Here we go again FB velocity CWS

Nonamedad posted:

I’m just relaying what I saw, we can all make judgments and have opinions on what we saw... clearly 2 people can watch the same event and come away with 2 different thoughts. 

I have no idea who the #3 starter on Ohio St is and I didn’t watch all the games, BUT I certainly saw mid 80s as the most common velo in the games I watched. Thats all I’m saying.

Tough to say. Ohio St was on their third high scoring game so pitching was most likely at a premium. That being said I also saw two lefties from the Buckeyes at 94 as well so it's a mixed bag. 

On that same note, Ohio State barely made the Big 10 tournament. They were in 10th place heading into the final weekend. Not exactly an NCAA tournament team, just caught fire and earned the auto bid. But yes, I've seen plenty of 88. And 84 in a winners bracket game. A lot of it depends on the conference that you're coming from. The idea that you have to throw 90 to play D1 ball isn't true. But 87 in college is much different than a max 87 in HS. 87 in college actually means 87. 87 in HS usually means 87 in the early innings and 82 in the 6th. 

 At all levels of college play there is both good and bad baseball.  The difference between the upper and lower end of the spectrum is pretty big in any classification. At the D1 level there are both very good and pretty bad teams. Same is true for D2, D3, NAIA & all levels of JUCO. Every D1 conference gets an automatic bid to the NCAA tournament.  The champions of the weakest D1 conferences are often not very good in comparison to the rest of the field.  You can pitch on some teams in the SWAC throwing 84-87.  But I see no value in playing in a low level conference just so someone can claim that you play D1 baseball.  Just my opinion.  If there is a pitcher on a good D1 tournament team that is under 90 there is something special about him. That fact tends to get overlooked on this board. 

adbono posted:

 If there is a pitcher on a good D1 tournament team that is under 90 there is something special about him.

I wouldn't go that far.  Many sub 90s are hurt, recovering, dual-position, switched from 3/4 to sidearm, or they have to throw curves since their FB didn't develop or was flat.

Brother in law said mine was mostly 92-93 last night according to the TV broadcast.  I was at the game so I could not verify.  Velos were not being posted on the video screen at the stadium.  That is down a little from what I would normally expect.

adbono posted:

 But I see no value in playing in a low level conference just so someone can claim that you play D1 baseball.  Just my opinion. 

They still offer scholarships and an education. You're going to have a hard time convincing me that taking a 40% discount on a degree and a few more years of baseball is a bad idea. 

Many of the low level D1’s only have six scholarships to divide up. A lot of the players aren’t receiving baseball money. So then it comes down to is it the right place academically. 

In the past I talked to several NESCAC parents whose kids had lower level D1 offers. But the kids knew they were unlikely to go past college ball. So they took the best academic route and played D3 ball.

Sure, if the options are Whatsamattah U in D1 or Bumblefart State in D3 you go D1 if you can compete at the D1 level.

i can’t imagine passing up the best academic opportunity just to claim playing D1 ball. A lot of NESCAC (and similar) graduates end up in the same Wall Street firms and grad schools as Ivy graduates. 

PABaseball posted:

adbono posted:

 But I see no value in playing in a low level conference just so someone can claim that you play D1 baseball.  Just my opinion. 

They still offer scholarships and an education. You're going to have a hard time convincing me that taking a 40% discount on a degree and a few more years of baseball is a bad idea. 

That is not the point. 

PAC12 not having the greatest tournament, but it had the best first day of the draft:

https://twitter.com/Brian_Clem.../1135766199055376384

When you factor in that the PAC12 had 2 of the first 3 picks, and only has 11 baseball programs.

RJM posted:

Many of the low level D1’s only have six scholarships to divide up. A lot of the players aren’t receiving baseball money. So then it comes down to is it the right place academically. 

In the past I talked to several NESCAC parents whose kids had lower level D1 offers. But the kids knew they were unlikely to go past college ball. So they took the best academic route and played D3 ball.

Sure, if the options are Whatsamattah U in D1 or Bumblefart State in D3 you go D1 if you can compete at the D1 level.

i can’t imagine passing up the best academic opportunity just to claim playing D1 ball. A lot of NESCAC (and similar) graduates end up in the same Wall Street firms and grad schools as Ivy graduates. 

I agree, but when you look at the tuition for the NESCACs you might reconsider and take that D1 offer, even if no money is included. 

I also don't think many students who can get into a NESCAC or other HA type would even consider a Niagara, St. Peter's, UMBC type school even with baseball in the picture. 

It should all be based on the best school/sport opportunity. After a certain threshold-the best education you can afford. 

adbono posted:

 ... But I see no value in playing in a low level conference just so someone can claim that you play D1 baseball.  Just my opinion.  If there is a pitcher on a good D1 tournament team that is under 90 there is something special about him. That fact tends to get overlooked on this board. 

What if you are playing in a low level conference not so that you can claim you played D1 baseball...what if you are playing to get a discount on college, get a good education, and continue playing baseball.  Conversely, some could say that someone attending a college that has a median SAT of less than 1400 is wasting his time when graduates of top schools make a multiple of the minimum MLB salary well into their 50s.

RJM posted:

Many of the low level D1’s only have six scholarships to divide up. A lot of the players aren’t receiving baseball money. So then it comes down to is it the right place academically. 

In the past I talked to several NESCAC parents whose kids had lower level D1 offers. But the kids knew they were unlikely to go past college ball. So they took the best academic route and played D3 ball.

Sure, if the options are Whatsamattah U in D1 or Bumblefart State in D3 you go D1 if you can compete at the D1 level.

i can’t imagine passing up the best academic opportunity just to claim playing D1 ball. A lot of NESCAC (and similar) graduates end up in the same Wall Street firms and grad schools as Ivy graduates. 

Ah....Wall St firms. Now there is a group of institutions one should aspire to work for. A fine, honest, hard working group of people if there ever was one. 

Nonamedad posted:

RJM posted:

Many of the low level D1’s only have six scholarships to divide up. A lot of the players aren’t receiving baseball money. So then it comes down to is it the right place academically. 

In the past I talked to several NESCAC parents whose kids had lower level D1 offers. But the kids knew they were unlikely to go past college ball. So they took the best academic route and played D3 ball.

Sure, if the options are Whatsamattah U in D1 or Bumblefart State in D3 you go D1 if you can compete at the D1 level.

i can’t imagine passing up the best academic opportunity just to claim playing D1 ball. A lot of NESCAC (and similar) graduates end up in the same Wall Street firms and grad schools as Ivy graduates. 

Ah....Wall St firms. Now there is a group of institutions one should aspire to work for. A fine, honest, hard working group of people if there ever was one. 

Most people on Wall Street they are fine, honest, hard working people. These people don’t make the news. Do you stuff your money in a mattress?

in any profession there are bad people. But corrupt rarely works in the long run. The way to become successful is develop a reputation where both the seller and the buyer win. It brings a positive reputation and referrals roll in.

I always told sales people don’t develop a reputation you could sell ice cubes to Eskimos. No one wins in the long run. 

I bet most of those 86 mph pitcher can one dial up to 90 in a showcase but in college they need to throw strikes and make it through 5-6 innings. Doesnt help to throw 91 to the backstop or be gassed after 2 innings.

Btw I read an article that it is good for injury prevention in mlb if you sit 3-4  mph under your max (only dial it up a couple times  a game in a tight spot) and not throw within 1-2 mph of your max all the time.

For example verlander sits like 93-94 but can throw 98 he has to. Of course it helps if your max is a hundo, if you max at 87 and you cruise 84 you might not be very effective.

Did anyone else notice that a LHP that Creighton brought in against UCLA the other night had a max velo of 78 during the game?  I dont know if ESPN gun was off but they did mention he was only throwing sliders and breaking balls, but that still seems very low.  Of course he only lasted 12 pitches and was hit pretty hard.  Just thought it was really an outlier with all the upper 80 - low 90 readings in the various games.

I watched a lot of those regional games. I thought the velo was on par with what I have seen in the past.

I attended D3 regional a couple of weekends ago. On Friday a kid throwing 80 with great command threw a great game to upset a top ranked team. Unbelievably, he started again on Sunday. Whether I agree or not (not) I’m sure the strategy was to go as far as possible due to lack of depth on the pitching staff. 

Had I been a college kid playing I could have used one of my old favorite rags on pitchers. “ Wipe the damn ball off. Flies are landing on it on the way to the plate.” The kid was fatigued. He had to be 70-75. Let’s just say on Sunday he ruined his weekend stat line.

The yearly tradition of exposing the snooty baseball crowd. The whole "everyone throws 95" thing is a joke. 50/50 shot they touch 90 in a game; and even the good teams seemingly only have 1 or 2 that can tickle 95. As evidenced by the PG rankings of many top draft picks, none of the colleges nor scouts have a clue what they're doing. Just going off of reputation. The whole youth baseball scene is 90% sizzle 10% steak.

For all the years I’ve been on this board I’ve never seen anyone post every pitcher throws 95. For the most part if a pitcher doesn’t max 90 in a showcase he’s not going D1. Are there some exceptions? Sure. But in mid season form most pitchers on top fifty teams are cruising 90. The post season is not the mid season. Quinnipiac is not a top fifty program. 

RJM posted:

For all the years I’ve been on this board I’ve never seen anyone post every pitcher throws 95. For the most part if a pitcher doesn’t max 90 in a showcase he’s not going D1. Are there some exceptions? Sure. But in mid season form most pitchers on top fifty teams are cruising 90. The post season is not the mid season. Quinnipiac is not a top fifty program. 

I understand the point you're trying to make, but the bolded overstates things.

Jerry Ford -- when he still used to post here -- explained the math pretty well:

https://community.hsbaseballwe...85#47474438380416185

So in any given high school class there are 400 (Jerry's number) or even 500 kids who could touch 90 or higher, and with 300 D1 programs, there are something like 1500 pitchers recruited each year. The majority of pitchers who go D1 do not touch 90 in high school. Close to 90? Sure. Top 50 programs? Sure.

But the majority of kids -- in fact about 70% -- recruited to D1s as pitchers have no documented 90 mph velo in high school. Of course, if you ask their dads . . . 

We are talking about the CWS here.  All these teams have many, many kids throwing 90-100.

My kid went to an (lesser) SEC team camp very late in the year and there were 12 kids that threw 90+ in that one small camp.  My son's mid D1 team had 6 kids throwing 90-96.