Grandstanding Senators

Don't you think they should outlaw obesity in the NFL too?

Vote the jokers out of office. This is what you get with the administration in charge now.

I believe this action was proposed by senators. They are part of the legislative branch, not the executive (administrative) branch. Some senators threatened the same action during the last administration. Seems that administrations have nothing to do with it.

Be careful, Jimmy. I hear those same dems that don't want to let you chew want to kick out the fat umps too.

quote:

Originally posted by Tx-Husker:
Be careful, Jimmy. I hear those same dems that don't want to let you chew want to kick out the fat umps too.

Why would that concern me? 5'11" - 165 lbs.

If you're referring to the MLB umpires, unless you're living in the past, you've noticed that the number and percentage of overweight umpires have dropped significantly. Even Joe West lost 70 pounds this season and is planning on losing another 40.

AAA and AA umpires have their weight and body shape monitored by evaluators. MiLB umpires have been released for failure to lose weight.

There are far more fat players, managers and coaches than umpires these days.

Gov't has a role to protect our youth. I have no problem whatsoever with the gov't stepping in and trying to remove chewing tobacco from the game thereby passing it onto generations of future baseball players. Just like cigarettes, chewing tobacco can cause cancer in the throat, mouth, lymph nodes. If adults want to make the decision to chew tobacco on their own....Godspeed.

I agree with the goal but don't think the grandstanding before the World Series (and up coming election year) is necessary to get the message across.

quote:

Originally posted by fenwaysouth:
Gov't has a role to protect our youth. I have no problem whatsoever with the gov't stepping in and trying to remove chewing tobacco from the game thereby passing it onto generations of future baseball players. Just like cigarettes, chewing tobacco can cause cancer in the throat, mouth, lymph nodes. If adults want to make the decision to chew tobacco on their own....Godspeed.

Shame on MLB and any team that has not banned it's use during games and especially with TV coverage. Even more distasteful of Nyger Morgan's behavior was that huge wade of chew in his mouth.

As an adult my son indulges in the nasty habit, at least he did until he found out that his uncle was diagnosed with throat cancer (and he never used tobacco products). The costs for his treatment is unbelievable, and he has excellent insurance. I thank the senators for not only trying to protect the youth, but possibly myself and others from paying the costs for someone elses treatment because they cannot afford private health insurance . While I do not like government telling me what to do in certain instances, I am tired of government taking my money to help pay for others care.

So the senators "care" so much about us, they want to ban use of tobacco in MLB. But not in the military? Why.

Driving small compact cars is more dangerous than the alternative of big cars. But they don't ban them.

Women over 40 having babies is dangerous, we better ban that.

Eatting fatty and sugary foods is dangerous...adds weight and increases heart disease. We better mandate what people are allowed to eat.

Sitting at the baseball game watching it endangers one because they could get hit with a foul ball, broken bat, fall from the stands. Better stop baseball all together.

Come on...parents need to parent their kids, not the feds. Don't these senators have something better to do? Shouldn't they be fixing their own broken society in Washington DC?

I like how the government just cherry picks what things to protect our children from. I guess that the tobacco industry doesn't line their pockets like the Alcohol and food industry. If you truly want to protect the children lets ban all the things that are harmful at the ballpark.

Beer, hot dogs, cotton candy, soda pop, crackerjacks, ice cream, and foul balls. Now that I think about it the stuff they sell in the stands are a lot more harmful than what the players have in their mouths in the field.

Chewing tobacco should be banned but why stop there?

My employer bans tobacco at work. I think most do. The teams should ban the use not the goverment.... I thought milb banned the use of tobacco on the field?
Local beach towns in this area are banning tobacco use on their beaches. Why not the MLB

It's a VERY Slippery slope. Just because you agree, and are okay with the Federal Government banning tobacco, as far as the MLB, it's not the smartest road to go down.

Before you know it there will be other things getting banned by the government. Eventually it WILL Effect you personally, but by then it will probably be too late.

NONE Of us should be okay with the Federal Government banning choices we can make. That's not the reason or purpose behind the founding and establishment of our government.

Saying you "don't want to have to pay for their care" is a two way street.

Next would be motorcycles because they are dangerous. Then fast food, because obese people tend to have lots of health problems.

Pretty soon you are told where you can go to school, where you can work, what you can wear, where you can live...pretty much everything will be decided "in your best interests" by the government.

Don't believe me? Break out a history book.

I think they should ban hot dogs at ML games. You know they are bad for you. Why not ban Alcohol ads during ML games? Whats more dangerous peope getting behind the wheel of a vehicle drinking or chewing? The entire game is BUD commercials. "This game break is brought to you by BUD the King of Beers!" Hey ban McDonalds. You know its bad for you. DBL QTR Pounders Fries Coke and Super Size it. Why not ban McDonalds Commercials? Heck why not ban everything that is bad for you? We are not smart enough or educated enough to make our own decisions. We need these people to decide for us. OK you can show the winning team showering each other with alcohol but we need to ban tobacco?

If I had to choose between two things for kid to do "chew, dip or drink what would I choose?" Is there any doubt? I dont want kids to chew or dip. I dont want them to eat fast food every day. I dont want them to drink. There are many things I dont want them to do. Who is responsible for teaching kids?

As ctandc said whats next? Where do they stop? Do they stop? Who decides? I am a grown man. If I want to dip I will. If I want to drink I will. I have never known anyone that drove their vehicle into another vehicle and killed someone because they were chewing. How many people are killed every day because someone got behind the wheel of a vehicle with a buzz going?

When my kids were small and we were watching a game and a beer ad came on it was up to me to make the comments that needed to be made. To educate them and to teach them. I didnt do that with a beer in my hand. Or one in my frig. We didnt go to McDonalds every day and eat burgers and fries. But that was my job not the governments job. Are we so stupid, uneducated, lacking in morals, that our government needs to step in and make all of our choices and decisions for us. Do you really want to turn your life over to the government?

Have we not been to the Mall lately? Or gone by a school lately? How many obese "FAT" kids have you seen? Only about 3 in 5. But what about the Taco Bell commercials? Why dont we ban those? Come on this is ridiculous. Where do you stop? Where does it stop?
Stay out of it Mr Government. Slippery Slope indeed. And its taken inch by inch. Our parents can't parent so we need "Government" to parent for us. Wow.

I think NJBB has the best solution. Have MLB offer some leadership on the issue and ban its use on the field.

What the players do off the field on their own time is their business and we dont need the govt getting involved but it is a problem and some kids do emulate what they see-rightly or wrongly.

Maybe they should ban beer, fried chicken and cable TV .... at least at Fenway.

quote:

Originally posted by igball:
I think NJBB has the best solution. Have MLB offer some leadership on the issue and ban its use on the field.

What the players do off the field on their own time is their business and we dont need the govt getting involved but it is a problem and some kids do emulate what they see-rightly or wrongly.

That's where I disagree.

Would it be wonderful of professional athletes conducted themselves in a manner that would make them good role models for children? Sure. And there are some out there.

But it's NOT a professional athlete's job to be a role model or raise our children.

Kids want to emulate pro athletes..I get that. But if you think chew / dip is the biggest thing that kids need to be prepared for...you are sadly mistaken.

Parents should be role models. Parents should be parents. It shouldn't be TV shows, video games, books, teacher, coaches or athletes. Parents. The buck stops with US as parents.

I'm reminded of an incident when my son was maybe 5 years old or so. We're in a local store. We're in line to check out. Right behind us is a couple with two kids (both at least as old or older than my son) and they are running around like wild animals. Mom and Dad keep saying "Come on honey, stop doing that.." etc etc.

So my son asks about a candy bar (that sits right next to the checkout) and we have a conversations and I tell him something and he answers with "yes sir."

The guy behind me, with the crazy kids, kind of half-jokingly says "How do you get him to do that?" (Be respectful, say Yes Sir).

While watching his kids run around I answer

"He's been taught by example. He knows there are consequences for his actions. And when he needs his butt whipped, I whip it."

The wife / mother overheard the last part. She says "I would never strike my child."

As I watch one of her kids actually take something out of another shopper's cart, I answer "Obviously not. How's that working for you?"

Parents as a whole are entirely too soft. I catch myself sometimes letting up as my son gets older. We want to be friends with our kid, hang out...that's GREAT. But when push comes to shove, WE are the PARENT and we need to act as such.

When I was a teenager at times I hated my Dad. He was so "mean". I recently told my wife, that if it took my son HATING me for his teenage years to respect and love me HALF as much as I do my Father as I got older..I'd gladly make that trade.

Remember, when it comes to the government getting involved in MAKING CHOICES for us...it's ALWAYS easier for them to make MORE choices then to back off. Again, history tells us this over and over.

I don't want my kid to start chew but I don't want our country to become any more of a Nanny state than it already is. They are so concerned with what's good for The People (you know, their bosses) they forget that it's none of their business.

If they are that concerned, outlaw it. Make it illegal to own, possess or use any tobacco product. Of course they would not get all that tax money they love so much but that should come second to our well being ...right? Like that will happen.

Here's a compromise: don't ban it or anything else, just use the "magic green screen" behind the batter, normally reserved for commercial messages, to show photos like this one:

http://www.deseretnews.com/art...f-chew-stressed.html

Or the poster of the former player who lost his jaw and went around the country doing anti-smokeless tobacco meetings.

That should get the message across.

Years ago when my oldest started to dip, I found the poster on line of the former baseball player, without his jaw, and put it in his bedroom. I think it got the message across.

I watched my dad die of lung cancer from smoking so I have no problem with anything done to educate kids on the dangers of tobacco.

Are the spectators allowed to use tobacco at the games?
Why are the players?
Are any of your employers allowing you to use tobacco at work?

quote:

Are the spectators allowed to use tobacco at the games?
Why are the players?
Are any of your employers allowing you to use tobacco at work?

Sure fans use smokeless at games. And I've seen plent of folks at work too. Not me...but I'm not going to tell them they can't.

Not directed at anyone but just a general statement.

Don't confuse choice versus decision made for you.

Don't confuse what private companies can make you do as employees versus what the government can make you do.

Huge differences in both of these.

quote:

Originally posted by Tx-Husker:

quote:

Are the spectators allowed to use tobacco at the games?
Why are the players?
Are any of your employers allowing you to use tobacco at work?

Sure fans use smokeless at games. And I've seen plent of folks at work too. Not me...but I'm not going to tell them they can't.

I guess its different in TX then it is in NJ,people just don't "chew" around here.

My employer is the goverment

Yes, we have the right to make bad choices, and sometimes, like in the case of chewing tobacco, that choice may lead to a self-inflicted oral malignancy. Should federal government be legislating on this particular choice? Maybe not.

However, it can be effectively argued that we are a society that is increasingly making bad choices.

For instance, let’s move from “chewing tobacco” to a little more substantial issue, for instance: Type-2 Diabetes.

This devastating, self-inflicted malady is primarily driven by poor lifestyle choices. These choices are driven by 1) indifference to the consequences, or 2) lack of access to good choices (healthful food, for instance), or 3) lack of education regarding how to make/consequences of lifestyle choices or 4) a combination of two or more of the preceding.

In 2002 T2 Diabetes accounted for 10% of our nation’s total health care spend.

24 million people have T2 Diabetes now. The number is projected to rise to nearly 50 million by 2035.

About $120 billion dollars was spent in 2010, alone, on the healthcare costs of T2 Diabetes

This is projected to rise to over $325 billion per year by 2035.

Simply, as a nation, we cannot sustain the fiscal impact of those poor choices.

So, who else, besides federal government, is going to invest in the necessary strategies to stem an epidemic that will cost Medicare trillions of dollars? Why is government intervention to prevent and reverse a national epidemic deemed a “nanny sate,” and “chiding us over our lifestyle choices,” when it is a matter of a fiscal and societal emergency?

Just another viewpoint on how the "line can be drawn"

like2rake you make some good points but let me go at this from more of a conspiracy theorist point of view.

I totally agree that we are making more and more decisions that are just flat out dumb as Americans. So why is that? Why have we all of a sudden stopped thinking with logic in mind?

One part of this reason is look at the state of our educational system. Politicians are the ones who have wrecked it by trying to legislate everyone into being college level students when really only about 20% of the nation's graduating classes each year should be moving onto college. Through the political aspect of education all blame is thrown onto the teachers and none of it is on the students or parents. Eventually down the line because of the rules, regulations and mounds of paperwork we have to do mistakes get made and parents sue. Due to teacher / school mistakes then the courts rule in favor of the parents and now other parents start trying to find lawsuits which bogs down our system.

Now look at funding - what is always one of the first things cut when the economy goes bad? Education will always be one of the first to get cut. Now we get situations like at our school where we struggle to buy enough paper for each teacher to make copies so kids can learn.

So why is all this relevant? Here is where I go all conspiracy theorist - the government wants to purposely destroy education because an uneducated population NEEDS to be "helped" by the government. If we keep turning out kids that are not capable to make decisions on their own then we will keep putting into office those who can rattle enough cages that will keep taking the power away from the people.

Like I said in my post above - there is a huge difference between choice and government mandates. We need to do everything in our power to maintain that power of choice with us. That's where our government has to work FOR us to help create an educational system that works and teaches our kids what powers we have and how to use them. To be able to make good decisions that will help all of us as a nation. Once we give that choice away - even with good reasons and intentions - we will never get it back. When was the last time government legislated power back to us? But every year regardless of party they keep passing laws that take power from us.

Education and the power of choice HAVE to go hand in hand.

I'm just hoping the Red Sox will ban Bud Light, Popeyes chicken and Gears of War 3 during games. Can we start there? See how that goes and work up to tobacco?

http://articles.boston.com/201..._tito-beer-bad-habit

Since the govt. can't fix the real problems, this is what they resort to...Pathetic.

quote:

Originally posted by njbb:
Are the spectators allowed to use tobacco at the games?
Why are the players?
Are any of your employers allowing you to use tobacco at work?

Only a relative few employees have the clout of the MLBPA behind them. For these Dem Senators to make this an issue, while we race toward an economic and fiscal cliff, is truly "fiddling while Rome burns."

quote:

Originally posted by zombywoof:
Since the govt. can't fix the real problems, this is what they resort to...Pathetic.

Are we reading the same article? I didn't read anything about the government doing anything. Some Senators have asked the MLB to extend their tobacco ban to smokeless tobacco. No legislation has been introduced, no hearings set, no government action of any kind. Why is everyone getting their knickers in a knot?

quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy03:

quote:

Originally posted by zombywoof:
Since the govt. can't fix the real problems, this is what they resort to...Pathetic.

Are we reading the same article? I didn't read anything about the government doing anything. Some Senators have asked the MLB to extend their tobacco ban to smokeless tobacco. No legislation has been introduced, no hearings set, no government action of any kind. Why is everyone getting their knickers in a knot?

I think the point is aren't there more important things these guys should be spending their time and our tax dollars on?

It would be great if no more kids ever chewed or smoked. Of course it would be a moot point, since at the rate we're going, they'd need to steal money to be able to buy it in the first place.

It's all a big conspiracy Jimmy. ;-) When you're obsessed with the boogeyman you're bound to see him, whether he's there or not.

quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy03:

quote:

Originally posted by zombywoof:
Since the govt. can't fix the real problems, this is what they resort to...Pathetic.

Are we reading the same article? I didn't read anything about the government doing anything. Some Senators have asked the MLB to extend their tobacco ban to smokeless tobacco. No legislation has been introduced, no hearings set, no government action of any kind. Why is everyone getting their knickers in a knot?

quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy03:
I didn't read anything about the government doing anything.

True. But what if they don't get their way with this obviously-timed request?

The government tells me I have to be 15' away from a building to smoke. Doesn't matter how the wind is blowing.

The goverment tells me I have wear my seatbelt. But motorcyclists (in my state) don't have to wear helmets.

The government tells me I cannot burn my leaves. They tell me I have to have rabies shots for my dog who never leaves the house. They tell our local businesses they must plant flowers in the middle of their parking lots.

I read about a town that made a man tear down his son's treehouse because it didn't have a permit.

Oak Park, IL is considering banning motorists from eating in their cars.

I am fully capable of determining for myself what is safe for me and what isn't. I don't smoke cigarettes but I do smoke cigars. I wear my seatbelt because I don't want to fly through the windshield. If I was a biker, I'd wear a helmet because I like my skull. I quit drinking because it wasn't good for me in many different ways. I eat lots of fast food and I eat it in my car. I use my cell phone in my car. My dog does have her rabies shots because she chases squirrels and I'm afraid she'll actually catch one some day.

I'm sorry to start a political thread. I know they are frowned upon here. But it was baseball related, at least for a while.

"What if?"

Would you answer a hypothetical question if I asked one?

Jimmy, are you asking me to answer the "what if" question?

Maybe if the Senators don't get their way, they'll come out and threaten MLB's anti-trust exemption.

I'm sorry, I just can't understand getting riled up over "What ifs" and "Maybe's"

Bottom line...No one has instituted action by the government or spent public money, yet the majority of posters are whining about the government getting involved.

quote:

yet the majority of posters are whining about the government getting involved.

That's because the majority of us would like to have congress as interested in balancing the budget and controlling spending as they are in other people chewing tobacco.

quote:

Originally posted by Tx-Husker:

quote:

yet the majority of posters are whining about the government getting involved.

That's because the majority of us would like to have congress as interested in balancing the budget and controlling spending as they are in other people chewing tobacco.

The point is, if one reads the story that started this thread, congress has done nothing to indicate controlling chewing tobacco. No action, no proposal, nada. Now tell me again, why intelligent people who can, presumably, read, continue to claim otherwise.

I love it when I get called stupid because I have a differing opinion.

I'll guess I'll just have to admit that I'm not that intelligent.

Just like all the people who thought Holliday was out on the double play in Game 3.

According to Joe Torre MLB is considering banning alcohol in clubhouses. His reason:

“If we do happen to bar alcohol from the clubhouses, you have to understand the intent of this thing and what it looks like,” Torre said. “We’re role models, or we should be role models for the youngsters and how they behave.”

Hmmm. Not a government official in sight. Say it ain't so. Old Joe's just a Grandstanding MLB Exec. I guess that other old standby "political correctness" will get the blame for this one. ;-)

Of course, old Joe says nothing about all the Budweiser ads on the Fox telecasts.

So lets summarize. MLB players ARE role models when it comes to beer consumed in the clubhouse, where nobody sees it. But they apparently ARE NOT role models when it comes to dipping, chewing, and spitting on the field, where everyone can see them?

I say let em dip and let em drink. THIS IS WHAT REALLY NEEDS TO BE BANNED. <TFIC>
http://arstechnica.com/science...agical-necklaces.ars