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Son’s travel team had their summer team tryout/showcase today. There were a TON of 2022 kids trying out for the 2023 team. The coaches had each class in a different color shirt. The re-class kids had there own color because there were so many. The good news I guess is the team will have a couple really good MIF additions and some depth at P.

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@langra posted:

What state are you in? How are juniors reclassifying as sophomores--most states only allow 4 years of eligibility once you start HS. I see a fair amount of 8th graders reclass and repeat 8th grade, but not HS.

Same state as I am in. The players that I know of, 2020s, reclassify and attend academies that are cropping up all over, but not so early. Many have already solid commitments.

@langra posted:

What state are you in? How are juniors reclassifying as sophomores--most states only allow 4 years of eligibility once you start HS. I see a fair amount of 8th graders reclass and repeat 8th grade, but not HS.

All it takes to get around four years of eligibility is attend a private that’s not part of the state athletic association. Many privates are members of their own athletic association.

Last edited by RJM
@Smitty28 posted:

California starts the 4 year clock when you enroll in HS.  If you want to reclass you have to repeat 8th grade or earlier, which lots of athletes do.

Same in Texas. And Perfect Game etc age rules are by grad year, right? I don't think you can decide as a sophomore or junior that you are going to eventually do post grad and reclass now for summer teams.

I dont know specifics but I am sure one can reclassify in HS, without repeating as long as the student meets NCAA D1 requirements in core classes to be met in the 4 years he would have graduated. Does that make sense?

Maybe this is on a state to state basis, and why in FL it's becoming common.

Last edited by TPM
@Francis7 posted:

I have officially lost track on how many good 22s we have seen reclass to 23s. Some of them were even old for their grade as 22s. Everyone knows who they are and what they are doing. The coaches and recruiters don't seem to care. In fact, they they seem to prefer it.

This has always stumped me.  WHY don't they care? Can someone explain this to me other than if they can play they can play because there are kids that play just well above average against their own age and WAY better when playing down and get very good offers in 9th grade.  Not sour grapes this doesn't affect my kid.

Last edited by KennieProton
@Smitty28 posted:

California starts the 4 year clock when you enroll in HS.  If you want to reclass you have to repeat 8th grade or earlier, which lots of athletes do.

Same in our state.  Half of the athletes in my kids' Sophomore class reclassed by taking an extra year in the adjoining Private Catholic Middle School (some of the classes were in the High School) after 8th grade and no on seems to care (HS coaches, ranking services, parents).  Many of them are not elite and it won't matter except to their helicopter parents. For  a handful, they will have a significant advantage academically, athletically in school and for recruiting purposes,  and even in the draft.  Try explaining this to your kid some day..

Last edited by KennieProton

In GA, clock starts as soon as you begin 9th grade. 8 semesters of eligibility.  

PG’s #1 ‘23 C in GA reclassified between 7th & 8th grade. Also attending IMG now, which makes it irrelevant most likely.

#4 ‘23 C in GA was a ‘22 until summer, is now a ‘23. Not sure how that’s going to work for him, as he’s in a public school. But not my problem.

I would imagine that the easiest thing to do here in GA (if you reclassified after entering HS) would be to home school the 5th  year and play with an academy team (plenty here).

Not something our son will be doing, so we’re just gonna eat popcorn and watch the show...

@TPM posted:

I dont know specifics but I am sure one can reclassify in HS, without repeating as long as the student meets NCAA D1 requirements in core classes to be met in the 4 years he would have graduated. Does that make sense?

Maybe this is on a state to state basis, and why in FL it's becoming common.

Yes this makes sense in that the NCAA doesn't care, but in CA and other states they limit HS sports eligibility to 4 years, so if you reclass as a sophomore (for example), you can change your graduation date but you'll have to sit out sports your senior (5th) year.

This has always stumped me.  WHY don't they care? Can someone explain this to me other than if they can play they can play because there are kids that play just well above average against their own age and WAY better when playing down and get very good offers in 9th grade.  Not sour grapes this doesn't affect my kid.

Why don't they care?  Because it makes their job much easier.  A bigger freshman or sophomore who is already 6' 180lb and throwing close to 90 is a much lower risk than a 14 year old they have to project and hope grows into a college player.

Pro scouts care because they love the 17 year old senior.

@Senna posted:

In GA, clock starts as soon as you begin 9th grade. 8 semesters of eligibility.  

PG’s #1 ‘23 C in GA reclassified between 7th & 8th grade. Also attending IMG now, which makes it irrelevant most likely.

#4 ‘23 C in GA was a ‘22 until summer, is now a ‘23. Not sure how that’s going to work for him, as he’s in a public school. But not my problem.

I would imagine that the easiest thing to do here in GA (if you reclassified after entering HS) would be to home school the 5th  year and play with an academy team (plenty here).

Not something our son will be doing, so we’re just gonna eat popcorn and watch the show...

This just sounds like declaring a post grad year early as an excuse to play down. Surely the rule at PG, PBR etc is that you can't just make up your graduation year. It has to be the year you actually graduate high school.

@Smitty28 posted:

Yes this makes sense in that the NCAA doesn't care, but in CA and other states they limit HS sports eligibility to 4 years, so if you reclass as a sophomore (for example), you can change your graduation date but you'll have to sit out sports your senior (5th) year.

I guess that's where attending an academy comes into play. Yes you can change your grad date, done all of your required NCAA classes and attend an academy to work out everyday and play games, take some extra classes, etc.

I think that I saw that Rick posted about this once.

I actually overheard an ACC and Big 10 coach talking about it. In their opinion, reclassing can help in the short term but in the long term it is one more year of wear and tear on a body. Especially for pitchers. They were not fans. I know that this year is an outlier but, in general, reclassing is not the slam dunk some parents think it is.

@PTWood posted:

I actually overheard an ACC and Big 10 coach talking about it. In their opinion, reclassing can help in the short term but in the long term it is one more year of wear and tear on a body. Especially for pitchers. They were not fans. I know that this year is an outlier but, in general, reclassing is not the slam dunk some parents think it is.

I tend to agree with you, unless the reason was due to injury. I also agree that this year and next perhaps are exceptions.

@langra posted:

What state are you in? How are juniors reclassifying as sophomores--most states only allow 4 years of eligibility once you start HS. I see a fair amount of 8th graders reclass and repeat 8th grade, but not HS.

I’m in FL. PG absolutely let’s kids in HS re-class in HS. By re-classing now I guess they begin to compete against their new recruiting competition. As TPM mentioned, once they exhaust their HS eligibility they play for an “academy” and don’t have to adhere to FHSAA rules because they aren’t playing sanctioned events. Look at IMG for example. They still play top HS teams and other academies. Some of the academies actually get to play year round.

The crazy thing to me is none of these kids were studs and weren’t any better than the top 2023 kids. Some were a little more filled out, but overall play wasn’t better.

Just for conversation, is this really any different than kids born in May/June/July playing against kids born in Feb/March/April???  I bring this up because for a lot of kids they have already grown up accustomed to competing against a whole grade older ???

To an extent, yes. My son (2022) is a late April birthday. The entire time in LL, he played with and against 2021s who were born in May and June. Same baseball age. But one year younger/older.

Actually, it was more because he was 10u playing LL 12U majors. So, sometimes the kids were 3 years older.

Personally, it served him well. He played HS varsity as a freshman and playing with and against older kids was nothing new.

Just for conversation, is this really any different than kids born in May/June/July playing against kids born in Feb/March/April???  I bring this up because for a lot of kids they have already grown up accustomed to competing against a whole grade older ???

I don’t really care about the ages for the kids playing. As Francis mentioned, they’ve been playing against these kids for years. In FL they won’t be allowed to compete beyond their 4 years for FHSAA events.

I’m curious how the schools will handle it. My son’s prep school is not allowing current students to re-class. The starting SS transferred over the summer so he could go from 2022 to 2023. Worked out well for my son’s team as they picked up a stud 2022 SS from a state not playing sports in the spring. Huge upgrade

a kid my son knows started in kindergarten at the same time (went to kindergarten with one of my son's friends) (2023). Somewhere along the line he was listed as a 2024 (that's fine, he's young for the 2023 grade). then he went away for a year of intermediate school and was listed as a 2025.  played PG as a 2025 this year.  now, i'm hearing that he's enrolled at a local private school as a freshman (2024).

@TPM posted:

I tend to agree with you, unless the reason was due to injury. I also agree that this year and next perhaps are exceptions.

I think that birthdate plays a huge role in it. For us it was easy, having a May birthday mattered. So the choice was keep him where he is and be slightly less developed or repeat 8th and then enter high school after he’s turned 15 and now on the more developed side. It flat out mattered in his case even though his skill set was very solid. In the end size drove a lot of the interest.Anyone that tells you other wise is kidding themselves.

The only thing I would add was that he was 100% bought in on the idea because he had a goal. Without his buy in I don’t think we would have done it which would have been bad but he needed to be invested in the path. I look at kids who didn’t with similar birthdays and they had absolutely no shot. The problem is when you put your kid into Kindergarten you aren’t necessarily thinking about it this way, you really can’t. My wife is a teacher and I was a coach and the only decision was if he was socially and emotionally ready for school at that point which is why we put him in. It took a lot of explaining to my wife 9 years later when I ,along with others ,explained what was in his best interest to do in repeating a grade. In our state we have to go to a catholic school for the repeat year and then into HS.

Each case is different that I understand but as a rule I tell parents your kid shouldn’t be in Hs unless he’s already turned 15 if you want to give him the best opportunity for success, and that’s really irregardless of skill level. In the end what’s the rush?

Ah, I know this dilemma all too well.  My 2021 has a June 5th birthday.  Preschool teachers said "if you bring him back for another year of preschool, he'll be bored and won't be challenged at all."  So we trusted in that and moved him on to kindergarten.  He struggled some in English in elementary school and his mom regretted the decision because of it.  He got up to speed by the time he got to middle school.

He's an awfully good ball player, but he's undersized at 5'9" 165ish.  Not sure how much more he'll grow (likely very little), but it almost certainly would have been better for him to graduate in 2022 versus 2021.  He has all D1 measurables despite his size and had some legit D1 interest, but no D1 offers ever came, so he's going the JUCO route.  I wouldn't say we have any regrets because he's in a really good spot, but there is little doubt in my mind that his chances of going straight to D1 from high school could have been improved if he were a 2022 grad and had the extra year to grow and develop.  He's making the most of what he was handed.  Smaller guys always have to outwork and outperform the larger guys to be successful.  Welcome to normal life.

I used to think it was odd that the hoops kids were always playing down while baseball kids were always trying to play up

The ultimate are Hockey players.  My son is a young Freshman in college, turned 18 in September.  He made friends with a Hockey Freshman who turns 21 in May.  Kid was old for grade, took a PG year, played a year before college and as a result buys the beer.

We "academically red-shirted" our 2023 summer birthday boy in 6th grade.  He was so smart as 4-5 year old we felt like we had to put him in Kindergarten early.  But he was always noticeably a little emotionally behind as the youngest kid in his class.  After 6th grade, I had a career change and an epiphany to have him repeat the grade.  (I would be lying if I didn't consider the sports implications)  Every teacher and the principal told me I was being unreasonable... he's too smart, he'll be bored, he'll get in trouble, etc...  We did it anyways.  We home schooled him so he wouldn't feel weird.    I went fishing and camping with him.  Did overseas travel trips.  And played lots of sports together.  It was a great year.   

He's definitely a more mature high school student because of it.  Grades are super easy.  He's disciplined enough to study for the SAT/ACT every day since mid freshmen year. 

I think it will help him out with soccer and baseball.  He's little so I can't imagine he would have had any shot if he were on the original timeline.  Now I think he might have a shot at high level D3 baseball or soccer.  IMO, it was a win to do this.   

I find some of the post here about summer birthday kids and the kindergarten decision very interesting.  My 2025 is an August birthday and we went through the same thoughts as many of you.  He was very smart, emotionally ready for kindergarten, etc...etc.  We sought feedback from anyone we could think to ask.  Not just his preschool teachers but elementary schools teachers, middle school and highschool teachers and principals.  The overwhelming majority said wait. They often said they never met a parent who regretted holding them back a year but saw many over the years who regretted sending them early.  They pointed out the struggles of being late in every milestone, not the least of which was puberty.

So we waited, rather than enter kindergarten at barely 5 years old he entered at barely 6.  No regrets....and so he is 2025, and not 2024.

@22and25 posted:

I find some of the post here about summer birthday kids and the kindergarten decision very interesting.

So we waited, rather than enter kindergarten at barely 5 years old he entered at barely 6.  No regrets....and so he is 2025, and not 2024.

I think that's fairly common story although there's a lot of rationalizing that goes on. I n my state they even moved the date back from December or January 1 to Sept 1 several years ago so your kid would have right on the cusp in our state  Holding your kid back to re-do 8th grade, while his lifelong friends move on, for a slightly better chance at being a high 2024 over an above average 2025 or maybe not getting cut from sports altogether is different and much more common story.  I can look at my kids yearbook and see at least 10 out of 200 boys that did that and I don't think it will matter one bit.  And I've heard some of the other boys and parents call them red-shirts.

Last edited by KennieProton

Soooo, my son went to a Montessori school for pre-k and K. Pretty good group of kids and parents. There were some summer birthdays including late august. The school convinced a few of these parents that their kids were so smart they needed to be skipped ahead a grade. Can't remember if they skipped K or 1st, but they skipped. So a couple parents tried to move over to public school and the district told them they don't let kids advance until after 3rd. Low and behold wouldn't you know it, the families were locked into another 2 years at the Montessori school. Now that the kids are in HS, the parents are pissed. Their kids are not able to really compete at sports with kids in their grade levels who are 2-3 years ahead.

My son is a May bday, so he's already young. Thank God my wife listened to me when I argued to leave him on grade level.

We "academically red-shirted" our 2023 summer birthday boy in 6th grade.  He was so smart as 4-5 year old we felt like we had to put him in Kindergarten early.  But he was always noticeably a little emotionally behind as the youngest kid in his class.  After 6th grade, I had a career change and an epiphany to have him repeat the grade.  (I would be lying if I didn't consider the sports implications)  Every teacher and the principal told me I was being unreasonable... he's too smart, he'll be bored, he'll get in trouble, etc...  We did it anyways.  We home schooled him so he wouldn't feel weird.    I went fishing and camping with him.  Did overseas travel trips.  And played lots of sports together.  It was a great year.   

He's definitely a more mature high school student because of it.  Grades are super easy.  He's disciplined enough to study for the SAT/ACT every day since mid freshmen year.

I think it will help him out with soccer and baseball.  He's little so I can't imagine he would have had any shot if he were on the original timeline.  Now I think he might have a shot at high level D3 baseball or soccer.  IMO, it was a win to do this.   

I started kindergarten a year early. While I was one of the top kids in my class I started falling behind emotionally and socially in 7th grade. What I posted below about sports bothered me. In 8th grade my grades started to decline. We moved. I repeated 8th grade got all A’s and was back on track.

Sports were never mentioned as a reason. But I went from being a competent athlete to a dominant athlete at school like I was in age related non school baseball and basketball. In 7th grade I was an 11yo competing in football against some 8th graders who were 13. Same thing in basketball. In sports where size mattered I was at a tremendous disadvantage.

My daughter (oldest) has a July birthday. When she was young I could see the difference between her and girls who were ten, eleven months older. But girls physically mature by 8th, 9th grade. Recruiting isn’t effected. My son with his May birthday was the dominant kid from the time he stepped on any field/court. He fell back in 7th and 8th grade in terms of size, strength and power before growing. But the skills were visible.

My son was 5’ at twelve and 5’2” and 5’4” the following two years. When we saw a tall, non athletic  person he would mutter, “What a waste of height.”

Last edited by RJM

We held my son back and while it wasn't uncommon then, it is uncommon not to now.  My oldest was born late August, would have been the youngest, or we hold him and he is one of the oldest.  Preschool teacher said he wasn't emotionally ready and we knew he would be a late bloomer.  A week before turning 13, he was 5' flat.  At 14, he was 5'8 and ended up graduating at 6'3 and 205 .  It 100% made a difference in his ability to reach his goals.  Our youngest son is 5'3 and almost 13.  He will likely be bigger than his older brother and he is 8-12 inches shorter than almost every kid on his 7th grade football team.  Every boy he knows in his grade is almost a full year older.  He was born in February...couldn't justify it. That said, there are many kids born around the same time that are a grade below.  I see the value in holding them.  I don't blame anyone.  Reclassifying in high school usually only makes sense if the kid really hasn't developed physically yet, but this year and last...who knows.

The ultimate are Hockey players.  My son is a young Freshman in college, turned 18 in September.  He made friends with a Hockey Freshman who turns 21 in May.  Kid was old for grade, took a PG year, played a year before college and as a result buys the beer.

Hockey is notorious.

New England prep hockey is full of kids who have repeated 8th grade at private schools, do a year of public school for 9th grade, and then re-class back to 9th when they go to prep school. Most kids who come into the league later after being somewhere else re-class too. Parents fuel it and Coaches want it 3yrs instead or 2, or 2 instead of 1 for the tuition "subsidy" provided. 21yo freshman in college hockey is very common.

I'll never forget the feeling of first watching my 14yo 145lb "true" freshman competing against 19yo 200lb men, from all over the country and world, who had better beards than me. He's 5'9 and has always played like he doesn't know he's not 6'3. Despite some huge hits given and taken he came away relatively unscathed, but man what a season.

Definitely seeing more of it now in baseball. Four baseball friends of his (2) re-classed and (2) PG'd. The two PG ended up going committing to better schools than they were originally committed to. But the re-classes haven't found a home yet.

Here in Texas lots of parents are having their kid redo 8th grade in private school. I have a June Bday boy and he wants “no part” of doing an additional year. He will graduate HS at 17. We considered reclassify him but he’s a A/B student and his social friends group is something we also consider. Maturity wise he’s behind, wish I started him in K at 6 this said...he wants no part of it now! It’s so common here to be older it’s now weird to be the correct age/grade lol.

Last edited by NY
@Francis7 posted:

I have officially lost track on how many good 22s we have seen reclass to 23s. Some of them were even old for their grade as 22s. Everyone knows who they are and what they are doing. The coaches and recruiters don't seem to care. In fact, they they seem to prefer it.

Hypothetical:  Kid repeats 8th grade because he's small for his grad year and wants to have a better chance to play Varsity Baseball and get recruited. Actually dad thinks he will grow to be 6"2' even though he's 5'8 and mom is 5'2.

I know of one instance where the kid actually took 9th grade classes in the HS he was going to attend but enrolled in 8th grade in the attached private middle school where he took gym etc. but he took Spanish, math and chemistry in the HS with Freshman which set him up for more AP credits.  Pretty smart.     

Only problem is, in our state  you are not supposed to be able to that.  There is a rule that says once you start taking 9th grade curriculum, whether home school or in school, you are a freshman and your 4 year eligibility clock is ticking. Problem is  they seldom enforce it.  If the HSAA enforced their own rule the 8th grade redshirts wouldn't bother.

The ultimate are Hockey players.  My son is a young Freshman in college, turned 18 in September.  He made friends with a Hockey Freshman who turns 21 in May.  Kid was old for grade, took a PG year, played a year before college and as a result buys the beer.

It’s very common for hockey players to head off to Juniors after high school if not during high school. If they’re still in juniors at twenty they tend to head for college hockey.

There used to be a handful of dominant college hockey programs. Ultimately other programs became more competitive by recruiting men (20yo Juniors). Then it became a trend for all programs.

If you see an 17/18yo freshman  in D1 college hockey player getting ice time he’s a legit pro prospect.

Hypothetical:  Kid repeats 8th grade because he's small for his grad year and wants to have a better chance to play Varsity Baseball and get recruited. Actually dad thinks he will grow to be 6"2' even though he's 5'8 and mom is 5'2.



Kennie, I have to respond to you because it's too ironic not to.  I am 5'2", my husband is 5'8" (he's says 9) and our 2022 just hit 6'2". lol

The post-grad/academy biz must be booming in FL with all the re-classing going on. This week I’ve seen 3 new travel orgs offering PG teams for this summer and next spring. I’m sure there are more, I just happened to check out their sites. Doesn’t look like there is any type of academic tie in, just a team to play on.

Same in SoCal.  I think they've already created a league.  Basically taking the league that had existed for committed highschoolers who didn't want to play for their high school (a lot of talented pitchers with HS coaches w/no regard for arm care and some potential draftees who graduate early to focus on training) and expanding it.  If there is a need, someone will fill it..and profit from it.

@LousyLefty posted:

Kennie, I have to respond to you because it's too ironic not to.  I am 5'2", my husband is 5'8" (he's says 9) and our 2022 just hit 6'2". lol

Your son is definitely an outlier. When forming a 13u travel team it was an all star team of our eighteen LL district. I identified the top twenty players I felt had high school potential and secured thirteen. The idea was to train kids to become high school players. All but one played college ball at some level. He could have played college baseball. He played D1 basketball. I was more interested in the 5’2” kid with athleticism and tall parents than the player in the next paragraph.

The dad of the most dominant pitcher was perplexed I wasn’t interested. His kid was 5’8, throwing mid 70’s at 12 and never lost a game. Dad was 5’5. Mom was 5’1” The kid was cut from the high school JV team entering junior year. He was now 5’9” throwing 78.

Last edited by RJM

The post-grad/academy biz must be booming in FL with all the re-classing going on. This week I’ve seen 3 new travel orgs offering PG teams for this summer and next spring. I’m sure there are more, I just happened to check out their sites. Doesn’t look like there is any type of academic tie in, just a team to play on.

I do believe they have to take classes but have no clue what type.

@TPM posted:

I do believe they have to take classes but have no clue what type.

The programs I saw were geared more towards the reclassified kids who won’t be able to play their senior year. You go to whichever high school you want (most seem to prefer virtual) and you pay to play on the team.

I think we will see a scenario exactly how LousyLefty described SoCal as far as having a league.

Hmmm, interesting concept @TerribleBPthrower. Repeat grade 12 and continue with HS classes ineligible for a 5th year of sports (to my knowledge no states have awarded a 5th year of eligibility to high school students) vs graduate and take a few courses at the local JUCO?  Realistically if the HS offers enough AP classes you could accrue more credits (if the college you end up accepts them) by staying in HS. My high academic student left a few AP classes on the table that he would have enjoyed taking but there simply weren't enough periods in the HS day.  (that was with a few college "dual enrollment" classes to make room for the 14 AP classes he's already taken/enrolled for next year). Granted, a kid taking that many AP classes  likely won't end up at at a school that accepts all those APs...

Biggest downside, if you get hurt or finally acknowledge it's not going to happen you're stuck in HS an additional year.  At least with JUCO you could pivot at semester and move on with your life.

@RJM posted:

I was more interested in the 5’2” kid with athleticism and tall parents than the player in the next paragraph.

The dad of the most dominant pitcher was perplexed I wasn’t interested. His kid was 5’8, throwing mid 70’s at 12 and never lost a game. Dad was 5’5. Mom was 5’1” The kid was cut from the high school JV team entering junior year. He was now 5’9” throwing 78.

Which is exactly why I had Lefty's 6' tall older brother take him to all tryouts when we were shopping new programs in middle school   Lefty had a little height, but clearly hadn't hit full blown puberty yet.  

I only commented because he nailed EVERY height to the inch

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