NCAA will be dealing with a major scandal - coaches indicted.
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Holy crap!
From the AP:
"Authorities say the coaches accepted bribes in exchange for admitting students as athletes, regardless of their ability."
And now we finally have the answer to the question "How did THAT kid get recruited?" Just kidding.
Penn's former basketball coach pleaded guilty to a similar charge a few months ago:
The scheme involved students who attended or were seeking to attend Georgetown University, Stanford University, UCLA, and other top colleges.
I'm glad I didn't see St. Bonaventure mentioned.
Is it April 1? I thought we were still in March.
https://www.justice.gov/usao-m...sting-bribery-scheme
that's a long list of folks...
Holy smokes!
- "it is alleged that the head women's soccer coach at Yale was paid $400,000 to accept a student even though the applicant did not play soccer." https://abc7chicago.com/actres...ssions-scam/5186103/
- Associate AD at USC is alleged to have received $1.3 million in bribes:
https://twitter.com/nathanfenn.../1105506855315419136
- Actress Lori Loghlin is alleged to have paid $500,000 in bribes to have her daughters designated as crew recruits:
Geezusss... these schools, mostly, are supposed to represent America's finest and most reputable learning institutions.
It's almost like college coaches that are paid more than the dean care more about sports than ethics and the academic process.
Weird, yeah?
Wow.
Glad they got caught. Kids, who apparently were unaware of the parent's schemes, must be humiliated.
This is a new low both for overzealous parents, and some of the employees of supposedly HA schools. If I was the dean of those schools I would want the book thrown at the culprits.
Other than the coach pocketing the money how is this different than prestigious colleges and universities taking huge donations from wealthy alumni so their academically below average kids get accepted? It’s been going on for generations.
RJM posted:Other than the coach pocketing the money how is this different than prestigious colleges and universities taking huge donations from wealthy alumni so their academically below average kids get accepted? It’s been going on for generations.
Well, the school gets to decide how they determine whether to let a kid in. If they decide that a donation of $1 million -- or whatever -- makes it worthwhile to let a kid in, they can do it. As far as I know, the schools never agreed that they would let in only the most academically qualified.
Coaches and Athletic Directors accepting bribes seems very, very different to me.
This reminds me of an old saying in business that has kept consultants busy for years - "Where there is mystery there is margin ($)". There is plenty of mystery surrounding the college admissions process, so it's no wonder it is ripe for shady characters and backroom dealings, and people looking for a way to make a buck. Until they open up about how admissions decisions are really made I don't see this type of thing going away. People are always going to be looking for an edge.
RJM posted:Other than the coach pocketing the money how is this different than prestigious colleges and universities taking huge donations from wealthy alumni so their academically below average kids get accepted? It’s been going on for generations.
Bribe paid to school: legal extortion
Bribe paid to coach: illegal extortion
MidAtlanticDad posted:RJM posted:Other than the coach pocketing the money how is this different than prestigious colleges and universities taking huge donations from wealthy alumni so their academically below average kids get accepted? It’s been going on for generations.
Bribe paid to school: legal extortion
Bribe paid to coach: illegal extortion
Exactly
I was all set to rip on two of my cousin’s Ivies for being on the list. Then, dammit there was my school.
Bribe or donation paid to school helps other students at the school (new hall, training facility, etc) bribe paid to coach just helps that coach. Very different IMO.
These people have no shame!! Our kids have to work their butts off for years to get into these schools the honest way and many who qualify still don't get in! 
What happens when their kids get in to a top school on a bribe and then can't meet the academic rigors? Do their parents bribe employers too??
2020Hopeful posted:What happens when their kids get in to a top school on a bribe and then can't meet the academic rigors?
Attachments
SC's men's and women's water polo coach was one charged. 15-time national coach of the year, 16 national championships.
nycdad posted:Bribe or donation paid to school helps other students at the school (new hall, training facility, etc) bribe paid to coach just helps that coach. Very different IMO.
Fair.
What about those Honorary Doctor degrees bestowed on Athletes and Actors.
Pay to Play and influence peddling is rampant in USA
Back to Baseball- There’s many reasons why MLB will have 50% int’l players by 2022.
They just play the game at a high level and later for the academics.
Not judging
Well, there are legal ways to use money to your advantage. But I guess bribery works wonders where all else fails.
"This is an extreme, unsubtle and illegal example of the increasingly common practice of using money to get an edge in the race for a place in an elite university,” said Chris Hunt, who runs College Essay Mentor, a consulting service for applicants. “The more common practice is to spend money in indirect ways: High-priced test prep. Coaches so your kid can be a recruited athlete. Donations as an alum. Donations as a non-alum.”
Names and charges ...
https://www.justice.gov/usao-m...sting-bribery-scheme
Article with who the people are ...
Do y’all actually believe the kids applying to college (most of them, anyhow) didn’t know some of this was going on? Applicants were posed in fake photos as if playing sports they never participated in. Impostors took SAT and ACT on the kids’ behalf. The students don’t all seem to be innocent victims.
And I imagine there are a lot of folks out there feeling pretty nervous right now about their own children’s college application process. (“Out there” meaning in wealthy zip codes across the US, not HSB web commenters.) I always assumed stuff like this went on—the admissions process is a black box and the perceived value of getting in these schools is so high that it seems inevitable.
Chico Escuela posted:Do y’all actually believe the kids applying to college (most of them, anyhow) didn’t know some of this was going on? Applicants were posed in fake photos as if playing sports they never participated in. Impostors took SAT and ACT on the kids’ behalf. The students don’t all seem to be innocent victims.
This was my thought as well. Kids also tend to know where they fit in the academic pecking order. However, I also believe that kids tend to believe their parents when they are told "everybody does this stuff".
Chico Escuela posted:Do y’all actually believe the kids applying to college (most of them, anyhow) didn’t know some of this was going on? Applicants were posed in fake photos as if playing sports they never participated in. Impostors took SAT and ACT on the kids’ behalf. The students don’t all seem to be innocent victims.
And I imagine there are a lot of folks out there feeling pretty nervous right now about their own children’s college application process. (“Out there” meaning in wealthy zip codes across the US, not HSB web commenters.) I always assumed stuff like this went on—the admissions process is a black box and the perceived value of getting in these schools is so high that it seems inevitable.
Getting screwed out of one situation isn’t going to ruin a student’s life. If the student has any mental strength at all he/she will prosper some place else. People tend to sweat too much stuff not worth sweating. If a person wants something badly enough they will find a way. Sometimes doors are opened. Sometimes they have to be kicked in. But there’s always a way to get through the door. The mistake these parents made was thinking they could pay to be sneaked in the back door.
With or without sports unless the family is delusional the kids and parents know where the kid fits in. If you don’t get into one college you get into another comparable college.
A cousin was devastated when he wasn’t accepted to Harvard. He went to another Ivy. He’s now a senior partner in one of the most prestigious law firms in the country. He’s recognized nationally as one of the top lawyers in his field. It seems he recovered from the devastation of rejection.
The real question is how bad were the daughter's grades if it was going to take half a million to get her into USC? Wow.
I don't care much for the parents getting caught, things like this happens daily. I'm glad they outed the coaches though. I'm sure there is some kid at a camp somewhere doing all the right things wondering why they haven't received an offer.
nycdad posted:Bribe or donation paid to school helps other students at the school (new hall, training facility, etc) bribe paid to coach just helps that coach. Very different IMO.
There also is no quid pro quo for the donation. So I can agree to donate $20 million for a new university building (or imply that I will in the future), and the president of the school will not (explicitly) agree to admit my kid to her school. The college is a nonprofit and my donation is tax-deductible (in part because I didn't receive anything of value in exchange for my $20M). But if I offer a coach a payment specifically so that he will admit my kid, then we have a problem--even more so if I tried to claim a deduction for some of the unlawful payments, as has been alleged. So we have tax fraud, the coach has defrauded his employer, I have participated in a racketeering scheme with the coach and others, any emails, letters or calls I sent to further the scheme are instances of mail or wire fraud... the charges multiply pretty fast.
PABaseball posted:The real question is how bad were the daughter's grades if it was going to take half a million to get her into USC? Wow.
I don't care much for the parents getting caught, things like this happens daily. I'm glad they outed the coaches though. I'm sure there is some kid at a camp somewhere doing all the right things wondering why they haven't received an offer.
Fifty kids over eight years isn’t going to impact recruiting. Besides they’re getting accepted as non scholarship, bottom of the roster athletes. These are the slots where kids end up transferring or quit playing.
Loughlin’s has two daughters. One of them has a high social media profile with over two million followers. She’s been very open she’s only at USC for the party scene to enhance her Instagram profile. The family is wealthier than God. Her father is an Italian fashion designer.
RJM posted:Other than the coach pocketing the money how is this different than prestigious colleges and universities taking huge donations from wealthy alumni so their academically below average kids get accepted? It’s been going on for generations.
It just makes good business sense. A direct bribe under the table to the coach must be pennies on the dollar compared to an over the table contribution to the University. Besides, you will then have something to blackmail the coach with later if your smart and record the taking of the bribe.
Once dirty, always dirty.
So, what punishments are due: 1. The coach who betrayed his employer, his charges, his morals, and the kid who did everything right to earn a athelete reserved spot - sailing time or no sailing time - at Stanford; 2. The parent who made it all happen and who betrayed [fill in the blank]; 3. The kids who are still at the schools (you can assume or not that every kid knew); 4. The test administrator who knew.
A total betrayal of a system. And not a victimless crime. For EVERY SINGLE "recruit," a kid who colored in the lines lost a chance to go to, e.g., Stanford, Yale and get a good life head start.
In our community, we feel the betrayal at a gut level.
How many of the wealthy people do time? I say none.
Outside a plea deal for valuable evidence how many of the enablers (coaches, administrators, etc.) do time? I say all of them.
RJM posted:PABaseball posted:The real question is how bad were the daughter's grades if it was going to take half a million to get her into USC? Wow.
I don't care much for the parents getting caught, things like this happens daily. I'm glad they outed the coaches though. I'm sure there is some kid at a camp somewhere doing all the right things wondering why they haven't received an offer.
Fifty kids over eight years isn’t going to impact recruiting. Besides they’re getting accepted as non scholarship, bottom of the roster athletes. These are the slots where kids end up transferring or quit playing.
Loughlin’s has two daughters. One of them has a high social media profile with over two million followers. She’s been very open she’s only at USC for the party scene to enhance her Instagram profile. The family is wealthier than God. Her father is an Italian fashion designer.
I meant more along the lines of admissions tips. An athlete with borderline academics would most likely be passed over if no green light from the coach in admissions.
A New York Times writer agrees with me ...
“The wrinkle here is that the schemes were actually criminal and will apparently be prosecuted, and for once the colleges’ administrators were in the dark about them. But they’re versions of routine favor trading and favoritism that have long corrupted the admissions process, leeching merit from the equation.”
This kind stuff isn't new or going away. These people chose a poor route for how to go about it. I do agree it is a shame but honestly we have much bigger issues going in the country that in my opinion this isn't much more then a speed bump.
So, I think more information is needed before casting a net over of the NCAA. Clearly some criminal organization was set up to by some ring leaders, admissions officers, coaches and very feeble minded parents who happen to be rich celebrities. I wonder how far this thing goes down the rabbit hole....do we just know of a few crimes or is it more systemic. I've been reading up on this but I'd really like to know more. They keep repeating the same info, so waiting for a little more data points to become public.
My thought was exactly the same as PABaseball..."The real question is how bad were the daughter's grades if it was going to take half a million to get her into USC? Wow." The daughter must have had very low self esteem to watch the parents try to pull this off for her, and probably even lower now that they've been caught. That kid is going to be messed up and need some serious counseling.
fenwaysouth posted:My thought was exactly the same as PABaseball..."The real question is how bad were the daughter's grades if it was going to take half a million to get her into USC? Wow." The daughter must have had very low self esteem to watch the parents try to pull this off for her, and probably even lower now that they've been caught. That kid is going to be messed up and need some serious counseling.
At least one of the kids involved who is attending USC is an Instagram "influencer" with almost 2 million followers. Several major news stories have covered her and excerpted some of her posts. Based on those articles, I'd say lack of self esteem is not an issue for her...
A quick Google search shows USC students have an average ACT of 32. That's 96th percentile. Average high school GPA is 3.73. I have no ties to the school and live on the opposite coast, but based on the numbers, getting in is far from easy. (And no, a $500k donation isn't going to get your kid admitted at a school with the kind of resources USC has. Their endowment is $5.5 billion.)
Today's NY Times has a really interesting editorial about this scandal. They point out that the issue for the schools isn't meritocracy, but property rights. The colleges want the right to admit legacies or children of donors so as to maximize fundraising. When a coach or other employee takes money for admission, that person is, in effect, pocketing the proceeds for selling a spot in the class instead of allowing the school to do so. That is an incredibly cynical take, but there is a lot of truth in it.