January Camp expectations as a pitcher

Since Babson is a D3, my suggestion would be to not go to this camp under these circumstances. If he is not ready and does poorly, he might get written off. He will have plenty of time to shine in his Jr HS season and the important rising senior summer. My 2025 got several HA D3 support offers in this November/December.  You've got more time than you think.

I agree Dadbelly.  My question would then be, why hold camps in January and February then?  They have to know most kids aren’t going to be in peak form right?   I know some camps are moneymakers, but I also know they actually look at specific kids at these events.

@Dadof3 posted:

I agree Dadbelly.  My question would then be, why hold camps in January and February then?  They have to know most kids aren’t going to be in peak form right?   I know some camps are moneymakers, but I also know they actually look at specific kids at these events.

This is the same question in my head. They don't usually have a summer camp or fall camp, just 1 every January. Those kids that are already up to their full stardards by January are probably passing the school up talent wise by summer/early fall and may go to a higher level.

What's his height and current FB velo?  What do you think: general rule of thumb, add 5-7 mph to catcher velo to estimate mound velocity?

@Dadbelly2023 posted:

What's his height and current FB velo?  What do you think: general rule of thumb, add 5-7 mph to catcher velo to estimate mound velocity?

He's 6' 195lbs. If he were to get on the mound today, fully warmed up, I'd estimate he'd be around 82-83. He was 80 on the mound at the end of Oct before beginning offseason lifting and velo.

Why not go to the camp if he is interested?  The RC may not get a chance to see him during the season.   After all, your son has to decide if he likes the coaches and the school (not just vice versa).  Please don't give up your enrollment power; it is not a one-way street.

I will say that if your son is not ready to throw, don't have him throw a bullpen.  He'll just open himself up for a pre-season injury.  Have him do his regular workout, pulldowns, etc.  If they like him, they will follow his season.  I don't think having a surprise spring is worth the chances of them missing him altogether.  The chances of them "finding" him without him showing interest may be slimmer than you think.  As you say, he can't attend this camp next year and still be in the mix.

Just my opinion, though.  I agree it is a judgment call.  I worry that if the players give all the power to evaluators, they end up selling their own talent and preferences short. 

@RHP_Parent posted:

Why not go to the camp if he is interested?  The RC may not get a chance to see him during the season.   After all, your son has to decide if he likes the coaches and the school (not just vice versa).  Please don't give up your enrollment power; it is not a one-way street.

I will say that if your son is not ready to throw, don't have him throw a bullpen.  He'll just open himself up for a pre-season injury.  Have him do his regular workout, pulldowns, etc.  If they like him, they will follow his season.  I don't think having a surprise spring is worth the chances of them missing him altogether.  The chances of them "finding" him without him showing interest may be slimmer than you think.  As you say, he can't attend this camp next year and still be in the mix.

Just my opinion, though.  I agree it is a judgment call.  I worry that if the players give all the power to evaluators, they end up selling their own talent and preferences short.

I like the idea of him doing his regular "Saturday" workout because that would be his normal heavy day during that time of training. He would normally throw a bullpen that day anyway, but his concern is that it is only the second week and he isn't sure what level of pitch command he will have. Would a coach be understanding of the timing if you talk to them and tell him it's only the second day throwing of the season?

Oddly enough, the week before for his first bullpen he will be throwing it in DC at the ABCA convention. He is attending with me and several others on my team to represent our new Sports Software business focusing on improving the training process and visibility, especially when you have multiple coaches and programs you work with (or multiple sports). He's already trying to find the coach there since he will be in attendance to talk about the business (Babson - one of the best business/entrepreneurship schools - always good to highlight why you really want to go there and to show off the business you co-founded and raised half a million in seed funding to kick off).

So... more complex than originally presented.

@Dadbelly2023 posted:

So... more complex than originally presented.

Is anything ever less complex?

If you want honesty... It sounds like a money grab...

Only a couple reasons I would pay to send my kid to this camp:

1.The coach has been in direct contact with my son or my son's travel coach and wants to see my son in person (this shows real interest).

2. My kid has developed numbers that will turn heads (80 off the bump from the right side won't do it at any level)

p.s. I'm not trying to be rude, I'm just pointing out that the ROI doesn't seem to be in your favor

Anecdote about Winter camps:  My son attended a January camp at a D1 before his sophomore year in HS.  He had the best 60 time and according to travel coach "Put on a show" in BP.  About 8 months later he accepted a scholarship offer to the school.  In our meeting with the HC I asked him how important the camp was to his getting noticed and recruited.  His answer: "He was at our camp?"

@Gary D posted:

I like the idea of him doing his regular "Saturday" workout because that would be his normal heavy day during that time of training. He would normally throw a bullpen that day anyway, but his concern is that it is only the second week and he isn't sure what level of pitch command he will have. Would a coach be understanding of the timing if you talk to them and tell him it's only the second day throwing of the season?

Oddly enough, the week before for his first bullpen he will be throwing it in DC at the ABCA convention. He is attending with me and several others on my team to represent our new Sports Software business focusing on improving the training process and visibility, especially when you have multiple coaches and programs you work with (or multiple sports). He's already trying to find the coach there since he will be in attendance to talk about the business (Babson - one of the best business/entrepreneurship schools - always good to highlight why you really want to go there and to show off the business you co-founded and raised half a million in seed funding to kick off).

Interesting.  I'm split on whether or not the Babson RC will care about this too much.  I certainly think the admissions office will be interested.  But the RC will probably simply want to know if he can pitch.  But then again, the software is sports related...  And the RC will figure this kid is going to be showing up on campus regardless: "so let's take a look."   I'm wishy.  I'm washy.  I can't decide. K9's story is pretty damn funny for sure.  Anecdotally, my 2023 got his spot by doing well at a jr fall camp. He was unknown to the coaches prior to the camp. 

@K9 posted:

Anecdote about Winter camps:  My son attended a January camp at a D1 before his sophomore year in HS.  He had the best 60 time and according to travel coach "Put on a show" in BP.  About 8 months later he accepted a scholarship offer to the school.  In our meeting with the HC I asked him how important the camp was to his getting noticed and recruited.  His answer: "He was at our camp?"

how long ago was this?  I am told that camps are becoming increasingly important.

@Dadof3 posted:

how long ago was this?  I am told that camps are becoming increasingly important.

This was Winter 2017.

I agree with @ReluctantO'sFan's take on the situation.   On the athletic side of the equation, the HC would have to be in direct contact AND the recruit is ready to show them something special.   A January camp is not the time to do it as most high schoolers are barely starting to throw, much less showcase from a mound.  Getting on a mound in January to showcase to potential college coaches is not a good idea....more bad than good can happen.    I'd think about taking a different tack.   I'd visit a handful of schools in the area (New England is full of them...like shooting fish in a barrel) that your son is interested in.   Make arrangements through Admissions and visit the school through the academic side, and see what each has to offer.   Ask each admissions dept to schedule time with the baseball coaches or schedule it on your own during your visit.    Rinse and repeat for every school.   Developing a relationship is the best thing you can do in January to demonstrate your interest.  Once you develop a relationship keep them updated on your milestones.  When the time comes then showcase for them.

FWIW....Its been almost 45 years since I visited Babson on an overnight tennis recruiting visit through one of my friends who was on the tennis team.  I lived less than an hour away.    As a high schooler, I was very disappointed with the campus party life.  There was way too much studying going on over the weekends.  ;-)

FWIW, looks like Babson will be at two of the Headfirst Northeast camps in the summer.

https://www.headfirstshowcase....mp-coaches-baseball/

Nothing more to add on the camp front but wanted to say that I graduated from Babson 30 years ago and it is a terrific school.  The preparation for the real world was amazing and graduates of the school do really well.  I do agree with fenwaysouth's comment on the party scene though!

What is his grad yr?

Son's summer teammate committed and played at Babson in 2021 (or 22 if they didn't have a 2021 season) LHP, he was 83-84. Would have been the last out of the bullpen, and eventually quit after a year. Your millage may vary, but that's a LHP with similar velo.

I agree with others that cautioned about throwing in showcases in January if not fully ready. Also big velo gains in a short period time has a higher injury risk. May want to have a nice ramp up in the off season before showcasing.

@2SeamPizza posted:

Nothing more to add on the camp front but wanted to say that I graduated from Babson 30 years ago and it is a terrific school.  The preparation for the real world was amazing and graduates of the school do really well.  I do agree with fenwaysouth's comment on the party scene though!

As his dad, I really like that it doesn't have a big party scene!

Has your son been in contact yet with the Babson coach? As in, have they said "come to our camp"? (keeping in mind that camps are moneymakers, so they always say that) Has his travel coach contacted the Babson coach and said "look at this guy"? If he goes to the January camp, I recommend doing all that first.

D3s used to recruit seniors in January, i.e. not through ED applications, but through RD. Their January camps were for that, and also to be a moneymaker. With all the recent changes, I don't know if that is the case any more.

"Getting on their radar" is fine, but if someone else they like better shows up on their radar before September of senior year, they will offer that person the ED slot.

@anotherparent posted:

Has your son been in contact yet with the Babson coach? As in, have they said "come to our camp"? (keeping in mind that camps are moneymakers, so they always say that) Has his travel coach contacted the Babson coach and said "look at this guy"? If he goes to the January camp, I recommend doing all that first.

D3s used to recruit seniors in January, i.e. not through ED applications, but through RD. Their January camps were for that, and also to be a moneymaker. With all the recent changes, I don't know if that is the case any more.

"Getting on their radar" is fine, but if someone else they like better shows up on their radar before September of senior year, they will offer that person the ED slot.

There were emails and an invite to the camp, but nothing at this point that would be a solid "hey we really want you". This, to us, is more of a get to know/see event. We are not going in expecting it to be a close the deal kind of thing. With the work he's doing on pitching, his coach (who is quite good and been a round a while with great success and a great track record) gave him the realistic goal of sitting 85 by the HS season (march) mainly because he said my son has everything right now to throw that hard (body, strength explosiveness, etc) but had many mechanical issues for a bad instructor causing him to leak power. Our goal Jan is to show progress and then keep showing improvements into the summer camps and and event.

I know they don't use this for seniors because they announced it as it's for up to 2026s not 2025 and said they already have their 2025s identified (unless that was not true).

As to touring the schools in the area, we already did that. Babson was one of his favorites, and possibly the type of school he'd consider if he wasn't aiming for baseball. He's sitting on a 1440 SAT (760m 680rw) and waiting for the Dec results where he focused only on rw with practice results around 750s. He really wants to study business with a focus on entrepreneurship, something that runs in our family (uncle taught it at a great business school for over 30 years but there's zero chance of making that baseball team). I guess it's a dream, but he wants to chase it and do whatever he can to make it.

To cast a wider net, Case Western and Hopkins also have business schools and similar baseball. Doesn't seem like he has to retake the SAT, lol.   Good luck with the process, and keep us posted.

Just posting this reply because my son was following commits and saw this today. They had one for 2025, RHP, that was sitting 83-85 top 87 his rising summer at several events. So, there's hope... 😁

Thought I'd post a follow up now that it's over. First off, coach Noone ran a fantastic day for the kids. He set the tone early with a great speech about knowing for many of the they are just starting to ramp up, don't aim for a PR, we are more wanting to see how you handle yourself and our pace of play, etc. Anyone that pitched he emphasized now throwing later for the defensive work. All the coaching staff was great and made it feel like a big family environment. Overall, my son walked away more loving it than before.

His performance was strong. For early in the year he said he felt like he was sitting 80-81 and maybe hit 82. They only had the kids throw about 15 pitch bullpen after warming up. His faatballs were all on target and his curveball showed strength with the exception of the first 2.

The next day one of the assistants reached out and they have a call tomorrow.

I guess the moral of this story is that for juniors interested in high academic d3, this is a good time to go if you can show promise and build a good relationship. This was, according to the staff, the first time they were seriously looking g at the 2026 class and hopefully now they will follow my son's progress in the season.

@Gary D posted:

Thought I'd post a follow up now that it's over. First off, coach Noone ran a fantastic day for the kids. He set the tone early with a great speech about knowing for many of the they are just starting to ramp up, don't aim for a PR, we are more wanting to see how you handle yourself and our pace of play, etc. Anyone that pitched he emphasized now throwing later for the defensive work. All the coaching staff was great and made it feel like a big family environment. Overall, my son walked away more loving it than before.

His performance was strong. For early in the year he said he felt like he was sitting 80-81 and maybe hit 82. They only had the kids throw about 15 pitch bullpen after warming up. His faatballs were all on target and his curveball showed strength with the exception of the first 2.

The next day one of the assistants reached out and they have a call tomorrow.

I guess the moral of this story is that for juniors interested in high academic d3, this is a good time to go if you can show promise and build a good relationship. This was, according to the staff, the first time they were seriously looking g at the 2026 class and hopefully now they will follow my son's progress in the season.

Noone is one of the best D3 coaches in the country. He’s also connected to the Red Sox and the Cape League.

@fenwaysouth posted:

I agree with @ReluctantO'sFan's take on the situation.   On the athletic side of the equation, the HC would have to be in direct contact AND the recruit is ready to show them something special.   A January camp is not the time to do it as most high schoolers are barely starting to throw, much less showcase from a mound.  Getting on a mound in January to showcase to potential college coaches is not a good idea....more bad than good can happen.    I'd think about taking a different tack.   I'd visit a handful of schools in the area (New England is full of them...like shooting fish in a barrel) that your son is interested in.   Make arrangements through Admissions and visit the school through the academic side, and see what each has to offer.   Ask each admissions dept to schedule time with the baseball coaches or schedule it on your own during your visit.    Rinse and repeat for every school.   Developing a relationship is the best thing you can do in January to demonstrate your interest.  Once you develop a relationship keep them updated on your milestones.  When the time comes then showcase for them.

FWIW....It’s been almost 45 years since I visited Babson on an overnight tennis recruiting visit through one of my friends who was on the tennis team.  I lived less than an hour away.    As a high schooler, I was very disappointed with the campus party life.  There was way too much studying going on over the weekends.  ;-)

Do you remember a poster from Arizona 3rd Gen? His son was an Ivy, HA D3 tweener prospect. His son was a 2010 high school grad. The dad was very active here into his son’s freshman year of college.

The son chose Babson and started as a freshman. I went by to see him play and chatted after the game. Based on what he said nothing has changed about campus life.

A friend’s son played baseball there. He was a 2009 high school grad. He called it a nerd school.  He said the liveliest place on Saturday night is the library. But it got him to Goldman Sachs.

Baseball got him in. He quit baseball after one year. His father had always put too much pressure on him. He ended up not liking baseball. Their relationship was damaged. It got worse when his one younger brother played for a ranked SEC program.

@RJM posted:

He quit baseball after one year. His father had always put too much pressure on him. He ended up not liking baseball. Their relationship was damaged. It got worse when his one younger brother played for a ranked SEC program.

really?  That’s a shame.  How did the younger brother do?