EH
I will reiterate what has been said---if the Japanese players are that much superior to US players why aren't their more of them in the big legaues?
TR, they make more money playing for there Japanese teams?
And the MLB owners don't have enough money to even ask a Japanese player if he would like to play for a MLB club.
The Japan owner's have there players tied to contracts.
How much money did the Boston Red Sox pay just for a chance to talk to a Japanese player??
And don't be surprised to see more Asian players in the next 10 years in the MLB.
EH
And the MLB owners don't have enough money to even ask a Japanese player if he would like to play for a MLB club.
The Japan owner's have there players tied to contracts.
How much money did the Boston Red Sox pay just for a chance to talk to a Japanese player??
And don't be surprised to see more Asian players in the next 10 years in the MLB.
EH
Plus I never said they were superior.
I said it was a better brand of baseball.
There approuch to the game is much more exciting then waiting for a Home Run. JMHO
EH
I said it was a better brand of baseball.
There approuch to the game is much more exciting then waiting for a Home Run. JMHO
EH
EH
Better = Superior
I do not equate money earned with ability--we have players in the bigs making millions and they hit .220
We have American players in JApan making loads of money but they are there because they had trouble making it in the USA
Better = Superior
I do not equate money earned with ability--we have players in the bigs making millions and they hit .220
We have American players in JApan making loads of money but they are there because they had trouble making it in the USA
The Game is better, The style of play.
Not the Players that play it.
Even though the MLB could work on there defense a little more.
I have faith in the US ability to play the game.
Just not in the Approuch that the Owner's and Management takes in Just finding HR hitter's and forgetting the other factor's that make the game exciting.
EH
Not the Players that play it.
Even though the MLB could work on there defense a little more.
I have faith in the US ability to play the game.
Just not in the Approuch that the Owner's and Management takes in Just finding HR hitter's and forgetting the other factor's that make the game exciting.
EH
I would say that the Japaneese play superior baseball to the MLB.
The MLB game is laden with slow hulks waiting for home runs or big hits rather than bunting and making things happen.
Bunting for a single in the MLB seems to have become less than masculine, but it's as good as a one hopper to the outfield if you beat it out.
The MLB game is laden with slow hulks waiting for home runs or big hits rather than bunting and making things happen.
Bunting for a single in the MLB seems to have become less than masculine, but it's as good as a one hopper to the outfield if you beat it out.
Good Morning;
1. MLB and Japan Professional Baseball have an agreement not to weaken the Japan Professional Teams. Each team is owned by a Major Corporation.
Several ML teams have a "working" relationship for the first opportunity to "petition" to sign a Japanese pro player after his 5 or 6 year term.
Many Japan pro players prefer to remain in Japan.
2. When a High School players graduates, he declares College or Pro baseball. He can not use both in his negotiations.
3. Several high school players have been signed by a US Major Team [Padres] before they entered college or pro baseball. It is very difficult to scout the high school teams, because they only play in tournaments in each of the 49 perfecture's *States].
There are 50-150 high school teams in each State.
Over 4,200 in Japan.
4. Baseball in Japan is over 100 years old.
5. The Japan High School National team, College teams and Pro Teams can be defeated by USA teams. The selection of American players and American coaches is the "key" to success. Running speed
is an important tool. Jerry pointed out the statistics in the recent games. Pitching and training was the difference.
One year, I was invited to view the Spring HS tournament in Koshien. 30,000 people attended this game each day of the tournament. My host the President of the JHS Federation mentioned that the Coach of the team on the field, bunted each batter each time at bat, until the hitter had 2 strikes.
This was Ichiro's former school.
I mentioned that, "if I was the opposing coach, I would move the left fielder into the infield until the hitter had 2 strikes".
I received the "look". Hai, yes I understand, but not yes I agree.
Bob
1. MLB and Japan Professional Baseball have an agreement not to weaken the Japan Professional Teams. Each team is owned by a Major Corporation.
Several ML teams have a "working" relationship for the first opportunity to "petition" to sign a Japanese pro player after his 5 or 6 year term.
Many Japan pro players prefer to remain in Japan.
2. When a High School players graduates, he declares College or Pro baseball. He can not use both in his negotiations.
3. Several high school players have been signed by a US Major Team [Padres] before they entered college or pro baseball. It is very difficult to scout the high school teams, because they only play in tournaments in each of the 49 perfecture's *States].
There are 50-150 high school teams in each State.
Over 4,200 in Japan.
4. Baseball in Japan is over 100 years old.
5. The Japan High School National team, College teams and Pro Teams can be defeated by USA teams. The selection of American players and American coaches is the "key" to success. Running speed
is an important tool. Jerry pointed out the statistics in the recent games. Pitching and training was the difference.
One year, I was invited to view the Spring HS tournament in Koshien. 30,000 people attended this game each day of the tournament. My host the President of the JHS Federation mentioned that the Coach of the team on the field, bunted each batter each time at bat, until the hitter had 2 strikes.
This was Ichiro's former school.
I mentioned that, "if I was the opposing coach, I would move the left fielder into the infield until the hitter had 2 strikes".
I received the "look". Hai, yes I understand, but not yes I agree.
Bob
quote:Originally posted by Bob Williams:
Good Morning;
1. MLB and Japan Professional Baseball have an agreement not to weaken the Japan Professional Teams. Each team is owned by a Major Corporation.
Several ML teams have a "working" relationship for the first opportunity to "petition" to sign a Japanese pro player after his 5 or 6 year term.
Many Japan pro players prefer to remain in Japan.
2. When a High School players graduates, he declares College or Pro baseball. He can not use both in his negotiations.
3. Several high school players have been signed by a US Major Team [Padres] before they entered college or pro baseball. It is very difficult to scout the high school teams, because they only play in tournaments in each of the 49 perfecture's *States].
There are 50-150 high school teams in each State.
Over 4,200 in Japan.
4. Baseball in Japan is over 100 years old.
5. The Japan High School National team, College teams and Pro Teams can be defeated by USA teams. The selection of American players and American coaches is the "key" to success. Running speed
is an important tool. Jerry pointed out the statistics in the recent games. Pitching and training was the difference.
One year, I was invited to view the Spring HS tournament in Koshien. 30,000 people attended this game each day of the tournament. My host the President of the JHS Federation mentioned that the Coach of the team on the field, bunted each batter each time at bat, until the hitter had 2 strikes.
This was Ichiro's former school.
I mentioned that, "if I was the opposing coach, I would move the left fielder into the infield until the hitter had 2 strikes".
I received the "look". Hai, yes I understand, but not yes I agree.
Bob
The phylosophy is very similar to that of the slap hitter in fastpitch softball and when the outfield is moved in,the slapper becomes a hitter.
I agree with quincy,the Japanese game is a better game imo.Maybe doesn't have the same level of talent but I really enjoy watching the game I must say that fastpitch is growing on me for much of the same reasons.
Get em on,get em over,get em in.
Hi Everyone;
Please read the MLB article on Bobby Valentine
and his desire to coach the USA team. I would add
Reggie Smith.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=200903
For the "great" trip this summer, it would be educational,fun and enlightening to travel to Japan in August.
We can meet Bobby Valentine,discuss Japan and USA hitting styles, watch a pro game, travel the bullet train and attend the Summer HS Tournament at Koshien.
Bob
Please read the MLB article on Bobby Valentine
and his desire to coach the USA team. I would add
Reggie Smith.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=200903
For the "great" trip this summer, it would be educational,fun and enlightening to travel to Japan in August.
We can meet Bobby Valentine,discuss Japan and USA hitting styles, watch a pro game, travel the bullet train and attend the Summer HS Tournament at Koshien.
Bob
quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
Another thought: if all the Japanese hitters could hit like Ichiro there would many more "Ichiro's" in the major leagues.
Personally, I think the Dominican's are better hitters overall
BUT
In New York State last season KEIO a Japanese school won the state title in their class
Tr- Did you have to bring that up?
My son faced them in the State quarterfinals and took his first and only loss of the season after 9 wins. He had them to two runs over six innings but they slapped a few singles in the seventh and he was done. Left game down 4-1. His teammates couldnt get an out and before inning was over it was 7-1 No hard hits, just slapped it in spots where they got through
BUT- truth be told- pitching was their strength in this game too as their pitcher only allowed 2 hits and one run over 7 innings to sons team who were a good hitting club. Sons team coudnt touch the pitcher from Keio and got no hits over the last 5 innings.
Hopefully, he will get another shot at them this year.
I think Shuichi Murata could be considered a "power hitter". In 2008 he hit 46 home runs.
Here's a clip of him hitting a home run in the WBC...
Here's a clip of him hitting a home run in the WBC...
EH-
I love the post you put about "MLB owner's don't have enough money to even ask a Japanese player would like to come play" and Japan has players tied to contracts"
and then two sentences later you put "don't be suprised to see more Asian players in MLB over next decade"...
those are opposite comments....
why are some of the best Japan players (i.e. Ichiro) over here and players that can't play here that are american over there?
fans here want HR's and high scoring games... so clubs function in that way... just a mind set... doesn't make it wrong or bad... puts people in seats and brings in $$... that is the bottom line nowadays isn't it?
purists prob wld prefer small ball, but that is not how things work here... not enough purists to make teams $$ so teams don't function that way...
If Japan brought a team over here to play, it would be exciting (I guess) but that is about it... take a team over there from MLB and the place would be sold out and people would be going crazy to get tickets, etc...
it's a mindset...
I love the post you put about "MLB owner's don't have enough money to even ask a Japanese player would like to come play" and Japan has players tied to contracts"
and then two sentences later you put "don't be suprised to see more Asian players in MLB over next decade"...
those are opposite comments....
why are some of the best Japan players (i.e. Ichiro) over here and players that can't play here that are american over there?
fans here want HR's and high scoring games... so clubs function in that way... just a mind set... doesn't make it wrong or bad... puts people in seats and brings in $$... that is the bottom line nowadays isn't it?
purists prob wld prefer small ball, but that is not how things work here... not enough purists to make teams $$ so teams don't function that way...
If Japan brought a team over here to play, it would be exciting (I guess) but that is about it... take a team over there from MLB and the place would be sold out and people would be going crazy to get tickets, etc...
it's a mindset...
I don't think that this is confined to just American vs. Japanese styles. I think that in general the baseball in the 2 regions, (the Americas and the Far East) is more a product of the people and their societies. I'm probably gonna catch it for saying this.
The Americas (US, Mexico, Cuba, Dominican, PR, Etc.) have more bigger, stronger, athletic players playing baseball. We like thinks big. Over here, we're impressed and obsessed with big things like HR's, K's, and radar guns. So our game lends itself to our players and our society.
The Far East generally has somewhat smaller and overall faster players. They have an extreme work ethic and attention to detail imbedded in their culture that the people really appreciate, and probably expect from their players in all sports, not just baseball. So, again, their game lends itself to their players and their culture.
I think that our baseball is a better blend of both styles (AL vs. NL) than it is given credit for, its just that steroids era of the last decade or so has clouded it over. But steroidball is pretty much behind us, and make no mistake, for those who watched a lot of MLB, last season was the best baseball in a long time. Whether you like them or not, (sorry O's fan here) the TB Rays were so much fun to watch with their blend of speed, power, athleticism, and fundamental baseball. I found it funny that everyone kept talking about manager Maddon as thinking "out of the box", when I kept thinking he's playing the game that we're all playing at all the levels below! 1st to third, sac. flies, steal a base, bunt them over, hit to the right side. I'm sure this will continue this season and spread throughout MLB in the seasons to come.
BTW-I'm not sure what exactly a purist is, but before the past decade of steroidball the all-time home run, as well as the other major offensive categories, and strikeout lists were dominated by players that were in their prime in the 30's, 40's, 50's, & 60's. Our memories are often biased by how we wish that our memories were. Another visit to the HOF (one of the greatest places on earth!) will always help to clear those clouds and put these memories back in their proper perspective.
The Americas (US, Mexico, Cuba, Dominican, PR, Etc.) have more bigger, stronger, athletic players playing baseball. We like thinks big. Over here, we're impressed and obsessed with big things like HR's, K's, and radar guns. So our game lends itself to our players and our society.
The Far East generally has somewhat smaller and overall faster players. They have an extreme work ethic and attention to detail imbedded in their culture that the people really appreciate, and probably expect from their players in all sports, not just baseball. So, again, their game lends itself to their players and their culture.
I think that our baseball is a better blend of both styles (AL vs. NL) than it is given credit for, its just that steroids era of the last decade or so has clouded it over. But steroidball is pretty much behind us, and make no mistake, for those who watched a lot of MLB, last season was the best baseball in a long time. Whether you like them or not, (sorry O's fan here) the TB Rays were so much fun to watch with their blend of speed, power, athleticism, and fundamental baseball. I found it funny that everyone kept talking about manager Maddon as thinking "out of the box", when I kept thinking he's playing the game that we're all playing at all the levels below! 1st to third, sac. flies, steal a base, bunt them over, hit to the right side. I'm sure this will continue this season and spread throughout MLB in the seasons to come.
BTW-I'm not sure what exactly a purist is, but before the past decade of steroidball the all-time home run, as well as the other major offensive categories, and strikeout lists were dominated by players that were in their prime in the 30's, 40's, 50's, & 60's. Our memories are often biased by how we wish that our memories were. Another visit to the HOF (one of the greatest places on earth!) will always help to clear those clouds and put these memories back in their proper perspective.
quote:EH-
I love the post you put about "MLB owner's don't have enough money to even ask a Japanese player would like to come play" and Japan has players tied to contracts"
and then two sentences later you put "don't be suprised to see more Asian players in MLB over next decade"...
those are opposite comments....
Is Japan the only Asian country out there??
And believe me you will see more players from there if they continue to out hit out hustle out defend players from traditional powerhouses. JMHO
EH
The typical ML baseball fan does not want to see pure baseball. They could careless about watching guys move runners , bunt etc. They want gorilla ball. They want to see home runs , fireworks after every long ball , etc etc.
Ask them and they will tell you they would much rather see a slugfest than a well played 3-2 ball game. When is the last time Sports Center has shown a highlight of a perfectly placed sac bunt or well executed hit and run? Nope its home runs and webgems.
This is not Japan. People do not go to the ball park to see a guy slap it around the field. Not in America. Its just not part of our baseball culture. Its no different in basketball. A 60-58 defensive struggle on the hardwood is called boring. A 110 - 105 run and gun dunk athon is what people want to see.
I love pure baseball. I love to see hitters move runners , bunts put down etc etc. But the average fan quite honestly doesnt know what the hell is going on half the time anyway. Get me a beer , how about another hot dog , dang when is someone going yard?
Ask them and they will tell you they would much rather see a slugfest than a well played 3-2 ball game. When is the last time Sports Center has shown a highlight of a perfectly placed sac bunt or well executed hit and run? Nope its home runs and webgems.
This is not Japan. People do not go to the ball park to see a guy slap it around the field. Not in America. Its just not part of our baseball culture. Its no different in basketball. A 60-58 defensive struggle on the hardwood is called boring. A 110 - 105 run and gun dunk athon is what people want to see.
I love pure baseball. I love to see hitters move runners , bunts put down etc etc. But the average fan quite honestly doesnt know what the hell is going on half the time anyway. Get me a beer , how about another hot dog , dang when is someone going yard?
I know you guys are right about the MLB fans, and thats the way the product is being sold.
But you will see that winning also will put butts in the seats.
And any owner worth his salt will recognize that fact and go back to playing the game of baseball, not Gorilla ball as you say.
JMHO
EH
But you will see that winning also will put butts in the seats.
And any owner worth his salt will recognize that fact and go back to playing the game of baseball, not Gorilla ball as you say.
JMHO
EH
Bob Williams,
I enjoy your insight into Japanese baseball.
I believe they know more about the teaching of the swing than their American counterparts.
And.....I have to laugh at the comments about Ichiro's approach being 'handsy'.
His swing, and every Japanese swing I've seen, is very much a body swing with excellent loading technique and outstanding usage of the rear leg and hip.
And their knowledge of balance and how to use it is exceptional. Notice few if any show any lean over the plate. Their spines are as upright as possible while still being balanced over bent knees.
That is an important key.
I enjoy your insight into Japanese baseball.
I believe they know more about the teaching of the swing than their American counterparts.
And.....I have to laugh at the comments about Ichiro's approach being 'handsy'.
His swing, and every Japanese swing I've seen, is very much a body swing with excellent loading technique and outstanding usage of the rear leg and hip.
And their knowledge of balance and how to use it is exceptional. Notice few if any show any lean over the plate. Their spines are as upright as possible while still being balanced over bent knees.
That is an important key.
quote:His swing, and every Japanese swing I've seen, is very much a body swing with excellent loading technique and outstanding usage of the rear leg and hip.
How is "rear leg" used in a swing, besides as a foundation?....
quote:And their knowledge of balance and how to use it is exceptional. Notice few if any show any lean over the plate.
what is wrong with a "hip lean" over plate... since arms work perpendicular to torso, maybe they are gettting upper body on plane of pitch with the "lean over the plate?"
The Braves hit 3 HRs to beat the Phillies in the MLB opener. There were no errors in the game and Derek Lowe was outstanding.
In the opener in Japan at the Tokyo Dome the Yomiuri Giants lost to the Hiroshima Toyo Carp 5-3. The Giants scored their 3 runs on 3 HRs. The Carp scored 4 runs in the 8th on a 3 run HR and a solo HR. In that 5-3 game there were 5 homeruns.
I know that it's only one game (the opener) but sure doesn't sound like small ball at the Tokyo Dome.
BTW, If my figures are correct... The defending Japan champs (Giants) hit 177 homeruns in 144 games last year. That averages out to 1.23 homeruns per game. The MLB Champion Phillies averaged 1.33 homeruns per game. Basically 10 more HRs over a 100 games.
I think we tend to look at Ichero and think that everyone in Japan plays like him. Baseball is baseball! Japans most famous player ever (Sadaharu Oh) hit 868 homeruns and had a .301 lifetime batting average.
IMO, the one area that Japan is most different than the USA involves preparation. The Japanese players work very hard.
In the opener in Japan at the Tokyo Dome the Yomiuri Giants lost to the Hiroshima Toyo Carp 5-3. The Giants scored their 3 runs on 3 HRs. The Carp scored 4 runs in the 8th on a 3 run HR and a solo HR. In that 5-3 game there were 5 homeruns.
I know that it's only one game (the opener) but sure doesn't sound like small ball at the Tokyo Dome.
BTW, If my figures are correct... The defending Japan champs (Giants) hit 177 homeruns in 144 games last year. That averages out to 1.23 homeruns per game. The MLB Champion Phillies averaged 1.33 homeruns per game. Basically 10 more HRs over a 100 games.
I think we tend to look at Ichero and think that everyone in Japan plays like him. Baseball is baseball! Japans most famous player ever (Sadaharu Oh) hit 868 homeruns and had a .301 lifetime batting average.
IMO, the one area that Japan is most different than the USA involves preparation. The Japanese players work very hard.
I would be interested in seeing the strikeout numbers in the Japanese league verses the strikeout numbers in the MLB.
From watching their approach in world competition,their approach with 2 strikes is put the ball in play where I see American players still going for the long ball.
Am I the only one that sees this or is it just the world competition we see this?
I like the long ball as much as the next guy but when the situation dictates,just put the darn ball in play and move some runners.Am I alone here?
From watching their approach in world competition,their approach with 2 strikes is put the ball in play where I see American players still going for the long ball.
Am I the only one that sees this or is it just the world competition we see this?
I like the long ball as much as the next guy but when the situation dictates,just put the darn ball in play and move some runners.Am I alone here?
