Help me find thread about signing money

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I'd also PM TPM...she has some good insights...

44
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Thanks to O44 and to another poster who PM'd me. Will pass on any info I learn ....

I am too tired to look for the link.

I think that the player and his family need to look at last year's bonus' (first 10 rounds is available on PGcrosschecker and Baseball America, might be for a cost). A player needs to decide what it would take in $$ to go pro. The amount you see in signing bonus does not reflect federal taxes, state taxes, medicare and social security, or agency fees if they sign with an agent who has been advising the player before the draft. All teams are required by the IRS to take 25% (unless the bonus is under a certain amount) off the top. Any adjustments are made when one files taxes.

Do understand that whatever a player earns in season is usually gone by the end of season. Even though his room was free, mine ate most of his salary. For son, eating well is very important. If you need to cover car payments, insurance, cell phone bill, etc. with that money, it won't work unless you want to eat at McDonald's everyday. If you have gotten some decent money for signing, I feel it is important to put as much as you can away into savings and learn to live on a budget, perhaps a players parents are still willing to help if necessary. Many players work in the off season to help supplement their needs so they do not spend their signing bonus. I would imagine having some college experience or a degree, can make you more money than just out of HS.

I am not sure whatinfo you are looking for to pass on.

IMO, it's a personal preference. Just as important as getting a $$ bonus, the player needs to understand the system and how many years one may be in that system making the same salary.

Give me a shout if you have any questions.

Life changing money.

Don't sell yourself short.

There is a tremendous value to being an 18 year old on a college campus. Education, social life, and baseball.

How much would it take to forego those experiences?

One can assume every young man wants his crack at pro baseball. If you want to, choose a draft year, maybe 5 years ago, and do a where are they now ?

You may get some answers. Some are in MLB, some are in MILB, most are out of baseball. Did they go back to college ?

If a kid doesn't like school, then things change when dealing with the process.

Good, helpful comments. I will pass these on.

quote:

Originally posted by OLDSLUGGER8:

There is a tremendous value to being an 18 year old on a college campus. Education, social life, and baseball.

I think that a hs player should want nothing else but to go pro out of high school.. If there is any question whether he should go to college or pro he should go to college. Pro life is hard out of high school. There should be no doubt that this is what you want.

quote:

Originally posted by njbb:
I think that a hs player should want nothing else but to go pro out of high school.. If there is any question whether he should go to college or pro he should go to college. Pro life is hard out of high school. There should be no doubt that this is what you want.

not for a bag of peanuts

Assume you invested in a Rolex watch. Which one is easier to throw away, the new Rolex or the cheap one you just replaced ?

I want to re write what I wrote.....If a players decides to go pro out of high school its because he doesn't want to do anything else. If there is any question whether he should go to college or pro,he should go to college.Pro life is hard out of of high school. There should be no doubt that is what you want.

Slugger8,
You don't throw the baby out with the bath water. If your a prospect in your organization they don't release you because of your signing bonus.and you don't get to the bigs just because you got a bonus

It has been written, discussed, and mentioned many times. The more $$ they have invested in you, the more chances and opportunities are granted.

College baseball players basically get 8 weeks off. They get 4 weeks between semesters, and are required to continue their workouts off campus.

They get 4 weeks off between the end of summer ball and the start of Fall practice, but many workout or play to stay sharp to either retain or win a position.

You said "If a players decides to go pro out of high school its because he doesn't want to do anything else"

I read that as because he doesn't want to do anything else but play baseball.

The college player apparently plays 12 months straight in some form or fashion, so I guess they want to play baseball too.



So go to MILB for a cup of coffee. If after 2 years they toss you aside, then answer us this:

What you gonna do next ?

The following URLs aren't really responsive to Infield08's question, but they are perhaps useful. The first is a link to an excerpt of Bo Durkac's book. The excerpt speaks of the trade-offs of signing vs transferring from JC to 4 year college or staying for the senior year of college. I believe the book also talks about the trade-offs for a player coming out of high school, but that mostly isn't excerpted.

Bo Durkac--How to become a professional baseball player

The following link advocates a rule of thumb that the signing bonus for a HS player should exceed the sum of the value of 4 years of college plus one year's MLB minimum salary. I don't understand the rationale for that rule, but it does highlight the notion that a player who can command a high signing bonus can probably also command a free high end college education, and that college education costs a lot of money. I wonder if the typical contract that "pays for college after baseball" would cover the cost of attending a high end school?
Stuart Nachbar

"what you gonna do next?" Go to college,trade school, start a business,farm.
What if you flunk out of college what you gonna do next?
I find your statement "Unless a kid is a box of rocks,then pro ball out of high school should include $$$$ of significance," insulting.
Making a decision that YOU wouldn't make does not make someone stupid or their decision foolish.

Its not about the $ Its about being ready for pro life.
It doesn't matter if you sign for $ or $$$$ if there is any doubt in your mind about going pro then you better go to college. Life in the minors is hard for a kid out of high school.

quote:

Originally posted by 3FingeredGlove:

The following link advocates a rule of thumb that the signing bonus for a HS player should exceed the sum of the value of 4 years of college plus one year's MLB minimum salary.
Stuart Nachbar

Other than the HARD costs of attendance at a University, there is a value that needs to be assigned for the benefit to forego the college total experience, and that according to ECON 101 is the "opportunity cost".

I learned that in high school and PUBLIC college, not the IVY's.

It is a different assigned value unique to each individual. For some, it may be $5 million, and others, a bus ticket to the MILB assignment.

I saw a tape of Scott Boras talking to the Texas Aggie baseball team. He claimed that only 6% of the juniors in college who get drafted & signed, ever finish college. Geez, what are they they gonna do?

quote:

Originally posted by Infield08:
A friend's son is a talented '08 pitcher who is trying to decide whether to play college ball or go pro. I seem to recall a thread (or perhaps an article?) that talks about how fast signing money can dwindle, once taxes have been paid and funds are used to supplement a player's meager minor league salary (assuming he's not taken in the first 2 rounds). Can anyone provide a link for me to pass on? Thanks!

Its good to speculate but theres no choice unless he is draft

quote:

Its good to speculate but there's no choice unless he is drafted

True. However, it's very probable that this player will be drafted and it's helpful to read everyone's perspectives in advance of it happening. I'm sure these HSBBW comments will facilitate some productive dialogue betweeen the parents and the son.

infield08,
There are many players who probably could or should have been drafted but aren't. No one knows what is going to happen until draft day.

IMO, a lot depends on the players performance this spring and his signability (willingness to commit to going pro vs. going to college).

quote:

It has been written, discussed, and mentioned many times. The more $$ they have invested in you, the more chances and opportunities are granted

Again, the more chances you get to fail. If you have tools and talent you will get just as many chances to succeed no matter what the bonus is.

So many loose site of the fact that 85% of the drafted players are drafted so the prospects have someone to play with and against. Everyone is not a top round draft pick and then others have not developed their abilities.

If you can play you will play no matter the bonus. But it always boils down to 3 things. SKILL, GAME AWARENESS, MAKEUP.

On another note. I found it interesting that College Baseball coaches met with Pro Baseball and said that Agents are becoming a real issue. They mentioned that agents and players/ families are becoming so close that it is even affecting the college coaches and how they run their programs.

The NCAA has agreed to step in as long as college coaches and pro people will make them aware of situations.

Better beware of having an "advisor" the % of players loosing elgibility will be greater.

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuilder:


If you can play you will play no matter the bonus. But it always boils down to 3 things. SKILL, GAME AWARENESS, MAKEUP.

AGREE

A former MLB player said this in an article.

"I've always been in favor of players getting all they can. Sure, the money is great, but that big bonus also forces an organization to give a high pick every opportunity to succeed. It doesn't mean he will, of course. "

NCAA does not like "advisors" because of their competence. For example, the NCAA will not like an advisor who advises an individual to forego college baseball and enter the draft, even if it is in the player's best interest. Additionally, the NCAA will not like an advisor who may have inside information as to a college coach's recruiting practices. For example a college coach may have a reputation of guaranteeing a starting spot to a recruit, but then changing his mind. The NCAA seems to discourage an athlete from being equipped with information necessary to make a truly informed decision.

If an agent truly believes in his profession he will act competently. Playing Div. I baseball is an honor, not a privilege. However, the NCAA is a business, and like all business they too have their competition. Here, their business is baseball and their competition is MLB. Unlike MLB, there is no union to interfere with their draconian rules of what constitutes amateurism (one which merits its own post for discussion. Consider the following: A college coach is similar to a college professor in that they both work for the school. A college coach similar to a college professor must produce. For the college coach this means winning. For a college professor this means publishing. Both the college coach and the college professor have something in common, the possibile exploitation of the student. A college coach recruits a player to make his teamn better. The better the player the better the team. However, who takes credit for the program, the coach or the athlete? The college professor employs smart students to do research. The smarter the student the better the research. However, who gets credit for the publication, the professor or the student?

The only difference between a professional and an amateur is credit and pay. I submit that the amateur gets neither. So why does the NCAA discourage athletes from obtaining advisors?
Because maybe, the advice is good for the athlete and bad for their business.

its an honor and not a priviledge, most definitely wisdom! The name fits "NEWAGENT"

Its an honor, yet its not a priviledge. Going to college is a priviledge for making good grads in HS. Playing college baseball is a priviledge for being a good HS player. Helping Mom and Dad with "some" scholarship help is really an honor.

The NCAA didn't go to MLB. The college coaches did.

Newagent,
I read your post over 3 times and not sure I am really understanding what you are saying.

As pointed out to me, there is a big difference between an advisor and an advisor/agent.

An advisor can charge an amateur a fee for his services as long as he is not a professional sports agent. Advisors take lots of money from players folks with claims that he has tons of contacts and sometimes promises college scholarships from those contacts. No wonder college coaches don't like them! He also might help in the decision process as to playing college ball vs. going professional. You really can't advise anyone on that unless they have those options and unless you are in the business that deals with MLB on a daily basis. JMO.

Someone told told me she was willing to pay another parent 1500 because his son obtained a good scholarship and he could "advise" them in the process? Also, people get really upset when their advisor/agent tells them their son will most likley be drafted come june. How do they know that in advance? That's crazy stuff.

I was always under the impression that MLB doesn't like advisors/agents when dealing with those heading to college . I was always under the impression that college coaches don't like advisors/agents because many prey on the recruit or college student who may be drafted for no reason other than his own benefit? So I am confused as to the point of your post.

If an advisor/agent came into our home with that NCAA mumble jumbo he would out the door asap.

I agree it is a priveledge to go to college and play college boy and to be drafted, but not sure where honor fits into the equation.

BTW, you don't have to be an advisor to know about coaches recruiting practices. JMO.

TPM:
I am sorry you had to read my post three times, that means my explanation was flawed. With that said, I want to address the points you made.

First: The message I wanted to convey is that the NCAA does not want high school baseball players going pro. This is because they skip college and therefore prevent both the NCAA and the college from making a profit off of their services.

Second: ADVISORS SHOULD NOT CHARGE FOR THEIR SERVICES!!! If you pay for an advisor, that is your fault for not doing the research! In fact paying an advisor can raise high school and college eligibility (Remember Bryan Bass)

Third: Your assertion that MLB does not like "advisor/agents when dealing with those heading to college" is absolutely correct. Tis is because of the NCAA regulations and also the uncomfrtable predicament it puts the MLB clubs in. Remember, once the athlete goes to college, he goes to college. Since the NCAA strictly prohibits communication between eligible athletes and professional sports teams, communication between an athlete and advisor is both tedious and futile.

Fourth: Whether you would welcome an agent/advisor who provides you with all the options is certainly your decesion. However, I must be candid with you. A player just like an agent must be selective about those he represents. As an attorney, I used to work in the public sector as a public defender. In those instances I was unable to pick and chose who I represented. However, I am no longer in the public sector. Therefore, I can pick and chose who I represent. With all due respect, if someone with your similar views sought my services, I would in all liklihood decline representation. After all, how do you advise a man who has all the answers?

quote:

Originally posted by newagent:
TPM;

First: The message I wanted to convey is that the NCAA does not want high school baseball players going pro.
Thanks for that message, I do think that is pretty much a given.



Second: ADVISORS SHOULD NOT CHARGE FOR THEIR SERVICES!!! If you pay for an advisor, that is your fault for not doing the research! In fact paying an advisor can raise high school and college eligibility (Remember Bryan Bass)

A player can pay an advisor as long as he is not a registered advisor/agent with MLBPLA. Correct me if I am wrong.

Third: Since the NCAA strictly prohibits communication between eligible athletes and professional sports teams, communication between an athlete and advisor is both tedious and futile.
If that is true, why do college coaches have scout days? As far as I know, professional sports agents have to register with the the school? Professional scouts were always welcome on son's campus, coaches just prefer that they do not bother players during season to complicate matters. I found that most scouts really did respect that request. I always got the impression that their (college coaches) beef was with advisors/agents hanging around only because many tell the players they are going to get drafted and need advice and repersentation.

Fourth: Whether you would welcome an agent/advisor who provides you with all the options is certainly your decesion. However, I must be candid with you. A player just like an agent must be selective about those he represents. As an attorney, I used to work in the public sector as a public defender. In those instances I was unable to pick and chose who I represented. However, I am no longer in the public sector. Therefore, I can pick and chose who I represent. With all due respect, if someone with your similar views sought my services, I would in all liklihood decline representation. After all, how do you advise a man who has all the answers?

Personally I would prefer someone to advise regarding going pro afterwards with someone who is somewhat experienced agent with experience who has gone through arbitration and negotiated MLB contracts. One does not need (unless you have lots of options on the line regarding signing a MLB contract vs. a minor league contract) an advisor/agent to sign a minor league contract and take 4%, it's standard for everyone. Also, as a college recruit, I do not wish anyone to speak on my player's behalf, we all know that could jeopardize their eligibilty, I think that is why the NCAA doesn't care for them. That information is available and printed in the NCAA guide to recruiting, given to all who register with the Clearing house. A player should never ever sign with an agent until he has played one full season of pro ball. If his contract is declared null and void, whatever options he has left (maybe not D1)he has exhausted if he signs with an agent. JMO.

I like scouts I have always found them to be professional and done their job well.

I didn't like most advisor/agents we met and understand why college coaches and the NCAA doesn't either.

JMO

This is my final word on the topic:

First: If it is pretty much a given, then why did it take you three times to read?

Second:
This is America, you can pay anybody for anything. (Ever watch entourage). If you want to waste your money paying someone to provide you with unverified reassurances about your son's ability then go ahead. What is this registered MLBPA/Agent exception that you write of. Florida Stat, 468.454 addresses both the Athlete Agent and the issue of eligibility, and no such exception exists.

Third:
Scout days are regualted by both the NCAA and the college. I assumed someone as knowledgable as yourself understood what I meant. COACHES DO NOT WANT TO LOSE PLAYERS TO PROFESSIONAL BASEBALL TEAMS. Agents do not bother or complicate this processs. In fact, good agents expecite it. I do agree with your concern however, as to the agent's misrepresentation as to draft status. However, this is just an example of how the draft is similar to the five day forecast. It is always subject to change due to many variables.

Fourth:
If you are so anti-agent/advisor, then why would you want an "experienced" one? According to your own rationale, an experienced agent would require that he bother college players and complicate matters. I must confess, if that is the case, then I lack the requisite experience. I also take exception to your statement that one does not need (unless you have lots of options on the line regarding signing a MLB contract vs. a minor league contract) an advisor/agent to sign a minor league contract and take 4%, it's standard for everyone. Whether major or minor league contract, it is one conerning employment therefore some terms are negotiable. For instance you can negotiate for payment of college tuition with professional baseball teams. Second, 4% maybe standard for someone you know, but not all agents. I personally know an agent who takes less. One reason you do not wish anyone to speak on your player's behalf, is because it could jeopardize their eligibilty. You also don't want an agent to speak to a player because of your concern about being the recruiter who can only find players prone to jump ship after their sophmore year.

In all a player should be informed. Each player is different and so too are their options. Without knowing the entire situation, I do not pretend to have the answer. I gues that is where you and I part ways.

Quite frankly your dislike for advisor/agents is quite apparent, and I can respect and understand your opinion. However, you and I have something in common, we seek to protect the athlete from exploitation. Again, our disagreement stems from your unwillingness to except the fact that only agents seek to exploit the athlete. Most agents are not regulated. Therefore, the athlete has no where to turn. However, should I exploit the athlete, it could cost my license. And I can assure this: There is no talent in this world worth the risk of my bar card.

The NCAA doesn't care if a player goes to college or signs a pro contract.

The NCAA does care about an agent/ advisor becoming a 3rd party to a player and his family. Thats why there is a rule in place against them.

College coaches want their players to sign. They had a hand in the "sign after your Jr season" rule. What they don't like is an agent/ advisor affecting how they coach their team. That is becoming more and more the case in college baseball. The college coaches have asked MLB to help with this problem.

An agent/ advisor is defined as anyone representing a player BEFORE the draft by calling any professional team or its representatives on the players behalf. That would cost a player his elgibility and the NCAA could make the team forfiet games he played in.

The college coach and the scout are more than enough to educate both the player and the parents. Both should be given all the respect in the world.

You first posted the word "advisors". There are many people who are advisors who also advise and should not in the pro process. I am talking about those "advisors". They can skirt around the rules because they are not licensed agents. They get their money by being college advisors only which is legal. I just wanted to make those that are not aware of that, aware. Can you just see a parent reading this who used a college advisor begin to panic because they paid them a 2500 fee?
If you were speaking about agents who advise then there are different rules, we know that. They are agents period. This was pointed out to me by a scout here on the HSBBW. So therefore a player should NOT pay for an agent before he goes pro. I am in agreement.

You said that the NCAA prohibits contact between eligible athletes and professional sports teams. I was just wondering if that was true why are there scout days, or why do scouts hang out at summer leagues summer and speak to players if not allowed? I just wanted to point that out that it is regulated on the college campus by the NCAA. If not could you imagine what might go on? As a parent of an NCAA player, I was very happy they have rules like that. In HS parents have the option to control what goes on, you can't do that at college, so I am glad someone is minding teh store. You made it sound like it is a very bad thing to control the situation.

My son has an experienced agent who advised him and he never bothered him. Neither did any scouts. The way I see it, bothering and distracting that player only complicates his playing ability. Any advisor or scout that is on the players case 24/7 would be doing the player a great disservice as the player needs to concentrate on one thing, the game and his performance for the up coming draft. And if college coaches don't like scouts, how come I saw college coaches speaking to them often? Actually that college coach who has been developing that player TO BE drafted wants to make sure that he does talk to the scout as not to get misinformation and sperak to him regarding his progress. That was teh case for son. I don't see that as not wanting his player to be drafted. I don't think my son could have achieved what he did without that help.

What is negotiable in the basic milb contract? There is not much to negotiate, addendums do change that however, you didn't mention that. Yes, you can negotate the money they will award you for scholarship. You can negotiate when the signing bonus will be paid out and yes you can negotiate the signing bonus if you have leverage to do so and a few more things, MAYBE. IMO that should be a given for an agent, after all his job is to help the player he chooses (as you put it) in the pro process to eventually make the MLB level, that is when he makes the buckos. However many agents do need part of that signing bonus to pay THEIR bills regardless of what role they played in the process. Many of them do not even represent ONE MLB player, they MUST get a fee to survive.

I do agree that 4% is not always the case. But it has become the norm. But does a player have to pay an agent to sign something that is being given to him? My son's agent (who my son adores and we do to), was not interested in his signing bonus, he pretty much feels son earned on his own. A fee was presented and that fee covers negotiations he has made for card signings and equipment deals, etc. It also covers income tax preparation. That fee is not a yearly fee, but a fee he paid for his services until he reaches either MLB or the 40 man (can't remember). I would assume that is what is done and what should be done.

You are correct on being educated, it is very important that a prospect considering having an agent advise them to do their HOMEWORK! And very important to be educated in the college vs pro process. Trust is most important.

Why don't you educate those on how some agents are not regulated? That's the purpose here.

Swingbuilder:

1. I disagree. If the NCAA does not care, then why have regulations? By having regulations they do care.

2. I see an increasing trend of athletes employing friends to act as their financial advisor. So far I have fired two clients and refused to take a third due to third party interference. An agent is nothing compared to the athlete's best friend from Junior High School. The Florida Bar says I am competent to create trusts on a client's behalf. I believe otherwise at this time, however not for long. For this reason I refer clients to attorneys who I know possess the competence to handle these matters.

3. What if the player is better at left field than right, what if the coach wants to move the shortstop to second even though the "scout" said the "pro team" would only draft him as a shortstop. .

4. Your definition of Athlete Agent is different from the Florida Statutes. With all due respect, I will defer to Florida Legislature (at least I will this time. I admire and respect both the NCAA and the role a coach. However respect is earned and not demanded. I encourage you to further look into this issue. As I am confident that if you were truly informed you would be just as concerned about the college coach and scout as you are with the agent. I do not know which is more dangerous your negative views of all agents or positive views of all scouts and college coaches

5. I am sure that you would have no problem with SFX if they delivered a 7 figure signing bonus for your son. In fact, you would not even dignify my comments with a response as you would be upgrading whatever it is you need upgraded. SFX is a multimillion dollar business for a reason. Whether you agree with their tactics or not they produce. If you don't like their product, then walk away.

I chose to register on this webiste because of a geniuine interest in what athletes and their parents have to say. My motives are altrusitic and not financial. I want to answer any questions you have. However, I also believe in the bottom line and therefore do not mince my words. Part of the problem stems from parents and their unreasonable expectations. Other concerns of mine include parents' constant denial over their son's ability or lack thereof, the recruiter who promises the high school student that he will start at shortstop, bat cleanup and play as a true freshmen yet relegates him to water boy, or the agent who constantly knows where the line is just so he can cross. All of these individuals contribute to the dysfunctional profession we call baseball. I have represented convicted felons with more honor and integrity then some of the above mentioned individuals. I view my job as simple, get the kid a spot on the team. Right now my client base is small, but my work ethic is strong.

TPM:

I will start with your last sentence becuase that I can do. However agents are not regulated, and therfore I will tell you what I do.

As for payment, I only receive payment when the player does. I also see a disturning trend concerning the agent/advisor, and that is the role of financial planner. Please note that how you accumulate the money can directly affect where you land in the tax bracket. For this reason I strongly (by strongly I mean metaphorically grab you by the neck) advise seeking assistant from a licensed estate plnner. Ususally an attorney and/or accountant. Any person rendering such advice as to these matters who is not licensed to do so, should cease and desist, preferably immediately as it could subject them to unauthorized practice of law (a felony in Florida).

What is negotiable in the basic milb contract? Hotel rooms, (roomate or no roomate), airfare for the family to watch you play, HEALTH INSURANCE AND/OR LONG TERM DISABILITY. A promise not to play a sport (was your son recruited to play another sport).

Does a player have to pay an agent to sign something that is being given to him?

No, but I do, three percent. I charge 3% for every deal I negotiate. No more, no less. However, for independent league contracts I will ususally waive the fee altogether and get nothing, because the pay is not that high. Some agents, mainly lawyers may charge an hourly rate to do the contract. I charge 3% of the gross. I have no doubt that your son's agent is competent. As for his income tax preparation so what? Does he do trusts? Can he minimize or defer taxtion on the payments. Can he set up accounts that will accrue interest so that when your son retires he can live off the interest and not the principal. Doing taxes is simple, properly investing your money takes some skill. Maybe the agent does, in any event, I would ask him. I hope this helps nd best of luck.

newagent,
I have a question, why did you state in another thread that if it is the goal of the NCAA is to prepare student athletes to be professionals, why do they keep agents away (think that was the thought).

Where does it say that the NCAA's job is to prepare a student athlete for a pro career? That's just what the NCAA does not want. That's what schools want. One role of the NCAA is to PROTECT the student athlete from being exploited by professionals (even though they don't always practice what they preach). Yeah, yeah they make tons of money off of our athletes, it's not a perfect system, I agree.

They did however give my son a larger stage to perform on and that wash his choice and he loved every nminute of it.

Why so down on the NCAA?

First: I wrote playing major league baseball is an honor and not a privilege. What I meant to write is that playing Div. I baseball is a privilege not a right. My bad.

Second:

Your question as to Where it says that the NCAA's job is to prepare a student athlete for a pro career is inferred in 2.2 The Principle of Student Athlete Well Bbeing. Specifically, 2.2.1 Overall Educational Experience.

As for your son receiving a larger stage to perform on...I represent some clients who will play baseball anywhere regardless of the stage.

Why so down on the NCAA?

You already answered the question They make tons of money off their athletes. Further, baseball is a full time job. Therefore if you go to a good school you have to sacrifice the opportunity to get a good education. Why because once must study to get good grades. But if one plays baseball at a school, they need only satisfy minimal academic requirements. After all, Allen Iverson was not recruited to Georgetown for his academic exploits. And Georgetown is a difficult school academically, yet he managed to survive academically for two years. What is my problem with NCAA? Aluminum bats and inflated numbers for starters.

SW,
I definetly agree with your statement, however if a player never did give the agent that authority to do as such and the agent took that upon his own, the player is not the one who would be at fault.

Same way if a college coach made a phone call and spoke to the recruit during a period when he can't or went to his home. That falls on the responsibility of the coach to follow not the player.

I see situations where scouts request that players be moved to evaluate them in certain positions. So why place sole blame on agents for this?

I would assume any agent would advise that a player seek an independant financial advisor to do his finances, not himself, that is a conflict of interst. Many agencies have lawyers to read contracts, trusts and accountants,probably financial people. A one man agent should send his clients to those who can do that? If a client wants to hire a friend who is licensed to handle his affairs, why not? However, I don't really agree that friends or family should do that.

My son went to school played baseball and maintained an honor roll GPA. Tons of athletes do that. It's not easy but it's doable. That's where the baseball player has to decide when making a choice where to attend school. You can't blame that on the NCAA. What about David Price or Andrew Miller, they went to fine schools and didn't seem to sacrifice their education. I just read where David Price went back to school this fall to finish up on his degree. A good example that even achieving #1 draft choice, he wasn't going to sacrifice his education. Where did the NCAA hurt him? Actually this APR stuff comes a bit too late, IMO. The NCAA let schools take care of thier own business and some didn't care much if their bb players maintained the proper GPA and stayed on task, let coaches cut and over recruit or if they graduated, so the NCAA had to step in. Maybe my presumtion on that is wrong.
There are many parents here whose sons went to college, earned their degrees and drafted and play pro ball. Quite a few who were drafted out of HS.

I do realize that college players will play anywhere I was bringing up a point that if son was exploited, he did get what he wanted from them too. It works both ways.

All milb players get health insurance, long term disability? Is asking for my airfare negotiable in a milb contract? Your own hotel room?

If these things are negotiable will that help in the player's future as a player?

First, check with your agent and see if he receives a refferal fee from the attorney.

Second, responsibility goes both ways. If a coach enters your home without your permission, not only does that violate NCAA rules on recruiting but also may be a burglary. Now if you let that coach, scout, or runner in and offer him a cup of coffee, you consent to their impropriety. Or at the very least, the appearance of it. The analogy I use is this: If someone sells drugs to someone, then both parties are guilty of a crime. The drug dealer for selling/possession the drug using for purchasing/possession. Putting aside our ideological views on the war on drugs, both parties are "responsible." The NCAA similar to state stautes find all parties involved guilty of wrong doing. With that said, if someone is doing something wrong, do not invite them in, walk away.

My comment about player positions was directed towards swingbuilder, who refuses to believe that a college coach woul act contrary to a student's best interest.

First, you are correct that any agent would advise that a player seek an independant financial advisor to do his finances. However, some agents get refferal fees. Therefore, they might reccommend someone they can obtain a fee from as opposed to someone who knows that non-lawyer refferral fees at least in the state of Florida is prohibited. As for conflict of interest, that can and is often waived. (depending upon the situation).

A one man agent should know his limits and exercise discretion determining what he can and can not handle. While I believe all agents know their limits, not all of them exercise their discretion.

If a client wants to hire a friend who is licensed to handle his affairs, why not? Licensed is a different scenario, how many of their friends are licensed to handle their legal affairs or accounting matters? I am willing to bet not many.

Since I do not know your son or what school he went to, I refrain from making assertions about him. However, many students who play Div. I sports have tudors and proxies. Further from my understanding, in order for a college to remain accredited, they must require attendance at ___% of classes. Guess who falls outside this requirement? I don't blame the NCAA for making kids go to college, I blame the NCAA for requiring the kids to work for free or less than minimum wage. David Price and Andrew Miller are anecdotal exceptions and as you know, not the norm. By the way, what is a #1 draft pick going to do after baseball? Is he going he going to be the next CEO? No, but can he live confortably for the rest of his life without ever having to worry about getting a job just on his signing bonus' interest? Absolutely!

Finally, everything is negotiable. Wy ask for airfare? Simple, we are still dealing with kids and every kid gets homesick. Mom and Dad should be able to fly out and see their son, should they not? However, why should they have to pay for it. Finally, why negotiate a single hotel room. Because some players party all night while others want their rest. With your own room, you need not worry. Again, I hope this helps and I really do wish you and your family the best.

I think parents here should beaware of "NewAgents" agenda here. He is using this site for potential clients.

Which would be a violation of NCAA Rules. The NCAA is cracking down on the advisor/agent situation and that will be policed by college coaches. Beware!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by swingbuilder:
I think parents here should beaware of "NewAgents" agenda here. He is using this site for potential clients.[QUOTE]

I am not sure either what the agenda is. First it was bashing the NCAA,coaches and then agents. I don't get the bringing up negotiating parents paid airfare or own room either, that is not why a player signs or doesn't sign a pro contract and needs to pay anyone for that advice. If being homesick is an issue, all kids leaving home for the first time are homesick, maybe college may be a better option first.

I am not a scout or agent, but I can give advice. When seeking help in making a choice and deciding to use that person's services later, I would keep in mind, what can you do for me later, not what can you do for me now, regardless of any fees involved. And to make sure that person has yuor son's best interests in mind, not his. JMO.


Newagent,
Thanks for the advice, not really needed.

First:

I AM NOT THIS WEBSITE TO FISH FOR POTENTIAL CLIENTS. I can assure you that if this was my agenda, my name would be more discrere than NEWAGENT. For instance, I would use something less descriptive and more vague such as TPM (an admitted recruiter) or Swingbuilder.


So what are my motives:

My screenname describes what I am, a newly licensed agent. My agenda is to provide straight answers to your questions and concerns, not "steal" or "fish" for potential clients.

What I bring to this forum is a fresh perspective concerning players, coaches, recruiters agents and yes the NCAA.

Swingbuilder, your smug responses to my postings have caught me off guard. If you knew me, I am sure you would see that we have more in common than not. I do respect your guarded comments towards me. However, your accusations concerning my attempts to recruit are as false as they are insulting. Florida is a hotbed for unchecked recruiting violations, both in high school and college. You can blame the agent all you want, but they are just one cog in the inherently defective business of professional baseball. With that said, agenda is the same as yours, to learn and educate. Unlike some, I charge no fee, nor require any signature on a contract. All I ask is that you provide me with the same respect that you provide all of the other bloggers.

TPM:
I am not soliciting clients. I told you that already. My opinions about thye NCAA are no different then Mark Cuban. I am not bashiing the NCAA. In fact, I admire the NCAA's successful business enterprise. I just want them to adequately compensate those that contribute to their success. While full tuition is great, I think they can do more. By more I mean pay more.

Further, my comments about what is negotiable in the MILB contract was in direct response to your January 21, 2008 posting. Remember you asked what is negotiable in the basic MILB contract? Well, you are correct, you are not a scout or agent. Instead you are a parent and a recruiter. Just because you are free to give advice, does not mean I am captive to agree. Nor does my disagreement with your advice translate into my desire to solicit athletes. For some reason there are many people who are incapable of answering: "I don't know," or "I will have to look into that" when asked a question. I however, am not ashamed to do so. With that said, I just want to learn. And therefore, that is my agenda.

Are you registered with MLB as an agent?

No because I do not represent any players on the 40 man roster. MLB requires that an agent represent a player on the 40 man roster. However, I am registered as an Athlete Agent in Florida