Speedster

The only way to really tell is to put a stop watch on him.  So, I did so several times for this video and I come up with about 3.8 sec +., which is indeed fast . . .particularly for a RHB.  This would be well above average for a HS player or for any RHB at any level for that matter.    Putting a stopwatch on him during a live game with be the best way to get the best measurement.

PS:  If you don't have s top watch but do have a smart phone, you can download a stop watch app and take your own measurements. 

Yes, I'm getting something just a little faster in this video too.  But I would still call it at or around 3.8.  Speed is indeed an important tool as it helps a lot with production in that he will tend to get on base more often with those safe call.  And guys that are fast can get more extra bases and steal bases to get into scoring position.  It's a big plus if he can add this + tool to some other average or even below average tools.  Someone with that kind of speed can be a + in the outfield if he learns how to play out there and track down fly balls properly.  So, the coach moving in to the outfield sounds like it is a good decision.  

Good luck to him.  I hope that like my son's freshman year, he's bringing a big smile to the game and really enjoying himself.

Curious as to what his 60 time is . . . I mean, if he is truly 3.8 HTF . . . as a RHH that is literally off the chart:

Objective Tool Grades

See www.fangraphs.com/blogs/scouti...0-80-scouting-scale/

I believe Tanner English CF at South Carolina was a Right handed batter/speedster who was converted to a Switch hitter "officially" his freshman year at USC.  For same reasons.  With that speed FROM THE OTHER SIDE OF THE BOX as your leadoff?  Not sure how the switch hitting experiment ended with English at USC?  He used his speed in CF obviously but I seem to recall later in his career with Gamecocks he usually hit as a Righty, due to  an "injury."  Not sure what that was about?  I took it that the "experiment" of getting him to switch hit was on the rocks and he just wasn't comfortable doing it?  And with hid speed out of the right handed side of box he did just fine anyway.

HTF and 60 times dont always translate, but the 3.8 is more important. And what's nice is that it was recorded in a live at bat with a full swing, not a half swing trying to record a low time. I don't know if I have seen a 1.5 or lower in the 10 yard split, but this guy might be in that range.

#BBMOM-- Thanks for sharing. I always like to hear about speedsters. I could see that he ran track-- little wasted motion in run HTF.

Only because you asked, the ABs do look "best case" to me.  He's obviously a speedster, but he is leaning toward 1B at contact in both videos. Do you have a clip from an AB where he's driving the ball up the middle? I wonder if it makes much difference. There's an article on mlb.com about Trout going 3.53 on a bunt toward 1B, while his time on a ground ball to the left side was 3.82. I use a sundial on my kid, so I'm not an expert.

MidAtlanticDad posted:

Only because you asked, the ABs do look "best case" to me.  He's obviously a speedster, but he is leaning toward 1B at contact in both videos. Do you have a clip from an AB where he's driving the ball up the middle? I wonder if it makes much difference. There's an article on mlb.com about Trout going 3.53 on a bunt toward 1B, while his time on a ground ball to the left side was 3.82. I use a sundial on my kid, so I'm not an expert.

I agree that those two particular AB's look very much as "best case" to me too and of course it does make a little difference..  But still . . . he's pretty darn fast.

#1bballmomfan posted:

Ok because my lingo is limited "best case" would mean?

It's referring to the particular pitch he's hitting, he's already leaning well towards 1st base for a quick first step out of the box.  Pitch location when he hits the ball will effect his body position leading to just how quick he can get out of the box.

Speed is important but I would not try to concentrate on it too much. Work on power and staying back, getting a good turn and drive the ball hard in the air.

Most hitters won't be able to do the ichiro running hit and by trying to cheat out of the box they will sacrifice contact quality.

Of course I don't know that particular batter, just wanting to warn against focusing on home to first too much.

Super fast, like how he starts out low and head down. How's he hitting this year? That speed will catch the eyes of the scouts and if he has a couple more tools to go with it he will get some serious looks from the scouts. 

Some insight and things for you to look for.

Quality at bats: squared up hard hits or outs, 7 or more pitches in a at bat, a walk, sac bunt/fly.

What conference does he play in?

Are home to first times referenced in the table above typically only taken from live game scenarios, or is there a test where the player runs from the box?  

K9 posted:

Are home to first times referenced in the table above typically only taken from live game scenarios, or is there a test where the player runs from the box?  

Live game scenarios.

When will he be 21 years old?

He turns 20 in December.

#1bballmomfan posted:

He turns 20 in December.

Was thinking he might be draft eligible because of his age... but he's not.

Without knowing what the scouts notes said, I'm guessing he had some of the players on a follow list.  The notes could be positive or negative in that case.  If he didn't know about a player and was taking notes, they were most likely positive notes.  Possibly would write a report on him.

His running ability, is obvious.  He is an 8 runner!  For reference, we used to get Byron Buxton in the 3.8s from the right side.  He was one of the fastest we have seen.  2nd over all pick in the 1st round of the draft.  So in this case everything will depend on the other skills, because your son will be one of the fastest runners in all of baseball.

Good luck and I would be interested in knowing more about him.

the first video i got him 3.88 twice, the second video i got him at 7.98 because of the buffering,, lol, but got him at 3.66/7.  The difference is on the first video the first pitch high and inside 3rd, the pitch he hit was outside 3rd and wasn't ready.   The second video he already saw that same exact pitch and was ready and pulled it, launching his body toward first, hence faster time.  my opinion.

Are you interested for draft purposes ?

A friend of my son's is an OF at a mid-major.  We knew he was fast...he was a HS QB.  He made the All Star game for his college summer league team last summer.  Ran a 6.41 60....he had so many people talking that they made him run again....6.43.  He's 6'2, 210 with a lot of power.  Guess what....he went from an unknown to one of the top draft prospects in the league in about 6.43 seconds lol.   He has gotten contacted by over half the MLB teams and some of the projected draft positions for him are pretty crazy for a small town kid who had had knee surgery last summer and was only cleared to run 3 days before he put up those crazy 60 numbers.   You know what they say....you can't teach speed. 

He may get drafted, but the draft round won't  be just determined on speed but rather power, other skills, program he is coming from (who he played against) eligibility left etc.

My suggestion sit back relax, enjoy the season. If its meant to be it will happen at some point.

Opinions are great but only the scouts will determine if the player should be recommended for the draft.

Good luck. Enjoy.

He's fast.

Love the form.  Head down first 30 feet, stays low as he accelerates.  That's how a sprint coach would teach it.

2019Dad posted:

Curious as to what his 60 time is . . . I mean, if he is truly 3.8 HTF . . . as a RHH that is literally off the chart:

Objective Tool Grades

	Tool Is Called	Fastball Velo	Batting Avg	Homers	RHH to 1B	LHH to 1B	60 Yd Run
80	80	97	.320	40+	4.00	3.90	6.3
75		96	.310	35-40	4.05	3.95	6.4
70	Plus Plus	95	.300	30-35	4.10	4.00	6.5
65		94	.290	27-30	4.15	4.05	6.6
60	Plus	93	.280	23-27	4.20	4.10	6.7
55	Above Avg	92	.270	19-22	4.25	4.15	6.8
50	Avg	90-91	.260	15-18	4.30	4.20	6.9-7.0
45	Below Avg	89	.250	12-15	4.35	4.25	7.1
40		88	.240	8-12	4.40	4.30	7.2
35		87	.230	5-8	4.45	4.35	7.3
30		86	.220	3-5	4.50	4.40	7.4

 

See www.fangraphs.com/blogs/scouti...0-80-scouting-scale/

Who's hitting 40+ homers in a season at this age?  What time period is this?  4 years of HS?  

Midwest Mom posted:

2019Dad posted:

Curious as to what his 60 time is . . . I mean, if he is truly 3.8 HTF . . . as a RHH that is literally off the chart:

Objective Tool Grades

	Tool Is Called	Fastball Velo	Batting Avg	Homers	RHH to 1B	LHH to 1B	60 Yd Run
80	80	97	.320	40+	4.00	3.90	6.3
75		96	.310	35-40	4.05	3.95	6.4
70	Plus Plus	95	.300	30-35	4.10	4.00	6.5
65		94	.290	27-30	4.15	4.05	6.6
60	Plus	93	.280	23-27	4.20	4.10	6.7
55	Above Avg	92	.270	19-22	4.25	4.15	6.8
50	Avg	90-91	.260	15-18	4.30	4.20	6.9-7.0
45	Below Avg	89	.250	12-15	4.35	4.25	7.1
40		88	.240	8-12	4.40	4.30	7.2
35		87	.230	5-8	4.45	4.35	7.3
30		86	.220	3-5	4.50	4.40	7.4

 

See www.fangraphs.com/blogs/scouti...0-80-scouting-scale/

Who's hitting 40+ homers in a season at this age?  What time period is this?  4 years of HS?  

This chart if for major leaguers.  

And when scouts look at your kids, they try to project if and how they might get to such numbers if they're not already there.  If they ARE already there in more than one category and are ++, then it's very possible they'll be 1st round or very high round pics.

Stop watching 60s and HTF is pretty difficult, with too much room for error.  The method I use is taking the video into an app, which you can add start and stop markers, then get the true times computed for you.  Just using my phone and taking a video of your video, then using the app, I got 4.038 and 3.961.  Still very fast...  The app I use is VStopwatch

3.75 on bunt.

He realizes the odds and so do his dad and I.  He's a great kid with his head screwed on straight.  He's always dreamed of playing baseball as long as possible.  We have no idea where to start or what to do in this process.  How does he get his foot in the door or just get someone to watch his video?  Is there a place where the email address  are accessible?  How would you find out about area scouts? 

I've edited this post because I realized there is  information I left out.  He's running out of classes at current college and will either have to find another college to finish up his masters or try his hand at open try outs etc.

I realize stats aren’t everything. But six at bats freshman year and a .244 BA redshirt soph year with no power and not starting half the games isn’t promising for pro ball. You can’t steal first. When you’re pro material they find you. Tryout camps are a long shot. If a player beats the odds and signs as a free agent he’s typically low A roster filler for a year before being released. He has two years of eligibility left. He should stay in school, get his degree and enjoy the game.

RJM posted:

I realize stats aren’t everything. But six at bats freshman year and a .244 BA redshirt soph year with no power and not starting half the games isn’t promising for pro ball. You can’t steal first. When you’re pro material they find you. Tryout camps are a long shot. If a player beats the odds and signs as a free agent he’s typically low A roster filler for a year before being released. He has two years of eligibility left. He should stay in school, get his degree and enjoy the game.

 

This ^^^^^^

There's no reason to attend any camps/tryouts this year....yes, he's draft eligible, but that's not happening based on his stats at a small school and his lack of power.    Speed alone won't get you drafted.  My son is at a mid-major....and there are kids like your son everywhere...and a lot of them don't even see the field.  Guys getting drafted out of mid-majors are going to be well into the .300's with a lot more power.  It's likely going to take 10+ HR's for a mid-major OF to get noticed.    To get a look out of a small school, the numbers would have to be even better than that.  Even IF's looking to get drafted need to have some power.  A small school OF with little power is beyond a longshot at getting any real looks, even with great speed.    Sorry if this sounds bad....not trying to sound too harsh, but the summer would be better spent playing on a good college summer team ....getting better and stronger and see what that does for him in college next spring.

Thank you all for your insight.  I do appreciate it all and value the years of experience that you have. 

Here’s how hard it is for D3 position players to succeed in pro ball. Sam Dexter (ranked Southern Maine) was D3 player of the year hitting .400+ with power. He was considered good enough to be a consideration for the Golden Spikes award (best college player at any level). He was drafted in the 23rd round. After two years of mediocrity in A ball he was released. Had he played major college baseball he probably would have been given the benefit of the doubt and been in high A this year. 

http://www.thebaseballcube.com...rofile.asp?ID=203846

RJM posted:

I realize stats aren’t everything. But six at bats freshman year and a .244 BA redshirt soph year with no power and not starting half the games isn’t promising for pro ball. You can’t steal first. When you’re pro material they find you. Tryout camps are a long shot. If a player beats the odds and signs as a free agent he’s typically low A roster filler for a year before being released. He has two years of eligibility left. He should stay in school, get his degree and enjoy the game.

 

100% agree with RJM.  While he may be considered fast, I would not consider him a speedster.   Sub 6.2 or 6.15 is speedster territory.  Speed is a complimentary tool, to the other tools.   One of my son's high school friends an d travel teammates was a sub 6.15 guy who was recruited to play CF for an ACC team.   He was also followed by a gaggle of MLB scouts at all his high school games   His challenge was not running or catching the ball, it was hitting the ball.  When he got to college, the coach decided to play another guy ahead of him that was not as fast but was hitting .100 points higher.  As  RJM said, you can 't steal first.    He left the program after his sophomore year but stayed at the school to get his degree...smart move.     

I'd  give it everything he's got with his time remaining so he has no regrets.   He's got nothing to lose.   Good luck!

I've seen mention of start and stop markers using video and timers.  But I'm actually confused as to what constitutes a start marker.  Can someone explain.  Where do the scouts start the timer?

1.  The point where the bat contacts the ball, 

2. The end of the back swing (regardless of move to 1st). 

3. The very instant a forward move to 1st base is made.

Now, I've seen Hamilton videos with a timer but it's confusing because his forward movement often at exactly the same time as bat contact. So, watching those videos only adds to the confusion...  I can't find anyone else on a timer.

Robrod posted:

I've seen mention of start and stop markers using video and timers.  But I'm actually confused as to what constitutes a start marker.  Can someone explain.  Where do the scouts start the timer?

1.  The point where the bat contacts the ball, 

2. The end of the back swing (regardless of move to 1st). 

3. The very instant a forward move to 1st base is made.

Now, I've seen Hamilton videos with a timer but it's confusing because his forward movement often at exactly the same time as bat contact. So, watching those videos only adds to the confusion...  I can't find anyone else on a timer.

 

 

The point where the bat contacts the ball...  I would say on average stopwatch times are .2 or more off (giving better than actual times)

A 6.15-2 60 is blindingly fast, and very rare for a baseball player. Byron Buxton was clocked at 6.6 in HS...I think I read somewhere that he did a 6.34 later on. The fastest 2018 PG 60 is 6.34.

National Showcase in June had 5 guys under 6.3 with Jerrion Ealy at 6.13. I was there, he can fly!

Nice. A local kid clocked a 6.15 at PG and got national attention (understandably So). He passed on an opportunity to play SEC ball and got drafted in the 2nd rd.

You definitely need to hit even as a speedster. With elite speed you don't need plus power (see Hamilton or Gordon who hit 3-5 homers a year) but you need to be able to make contact and hit a solid line drive through the infield.

If you an 80 runner it is ok to be a singles hitter but if all you do is hitting weak dribblers, pop ups or even not making contact at all the speed won't help you.