Harper taking poker lessons in Las Vegas?

Not even close. Check the stats from every college summer league and you will see the same thing. Not just the Cape.

Some elite college hitters are no longer elite once they put wood in their hands.

PA Dino- Did you ever play baseball?

quote:

Sorry about yet another one liner.

That's ok. We all do the best we can.

I'd still be interested in your answer to the question:

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I mean, don't you think a kid like Bryce Harper can make the adjustment to wood way easier than say, an average hitter from a mid major college team?

You can use a simple "Yes" or "No" if you don't want to write a complete "one liner."

And J H :

quote:

PA Dino- Did you ever play baseball?

I was an almost famous baseball player 30 years ago.

Well - so far - you aint doing so well. LOL

As for the question and answer session - I'll pass.

(Does this count as two one-liners or one two-liner?)

This is a true example of a poster not knowing what he is speaking about

Well I did have a little brain ****, as my comparison of the ACC to the SWAC was the NCAA SWAC (not the NJCAA SWAC). I was wondering why you would make such a random comparison, but the joke was on me.

At any rate, if you honestly think I should use different stats to make my point, then I'm kind of at a loss for words. Exactly what stats should I use other than the batting stats of elite college players using wood bats in the best summer league in the country? And it is true that the quality of pitching on the Cape is great, but that's also true of the hitters. Those guys are the best of the best, and team offensive stats are pretty bad compared to what those same guys do with aluminum in the spring.

Look if we could just get by the insinuations and short little quips about me not knowing what I'm talking about, and if I ever played the game or why I'd even consider thinking that 'cause it ain't even close.....maybe someone could actually carry on a meaningful debate with me. Or is it that I am not worthy of your efforts?

Does it make a difference that Harper played in the SWAC even though he used a wood bat? Would he have put up the numbers in DI College Baseball's best conference? Whatever you deem that conference to have been? Surely, you can render an opinion on Grandal's worthiness.

PADino

How can one debate with someone who is continually making erroneous statements

How can you compare ACC pitching to JUCO pitching?
You say you had a 100$ scholarship at a D-I program and then back off the statement of 100% deals at D-I.

Realize that you are speaking to many here who have been thru the process, myself included. Thus we sort of know the ropes==

PA Dino, glad you brought up Yasmani. He scores high when it comes to character. Here is a look back (scroll down the page) of two very talented kids.

Yasmani Grandal
Bryce Harper

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How can one debate with someone who is continually making erroneous statements

The essence of debate is using facts and logic to prove others statements are erroneous or at least inferior.

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How can you compare ACC pitching to JUCO pitching?

Someone should be able to compare or contrast the "talent" level of each group. If you have a database or scouting report on the pitchers Harper faced that would help. Certainly the MLB draft sheds some light on that.

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You say you had a 100$ scholarship at a D-I program and then back off the statement of 100% deals at D-I.

I don't understand where this came from...........I need some context here. Origin?

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Realize that you are speaking to many here who have been thru the process, myself included. Thus we sort of know the ropes==

PGSTAFF,

Thanks for the info.....Grandal was a better option for Golden Spikes Award for many reasons but two that come to mind are character and a longer track record. Harper was and is still too young. Getting a GED and going JUCO worked for him. I don't knock it. The award just devalued the college student/athlete. Basketball has it's one year and gone rule - this is baseball's answer.

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At any rate, if you honestly think I should use different stats to make my point, then I'm kind of at a loss for words. Exactly what stats should I use other than the batting stats of elite college players using wood bats in the best summer league in the country? And it is true that the quality of pitching on the Cape is great, but that's also true of the hitters. Those guys are the best of the best, and team offensive stats are pretty bad compared to what those same guys do with aluminum in the spring.

The simple reason why you can't use stats from the Cape to make the case that hitters, or a particular hitter like Harper would hit better with a metal bat is that you can't isolate the wood bat as a variable. As pointed out, the pitching is different and the parks are different. My personal thoughts are that the pitching faced on the Cape is a much bigger factor then the wood bats but I can't figure out how to eliminate other factors to figure out what % of the difference is due to the pitching or the bats.

JMO, but wood vs. aluminum is a big deal. The differences do drop off a bit as the players become acclimated to wood but it is still significant.

There's really no way to compare Harper's totals with a wood bat vs. inferior pitching to a top D1 hitter vs. generally much stronger pitching using aluminum. Too many variables. JMO, Harper's stats were very impressive but the award should still have gone to a D1 player even without the sportsmanship issues.

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Originally posted by 3rdgenerationnation:
My personal thoughts are that the pitching faced on the Cape is a much bigger factor then the wood bats but I can't figure out how to eliminate other factors to figure out what % of the difference is due to the pitching or the bats.

Lot depends on how the pitcher pitches, I know that son did much better in the cape against wood than in the ACC against metal. And he faced many of the same hitters in both venues. The Cape league defines the better pitching prospects against wood while it beats up on the better college hitters with metal.

I do beleive that it won't be hard for Harper to make the adjustent, the only dfference is he will be facing smarter pitchers (if placed above his level). That might be the struggle for a bit. As far as what seperates the elite hitters from the pack, is not always what they use but how they approach their game. JMO.

Yasmani (a D1 player) without a doubt deserved the award over Harper (a Juco player).

I listened to a major scout talk about Harper---says there are many holes in his swing and he felt it would take at least 5 years to get to the bigs

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Originally posted by TRhit:
I listened to a major scout talk about Harper---says there are many holes in his swing and he felt it would take at least 5 years to get to the bigs

So is that from a scout that had the second or third draft pick?

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Originally posted by TRhit:
I listened to a major scout talk about Harper---says there are many holes in his swing and he felt it would take at least 5 years to get to the bigs

I've also heard a number of scouts say that you'd be crazy to draft him as a catcher because his bat is so advanced and he would be ready in two or three years--that means he'd be 19 or 20. There are definitely a wide array of opinions on this guy.

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homerun04

It was before the draft---in fact prior to the draft the panel of three on MLB.tv gave their # 1 draft selections andnot one of them named him-

I found that very interesting

I guess that would make three of them wrong....they might want to stay away from Las Vegas because they would have lost a wager on who was going to be drafted 1st.

I think the panel was probably answering to "who would they draft 1st" not "who would be drafted 1st." Two different questions and none of them would draft Harper 1st if it was their choice.

Correct TR?

Harper signs for $9.9 million.

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Originally posted by Homerun04:
Harper signs for $9.9 million.

Just goes to show, those pitchers (e.g., Strasburg) get all the money Congrats to the young man!

We had two Clevelanders sign for a million or more this afternoon. Alex Lavisky got 1 million from the Indians and Stetson Allie got more than that from the Pirates.

You had to believe it was going to get done. Now the next debate will be how long will it take before he's up with the big club?

I was happy that the Dodgers were able to make a deal for the first rounder, Zach Lee. Everyone figured that they chose Lee because of his lack of signability due to his football prowess, and the marital/financial mess with Dodger ownership...thankfully everyone was wrong!

A couple of scouting reports on Harper stated that they feel he will have 40 HR power but may be around a .270 hitter type. I tend to agree--he may struggle with the average at times while adjusting but I think the power will always be there. That's still a very valuable player especially if he was to stay a catcher, but it sounds like that's not going to happen. I feel without the extra work it takes to become a ML catcher, he could reach the majors in about three years. Just my opinion, of course.

Heard Scott Boras says Harper is under paid? I did not listen to the whole reasoning, but I think a lot of folks would like this:

Bryce Harper, of, Nationals (No. 1 overall): The most hyped prospect in draft history signed a $9.9 million major league contract that includes a $6.25 million bonus. He broke Mark Teixeira's record for the largest guarantee ever given to a position player in the draft ($9.5 million from the Rangers in 2001), and Harper's contract and bonus are each tied for the third-largest ever.

Baseball America