashing those site's, I think they are a great tool) but have fun and enjoy getting better.  I feel like it is my job for now to facilitate the process.

Again, thanks for all of the information. I would imagine there are a great many who use this forum without ever posting and the knowledge that is passed on does give one a sense of the landscape and others unique experiences.

This week PG is letting everyone have full access to the site, it's their Holiday present to the baseball community and it's awesome.  Having said that,what is listed for the class of 2020 is from a very very very small group of participants and not indicative of what that class actually has going on. 

PG can only correlate what they have seen and measured and in an average PG event the 60 times and OF velocities aren't measured.  Those are only done during things like showcases and the BCS.  I would guess that 98% of 2020's haven't done either of those things so there are stats like the #17 fastest catcher velo is 59mph, the 49th best pop time was a 2.68, the 51st best 60 time was a 7.48????

My point is...getting bogged down in which 2020's are in the top ten, or top 100, is pointless right now because the majority hasn't been measured at a PG event and so they aren't listed. I would also wager that 50% of the 2020's haven't achieved the height they will have by their Junior year, which is when the real recruiting typically kicks off. 

Being in Missouri my guess would be you are going to have to go to Iowa or Georgia for a few PG events, or possibly a showcase...eventually.

I like this portion of what you said "...don't really want him caught up in the hype of the PBR or PG rankings, recruiting sites etc"

Truth is many good players never get ranked simply because they don't attend PBR or PG events.  How can someone really say "Player X is the number one player in Virginia".  That statement can in no way be validated unless every baseball player in Virginia was assessed.  What I wonder is how many players go onto to the next level without ever attending one of those events.  I can tell you our small/young organization has assisted 17 players move on over the past two years; none of those players participated in any PG events and very few went to PBR's.

In the end, those players moved on because of their talent, hard work, and relationships involved across the process.

In short, there is no need to ever get caught up in the "hype" plenty of players move on without it.   

There are two things I think you need from PBR or PG or similar events. One is a sense of how you compare to other players of your age and position. It's how you determine if you really are D1 material--or not. Second is measurables. It matters to have a third party say you run so fast or hit so hard. You can get both of those things without getting wrapped up in ratings. You, as parents, just have to keep your heads. 

Redsdad posted:

I like this portion of what you said "...don't really want him caught up in the hype of the PBR or PG rankings, recruiting sites etc"

Truth is many good players never get ranked simply because they don't attend PBR or PG events.  How can someone really say "Player X is the number one player in Virginia".  That statement can in no way be validated unless every baseball player in Virginia was assessed.  What I wonder is how many players go onto to the next level without ever attending one of those events.  I can tell you our small/young organization has assisted 17 players move on over the past two years; none of those players participated in any PG events and very few went to PBR's.

In the end, those players moved on because of their talent, hard work, and relationships involved across the process.

In short, there is no need to ever get caught up in the "hype" plenty of players move on without it.   

Redsdad....the OP's son doesn't just want to play at the next level, he wants to play D1.  While I agree 100% it is entirely possible to move onto playing baseball in college without attending a PBR/PG event I'm just not certain how many players can move onto playing D1 without attending ANY of these events.

Out of the 17 players your organization assisted, how many went D1?

Very good advice so far, as usual. Support him throughout the process. Don't get caught up with the "We" vs "He" criticisms. Do your job as a parent and help him learn along the way. Most HS kids don't act like 40 year old men. Talk to your travel coach and leverage his network. Define your targets and be honest in your self evaluation. I would suggest PG or PBR events for the potential exposure, especially Ft Myers and Jupiter. Have fun, hold on and understand there is no handbook.

Last edited by Shoveit4Ks

First off those are some great numbers for your son kudos!  Second I would start thinking about showcasing if my son had those numbers. The pitch velocity might be borderline for a showcase but that exit velocity is huge!!  And Gov, I also see a fair amount of kids who go D1 without showcasing but it's generally local kids and not necessarily too of the roster kids. If you have the D1 dream it's very very helpful to do PBR or PG. And honestly not to give PG a free plug but they have become so dominant in that market you almost have to do at least one of theirs. 

Gov posted:

I've know plenty of kids that reached D1 level without PBR or PG.  Going directly to local and regional camps, and specific college camps.

Me too, Gov. Not just college camps, but being seen on their travel team or even (hard as it might be to believe!) their high school team.

There is a regional component to this, I think. PBR is big in certain states, and completely non-existent in others. PG is omnipresent in the Southeast, but not nearly as big in the West.

OTOH, I know a number of kids ranked highly by PG who have never played a PG event . . .

While I think it's great for any kid to move on utilizing whatever avenue, I don't particularly buy into the premise that it's the best approach to not utilize PG.  It's a little like saying we've had this pitcher or that pitcher move on to college.  That's great, but did they maximize their opportunity by having a pitching coach?  85 plus will generally get you a decent spot in college.  However if you had a pitching coach help get you over 90, you have a lot more options, and often better ones. 

Same thing for PG.  Attending PG events doesn't get you to a college roster, and it can be done without them.  The question is can you maximize your options and opportunities without the high exposure they provide.  Personally I don't think so, but that's a decision for every family.  Just because kids get to a school and a roster doesn't mean they used every resource to get to the best school and roster for them.  It's about opportunity and exposure. 

Absolutely, do PG and/or PBR showcases if it is beneficial to you. And for lots of kids it will be. My only point is that it is possible to not do a showcase and get to a kid's dream school -- and that in certain regions of the country it is actually quite common.

Just out of curiosity, I looked up the commitments of the current junior class (2018) to UCLA -- of the 9 commitments listed, 8 are ranked in the Top 300 nationally by PG. Just 3 of the 9 have done a PG showcase (and of course zero have done a PBR showcase, since they don't operate in California). FWIW, there is a 10th commitment to UCLA in the class of 2018 not listed in PG, and he hasn't done a showcase, either.

Is not showcasing the best path for most kids? Probably not. But it's not crazy.

I get the impression that there are a ton of parents and kids out there that do not have the skills and connections necessary to manage the process of recruitment well.  Some do have many of the skills necessary and may have the necessary contacts (a really good travel coach may be all this is required).  But, for those that do not have the complete skill set, a PG showcase - at the appropriate time - can prove invaluable in getting the kid seen by an appropriate audience and getting the necessary independent feedback to help get pointed in the right direction.

Showcasing alone won't suffice, but it can play a key role in identifying the appropriate pond, an exercise that is sometimes the most difficult of all.  Maybe assume $1,000 all in cost with travel/lodging and start comparing that cost to other paths.  If you fail to understand where the decision makers feel your son fits, you could spend many times that amount chasing a dream that will never become real.  Conversely, if you can get that independent evaluation (tougher than it sounds) and then start getting in front of those schools in some capacity, you can skip the showcase altogether.  I guess you need to understand the role the showcase can play in the recruitment program and then determine if that role can be met by another means - a presumably cheaper means.

JLR58, check your PM's....look up and towards the right of your screen, do you see the red number next to your name, click your name and open your private messages.

As a side note, received a camp/showcase invite yesterday for my 14 year old 9th grader from a very D1 school.  Within that email, which WAS a generic email, I thought it was interesting that they did point out "I know you are a Freshman"....they really are starting earlier and earlier since they are targeting Freshman for their camps/showcases.

CaCO3Girl posted:
Redsdad posted:

I like this portion of what you said "...don't really want him caught up in the hype of the PBR or PG rankings, recruiting sites etc"

Truth is many good players never get ranked simply because they don't attend PBR or PG events.  How can someone really say "Player X is the number one player in Virginia".  That statement can in no way be validated unless every baseball player in Virginia was assessed.  What I wonder is how many players go onto to the next level without ever attending one of those events.  I can tell you our small/young organization has assisted 17 players move on over the past two years; none of those players participated in any PG events and very few went to PBR's.

In the end, those players moved on because of their talent, hard work, and relationships involved across the process.

In short, there is no need to ever get caught up in the "hype" plenty of players move on without it.   

Redsdad....the OP's son doesn't just want to play at the next level, he wants to play D1.  While I agree 100% it is entirely possible to move onto playing baseball in college without attending a PBR/PG event I'm just not certain how many players can move onto playing D1 without attending ANY of these events.

Out of the 17 players your organization assisted, how many went D1?

I wasn't going to bite on the question but the curious side of me is pushing me to do so; I suspect any response in reply to the aforementioned numer is headed in only one direction...we have had two DI commits with the rest being DII and DIII; #18 committed to a DIII school last night.

Redsdad posted:
CaCO3Girl posted:
Redsdad posted:

I like this portion of what you said "...don't really want him caught up in the hype of the PBR or PG rankings, recruiting sites etc"

Truth is many good players never get ranked simply because they don't attend PBR or PG events.  How can someone really say "Player X is the number one player in Virginia".  That statement can in no way be validated unless every baseball player in Virginia was assessed.  What I wonder is how many players go onto to the next level without ever attending one of those events.  I can tell you our small/young organization has assisted 17 players move on over the past two years; none of those players participated in any PG events and very few went to PBR's.

In the end, those players moved on because of their talent, hard work, and relationships involved across the process.

In short, there is no need to ever get caught up in the "hype" plenty of players move on without it.   

Redsdad....the OP's son doesn't just want to play at the next level, he wants to play D1.  While I agree 100% it is entirely possible to move onto playing baseball in college without attending a PBR/PG event I'm just not certain how many players can move onto playing D1 without attending ANY of these events.

Out of the 17 players your organization assisted, how many went D1?

I wasn't going to bite on the question but the curious side of me is pushing me to do so; I suspect any response in reply to the aforementioned numer is headed in only one direction...we have had two DI commits with the rest being DII and DIII; #18 committed to a DIII school last night.

That sounds like a very successful program, and I won't pick on it.  I was actually curious at the numbers. 

I think others on here have explained it better...is it possible to go D1 without PG/PBR exposure, YUP!  Will it likely open up more possibilities if you have PG/PBR exposure, especially if you are trying to go more than 50 miles from home, YUP!

CaCO3Girl posted:

That sounds like a very successful program, and I won't pick on it.  I was actually curious at the numbers. 

I think others on here have explained it better...is it possible to go D1 without PG/PBR exposure, YUP!  Will it likely open up more possibilities if you have PG/PBR exposure, especially if you are trying to go more than 50 miles from home, YUP!

Not 100% accurate IMO.  I've explained this many times, but our 5-10/85 mph younger one would not have benefitted from big showcase exposure.  All they woulda seen is a 5-10/85 mph guy vs. a crop of 90+ guys and about the best he could hope for is being ignored.  At worst, his lack of velocity and size would have been accentuated and permanently kept him off their lists.

This was in fact what happened to him when he attended a regional showcase in Northern CA.  He was ignored or permanently written off by a number of coaches in favor of bigger, higher velocity guys who, in the end, never accomplished anywhere near what he did.  A big/national showcase would have only made this situation worse IMO, and so we did none of them.

To figure him out, a college coach needed to watch him for a while in HS/travel ball and understand what he brought to the table (pinpoint command, competitiveness, 4 pitch repertoire, etc...).  A college coach needed to call his HS and travel coach and ask if what they were thinking was correct.  A college coach needed to hear from coaches of other HS's and travel programs that they oughta give him a look cause he's 'different' than the stereotype of short, lower velocity pitchers.   A college coach needed to talk to area scouts to find out that he really knows what he's doing out there and that yes, his velocity in the 1st inning may be 84 but by the 4th inning its 88...something that would not be found in a showcase.

All of that paragraph above rang true for 3 or 4 college coaches who put their ear to the ground and listened to the rumble...and figured it out.  A couple in our area did not, and paid for it later in college.

The coach who ultimately recruited him to a Pac12 school must have watched him pitch close to a dozen times in HS.  

I love what a minor league pitching coach who used to coach in the Pac12 told him last year in Spring Training - 'JBBson, you are one of reasons I left college baseball - you were nowhere on our recruiting board as a HSer, but we learned we hated facing you in the Pac12 - I just got tired of recruiting big names only to find out kids like you were the ones we shoulda recruited.'

Last edited by justbaseball

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