"Genetics" and throwing velocity

My opinion has always been this. Genetics gives you a ceiling. Hard work gets you to that ceiling.

If a dad threw 95 chances are the kid has the potential to throw 95. But he still has to do the work to develop. Another kid may not have a dad who played sports. But maybe he had the potential. While the kid has less idea of his potential upside with hard work he can find it. On the flip side, a friend who pitched at the AAA level had a kid who didn't make the high school team despite working hard. He joked his ex polluted the gene pool.

My honest advice is to control the things you can control.  I agree with Scotty and RJM that genetics play a role in the ceiling for how hard you can throw but nobody knows how high that ceiling is.  You can't control it and will always wonder what is it but at the end of the day you can control how hard you work to reach your ceiling.  Keep working and preparing like you can reach 100 MPH but if you only reach 85 then that's probably your ceiling.  Nothing wrong with that.

If genetics were the main contributing factor to velo, you would not see pitchers like Lincecum throwing upper 90's, and big athletic dudes that can't break 80's.  Sequencing efficient body movements is the key to velocity....sure IF you are predisposed genetically, AND have efficient explosive sequenced body movements, you are ahead of the pack, however velocity is more a function of properly sequenced explosive movements, and not as much a function of strength or genes.

 

Do not be discouraged.....and do not believe everything you see on the internet. Many  "Pitching gurus" for the most part have very little understanding of cause and effect.

Great question Dz.  I was actually thinking about "Baseball Bloodlines" the other day and how they start.  I do think that genetics, or the bloodline, can increased the odds of producing a better athlete.  In my case, I was just wondering how it starts?  In my case, there was no history of anyone in the immediate family tree being athletic.  Fortunately, it has passed on to my kids as they all seem pretty good overall athletically.

I think I was born with a million dollar arm, because I spent a fortune driving all over the country playing ball!

I'm in my 50s. I throw just as hard as when I was 20. The ball just arrives a lot later now.

RJM that is hilarious. 

 

Coach is right, control what you can control. There is no question that genetics play a big part of athletic performance, however I am a big believer that most never come close to their genetic max. 

 

I would strongly encourage you to look into two websites for help. One for the proper lifting programs, and the second for throwing programs,

 

http://www.ericcressey.com/

 

http://www.drivelinebaseball.com/

 

Development takes years not months, and  you will be surprised how hard you can throw a ball with some work. 

 

Good Luck!

 

 

Great advice from the guys above. I would add one more thing. Never give up on your dreams.

If it was all genetics, why are there way many more pitchers throwing in the 90's these days.

The sophisticated training and instruction is light years ahead of when it was years ago.

Keep working hard kid. You'll get there!

Thanks guys!
Obviously there is an unknown ceiling for genetics that I will never know where I stand until I reach that. It could be 100, it could be 85, but I won't stop till I know.
I appreciate all the answers, this site has been my #1 resource as I go through my sophomore year. It's great to have you guys help

Best of luck in your pursuit  I would agree with the advice that you're getting in these responses.  Proper training and hard work DO produce results.  Following my son around the country this past summer, I saw a lot of different sizes, shapes and deliveries that moved a baseball to home plate very quickly!  

As far as genetics go, I'll leave you with this:  Perfect Game reported that 197 pitchers topped 90 MPH or above at last week's 2014 WWBA World Championship in Jupiter.  I know a lot of the dads of kids on that list, and I can guarantee you that velo didn't come from their gene pool!

I actually know a bit about genetics, but your assertion that you can't achieve something because of your genetics has me wondering how much you know about genetics. 

 

Genetic predisposition doesn't mean what you think it means.  You seem to think it means that if your dad didn't throw 90+ you are incapable of it, but you are forgetting that you are not your dad, that would be a clone.  The reason your dad may not have thrown 90+ might be a weakness in his shoulder...but your mom's side of the family may have better shoulders, thereby eliminating that weakness from your gene pool.

 

Genetic predisposition means if your dad DID have the capability to do something you are likely to be able to do the same thing.  It does NOT mean if he couldn't do something you for sure can't do it either, that's the beauty of genetics!  It can pull strengths from both parents into one child and the next child may have pulled all the weaknesses. Traits that make our bodies work more efficiently are usually more dominant, but there is no guarantee the special ability will be passed down.

 

There is also the argument of nature vs. nurture.  Can person X throw 90+ because his genes give him a special type of shoulder/elbow?  Or can person X throw 90+ because over the course of the last 10 years he slowly built up the muscles through repetition needed to achieve the velocity?  Was it nature, meaning genetics, or was it how you nurtured your body to behave the way you wanted?

 

It's not natural to hold your bat with your knuckles lined up...that's not in anyone's genetic make-up, however, every time you are at bat do you even think of how to line up your knuckles?  No, it's second NATURE to you that that is how you hold your bat.  My point is the body can be trained to do things that go beyond genetics.

 

Work hard, best of luck!

My advice?  Ignore the ceiling.

 

"And since he didn't know he couldn't fly, well of course he did"

          --Jerry Jeff Walker "The Cape"

 

It's probably true that genetics imposes a ceiling on everyone.

 

However, it's also probably true that almost nobody reaches their ceiling.  Nearly everybody stops before banging up against that ceiling because of distraction, discouragement, insufficient commitment, wrong kind of conditioning, injury, overuse, or whatever.

 

As my son told me, "I can handle the idea of not being good enough to play pro ball.  I can't handle the idea of working in an office when I'm thirty and not knowing for sure I did absolutely everything in my power to find out if I am good enough." 

 

Don't use the fact that there is a ceiling to discourage you from going full speed toward your goals. Your ceiling might be higher than anyone else predicts.

 

Best wishes,

 

Well stated Swamp...I just gave that speech to Righthook about 3 days ago!  Do everything you possibly can NOW so there is no looking back and wondering

A deeper understanding of genotype/phenotype is out of reach of 99.999% of people, including me, and I have quite a decent grasp of sports science and kinesiology. So let's not focus on possible restrictions that give kids extra excuses for why they didn't achieve certain goals in life or their career; college and pro ball gives you plenty of opportunity to fail with very concrete reasons.

Great discussion.  There doesn't seem to be any baseball topic that can't be learned at this site. Thanks all!

What I find interesting is that throwing hard isn't necessarily because you have a strong arm or certain body type.  

 

Your DNA determines things like height, weight, and body type. If these things help in achieving higher velocity, than that is good, but reality is that its the work (or the type of work) one puts in that will eventually determine how hard you throw. 

 

I blame all the bad stuff on mom's DNA

You don't know me, but I'm one of those Dads.  9 has made that Jupiter list two years in a row and I can't imagine it had anything to do with my genetics or his Mom's.

Is that for every mom? My dad was 6'4" with a "wing span" of an eagle and all legs and calves. My father in law was 5'4" while my husband is not 6', I am 5'2" and everyone wonders where son got his height and body type from (a replica of my dad).

 

The thing that really gets me is that my husband is a lefty...go figure.

Definitely a good discussion!
Is there any way that you could ever know when you've somehow hit your ceiling? Like Chapman hitting 105 MPH? Like Cabrera hitting 400+ bombs? Do you think those guys have hit their ceiling and are now maintaining it?

I wouldn't be surprised that if you asked them this they'd probably say that NO, they haven't reached their ceiling and are always trying to get better by raising the bar.  And in 20 years when they can no longer perform at that level, they'll probably make remarks like if they had done something a little different, they could have done a little better (hindsight always being perfect )

 

Genetics certainly plays a role in one's ability.  But just how genetics pays a role in any particular person is VERY complex.  As other's have suggested, you can't just look at your parents or even grandparents to evaluate what one's "ceiling" is.  So, it's best not to even think about this and just try to keep improving as one's body matures through young adulthood.  Being the best "you" you can make yourself be is the most important thing.

The fact of the matter is that so few people reach their asymptotic limit that genetics and congenital traits are rarely the hard roadblock stopping you from reaching the next level. Not to get all motivational or Outliers-esque, but trust me, what is considered "hard work" to advance in the game of baseball isn't exactly the toughest stuff on the planet. Try being a migrant farmworker in a third world country. That's actual hard work. When you work as hard as that guy does in all facets of the game (nutrition, education, physical preapredness, mechanical efficiency, mental preparedness, etc, etc, etc...) and you reach a hard limit, then you can complain about your bad luck. But chances are good you have a life outside of the game - which is fine - and therefore, genetics and congenital traits may make it HARDER to advance, but certainly are not the thing stopping you from achieving your goals.

To get back on track with the original poster: How sure are you that TuffCuff and Crossfit are the best programs to get you to where you want to be? What research have you done to confirm it? I am not saying they are good or bad, but how do you know how effective these programs are? Do you know at all? What is your nutrition like? How much have you studied the game? 

 

There's a lot that goes into improving. These are not even 5% of the questions I'd ask if I wanted to play college ball "more than anything." 

Kyle:

You make some really great points! The Tuffcuff program was a little bit of an unknown purchase, besides researching it online. The workouts are challenging, and I am putting my trust in it for results. As for the crossfit, those are mostly explosive movements using the legs and core (velocity gains?) there is not one workout that does not truly challenge me. Nutrition is a part of my game that I've been c

Kyle:

You make some really great points! The Tuffcuff program was a little bit of an unknown purchase, besides researching it online. The workouts are challenging, and I am putting my trust in it for results. As for the crossfit, those are mostly explosive movements using the legs and core (velocity gains?) there is not one workout that does not truly challenge me. Nutrition is a part of my game that I've been constantly improving. Breakfast, lunch, and dinner are monitered closer, and I try to intake carbs and proteins with every meal. I don't think these programs nescesarily guarantee results, but I can feel it after a workout! And although saying on an online forum that I want to play college ball may not seem so convincing, but I think my actions on and off the field (as well as a little faith) can take me to my goals.

In case anyone was wondering:
I am 16, a 2017 player.
I am a LHP, OF (in HS I played left and right) and 1B.
I currently sit around 71-74 (highest I've hit is 76)with the FB, mid 60s CH and a still in progress (mid to high 50s, sometimes 60.)

At tryouts travel tryouts this summer I ran a 7.6 60(obviously needs work) I am playing on a showcase team this summer in the Detroit area where we will play pretty high level tourneys (Black Swamp and Ulitmate Strike zone are scheduled)

Just trying to give everyone an update on where I stand