MSABC - Nomination Process -

I concur with Trepfan.

The old school Maryland State Association of Baseball Coaches would have done the right thing (and have in the past).

The several HS kids you are referring to are so deserving as the Top Shelf Maryland players, (both on and off the field), the young MSABC "Exec" Board should be ashamed of themselves (and resign), but will not.

Summary, the new "Exec Board" of the Maryland State Association of Baseball Coaches are very very misinformed (and both on and off the field). The two 'coaches' from Montgomery County should apologize to all players, coaches, and fans not only in the great state of Maryland, yet within in the Greater Washington DC-Maryland-Virginia Metropolitan area. (Or better yet, take their heads out of the sand)

Sure it is stupid but then again -- look who is running the show at MSABC and what their primary interest is --- not to showcase the best players residing in Maryland but to look for excuses to limit the field -- ignore the Perfect Game/Baseball Amercica rankings for the State of Maryland, ignore All-American designations (Alfac/Rawlings/Under Armor) from the State of Maryland, ignore that they reside in the State of Maryland and have been ranked as high school players from the State of Maryland, ignore that many of their high school games are played in the State of Maryland against other State of Maryland High Schools --- ignore that they played travel ball in the State of Maryland (BCC), ignore the fact that past baseball players residing in the State of Maryland that attended Washington DC prep schools were included in the past.......

No the current MSABC leadership want to have a shot at promoting their kids from their respective high schools and to seek "bi-laws" that limit the pool of candidates ....despite the fact that several of the other kids residing in the State of Maryland but excluded are ranked no.1 and no.2 by Perfect Game and top twenty in the US by Baseball American for high schools players from the State of Maryland --- but will not be considered because the "revised" bi-laws prohibit them because they attend a prep school in DC (although they reside in the State of Maryland and are recognized by Aflac, Rawlings, Under Armor, Perfect Game, Baseball America etc.) as high school baseball players from the State of Maryland.

To bad -- because it cheapens the honor and overall purpose of the honorary designation and lowers the overall skill of the team representing the State of Maryland in national events.

You guys make me laugh. Let's start with Bear. Bear is very bitter because he isn't allowed in the MSABC anymore, since he isn't a coach. He used to come to the meetings and spew out information like it was fact. Sometimes he was correct on a kids ability or who might be looking at them college wise. However, many times he had no clue and had major miss information. Coaches were laughing at him when he would say "Joe Smith from Apple HS has a scholarship offer to Arizona St." And many times they couldn't be farther from the truth. So now he isn't allowed to attend the meetings and vote like he had in the past and he wants to run hard working guys names in the dirt. These guys aren't perfect, and they don't claim to be, however the MSABC is more organized then it ever has been. Bear, stop living in the past. Don't let some of the good things you do for young baseball players in the MD area get ruined by you spouting off garbage about guys that are actually trying to make HS baseball in MD better.
TrepFan- stop crying, those St. John's kids choose to go to school there so be it. If you go to school in a different "state" then you shouldn't be included. If a MD kid goes to play baseball in for University of Texas, he will be included in the Big 12 preseason awards, he doesn't get included in the ACC award bec. he lives in MD. And as a matter of fact, there are awards and honors that only kids from DC get.....Last time I checked they would be eligble for that. Stop crying. I don't care what their other awards are or where PG has them rated....Good for PG. Here is another question, how can St. John's not win it all last year with the 9 Division 1 kids? That might be unheard of.

Let me start by saying I have only been a member for about 5 years but in that time I think the leaders during that time have done a great job. As for Bear I applaud the fact he is trying to get kids exposure any way he can. As for the kids living in MD. but playing in D.C. I think it is a shame but I can see the point that it is a Maryland Assosciation. Maybe there needs to be a chapter started in just D.C. with the winner of the Brooks game playing the winner of the D.C. chapter and rotate it between Camden Yards and the Nationals stadium.

quote:

Originally posted by Terp_Pride:
.

Terp_Pride:

Should you want to step up to the plate and identify yourself many readers, such as Coach King, and others would benefit from your information.

(However, the over-under, (should history repeat itself) is 2009 ....before the posting of your 3rd blog. I took the under!)

May this serve as your Twelve Days of Christmas!
(but then that by itself requires a cost-benefit examination.)

With regards to your acusations, assumptions and perceptions: there a differing view points of many, and I know I have my own.

However, since any ink is better than no ink, thanks.

Several of the 'old school' MSABC members (contrary to you being very misinformed) have requested my attendance at the Dec 11 meeting at Crofton Middle school. (As so stated: since the 'new' MSABC has received, taken and spent my 2007 dues.

And some of the aging MSABC members have not seen any email announcing requests for 2008 dues, nor any email listing the player nominees for 2008 Pre-Season. (Organized? lol)

And the "Twelve Days" are:
1) I returned to an active HS coaching status
(just in case you are reporting status, but then who really asks or desires to find out before the MSABC Exec makes up stuff for such decisions. (Organized ? LOL ).

2) A reserve status was probably due to:
heart attack,
stroke,
respitory distress,
high blood pressure,
diabetes,
protesthis, and recently, an
enlarging prostate.
I received a good report from the Colonoscopy exam (and strongly suggest you seek such services, if of age) however results from the endoscopic retrograde cholangio-pancreatography were less than remarkable (which is a good thing). And since you wanted to know, the senility comes and goes as the task of remembering which fricking color and size pill or liquid to take, I really would benefit from a game time scorecard.

3) Will (you or the MSABC) be nominating Joe Smith from Apple HS this year?

4) I was pleased to hear my Dec 2006 MSABC nominations for
- MSABC 2007 Media Person of the Year
- MCABC 2007 Female Executive of the Year
were honored at the 2007 MSABC Banquet.
I have known each of these fine individuals for a long time, and each required recognition for their development of youth and amateur baseball.
(Organized? lol)

5) It was dissapointing to hear my Dec 2006 player nomination for the 2007 Pre-season Team was accepted but not considered by the MSABC.
Maybe you did not hear this fine young man (who went to school and live in Maryland) was honored as the 2007 Washington Post All-Met Player of the Year

6) I believe in altruism.
Not to bore you, yet not as a superior moral faculty that suppresses basic selfish urges (as you may believe) but as a basis for the elementary pleasures provided by the cost-benefit relationship of human cooperation from past experiences as it is examined for acting together to gain resources from other groups at this challenging time in history.

7) In other words, I have been helping and (hopefully) developing youth, amateur, and professional baseball players in the great state of Maryland, on and off the field, for a lifetime.

Should this be what you believe is "living in the past", then I think some just might be sorry for you.

I have never had any desire to 'run hard working guys names in the dirt' and vehemently take exception.
Republicans, altruist, serviceman & Chevrolet's don't do that.
Democrat's with ego's do.

7) Knowing and understanding the past (IMHO) is a good thing.
It helps know where some have been, what were their challenges and alternatives to such decision making, how the information supports planning courses of action, and offers guidance to what and where next headings, the how's and why's are a few of the key performance parameters. (Kind of like coaching a baseball game, ya think?) Organized ? (lol)

8) Would you happen to sell health and life insurance?

9) In my vocation, there is a phrase on the door (or in the clubhouse).
'Words Have Meaning'. (Organized? lol)

10) The last metric on the number of public and private schools in the Great State of Maryland was 480. In 2006, ~ eighteen HS were represented at the 2006 Dec Meeting. That's < 4%. (Organized? lol)

11) Any over-under for the # of HS's representated at the Dec 2007 MSABC
meeting? Since I went under last time, I'm might do the same.

12) Will your apology to the Greater Washington DC-Maryland-Virginia Metropolitan area be in a carol "Hark! the herald angels sing" . Does this mean I might be seeing your Christmas card hanging over the fireplace this year?

Good luck to you sir (or m'amm).

Merry Christmas

cheers,

Bear

ps. How does sand taste?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Spike:
/QUOTE]

Coach,

Efforts are in the embrionic stage, but not as a chapter as stated.

Telecon's continue.
Meetings planned to:
- visit the new Stadium with the Clark Contruction family who has mentioned it to the Lerner family.
(that is if a big enough hard hat can be located for my bucket)
- Line-item budgets are in discussion
- High level schedules and concepts being discussed.
- And should every one involved so far have any say, it won't be closed.
- A concern being expressed in a draft charter is never desiring to place any HS player in the middle of making a conflicting decision, should that ever be the case.


It could remind me of the ol'days when Martz Insurance pitched, hit and ran over Leonies/Johnnie's! (Organized? lol)

Who remembers the Baltimore Old'Timers?

cheers
Bear

is there any way to see a list of who was nominated

Wow Bear another post that is all over the place? If you are coaching again then thats great, glad to see there. Hopefully this won't turn into another "Whatever Bear says must be true meeting" I think Jason is doing a great job, in the past I never even new there was all state voting among other things. Those guys did the best they could do at the time. It is a thankless job. I think Jason is doing a great job. Not everyone is going to agree on everything. There isn't a organization out there that does. My issue is when someone like yourself is out there blasting a guy that is working hard for kids. Since you will be in attendence will you be "blasting the current MSABC officers? Will you be letting all of the MSABC know your concerns? I hope you do, I would like to hear how that goes. For everything 2 good things you do for kids, do you 3 dumb things.

Excellent post Bear -- Sounds like Terp Pride is part of the group of fathers/coaches from MSABC that want to ignore the best players residing in Maryland and play the "loop-hole" game. Why would the MSABC not want to showcase kids that reside in Maryland, are recognized by all of the major scouting services as living in Maryland --- (PG, Baseball Amercia, Aflac etc) that have received All-American.......designations (Rawlings, Alfac, Under Armor) and are RANKED No.1 and No.2 in the State of Maryland ---

Wow Trepfan you just don't get it. Who cares what awards they have one and what PG has them ranked. The MSABC is a state school organization. It takes kids from state schools. Not a hard concept. Those kids are great players, and have numerous honors. Congrats to them, but there has to be some kind of cut off for these things. The MSABC's cutoff is you have to go a school in MD. Every league or association has rules for these kinds of things. I am pretty sure if a kid who lives in Northern VA and goes to Dematha, I don't think he is eligble for the Commonweatlh Games or All state honors in VA. Does that make their lists less repituble? No, of course not. Here is what I think the issue is, someone at St. John's either a coach/parent/or kid is only worried about honors and awards. If you can't figure this out, then you really need some help mentally. And by the way still shocked that they couldn't win the league last year with those 9 division 1 players.

quote:

Originally posted by Terp_Pride:

So you liked the gift of twelve days of Christmas.
It's just that you were unable to capture all of the knowledge?

Holy cow, you gave me 40%.
I'll take 40% every day, and twice on Sunday.
(I knew that deep down inside you loved the Bear.)

Just think about what 40% does:
1. My ROI in 2006 was about 24%

2. My ROI in 2007 may be (and with a 14000 DOW)
closer to 20%

3. Of all the players in Maryland, seeing 40%
play at the next level.

4. Mr. Williams went by 40%.....once

5. 40% in better health last year than than next year could keep me around for a 30 year retirement.

6. A fourty percent raise....... Sweet.

7. In 2006, ~ 4% of the Maryland HS represented at the 2006 Dec Meeting. At 40%, a bigger place is needed than a Middle School (don't you teach there?)

Hey, I won the first over-and-under.
Can I double down for the second over-under. (I choose the under, remember.)

However, just to keep you from being mis-informed.

And since it's not about me, it's not about you, it's not about Woodyard, it is all about the players. Period

Scott Silverstein is a special, special baseball player.

I recently replied to Coach McElfish the following:
-----------------------------------------------------
I believe he will be an early rounder (and as I also believe) could become as notable as the following pro players (the exception being the two 1st round picks who made the bigs and stayed there: Harold Baines #1 pick in '77 W Sox & Eric Milton 1st round NYY) ):

(And to just write and consider him as the Top of the Top Maryland players demonstrates how talented and projectable this HS lefty is)

01. Mark Teixeira
02. Jimmy Foxx
03. Tom Bradley (7th rounder - College)
04. Ron Svoboda
05. Gavin Floyd
06. Genie Hiser (1st round- College)
07. Bobby Grossman (2nd -College)
08. Brett Cecil (1st rounder - College)
09. Bob Ferris (2nd College)
10. Jimmy Norris (2nd - College
11. Phil Corddry
12. Justin Maxwell (4th rounder-College)
13. John Hetrick (1st round -College)
14. John McCurdy (1st rounder - College)

Do you recognize those names?

(And I probably left off lots of other top players, like the Ciardi brothers, Schaeffer, Chorye Spoone, Steven Johnson (Dave's boy), Brandon Erbe others like yours.

Spike, overall Scott Silverstein is that legit. He's been playing youth, pre-teen, and teenager baseball in Montgomery County since birth. From 2005-2006 he took a big jump (6 mph) in skill, strength, and desire. In 2007 he took a bigger jump (10 mph). He should begin throwing again next Monday (Dec 10) yet brings with him an arsenal at 93-95 (late movement), a pro slider (also an outpitch at 81-83 and late movement), and a MF change with two speeds and both sides of the plate, and with a 75 rating for command, with a soft touch, and with a power arm (and injury free), I see him signing, (yet with a 3.85 GPA, may not be ready for the minor-league bus rides and attending UVA is not a questionable fall back position).

Your idea is interesting.
Good chatting with you. Thanks for listening
-------------------------------------------

Cheers,
Bear

p.s What info you got to keep this from getting 40% boring?

If it's that important that this kid be on the MSABC Pre-Season All State team, I'm sure Coach Spike could find room on his roster this spring. It looks like the kid has the grades to compete at that magnet school and I think his top two pitchers gradusted last year, too. There, it's settled.

And St John's will still have 8 D1 players, he'll hardly be missed. They'll still win the league, going away.

Bear no one wants to hear your mind nubbing dribble. Who knows where you get that **** from. That last post ranks up there with some of your other ramblings that don't make sense. Not shocked though, you have a habit of doing that. I will keep it simple for you, since you come onto this message board and blast the current MSABC officers, will you blast them to their face at the meeting? Let me know how that goes....

Bear,
Rules are rules, Scott doesn't go to a school in maryland so there for why would he be on the All State team. And honestly what does the pre-season all state team mean to a guy who is pre season all american. Last thing 93-95 thats a little exagerration.

quote:

Originally posted by Bear:
Coach,
Efforts are in the embrionic stage, but not as a chapter as stated.
Telecon's continue.
Meetings planned to:
- visit the new Stadium with the Clark Contruction family who has mentioned it to the Lerner family.
(that is if a big enough hard hat can be located for my bucket)
- Line-item budgets are in discussion
- High level schedules and concepts being discussed.
- And should every one involved so far have any say, it won't be closed.
- A concern being expressed in a draft charter is never desiring to place any HS player in the middle of making a conflicting decision, should that ever be the case.
It could remind me of the ol'days when Martz Insurance pitched, hit and ran over Leonies/Johnnie's! (Organized? lol)
Who remembers the Baltimore Old'Timers?
cheers

Bear

Bear, This sounds exciting. I am not familiar with baseball in DC so I guess I am a "Rookie" in your vernacular, but by your reference to the new Nats’ stadium, are you saying that a MD vs. DC HS All-star game will be played in the new Stadium?
"Line-item budgets" - does that mean there is a group of people that have formally met and are preparing a budget for such a HS All-star game? Does that mean they are preparing to look for sponsors?
"High level schedules" being discussed - who is involved? The Nats? DC Gov't (stadium owner)? Leaders in DC and MD High schools?
"Every one involved" have a say, it won't be closed - Who is involved? I would hope that if they are involved they would be for the proposal - not against it.
"Draft charter" - Sounds like the process is pretty far along.

Since you are bringing this up in a public forum, I would suppose you are involved and have authorization to make these discussions public. Do you have any more details?

It would be great to have a game (or series - one at Nat's one at O's) like this. Is there a NCAA limit on the number of All-Star games that a student can participate in?

Based on your posts, sounds like you were involved in MD baseball a long time ago. And since I am a “Rookie,“ I don’t understand most of your cryptic abbreviations and obscure references - a lot of what you post is unclear to me. Have you been involved in MD HS age baseball recently (other than as an observer)? Did you manage or coach a team last year? Scout for an organization? Another thread indicated that you didn't have your tournament (named after you) last year - are there plans for 2008?

I grew up in MD and enjoy HS baseball. Was at the MSABC Classic at Stone in 2007 - but didn't get to see a couple of players I was thought might be there. Were you there? Might be nice to hear some of your stories and recollections of the old days.

Old Fox

P.S. Happy 56th birthday.

Terp_Pride:

Believe me --- I "get it" loud and clear -- sounds like you either have a kid in the Maryland School System or you are a coach in the Maryland School system -- searching for recogition even though the kids that will be selected WILL NOT BE THE BEST players residing in Maryland -- "GET IT" ----

You are right -- the kids excluded have been selected as National All-Americans and will be playing for top twenty D-I colleges so it will over shadow the local inherently flawed MSABC process.

Take care and enjoy your "local" moment in the sun.

Bear seems to be a bear of a story teller. In his post about the MSABC pre season team he seems to think he knows the list. As far as I no the list isn't out and the one he published isn't right. Also on the list he published of the players and the committed colleges - some of the schools are wrong. (At least for a few)

Not to jump on the 'Bear is full of BS bandwagon', but of this list he published of the top HS kids in MD, the colleges some of these kids are going to aren't even correct. Makes you wonder where he gets his info...

quote:

Originally posted by scout10:
In his post about the MSABC pre season team he seems to think he knows the list.

Dear scout: I did not recently post about the Maryland State Association of Baseball Coaches All-State (MSABC) pre-season team! So should I just think about the G, then the F, and end with the U (or maybe you can read after all)?

Dear Mr. Miller: I won't make any opinion about anyone's decisions to transfer from an excellent public school and pitcher (in his time, and friend) coach i.e. at Howard HS, or that I voted for your son two (?) years ago for the pre-season Maryland State Association of Baseball Coaches All-State team, and I am happy to hear your son's arm injury recovered and look forward to watching him pitch this year, and hope he will stick to his plan as a ME graduate, yet I may consider accepting guff from the best part of the Miller family, Deb, not your cr&p (apologies are accepted).

quote:

Originally posted by Bear:

quote:

Originally posted by scout10:
In his post about the MSABC pre season team he seems to think he knows the list.

Dear scout: I did not recently post about the Maryland State Association of Baseball Coaches All-State (MSABC) pre-season team! So should I just think about the G, then the F, and end with the U (or maybe you can read after all)?

Dear Mr. Miller: I won't make any opinion about anyone's decisions to transfer from an excellent public school and pitcher (in his time, and friend) coach i.e. at Howard HS, or that I voted for your son two (?) years ago for the pre-season Maryland State Association of Baseball Coaches All-State team, and I am happy to hear your son's arm injury recovered and look forward to watching him pitch this year, and hope he will stick to his plan as a ME graduate, yet I may consider accepting guff from the best part of the Miller family, Deb, not your cr&p (apologies are accepted).

Ok then what is the list that you published?

As someone who has had the priviledge of coaching dozens of 17-18 players over the years who have gone on to various colleges/universities and professional baseball...I'd like to say that the MSABC Nomination Process is no better or worse than some others I have seen.

As an associate scout for the Houston Astros for the past 15 years, I can tell you that some of the best players (with the highest ceilings) haven't even been noticed yet.

Bear does alot of homework. He sees lots of players and speaks to many people. He and I have had our differences in the past, but his son played in our summer program several years ago...and I know he knows what a good player looks like.

These lists are next to worthless in my opinion. No one knows why certain kids are nominated and others are not. It happens and there is nothing we can do about it...other than starting our own lists, full of players who are placed their by our biases and favoritism.

larry,

I have no problem if MSABC picks players that they want even if I don't agree. It is just the way it is. But they picked the other night and did not put it out yet.

It had nothing to do with the list. If he clarified that they were his picks or he said I think this is the list but the list didn't come out and the school commitments that he put next to some of the players were just wrong. It was misleading.

quote:

Originally posted by larrythompson:

He and I have had our differences in the past, but his son played in our summer program several years ago...and I know he knows what a good player looks like. These lists are next to worthless in my opinion.

Larry,
Merry Christmas to you and your family.
I am unable to recall such past differences, (and I am hoping it's a little part of my pretty bride's Christian heart that helps me to forgive, forget and move on. However you are a friend of some excellent baseball friends, and thus I would consider a friend.
(and you can never have too many of those, either.)

With regards to my son (and my hero & breadth of fresh air). I don't recall Casey playing in the Columbia Reds "Program". And that would include 19U, 18U, 17U, 16U teams (if they are included w/in 'Program).
I don't recall the Columbia Reds have a 15U, yet I am sure Casey did not play with them either. Casey did play for the Maryland Reds 12U, which were not a part of the Columbia Reds, and played for a summer HCYP team, and an AYRA team. Casey absolutely enjoyed playing for American Legion-Cissel Saxon at age 14, and then consecutively up to age 17, before moving on to Bradenton, FL in the Collegiate Florida League after HS (the year Legion moved the age to 19U).

I think lists are what they are.
I especially like a list where I write (at noon) the name of the guy hitting 3rd, who is catching, the kids who shows up two-three hours before game time, and who has the ball and for a good 6-7 innings. Makes the job a little easier, don't you think.

Nomination process? Nadda. OMG, we are talking about HS teachers that coach baseball, here. They have bosses that want them to have lesson plans. Many don't like 'em, and try hard not to use them. No need to even talk about process in the classroom environment.

OBTW: I accepted a 2008 position to be located at the Fort. You may be hearing from me for lunch, and are the third baseball guy I know there (and of course should you want to brow beat fastpitch in the area for your girls, I've been around that great game too.)

As far as that other guy (or gal): I don't know him/her from jack; have not seen much, if any, data/informations/contributions/substance in his limited posts; has or is becoming borderline boring;, appears to be a member of the excuse club; and with 'misleading' cr&pola, kinda reminds many of a very old dress (or maybe that very funny beer on the head commercial); might be from the Down-Under Gang as a wankr) Might you be a wankr?

Don't know why I am humming that verse: "We fired our guns and they began a running, down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico"

Hmm, I think scout 10 and Mdhsbbfan had great points. However in typical Bear fashion he will dance around a subject, talk about stuff that doesn't matter. I am going to give it to you in simple terms.
1) Does Bear watch a ton of baseball? Yes
2) Has Bear been involved in MD baseball for a very long time? Yes
3) Is Bear a BS artist? Yes
4) Does Bear write and say inaccurate information? Yes
5) Should you take anything he says with a grain of salt? Yes

Bear you said ealier how you would be at the meeting and everything, did you go? Did you tell the new MSABC adminastration that they were failures? That's right we know the answer...it is NO, and that's because you are all talk. Heard from a HC that there was almost 70 coaches there and membership is up over 100 now. Not to bad in my mind. A whole lot better than it used to be. I am never going to woof guys that are working hard to promote the great game of baseball to our kids. Maybe you should consider that also.

Terp_Pride

[quote]I am never going to woof guys that are working hard to promote the great game of baseball to our kids[/quote --- Exactly --- "to our kids" --- which kids are you talking about "our kids" -- now you are finally showing your cards......you sound and think like you attended Maryland public schools. ---- good luck with promoting "our kids".

So everyone that attends MD public schools is not smart?...typical private school answer.

T_P:

Should you want to step up to the plate and identify yourself, many readers, and others, would benefit from your information.

Until that time, you are simply boring.

Regarding MSABC Metrics. 100 Coaches in attendance is a great metric. Should 1 coach be represented per HS that would revise to 25% participation. However at the Dec meetings, typically four to five coaches attend per HS (voting block) which really means 20 - 25 HS (which is an increase of particpating HS from 4%.) Let's allow you do the math.

And three more items:

1. You are wrong in "Bear you said ealier how you would be at the meeting and everything"

2. You are wrong "the new MSABC adminastration"

3. You are on a crusade to and state "I am never going to woof guys that are working hard to promote the great game of baseball to our kids."

I have responded to your alleged allegations, took exception to it before, and will proceed under all available alternatives. May this be a Cease and Decist.

quote:

Originally posted by Bear:

quote:

Originally posted by scout10:
In his post about the MSABC pre season team he seems to think he knows the list.

Dear Mr. Miller: I won't make any opinion about anyone's decisions to transfer from an excellent public school and pitcher (in his time, and friend) coach i.e. at Howard HS, or that I voted for your son two (?) years ago for the pre-season Maryland State Association of Baseball Coaches All-State team, and I am happy to hear your son's arm injury recovered and look forward to watching him pitch this year, and hope he will stick to his plan as a ME graduate, yet I may consider accepting guff from the best part of the Miller family, Deb, not your cr&p (apologies are accepted).

Bear, Here you go again on one of your rambles... I stated, quite correctly, that your list has some inaccuracies. Why can't you just admit it and call it a day? How/why you have to pull my wife and son into this is way beyond me. In fact do me a favor... leave them out of it. Secondly, thank you for the support of my son a few years ago, but you know nothing about his reason for transfer and have no reason to even bring it up. The school he left may be excellent in your eyes, but the school he transferred to had AP science/math classes that no public school in Howard county even offers and is one of the reasons he is doing as well as he is as a ME major playing DI baseball. Go rant somewhere else, but you're way off base on this one. (apologies are accepted)

You are correct Mdhsbbfan, he is going into one of his rambles again, where he doesn't make any sense. That is what someone does when they can't back up their talk. Bear ran his mouth about the MSABC and it's leadership, but when push came to shove he didn't go to the meeting like he said he was going to do, and he sure didn't have the guts to say what he said on the internet to those in charge of the MSABC. Bear you are a joke, and the more you talk, the more you prove it.
To the players that made the MSABC list congrats. To those who didn't, work hard and show up at the regional tryouts and hopefully you can make Team Maryland or the Senior All Star game at Camden Yards.

Bear:

Thanks for your original list of players that you submitted, including the 12? ineligible Marylanders matriculating at DC or Va schools (one you left out was Ft Washington OF Leighton Cooper, a ND recruit, schooling in Va.)

I can't remember when Maryland has ever had as many future college players living within it's borders as are in this year's senior class. Much credit goes to passionate baseball folks like those who read and post here, who have coached, followed and supported these athletes. What's the over/under on D1's from the Land of Pleasant Living this year?

To those kids that made the final cut -- congratulations --- you have worked hard and deserve the recognition. To those players that reside in the State of Maryland including those that have already been NATIONALLY recognized as the best baseball players in the NATION....and were excluded from this local list --- take it for what it is worth......"it all comes out in the wash" ---lets see what happens in May/June MLB draft ---

Best of holidays to everyone.....

quote:

Originally posted by mdhsbbfan:

I have received the following email from Mr. Miller.

"Bear, I have no idea who you are and don't care... I also don't care if you have issue with what I write or say. What I do have a problem with is you including my wife's name in your response. Your editorial about my son's decision to transfer is also out of line. I don't give a rats behind what you think about my son's transfer. Did that thought ever cross your mind? I am not even sure how your reponse has anything to do with what typed.

I'm asking you nicely, please delete my wife's name from your post and remove and reference of my son.?"
)

Should he purge his bs first, then.

quote:

Originally posted by Bear:

quote:

Originally posted by larrythompson:

He and I have had our differences in the past, but his son played in our summer program several years ago...and I know he knows what a good player looks like. These lists are next to worthless in my opinion.

Larry,
Merry Christmas to you and your family.
I am unable to recall such past differences, (and I am hoping it's a little part of my pretty bride's Christian heart that helps me to forgive, forget and move on. However you are a friend of some excellent baseball friends, and thus I would consider a friend.
(and you can never have too many of those, either.)

With regards to my son (and my hero & breadth of fresh air). I don't recall Casey playing in the Columbia Reds "Program". And that would include 19U, 18U, 17U, 16U teams (if they are included w/in 'Program).
I don't recall the Columbia Reds have a 15U, yet I am sure Casey did not play with them either. Casey did play for the Maryland Reds 12U, which were not a part of the Columbia Reds, and played for a summer HCYP team, and an AYRA team. Casey absolutely enjoyed playing for American Legion-Cissel Saxon at age 14, and then consecutively up to age 17, before moving on to Bradenton, FL in the Collegiate Florida League after HS (the year Legion moved the age to 19U).

I think lists are what they are.
I especially like a list where I write (at noon) the name of the guy hitting 3rd, who is catching, the kids who shows up two-three hours before game time, and who has the ball and for a good 6-7 innings. Makes the job a little easier, don't you think.

Nomination process? Nadda. OMG, we are talking about HS teachers that coach baseball, here. They have bosses that want them to have lesson plans. Many don't like 'em, and try hard not to use them. No need to even talk about process in the classroom environment.

OBTW: I accepted a 2008 position to be located at the Fort. You may be hearing from me for lunch, and are the third baseball guy I know there (and of course should you want to brow beat fastpitch in the area for your girls, I've been around that great game too.)

As far as that other guy (or gal): I don't know him/her from jack; have not seen much, if any, data/informations/contributions/substance in his limited posts; has or is becoming borderline boring;, appears to be a member of the excuse club; and with 'misleading' cr&pola, kinda reminds many of a very old dress (or maybe that very funny beer on the head commercial); might be from the Down-Under Gang as a wankr) Might you be a wankr?

Don't know why I am humming that verse: "We fired our guns and they began a running, down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico"

I know it has been lots of years, but Casey played for Stan Merson for a year. Stan coached one of our younger Columbia Reds teams. They eventually won a Dizzy Dean World Series the next season.

If I may, it seems the discussion has gotten off track and the focus has gone from the kids and ... well let's say it has gone from the kids.

The reason why or the he said/she said discussion takes away what we seem to have a lot of in this state. Some very nice baseball players, regardless if they get Pre-Season All State or not.

I speak with college coaches on a daily basis and I can tell you they love players from Maryland. Not to start a debate or argument, never have had one ask me about any of the adults.

With that we are all blessed with talented kids, whether they are are ours or those who allowed us the opportunity to coach. Let's enjoy them, mention them here, and stay positive.

Remember players do read this site, and in a funny sort of way we are teaching them with our approach, as well our actions.

Be safe and enjoy the holidays. It won't be long until we are all watching the game we love, as well the kids we love.

Al McCormick
www.mostvaluableplayer.biz

Al:

You are right -- there are alot of good baseball players from the State of Maryland --- that is why the MSABC selection process is flawed and self servicing.

Al, I couldn't agree more with your statement.

If Mr. Bear could show me the inaccuracy of my intial statement I'd be glad to edit it/correct it.

Now if he'd do the gentleman thing and retract his family/spouse reference we could all move on.

quote:

Originally posted by Al McCormick:
If I may, it seems the discussion has gotten off track and the focus has gone from the kids and ... well let's say it has gone from the kids.

The reason why or the he said/she said discussion takes away what we seem to have a lot of in this state. Some very nice baseball players, regardless if they get Pre-Season All State or not.

I speak with college coaches on a daily basis and I can tell you they love players from Maryland. Not to start a debate or argument, never have had one ask me about any of the adults.

With that we are all blessed with talented kids, whether they are are ours or those who allowed us the opportunity to coach. Let's enjoy them, mention them here, and stay positive.

Remember players do read this site, and in a funny sort of way we are teaching them with our approach, as well our actions.

Be safe and enjoy the holidays. It won't be long until we are all watching the game we love, as well the kids we love.

Al McCormick
www.mostvaluableplayer.biz

Right on Al! The head coach of Gulf Coast C.C. (Florida) told me back in 1999 he would take a player from MD over a player from Florida anyday if the two players had similar skills (and he could afford him). Players in MD play in terrible weather and on shoddy fields.

quote:

Originally posted by Terp_Pride:
You are correct Mdhsbbfan, To the players that made the MSABC list congrats. To those who didn't, work hard and show up at the regional tryouts and hopefully you can make Team Maryland or the Senior All Star game at Camden Yards.

T_P

As I have stated to you directly it's NOT about me, it's NOT about you, and for those that enjoy baseball, they know that I believe and practice, and have been blessed that it's all about the kids. AND I PRACTICE THAT JUST ABOUT EVERYDAY and IT IS NOT DEBATABLE.

I have responded to your alleged allegations, take exception to it again, and will proceed under all available alternatives. May this be a 2nd Cease and Decist.

As far as the MSABC, I support it and have paid my MSABC dues. I see no need to even inquiry about you, since it is reality of your inabilities to come out of the closet, so try to keep up.
OBTW: And to clarify so that you may be able to understand, the 'unofficial' MSABC list was made available by the MSABC Exec Committee and I have posted on a separate blog.

I am not thinking about the G, then the F, and finally the U for you anymore.
T_P you are 100% boring, and then, there is no reason for to match wits with someone unarmed.


Mdhsbbfan: Purge your blog first, & I will amend. Final Answer

quote:

Originally posted by larrythompson:

I know it has been lots of years, but Casey played for Stan Merson for a year. Stan coached one of our younger Columbia Reds teams. They eventually won a Dizzy Dean World Series the next season.

Larry,

From memory, that team in 1999 was a merger of two good youth teams from the year before, yet was under the budget and domain of the AYRA Reds.
The 1998 Maryland Reds (from SSSA - played at Fairland - from which Merson's oldest Steven briefly played). Merson's 1998 AYRA Reds played both in-house and some travel (I do remember the Maryland Reds five inning mercy of AYRA Reds at the NABF Playoffs at 6th Street. My friend Frank Jocko Svoboda umpired (and he frequently recalls barking at Merson before the game even started)!

Any way, about 7-8 parents from the 1998 Maryland Reds got together and asked what it would take to get to the World Series. The offer on the table in front of me was if I could figure out a way to do that, the trip would be paid for. I recall handing my 1999 recruiting list to Merson when I met his President of Sandy Spring Bank in Olney (Pres - he played at UVA, when I played at Terpville) the year before. So presto, those two youth teams combined, Stan coached, (he asked me to help coach with him at the 1999 World Series yet under strict doctors orders ...unable to....wife would have stopped feeding me....which probably was a good idea). I think it was in 2000, where Merson coached as you say, the Columbia Reds 15U and won a WS. Casey played American Legion for Cissel as a 15 y/o in 2000. Matt Montgomery also played American Legion that year (and I think you know that story). It was also Conrad's Bolston last year of baseball as he is now a pro-football player. (Of course I had to call Casey in Wisconsin to figure this all out, and I may be a year off or two. Good memories though, and of course it went so fast.)

Nice try Al!

I can see both sides of the MSABC argument. Let's not forget Gonzaga, as MD players have attended and played there in the past and may have some talented players this year also.

Not that we like it, I am sure most would agree they have to draw a line somewhere, or eliminate the line altogether. Before you jump to the conclusion of eliminating the line: What about the kid who is from Maryland and plays at a private institution in PA, or MA, or...Once the dominoes start falling...

Some may argue selecting to go to a private institution out-of-state means selecting to give up on the opportunity to be selected by the MSABC regardless of the players abilities. I believe Matt Mack is a top quality, even potential Pre-Season All State type player.

I do have mixed emotions about the subject, but as a coach I know one thing, inequities are tied to awards and with every award given, there are several kids left off without the addition of in-state players playing out-of-state.

In an effort to re-focus the thread without "flogging the dead horse, name calling, showing off, venting, ... " is there some method to the madness? In business I used to say, "Give me a Problem Solver, not a Problem Identifier!"

Eliminating the emotion, understanding the problem, is there a true solution to Maryland Players being selected to Pre-Season All State even when they play baseball at a High School out of state?

Al McCormick
www.mostvaluableplayer.biz

Al,

There are several things going on here.

One is the final list of players that were picked at the meeting.

I haven't seen any list and to my knowledge there is no published list yet. Putting out a list from someone that says I talked a guy that was there or publishing a list of players that wasn't finalized is irresponsible. Somewhere one of the players that saw his name on the unofficial list here is telling his friends and family members that he made the pre-season team only perhaps to suffer embarresment later to tell them he didn't. If msabc wanted to publish a list they would have.

Does anyone have a final published list? That is the question.

Al:

It does not take a brain surgeon or even a member of the MSABC Board to answer your question....If the kid RESIDES in the State of Maryland then he should be included in the potential pool of candidates. Just like Perfect Game, Baseball America and College Recruitment......these groups don't exclude a kid from the State he resides in ....if a kid is designated as a All-American -- He is an All-American from the State he resides in --- period.....the problem is that the MSABC Leaders want to recognize their players although in some cases they do not represent the best high school players that reside in the State of Maryland... that is what Bear was trying to convey.... it is that simple....

Not that I disagree with your statement, but if the rule is attending a school within the State of Maryland, comparing it to PG and/or BA, as much as you may not like it, is an Apples to Oranges comparison.

I do not believe anyone is questioning the talent of your son, LJ, or any other player attending St. John's, Gonzaga, Hill School, Perkiomen, St. Albans etc...A rule is a rule.

Now going forward I would recommend Mark present a proposal to MSABC, and if he can not do it, suggest someone else present it for him. I know he has connections with several coaches in the MSABC.

I also agree with not presenting the list until the MSABC does it, otherwise you run the risk of errors and hurt feelings.

All good points.

Al McCormick
www.mostvaluableplayer.biz

Trepfan:

This would be an issue for every state in America except Hawaii and Alaska.

How do the other states who have such honors handle this issue? How do the states, like Maryland, who are represented in the Sunbelt Classic (Texas, Florida, Ohio, Oklahoma, California, Arizona, Georgia) each June for the past 40 years, handle this issue for "border" players?

I see your point, and appreciate the talent of the players you are promoting, but this state high school coaches association first needs to get better representation from it's own coaches to nominate and support deserving players before worrying about the players attending high school in other states or DC.

Trep,
I have no idea who you are and what your axe to grind in this is, BUT I agree the line has to be drawn somewhere. If your child CHOSE to go to a school out of state then that is on you. The MSABC is a MARYLAND organization. Plain and simple.... You are really making an argument out of nothing in my opinion

So far it seems that everyone is trusting that the list published by Bear is the list. Where did it come from and how reliable is it? Has anyone seen any official list?

Scout:
"No axe to grind" -- the point is that the selection process does not reflect the "best high school players that represent the State of Maryland" -- if you exclude kids that live in the State of Maryland, and are worthy of the designation and are excluded then the selection process is flawed and lessens the honor of those chosen. Everyone understands that the MSABC is a "Maryland organization" --- and that they are primarily interest is in promoting THEIR kids....everyone sees that for what it is...

Scout:

The selections have not been published on the MSABC website. Unfortunately, some names on Bear's list are likely to be different from those who were actually chosen to the 30 man team.

I understand there was an internet/fax/write-in vote among the membership which provided the first half of the team by number of votes received, with each of those players receiving a minimum of 14 votes (there were nine who received 20 or more votes).

Then there is discussion among the coaches at the meeting about the candidates remaining for 15-18 spots on the roster. Some glaring oversights that were left off the original ballot were also voted to the team at the meeting, and apparently several rounds of additional voting went on in order to complete the roster.

There will certainly be some deserving players who were not included, but the MSABC coaches are doing a good job of promoting baseball in the MD and I'm sure next year will be even better.

Finally, it seems the honor has more intrinsic value to a deserving jr. who hasn't settled on a college yet. Shame on any coach of a deserving player, particularly a jr., who wasn't there to support your player.

quote:

Originally posted by baseball12532:
Scout:

The selections have not been published on the MSABC website. Unfortunately, some names on Bear's list are likely to be different from those who were actually chosen to the 30 man team.

I understand there was an internet/fax/write-in vote among the membership which provided the first half of the team by number of votes received, with each of those players receiving a minimum of 14 votes (there were nine who received 20 or more votes).

Then there is discussion among the coaches at the meeting about the candidates remaining for 15-18 spots on the roster. Some glaring oversights that were left off the original ballot were also voted to the team at the meeting, and apparently several rounds of additional voting went on in order to complete the roster.

There will certainly be some deserving players who were not included, but the MSABC coaches are doing a good job of promoting baseball in the MD and I'm sure next year will be even better.

Finally, it seems the honor has more intrinsic value to a deserving jr. who hasn't settled on a college yet. Shame on any coach of a deserving player, particularly a jr., who wasn't there to support your player.

Baseball 12532 - I know we have had some differences but I thankyou for answering the question.

Bear posted a list that was "his list" it wasn't an official list from the MSABC. You can totally disregard that list. I am sure the correct list will be out shortly. Most if not all kids that made the list have been contacted by either their coach or a another coach that attended the meeting. Congrats to the players who made the list. Also baseball 12532 to answer your question, most states have the exact same rules that the MD association has. Virginia has the same rules as MD does. Like AL said, every list or award has some kind of stipulations to it. This list is put out by the coaches who coach in the state of MD. Hence, why only kids that go to state schools get the award. If people can't understand that they never will, so be it. Not sure why an award means that much to a parent anyway. Especially when the player has numerous other awards that honestly carry more weight anyway. I guess that isn't enough. He could get the Gatordaide player of the year for DC though. Seems kinda selfish to me. Again, congrats to those kids who have been contacted, and if you don't make the pre season team, then have a great year and see you at the regional tryout's in May.

Gatorade Player of the Year for DC will go to either one of the two at St John's -- LJ or Mack...

For DC....what abot Silverstein?

We'll have to see. There are many fine baseball players at DC high schools. Whoever wins the award will qualify by virtue of attending school within the jurisdiction that the award is presented.....and also by having one heck of a season.

Agree -- both players (Hoes/Mack) are strong candidates for consideration.....and have been ranked very high by Perfect Game, and Baseball America as representatives of the STATE OF MARYLAND - since they both reside in the STATE OF MARYLAND and play for Maryland teams during the summer months. They will continue to be recognized as several of the best players representing the STATE OF Maryland by fair minded/non political constitutes ---- in the future.

Trepfan....at what point do you think we don't understand how good your boy is along with several others you've mentioned. Give it a rest....he has made a name for himself, based on his performances on the field, not his daddy on the boards or by how many awards he has collecting dust on the wall at home. Trepfan Jr. is going to have much success at the next level, but the rest is up to him.....not much more you can do now but sit back, relax and enjoy the ride ! I commend your persistance but for the love of god....let's move on. Best of luck to all of the boys this spring !

quote:

Originally posted by j2h6:
Trepfan.... Give it a rest.... !

Trepfan,

I, as well as many others, enjoy reading and hearing about the success (and struggles) of the local Maryland talent. I will defend your position to offer your opinion.

j2h6: Much information read from you is outdated and overcome by events (OBE). For example, info on VA HS players becoming Terp's have been out for almost a month. Just recognizing it yesterday is rather outdated. I rather hear Trepfan talk about St Johns players

quote:

Originally posted by baseball12532:
Gatorade Player of the Year for DC will go to either one of the two at St John's -- LJ or Mack...

baseball 12532 brings up a good point. If one of the MARYLAND resident players gets picked as the Gatorade Player of the year for DC, then Gatorade must not be using the "where he lives" rule that Trepfan so valiantly espouses. They must be using the "where he goes to school" rule. So Trepfan must think that Gatorade's player selection committee is just as out of touch as the MSABC group.

I would hope that Trepfan would campaign just as hard that Gatorade would do the right thing (as Trepfan defines it) as he is campaigning that MSABC do the right thing (as Trepfan defines it). And if Trepfan is related to a player that lives in MARYLAND and goes to school in DC, and that player should win an award for DC (like the Gatorade player of the year award for DC), I would hope that he would advise that player not to accept that award. I am sure that because Trepfan recognizes that it is wrong for the MSABC coaches to have a "primary interest in promoting THEIR kids" it would be wrong for him to have a primary interest in promoting HIS kid by accepting an award for a state (or District) that his kid doesn't live in.

Imagine if Gatorade didn't have a "where he lives" or "where he goes to school" rule - then one player could win both the Maryland and DC awards. Now wouldn't that be strange?

I suppose that we don't have to worry that one player would be on both the MARYLAND and DC pre-season All-State teams. I don't think that DC has a coaches association (http://www.baseballcoaches.org/stateassociations.pdf) - so DC doesn’t have a preseason All State team.

Maybe that's why it is so important to Trepfan that players that live in MARYLAND and go to school in DC be allowed to be on the MARYLAND team. Maybe Trepfan could try to organize a DC coaches association, or a DC pre-season All District team (he could work with Bear - who is discussing "line-item budgets" and "high level schedules" and working on a "draft charter"). That way he could be working to benefit all the players in DC, and he wouldn't have a primary interest in promoting just kids that he knows, because we know Trepfan thinks it is wrong for the MSABC coaches to have a primary interest in promoting just THEIR kids.

Trepfan is right - "everyone sees that for what it is" - and "it is that simple."

Old Fox

Trepfan - Just two points on this:

1. What about the kid that goes to school in VA and lives in MD? Should he be included in both states selections? I don't think so..

Shoud he be excluded from the VA list even though he plays in VA? That makes no sense. Remember, this is a HIGH SCHOOL COACHES selection and he plays in VA so only the VA coaches see him play.

It's really pretty simple; this selection is based on players that GO TO SCHOOL IN MD.


2. Administrative rules aside, I'm not convinced that both of these kids that you keep harping on are deserving, anyway. Remember, this selection is based on PAST PERFORMANCE, not on POTENTIAL/PROJECTION, as some of these organizations (Aflac/Perfect Game) base their ratings on.

Obviously one of them is a no-brainer: Two time National Team selection, First Team All-met - both of these are performance-based.

The other one seems to fall short on actual game based performance - Didn't make first OR second team '07 All Met; Didn't even get invited to try out for '07 National Team because of LACK of performance in Carey.

Remember, the MSABC selection doesn't care how tall you are, how hard you can throw in a cage, or even how you do in those simulated games. These are things that Perfect Game care about because they're interested projecting kid's potential. The MSABC selection cares about what you have done on the field in the last year, or so, not what you MAY be able to do in the future.

We could argue all day along about weather or not he deserves to be on the team, but I will absolutely say that this kid is not even close to being 1 or 2 in the state at this point in his career. One day that Perfect Game POTENTIAL may come thru, but again, we're talking about PAST performance and many of the kids on this list CLEARLY are superior in terms of past performance.

Bear....I debated whether to even waste my time replying to you, however, what the heck! If you click on the link below you'll see that the official press release for Maryland was just posted 12/17/07 on their website. Outdated? hhhhmmmmmm

UMD announce signings

Trapfan:

FYI, Baseball America this week has two outstanding players listed from DC (no mention of living residing or visiting Maryland frequently, can you imagine?) ranked among the top 100 high schoolers in the country. I hope your boy has an outstanding, record-breaking, projection fulfilling season.

Alert - Alert

There is another organization that has it all mixed up. They also are not basing their award by where a player lives - but by where he plays.

In the 2008 International High School Power Showcase Home Run Derby
http://www.powershowcase.us/index.php?ps=participants , the player representing DC lives in MARYLAND. Somebody needs to post 9 messages in the same thread condemning the selection committee from this group. Who is up to the task?

In a non-sarcastic note - congratulations to Chris Barker on his comeback from his injury. I heard it was a rather nasty shot to the face he took playing Legion ball.

OldFox...where does Chris Barker play ball? I had a player about 9 years ago...Alexander (Shooter) Starr...play for me. His junior year in high school he got crushed in the face by a batted ball. His high school season was pretty much done. When he came to me in summer ball, he was not the kid who played on our 15-16 team the year before. The next year he played for me, he was outstanding...and went on to have a fine career at UVA. I remember asking him the second season what he learned from the first season after the accident that made him struggle on the mound. He flat out said FEAR! He said it took him about a year to get over the FEAR. Good luck to Chris!

quote:

Originally posted by larrythompson:
where does Chris Barker play ball?

Dematha class of 08 - http://www.powershowcase.us/profiles/profile_dc_barker.php . If I remember the story right, he was at Thomas Stone playing 1st base for his legion team this summer and took a ground ball in the face.
http://www.gazette.net/stories/112907/bowispo140709_32360.shtml

Old Fox

What do you say we close this thread out. I believe everyone would agree we have gone way beyond where we need to be. Setting all the inequities aside, I believe everyone is in agreement we love our Maryland baseball player and what is neat so do a lot of other colleges and other organizations. With the holiday season upon us, and the clock ticking away towards spring and the game we love, let's agree to disagree and drop it.


I certainly wish everyone a safe and enjoyable holiday. What the heck, let's have a great 2008!

For those celebrating with their son's home from college, give them a hug, make sure they know they can call you anytime, any place, about anything and remind them "Success comes from working hard, and success breeds success!"

For those with son's in the military our thoughts are with you, and rest assured our issues are small in comparison.

As always, thank you for the opportunity,

Al McCormick
www.mostvaluableplayer.biz

On December 28th, Perfect Game updated their rankings for high school players in the State of Maryland and their national ranking.

quote:

Originally posted by Trepfan:
On December 28th, Perfect Game updated their rankings for high school players in the State of Maryland and their national ranking.

What do you think of the rankings?

On December 28th, Perfect Game updated their rankings for high school players in the State of Maryland and their national ranking.

can anyone post the list here?

Perfect Game only ranks kids that go to their events which makes sense for a natoanal orgainzation. The more they see someone the better chance the have of getting it right.

I am not throwing any stones. The kids they have listed are the best kids in the state but there are some that they are mising too.

Maybe one at DeMatha....

Link to Perfect Game:

http://www.pgcrosschecker.com/hsprospects/stateprospectswithrankings

Trepfan - that link does not work can you copy and paste? I am sure I am not alone in wanting to see this.....

1 40 Scott Silverstein LHP 6-5 225 L L St. John's College Brookeville MD Virginia
2 53 LJ Hoes OF IF/P 6-0 190 R R St. John's Mitchellville MD North Carolina
3 75 Kevin Brady RHP 1B 6-3 195 L R Gaithersburg Montgomery Village MD Clemson
4 138 Tommy Winegardner SS P 5-11 175 S R Riverdale Baptist St. Leonard MD Coastal Carolina
5 156 Tyler Hibbs RHP SS 5-11 160 R R Arundel Odenton MD Florida St.
6 242 Gabriel Feldman RHP 5-11 175 R R Notre Dame Academy CabinJohn MD Wake Forest
7 403 Paul Devito LHP OF 6-2 165 R L Arch. Spalding Annapolis MD Radford
8 566 Danny Hultzen LHP 0-0 L L St. Albans Bethesda MD Virginia
9 585 Nick Routt LHP 6-3 185 L L St. John's Silver Spring MD Mississippi State
10 684 Sander Beck MIF P 6-2 195 R R Severn Millersville MD Maryland
11 826 Leighton Cooper OF 6-0 170 S R Flint Hill Fort Washington MD Notre Dame
12 921 Carl Travers C MIF/P 5-11 165 R R Riverdale Baptist Huntingtown MD Radford
13 1039 Austin Knight MIF 6-0 180 S R Boys Latin School Peisteistown MD
14 1179 Austin Poretz RHP IF 5-5 130 R R St.Mary's Lothian MD
15 1215 Jason Patten RHP OF 6-0 175 R R Spaulding Davidsonville MD Radford
16 1233 Matthew Markey RHP 3B 5-11 175 R R St Pauls School Kingsville MD
17 1282 Hugh Adams RHP 6-5 210 R R St. John's Bethesda MD Florida Atlantic

This list, by Perfect Game, is not saying that these are the best players at this current time. This is just a list that the Perfect Game company projects could be the best players at some point in the future. Clearly, some of these have not proven to be the best players at this stage of their careers. There are clearly some here who want to believe that their player is the best at this current time. Sorry to inform them, they are not.

Like a said before

quote:

Perfect Game only ranks kids that go to their events which makes sense for a natoanal orgainzation. The more they see someone the better chance the have of getting it right.

Does anyone else have a problem with them rankings kids like this? Based on thier paid events only.

According to one of the posters PGStaff on this website they rank others also. I will give him the benefit of the doubt. If the list was correct I wouldn't have a problem with however they wanted to rank players but the list that they put out is not the best prospects in the state. They are missing some key players that were left on the non ranked list.

I think that PG leaves themselves open for scrutiny by putting some of the names they have on the list- on the list. People look at the list and say that this player had to pay to be on this list. I know I looked at a couple of names and I did.

I did look at the ranked player list and saw that most if not all attended PG events.

I think the poster on this website named PGstaff believes what he is writing is true. He believes in what he is doing for the players and it seems to be more then just a money making thing.

First of all, welcome to the HSBBWebsite.

Since you believe there are errors in the listing/ranking provided by PG, what players do believe have been wronged? Just curious.

also curious who should and should not be on the list?

Perfect Game is a pay to play but in my opinion most of the top players in the country have been seen by PG at one point or another. Is there another organization that comes close? Baseball Factory? Blue-Grey? I think not... Is there a better tourny than the one held in Jupiter? I think not....

I think everyone can agree that everyone on the Perfect Game list are very talented players with bright futures ahead. I also believe that Perfect Game is one of the best organizations for showcasing and evaluating players talent. That being said I think we can also agree that they can only evaluate players that they know about. There are some very talented players scattered throughout Maryland. One could argue that Calvert Hall is loaded with prospects which happens to be one of the best teams in the state,and no I'm not from Calvert Hall.



My point is that there is so much talent in this state you could have 50 players on that list and some would still argue about who are the best. Everyone has different opinions. I would be willing to bet there are some very good prospects that most of you have never heard of and would not rate them at all just because you have never seen them play. I think everyone should just congratulate these players as being SOME of the best players in the state and not be offended if your son or someone you know wasn't on the list.


Just my opinion.

Banditsbb

quote:

Originally posted by banditsbb:
I think everyone can agree that everyone on the Perfect Game list are very talented players with bright futures ahead. I also believe that Perfect Game is one of the best organizations for showcasing and evaluating players talent. That being said I think we can also agree that they can only evaluate players that they know about. There are some very talented players scattered throughout Maryland. One could argue that Calvert Hall is loaded with prospects which happens to be one of the best teams in the state,and no I'm not from Calvert Hall.



My point is that there is so much talent in this state you could have 50 players on that list and some would still argue about who are the best. Everyone has different opinions. I would be willing to bet there are some very good prospects that most of you have never heard of and would not rate them at all just because you have never seen them play. I think everyone should just congratulate these players as being SOME of the best players in the state and not be offended if your son or someone you know wasn't on the list.


Just my opinion.

Banditsbb

banditsbb: Very well said.....

I would also agree with banditsbb...

However, I also believe there is some correlation between how many PG events you attend (read: money paid to PG) with how high your ranking is.

I highly doubt that if some stud went to ONLY ONE of their sanctioned events (meaning they know about him) he would be ranked nearly as high as a comparable kid that went to every possible event.

Let's face it - they're in it to make money and they wouldn't do too well if they had very few repeat customers. And repeat customers get "perks"..

just my thoughts...

baseballguyMD3 --

Regarding your "thoughts" ---- your hypothsis has some merit regarding the "pay to be seen" reference --- but if you look at the top 100 high school kids ranked -- they appear legit ---- I think as you work your way down the rankings some of the players noted would not have been recognized nor ranked if they had not participated in several PG events. In some cases, although a player attended multiple PG events his ranking did not elevate ---

quote:

Originally posted by Trepfan:
baseballguyMD3 --

Regarding your "thoughts" ---- your hypothsis has some merit regarding the "pay to be seen" reference --- but if you look at the top 100 high school kids ranked -- they appear legit ---- I think as you work your way down the rankings some of the players noted would not have been recognized nor ranked if they had not participated in several PG events. In some cases, although a player attended multiple PG events his ranking did not elevate ---

yea, but we are only talking about Maryland here.

If a certain pitcher from the WCAC produces similarly to what he has in past seasons and ends up as an honorable mention selection within his school league -- will the first and second team pitchers selected ahead of him be immediately promoted to major league rosters?

After all, the PG events he paid to attend has him ranked "really high".

banditsbb said it best when he points out that we should 'celebrate' the acccomplishments and recognition of all of the players from our state. Who is ranked and where is inconsequential. Tons of MD kids are going on to play in college, this may be the best overalll class so far!

For one who has both worked with numerous recruiters and scouts, and has known many for years, let me start by saying all these ratings are biased to say the least. All of the recruiters and scouts I know realize this. One is only mentioned on certain sites if the pay to join. trust me the colleges and pros know who the players are out there. I applaud any group who tries to push our young men out there but really the truly great ones are already known. There really is not the need to "pimp" them out there.

Spike,

quote:

let me start by saying all these ratings are biased to say the least.

Part of this I agree with and part I don't. That is why you have to be really careful what showcases you attend. Many are there just to get your money plain and simple. Others like Perfect Game are very well respected by colleges (can't speak for scouts because I don't know any).

quote:

There really is not the need to "pimp" them out there.

I believe this statement is very demeaning to a parent who takes their kid to a showcase. I also believe it carries no weight. I will use my sons area as an example since this area I'm familiar with. My son plays for a public school in Baltimore county. Although there are some very good county teams most are not. There are some excellent players in the county that will get no recognition because they will not be seen by anyone other then family and friends at High School games.

I will use my son as a example. I would be willing to bet that no one knows who he is on this site. Last February my son attended a Perfect Game State Showcase. It was his first showcase and he hit 86 on a stalker gun(age 15). Later that year he was pitching in a high school game and I noticed a parent from the other team gunning the pitchers (juggs gun). After the game he asked me if my son was the pitcher for our team. He told me he was throwing 89 mph in the 7th inning (had 14 k's that game). I can guarantee that nobody other than parents saw him pitch that day. Yet because of the Perfect Game Showcase we have recieved many questionnaires and some e-mails from colleges and coaches. We were also contacted by two out of state teams about pitching for them in the Perfect Game Tournament in Jupiter Florida in Oct. for last year. My son has also been to the Southern Maryland pitchers camp. If my son threw in the nineties you would probably be right and not need to go somewhere to be seen, but that isn't the case.

quote:

trust me the colleges and pros know who the players are out there.

Here is a e-mail from a D-1 college in Maryland sent to us for our son. I will not show who it is from because I don't know if they would get mad at my son for showing it.


"Let me know when he starts throwing in games next fall and I would like to come see him throw. When he starts throwing in games you have to make sure there are some sort of pitch counts. We make sure all of our pitchers are on pitch counts, start at 50-60 pitches in late Feb. to a max of 120 in May. Personally I wouldn't let one of our pitchers go higher than 120. We gradually build up our pitchers from when they start throwing in mid-January to the end of our season in late May. Here is link to a website that looks at pitch counts and pitcher abuse at every Division I school in the country. http://boydsworld.com/data/2007_teams_pap.html
I've been to Perfect Game the last two falls. All the big-time players from all over the country are there.. There are like 20 fields at the complex and they have games going on at all the fields from morning to sunset. Talk to you soon!"


My son is a junior recovering from Tommy John surgery and one of his goals are to pitch in the P.G. Game in Florida next Oct. That is why the coach was talking about Perfect Game. IT seems this coach finds it worth his time to go all the way to Florida to watch players at Perfect Game.


I think in the end it's up to each parent to choose what's best for their child. Saying that because they pay to go to a camp or showcase is the only reason they are graded the way they are is uncalled for. Just if you choose to attend a camp or showcase do your homework. Sorry for the long post.


Banditsbb

quote:

Originally posted by banditsbb:
Spike,

quote:

let me start by saying all these ratings are biased to say the least.

Part of this I agree with and part I don't. That is why you have to be really careful what showcases you attend. Many are there just to get your money plain and simple. Others like Perfect Game are very well respected by colleges (can't speak for scouts because I don't know any).

quote:

There really is not the need to "pimp" them out there.

I believe this statement is very demeaning to a parent who takes their kid to a showcase. I also believe it carries no weight. I will use my sons area as an example since this area I'm familiar with. My son plays for a public school in Baltimore county. Although there are some very good county teams most are not. There are some excellent players in the county that will get no recognition because they will not be seen by anyone other then family and friends at High School games.

I will use my son as a example. I would be willing to bet that no one knows who he is on this site. Last February my son attended a Perfect Game State Showcase. It was his first showcase and he hit 86 on a stalker gun(age 15). Later that year he was pitching in a high school game and I noticed a parent from the other team gunning the pitchers (juggs gun). After the game he asked me if my son was the pitcher for our team. He told me he was throwing 89 mph in the 7th inning (had 14 k's that game). I can guarantee that nobody other than parents saw him pitch that day. Yet because of the Perfect Game Showcase we have recieved many questionnaires and some e-mails from colleges and coaches. We were also contacted by two out of state teams about pitching for them in the Perfect Game Tournament in Jupiter Florida in Oct. for last year. My son has also been to the Southern Maryland pitchers camp. If my son threw in the nineties you would probably be right and not need to go somewhere to be seen, but that isn't the case.

quote:

trust me the colleges and pros know who the players are out there.

Here is a e-mail from a D-1 college in Maryland sent to us for our son. I will not show who it is from because I don't know if they would get mad at my son for showing it.


"Let me know when he starts throwing in games next fall and I would like to come see him throw. When he starts throwing in games you have to make sure there are some sort of pitch counts. We make sure all of our pitchers are on pitch counts, start at 50-60 pitches in late Feb. to a max of 120 in May. Personally I wouldn't let one of our pitchers go higher than 120. We gradually build up our pitchers from when they start throwing in mid-January to the end of our season in late May. Here is link to a website that looks at pitch counts and pitcher abuse at every Division I school in the country. http://boydsworld.com/data/2007_teams_pap.html
I've been to Perfect Game the last two falls. All the big-time players from all over the country are there.. There are like 20 fields at the complex and they have games going on at all the fields from morning to sunset. Talk to you soon!"


My son is a junior recovering from Tommy John surgery and one of his goals are to pitch in the P.G. Game in Florida next Oct. That is why the coach was talking about Perfect Game. IT seems this coach finds it worth his time to go all the way to Florida to watch players at Perfect Game.


I think in the end it's up to each parent to choose what's best for their child. Saying that because they pay to go to a camp or showcase is the only reason they are graded the way they are is uncalled for. Just if you choose to attend a camp or showcase do your homework. Sorry for the long post.


Banditsbb

Hey Bandidsbb I think you are over reacting to these comments. I see that you have a Junior so this means you are still new to this. I think you better put your seat belt on and get ready for the ride.

Recruiting is heartless. Even the coaches will tell you that. As far as your letter it is nice but the only letter that will matter is the signed letter of intent.

For every event your son attends he will get anywhere from 10 to 50 letters. Some will be hand written and some will look like they just went to your son but come next Fall when it matters you will be lucky if many of these coaches remember who he is. Don't take it personally they just move on to the next thing. Sorry but it is just the way it is.

Here is some advice for you.

1) Stop looking at the guns. Each brand says something else.

2) He better develop a 2nd and 3rd pitch that he can throw confidently.

3) Forget High School. It doesn't matter what he does there just have fun and play the best he can. All county, all state, all whatever. All doesn't mean anything in the big picture.

4) Find a good summer team. - Good competition.

5) Find him the best Fall Showcase team he can find to compliment the PG Showcases. You need both.

6) List 5 to 10 schools that he wants to go to. Ones that are realistic. Have HIM contact the coach - not you. Short email telling them that he is interested in that school and where he will be playing (or phone call). Most College coaches will make an effort to come see him. Be truthful. if you throw 88 don't say 90.

7)Visit the schools and take the tour. When you are done ask your son if he could see himself going to that school if he gets hurt and can't play baseball.

It sounds like your son will have many options. be patient.

One more thing. As far as the letter goes you better check out the 120 pitches even if he works his way up. That is too much for a 16 or 17 year old.

I hope what I wrote was helpful.

I think you mistook my words. I agree the parent should be out there doing what ever he can to get the kids exposed. The pimping I was talking bout are the numerous give me $500 or so and I will get you kid seen. Granted PG and a few others are very respectable but there are some out the that I feel are scams. As for high school you are right. Kids in this area really dont get seen in hs, it is all about the right fit in a summer team. You are also correct that Baltimore County as a whole is not the best. Your high school coach should be out getting those extra games and tourny's, scrimmages with the best he can find. Sorry I did not make make statement clear.

Mdbaseballcoach,

quote:

Hey Banditsbb I think you are over reacting to these comments. I see that you have a Junior so this means you are still new to this. I think you better put your seat belt on and get ready for the ride.

Not over reacting at all and hope it doesn't seem that way. I also am not unfamiliar with the recruiting process. The point of the post had nothing to do with my son, and only tried to use him as a example. IF he plays college ball or not will be up to him. My point is that there are different avenue's that players take to reach their goals. For someone to say that all players grades are biased to me is uncalled for.

quote:

Here is some advice for you. 1-7

Very good advice that I totally agree with, and no I don't speak for him. I have coached long enough to know that parents are one thing the coach doesn't want to deal with. I would imagine that parents have caused many players to not be recruited.

quote:

One more thing. As far as the letter goes you better check out the 120 pitches even if he works his way up. That is too much for a 16 or 17 year old.

Those pitch counts are for college teams. The reason the coach gave me that link was because my son threw 148 pitches in the game before he tore his ucl (tore it in next game). The reason for the high pitch count was the 14 k's but also 7 walks. I was very upset and told the pitching coach so. Many coaches advise the parents to just sit back and watch the game and let the coaches coach. As a parent you don't want to interfere because you don't want to cause your son problems. So I agree with your statement that coaches want to hear from the player and not the parent. Just be sure that the coach is someone you want your son to play for and that the school you choose is the best fit for your son. If they have talent they will also have options.



Banditsbb

Spike,


I totally agree with your last post. There are very many showcases that will tell you anything and lead the players on. Thats why you better do your homework or just chock it up as a family vacation.


Banditsbb

Enough with the love fest already! Al...can you step in here before the heavy breathing starts?

Just kidding...good discussion. 1-7 were really good and accurate as all get out!

quote:

Originally posted by banditsbb:
Mdbaseballcoach,

quote:

Hey Banditsbb I think you are over reacting to these comments. I see that you have a Junior so this means you are still new to this. I think you better put your seat belt on and get ready for the ride.

Not over reacting at all and hope it doesn't seem that way. I also am not unfamiliar with the recruiting process. The point of the post had nothing to do with my son, and only tried to use him as a example. IF he plays college ball or not will be up to him. My point is that there are different avenue's that players take to reach their goals. For someone to say that all players grades are biased to me is uncalled for.

quote:

Here is some advice for you. 1-7

Very good advice that I totally agree with, and no I don't speak for him. I have coached long enough to know that parents are one thing the coach doesn't want to deal with. I would imagine that parents have caused many players to not be recruited.

quote:

One more thing. As far as the letter goes you better check out the 120 pitches even if he works his way up. That is too much for a 16 or 17 year old.

Those pitch counts are for college teams. The reason the coach gave me that link was because my son threw 148 pitches in the game before he tore his ucl (tore it in next game). The reason for the high pitch count was the 14 k's but also 7 walks. I was very upset and told the pitching coach so. Many coaches advise the parents to just sit back and watch the game and let the coaches coach. As a parent you don't want to interfere because you don't want to cause your son problems. So I agree with your statement that coaches want to hear from the player and not the parent. Just be sure that the coach is someone you want your son to play for and that the school you choose is the best fit for your son. If they have talent they will also have options.



Banditsbb

Banditsbb - 14 Ks is no reason to let a player at 16 or 17 or 18 for that matter go 148 pitches. The majors won't let their guys go that much why should a 16 year old who is still growing.

I am sure you learned from this experience and feel terrible for not stepping in. Yes a coach doesn't want to hear from parents because most of the time the parent thinks that little Johnny should get more playing time.

At 16 you need to watch the pitch counts and step in if you have to. Tell your son that he has to say no. Ask for a meeting before the season starts to discuss a limit to how many pitches your son will throw. No matter who is winning the game.

Your high school coach may get the win but your son will end up never playing again.

I know that some on this board will say that going 148 pitches is OK...but that has never been and will never be my philosophy.

Pitching is a tearing down process. The elevated mound causes loss of strength in the legs. In the later innings, once a pitcher loses his legs, he immediately induces more stress on his shoulder and elbow.

Even a pie thrower (an 18 year old lefty who throws 75-78), who most people say "can throw forever", needs to come out at some point.

Another factor we consider during the summer is how much a pitcher threw for his high school team in the spring.