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A lot of these kids can't afford or don't want to spend the money to come back, and it goes down the line I'm sure. My understanding is everyone gets a year of eligibility back. My son is committed to a school with 10 seniors (2 are grad students).

Anyway, until there is more clarity not much I  can worry about now.

hshuler posted:

I love this decision but (IMO) it’s is going to create a lot of disappointment because lots of these kids won’t be asked to come back because of incoming freshmen. 

I didn't think about this.  I guess the coaches might trim from each class to get rosters in line quickly.  It could be brutal for the tail of the rosters.  

... and I didn't think about underclassmen getting their year back as well.  In my mind, it would be a consideration just for seniors.  But, if true and all get another year, this could have more of an impact on recruiting than expected.  It still seems the fair and right thing to do... but may certainly make life interesting for the next few incoming classes.

cabbagedad posted:

... and I didn't think about underclassmen getting their year back as well.  In my mind, it would be a consideration just for seniors.  But, if true and all get another year, this could have more of an impact on recruiting than expected.  It still seems the fair and right thing to do... but may certainly make life interesting for the next few incoming classes.

Why would it be only seniors?  Everyone has been affected. The way I look at this:  there will be more talented players than ever on each roster, at each level. Guys may need to transfer down a level, depending on what’s coming in behind them. But, at least guys will have that option (possibly). The top guys from top programs will be lost to the draft as usual.  Other division 1 programs may become more competitive with higher RPI programs. It could make for a very fun to watch season. Domino effect for each level. 

RoadRunner posted:

Eoker, it’s always cut throat. Coach will keep the players that he thinks will get the most wins. If you signed a LOI, it won’t matter. He’ll let ya know your services are no longer needed. “We’re going in a different direction.”  Etc. 

Just more knives and more throats next year. 

RoadRunner posted:

Eoker, it’s always cut throat. Coach will keep the players that he thinks will get the most wins. If you signed a LOI, it won’t matter. He’ll let ya know your services are no longer needed. “We’re going in a different direction.”  Etc. 

It is, but this goes back to what's often said here, do your research about the program you're going into.Obviously you can't research this, but IMO this is not the same situation as just going in and knowing you have to compete.

I don don't know what the answer is. I do this this is more likely to affect 2021s. Lots of seniors will already have jobs lined up.

Of course I'm biased having a 2020 and 2022, but would be nice to allow 2020s and 2021s a one time transfer under certain conditions, I'm not sure exactly what those conditions would be, depends what the NCAA ends up doing.

Probably a stupid question, but the the statement from the NCAA specifies eligibility relief for D1 athletes. Any guess as to why it isn't "D1 and D2"?

Reading the NCAA website, it appears that the cancellation may affect some D2 athletes as well. Or am I reading it wrong?

"Division II student-athletes must complete their four seasons of competition within the first 10 semesters or 15 quarters of full-time enrollment."

Yep definitely cut throat. Didn't say it wasn't or wouldn't be. But I sure wouldn't want to be at a Vandy or Ark with 19-20 coming in each of the next 2 years classes. Ark loves their JUCO transfers, so does Tx A&M.  A lot more guys fighting for roster spots there. The guys are going D1, it's always going to be cut throat and every year, they bring in more people trying to take your job.

Image result for captain obvious

 

Last edited by Eokerholm
jacjacatk posted:

Curious how it'll work out for DIII guys going to grad school, like my son. He's eligible for a medical redshirt for this season, to boot, having just had wrist surgery. He's been accepted to several schools already, though no word yet from the one he applied to where he thinks he'd have the best chance to play.

Are you thinking he would get 2 additional years?  That would be cool but I’d be surprised if they grant two for one messed up year. 

He didn't play as a freshman, and is under the impression he has a year of eligibility because of that.  If that's correct, the question becomes whether this "amnesty" and/or the medical redshirt/hardship waiver for this year would get him into the 6-years to play 4 crowd (he'd presumably have one year, no matter what).

He's in a team meeting about the season right now, we'll see if that provides any info.

baseballhs posted:

It sucks for 2020s, even more for 2021 because they don’t have to honor those.  Wondering if more HS will go in the draft that had planned to do college.  If the push the draft, do the 2020s even  get a choice? It’s a mess.

I think this is right.   It's really the worse for 2021's at this point.  2020's don't have it great but they have signed LOI's and have been accepted to their schools.  The HS 2021 classes just might be very small relative to normal classes depending on the schools.  2020's though will have to play through a lot of players and some legit men who might be as old as 23 vs some kids who are 17! That is a mismatch.  I think our sons just need to embrace the challenge.  This is one heck of a life lesson for any Junior in HS to senior in college.    

As a uncommitted 2021 RHP my heart is broken as all of the sacrifices and pain that I have endured to get to this point may have been for nothing. I have been in contact with a few mid-low D1 coaches and was excited for the summer to get more exposure but I bet most showcases will be canceled like PG has done. It was not easy to gain 8mph and 35lbs in 6 months but I was carried by my dream of playing D1 ball. I don’t know what is going to happen. Any insight?

RHP21 posted:

As a uncommitted 2021 RHP my heart is broken as all of the sacrifices and pain that I have endured to get to this point may have been for nothing. I have been in contact with a few mid-low D1 coaches and was excited for the summer to get more exposure but I bet most showcases will be canceled like PG has done. It was not easy to gain 8mph and 35lbs in 6 months but I was carried by my dream of playing D1 ball. I don’t know what is going to happen. Any insight?

All of your 2021 competition is in the same boat, so you are not disadvantaged.  Keep working hard, let this play out, and take advantage of appropriate recruiting opportunities when they become available.  Things will work out, coaches will need a full roster of 2021s just like they do for each class.

RHP21 posted:

As a uncommitted 2021 RHP my heart is broken as all of the sacrifices and pain that I have endured to get to this point may have been for nothing. I have been in contact with a few mid-low D1 coaches and was excited for the summer to get more exposure but I bet most showcases will be canceled like PG has done. It was not easy to gain 8mph and 35lbs in 6 months but I was carried by my dream of playing D1 ball. I don’t know what is going to happen. Any insight?

Don’t stop fighting. Don’t stop believing. What I’ve seen over the years as a travel coach and a parent is the players who want it and are legitimate prospects get what they want if they’re willing to fight for it. 

wouldn't they just follow the "nonmedical hardship waiver" format?  Give a blanket approval based on the circumstance, but still hold true the five year participation limit so that they don't have 24-25 year olds on their roster?  maybe if you have previously redshirt (whether medical or not), then you most likely do not qualify.  I guess we will just wait and see what they come up with.

I think you will see more guys try to draft out of high school now than deal with this mess and the extra competition and reduced playing opportunity and time. If that is the case or happens. 

Why a blanket extra year for all 4 classes?

It isn’t like the MLB isn’t going to draft this year. I think the seniors came back for a reason. The didn't draft or didn't like their slot.  They shouldn’t need another year. Juniors hoping to draft this year still have a chance to draft this or go back and draft after their senior. Sophomores, aren't affected. Freshman, aren't affected. Red Shirt Seniors, definitely not affected.

Yes, losing the remaining of the season sucks, BUT everyone got the benefit of fall ball and prep and spring season prep. Weight room, nutrition, pitching/batting coach.... 

How many team roster spots have seniors on them? Typically not many. And they typically finish school/baseball and try to draft and/or more likely finish up and get a job. You’re going to create a 4 year problem for the small number of seniors who also had an opportunity to draft last year but chose not to. There are still or would be MLB workouts, etc.....   

I don’t get it.... help me understand this a bit better?

I agree with Eokerholm.  If this were to truly play out, it would adversely impact more kids than it would help. But reality it, there are fewer non-RS seniors, some will get drafted and others will just move on with their lives.  For those wanting the extra year (and can afford it) they’ll have to go the grad school route, and getting a roster spot won’t be guaranteed, despite the extra year of eligibility.

Every underclassman granted the extra year, will go through the same cycle, once seniors.

I think it’s a nice gesture that won’t have a material impact.  Maybe CBI can create a list of college seniors, who have already used their 4 years, and we can see how it plays out when next year’s rosters are set.

Probably impacts those who wanted to get a fresh new start by transferring the most, as there will be a few more kids in that pool.

RHP21 posted:

As a uncommitted 2021 RHP my heart is broken as all of the sacrifices and pain that I have endured to get to this point may have been for nothing. I have been in contact with a few mid-low D1 coaches and was excited for the summer to get more exposure but I bet most showcases will be canceled like PG has done. It was not easy to gain 8mph and 35lbs in 6 months but I was carried by my dream of playing D1 ball. I don’t know what is going to happen. Any insight?

Yeah, probably what you should do regardless of the Coronavirus, JUCO then DI. 

So my son is a junior (2021) at a D1 school in the MAC.  Assuming he graduates next year, I'm assuming he could come back as a grad player, in 2022 He currently receives a partial scholarship (like most) and the balance is covered with academic money.  I'm guessing that if he comes back, he would need to come up with the $ for difference between his athletic scholarship, including the increase cost of grad classes, as his undergrad scholarship would be done? (right?)  Lots of time to think about it. Just curious if anyone has a thought on this. Wondering how much financial sense does it make to come back for another year for baseball when not really pursuing a grad degree.  He has a slight possibility of being drafted in late rounds RHP 93-95 FB 6'3" 225 lbs.

CTbballDad posted:

I agree with Eokerholm.  If this were to truly play out, it would adversely impact more kids than it would help. But reality it, there are fewer non-RS seniors, some will get drafted and others will just move on with their lives.  For those wanting the extra year (and can afford it) they’ll have to go the grad school route, and getting a roster spot won’t be guaranteed, despite the extra year of eligibility.

Every underclassman granted the extra year, will go through the same cycle, once seniors.

I think it’s a nice gesture that won’t have a material impact.  Maybe CBI can create a list of college seniors, who have already used their 4 years, and we can see how it plays out when next year’s rosters are set.

Probably impacts those who wanted to get a fresh new start by transferring the most, as there will be a few more kids in that pool.

Keep in mind a redshirt freshman is likely to be twenty-three heading to short season. There are very few outside pitchers who just found their 95 mph fastball.

Has there been an announcement that D3 players will get an extra year of eligibility, too?  In that world, there aren't scholarship limits to contend with, and not many players who are thinking seriously about the draft.

Selfishly, as the parent of 2020 HS player going to a D3 next year, I'm wondering what the real impact of this will be.  The selfish side of me doesn't love the idea of Jr. having up to ~25% more players to compete with for playing time than he would have otherwise, all older and more experienced than he is.  I'm not arguing against an extra year of eligibility; just pondering what it will mean in practice.   

If there is a recession, that could be a game changer.  Staying in school to get a graduate degree or just pick up an additional major suddenly would look a lot more attractive. As I recall, grad school admissions ticked up considerably during the 2008 recession.  Many (most?) members of the college class of 2020 already have jobs or grad school lined up.  But some of those jobs could disappear if the economy takes a significant downturn. 

And small colleges without many graduate study options may not be able to retain many 5th year players.  So does that mean Tufts and other universities will be welcoming graduates from the Middleburys and Amhersts of the world?

So happy for players getting another year that lost this spring season; anxious about my son's situation as a 2021, not just for baseball but for getting into college, as well. SATs canceled, too. Who knows if all the APs he's been taking will have the tests on time. There is a big academic component to this as well. His school has closed in MD and they have ZERO online courses or any capability to grade because of lack of training and legal issues. What does that do to the academic year? The kid has worked so F'in hard to get smarter, stronger, gain weight and gain velo. Spring HS season is probably toast. I just keep telling him head down and keep working - now the season starts at Showball in Texas in early June. Fingers crossed. As a parent, we've tried to invest smart and time out his opportunities so he can show his best stuff. My son is fortunate in that we have the means to do this, but this is what the "Best laid plans of mice and men" really feels like. Tough, but not tougher than all the families that are suffering and will suffer a wide range of hardships across the next year. This just sucks for everyone, but I am happy the NCAA did what it did even if it complicates recruiting and rosters and scholarships. If it's meant to be, it's meant to be, I guess. As a Dad and husband, it's a bitter pill to swallow when my wife and I felt we were in such a great place and now...who the hell knows? I always told my son you might work harder than you've ever worked in your life and not get what you want. That's life. I guess its the work and discipline and effort that will last longer than this virus and what comes along the next few years. Stay safe everyone. Peace.

Last edited by BaseballDad72
jonsmith posted:

So my son is a junior (2021) at a D1 school in the MAC.  Assuming he graduates next year, I'm assuming he could come back as a grad player, in 2022 He currently receives a partial scholarship (like most) and the balance is covered with academic money.  I'm guessing that if he comes back, he would need to come up with the $ for difference between his athletic scholarship, including the increase cost of grad classes, as his undergrad scholarship would be done? (right?)  Lots of time to think about it. Just curious if anyone has a thought on this. Wondering how much financial sense does it make to come back for another year for baseball when not really pursuing a grad degree.  He has a slight possibility of being drafted in late rounds RHP 93-95 FB 6'3" 225 lbs.

Dang, with those measurables, you don’t think he had a chance to be drafted this year?  Not to rub it in, but losing his junior year probably hurt him pretty hard

Chico Escuela posted:

Has there been an announcement that D3 players will get an extra year of eligibility, too?  In that world, there aren't scholarship limits to contend with, and not many players who are thinking seriously about the draft.

 

Yes, DIII extended a year of eligibility to everyone in a spring sport. I'd think this is mostly symbolic, since a lot of those schools don't really have 5th year players, though you can always plan for grad school early.

Eokerholm posted:

I think you will see more guys try to draft out of high school now than deal with this mess and the extra competition and reduced playing opportunity and time. If that is the case or happens. 

Why a blanket extra year for all 4 classes?

It isn’t like the MLB isn’t going to draft this year. I think the seniors came back for a reason. The didn't draft or didn't like their slot.  They shouldn’t need another year. Juniors hoping to draft this year still have a chance to draft this or go back and draft after their senior. Sophomores, aren't affected. Freshman, aren't affected. Red Shirt Seniors, definitely not affected.

Yes, losing the remaining of the season sucks, BUT everyone got the benefit of fall ball and prep and spring season prep. Weight room, nutrition, pitching/batting coach.... 

How many team roster spots have seniors on them? Typically not many. And they typically finish school/baseball and try to draft and/or more likely finish up and get a job. You’re going to create a 4 year problem for the small number of seniors who also had an opportunity to draft last year but chose not to. There are still or would be MLB workouts, etc.....   

I don’t get it.... help me understand this a bit better?

blanket extra year is due to an existing clause in the eligibility handbook which states nonmedical hardship waivers will be considered for players who are unable to participate with no more than participation in 30% of a teams scheduled spring games due to "circumstances beyond the student-athletes control"...I would think they (NCAA) would just use this as support for the approval given a player still remained within its "four out of five years" clause.  My sons a JUCO soph, so not sure how this would impact him, but the season postponement definitely has thrown a wrench in the seasons plans.

Last edited by phillyinNJ

Eligibility to play another year isn't the same as required to get a roster spot.  Every single player, incoming and returning, will have to prove he deserves a spot next year.  I figure that the returning seniors will boost the squad numbers in the fall and cuts will have to be made by spring.  Most budgets can't absorb more than normal roster count, so I don't expect the cap to be increased.

I don't think the limits will go up because the AD's will not agree to it.  They cannot afford it or want to afford it, even P5's.  Not saying P5's can't but won't want to.  They would have to buy new uniforms and the extra players would make the costs go up.  Plus they really don't need them.  You can't get 35 players playing time so you sure wouldn't be able to get 40 playing time.  As someone suggested, they may give you the ability to travel with 30 or all 35 but that is about all.  I think for four years they will expand the scholarship numbers because the SEC is required to keep everyone for their full time on scholarship so unless they make a provision they cannot cut them and their scholarship unless the player on scholarship chooses to leave.  But who knows.  it may change tomorrow or Tuesday, you get the point.

This was fairly close to the conversation going on between my son and his other senior teammates when I hung out with a few of them last week after his surgery.  A few are actually more actively exploring graduate school choices that might allow them to play (and my son already was), but realistically it's a lot more likely, especially for DIII guys, to just move on with their lives.

Some of son's teammates are likely to stay in MN, where townball is a big deal still, so there are also amateur opportunities to keep playing.

For 2019 this could not have worked out any better. He had about 12 or so innings out of the bullpen as a true freshman and was set to make his debut as a weekend starter in what would have been yesterday's series finale. With the new 2020 draft rules he would've been a draft eligible sophomore - and now he'll be a draft eligible freshman next season. Assuming he doesn't get drafted and remains a contributor on the team he'll be able to milk a year or two of grad school out of the situation at the very least. 

That being said, it's not pretty for everybody - in fact it's only going to get uglier, not just for the guys who were in their last year of eligibility, but redshirt juniors, early grads, and older guys on the roster. Even if the scholarship limit were bumped from 11.7, who is funding this? How are 50 guys going to fit on a roster? Schools who were not fully funded to begin with? Guys who are free to transfer as grad transfers?

Truth is that the seniors who are not potential pros or key contributors are not going to be welcomed back. And it sucks, but baseball was never in the cards moving forward and they likely need to start thinking about life without baseball. Unless I had a very specific role on the team and grad school was a legitimate option I would likely be walking away as well. I know two of the seniors on our team have already informed everybody they won't be coming back. They are starters, but not pro prospects and would rather die of coronavirus than spend another summer living with a host family playing in a summer league halfway across the country. 

The only way I see this working is if the NCAA says all incoming freshmen must redshirt, the same way freshmen had to sit out years ago. But there is still the scholarship issue. 

I can’t understand why redshirting all freshmen is the only option?  If that were in play, I’m guessing most kids who have a draft option go, whether it’s the round they wanted or not, they would really consider it.  If you say most seniors will leave, there is no reason to redshirt all the freshmen.  If they were crazy pro options, they would have gone as juniors unless there was an injury.

PABaseball posted:

 

The only way I see this working is if the NCAA says all incoming freshmen must redshirt, the same way freshmen had to sit out years ago. But there is still the scholarship issue. 

And then do what with 2021's when its there time, Redshirt them too? It would just keep rolling forward that way as you are just building up a backlog of players unless I misunderstand what you mean.  What is the situation you are referencing from years ago where this happened?  Would love to read up on that.

Gunner Mack Jr. posted:
PABaseball posted:

 

The only way I see this working is if the NCAA says all incoming freshmen must redshirt, the same way freshmen had to sit out years ago. But there is still the scholarship issue. 

And then do what with 2021's when its there time, Redshirt them too? It would just keep rolling forward that way as you are just building up a backlog of players unless I misunderstand what you mean.  What is the situation you are referencing from years ago where this happened?  Would love to read up on that.

Used to be freshman could not play college athletics, only practice. 1950’s/60’s. 

if you know the actual date this changed, you are older than me!

phillyinNJ posted:

son just received the official email from his AD concerning the season cancellation at his JUCO...he will retain his soph status, but now season ending will only make it that much more difficult in the recruiting process...looks like recruiting will be turned to a virtual event as well.

How does that work with JUCO's?  I assume all Sophomore's have to transfer out due to being done with their hours but get an extra year at the next level? 

Ok, so I went through each of the PG Top 25 schools for the 2020 Recruiting class's rosters and counted the exisiting roster spots that are Senior or RS-Seniors.

Average across the top 25 schools is only 3.64. I would bet if I went to the top 100 it would get down closer to 3.0  

  • So you're screwing with programs and the next 4 years of baseball for players and recruits for 3-4 guys that could have drafted as Juniors - if they were good or healthy enough.
  • They've have 3+ years to prove their worth and develop their craft.
  • They could still do a showcase and/or combine or something for the MLB draft to make up for the shorten season for those Seniors (RS and regular).
  • This year's Juniors can still draft (in showcase/combine or not) and/or return for their normal Senior Year. So they're not affected.
  • Sophomores and Freshman are/were not affected either . Those that got to play got some reps, those that didn't, didn't - but EVERYONE across ALL 4-5 CLASSES got the benefit of education, nutrition, strength training, fall ball and prep, spring ball prep, and the 15-17 games that were played this season.
  • They still got the last 8 months of instruction and work with a pitching coach, hitting coach, batting coach and head coach.
  • This year was not lost or not valueable.

Most of the seniors should have been planing for a job and/or graduate school by now as their primary or back up plan knowing their time was going to be up.  

Why make such a mess of all of this? Move the Draft to the end of summer (so Juniors can draft if they want, or return to school.....and give them the summer to showcase and combine. No need to mess with ALL classes and the next 4 years of baseball, programs, recruiting, etc. 

Giving them another year of eligibility doesn't guarantee them a roster spot either. There are cuts every year that are made. 

Not everyone is on scholarship and for some schools that barely helps, so coming up with another year's worth of tuition is an additional hardship on players/families, for guys that if they were good enough, would/could/should have drafted already and were planning on it for a better slot this year or just moving on.

For example. When we sat down with Coach O'Connor at UVA on 11/1, if my son would have gotten their last arm slot, he told us he was practically out of money. So if he got any money it would only be 25%. Even after 25% and being out of state, across 4 years of school (at UVA you have to graduate in 4) that would be over $135,000 in loans.

So now a senior at UVA has to go to graduate school for their 5th year of eligibility. Now they'll get 2 degrees on the school and their dime now given time to graduate from grad school too, if they red shirted.

I like the summer draft idea posted online and the showcase/combine to give the scouts and guys time to show their stuff, be seen and draft before the Juniors have to return to campus.

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Agreed for your program, however, if they move draft to August before school starts they all will have a chance to showcase/combine and then decide and move on and not incur another year of school or delay the real world if they don’t draft...

And with just 3 months before Omaha and draft, I would have hoped they had back up plans in place...

Nothing is guaranteed in life but death and taxes. No one expects to get laid off, divorced, or cancer. Life happens....

Last edited by Eokerholm
Eokerholm posted:

Nothing is guaranteed in life but death and taxes. No one expects to get laid off, divorced, or cancer. Life happens...

Yes, this is correct and also applies to incoming players, no matter the age/year. NCAA is following their established rules. I’m sorry  this has happened to all involved. But players all have choices. They all need to learn to compete, sooner or later, in baseball and in life. College coaches want to win. Be ready to help your coach win. If this is too “scary” for you, then you are probably not at the right level. Coronavirus or no coronavirus.   I’m sorry if this sounds harsh. That is not my intention. 

Eokerholm posted:

Ok, so I went through each of the PG Top 25 schools for the 2020 Recruiting class's rosters and counted the exisiting roster spots that are Senior or RS-Seniors.

Average across the top 25 schools is only 3.64. I would bet if I went to the top 100 it would get down closer to 3.0  

Why do you think the average would decrease if you expanded? I actually would guess the # of seniors and rs-seniors increases at mid-major and lower D1s. Those rosters often have a lot of juco transfers, redshirts, and undraftable upperclassmen. My 2020 is headed to one such school, and they had maybe 11 this season (no idea yet how many desire to return). I heard from another mid-major D1 with 7 seniors that 5 are hoping to return. 

Last edited by TheRightScuff
d-mac posted:
phillyinNJ posted:

son just received the official email from his AD concerning the season cancellation at his JUCO...he will retain his soph status, but now season ending will only make it that much more difficult in the recruiting process...looks like recruiting will be turned to a virtual event as well.

How does that work with JUCO's?  I assume all Sophomore's have to transfer out due to being done with their hours but get an extra year at the next level? 

JuCo sophs will have the option to come back for a 3rd year if they choose to. At my sons school a couple are considering doing that b/c they are coming off injuries, are just now healthy, and don’t yet have a four year school to go to. Obviously there are academic challenges that go along with spending 3 years at a JuCo and I wouldn’t recommend that anyone do that under normal circumstances. 

adbono posted:
d-mac posted:
phillyinNJ posted:

son just received the official email from his AD concerning the season cancellation at his JUCO...he will retain his soph status, but now season ending will only make it that much more difficult in the recruiting process...looks like recruiting will be turned to a virtual event as well.

How does that work with JUCO's?  I assume all Sophomore's have to transfer out due to being done with their hours but get an extra year at the next level? 

JuCo sophs will have the option to come back for a 3rd year if they choose to. At my sons school a couple are considering doing that b/c they are coming off injuries, are just now healthy, and don’t yet have a four year school to go to. Obviously there are academic challenges that go along with spending 3 years at a JuCo and I wouldn’t recommend that anyone do that under normal circumstances. 

As the CCCAA in CA isn't governed by the national Juco's, all the California Juco's are still in the waiting game.  Season has not been canceled, but merely postponed.  This is good in that hope for this season still remains (albeit diminishing daily), but bad in that there has been no official ruling on status of players and whether they will also be given a "do-over".   Gotta believe they eventually will.  At least my sophomore pitcher surely hopes so.  

For any who might be interested, we're trying to keep our clients and subscribers updated on new developments through our weekly email newsletter, our Informed Athlete Facebook page, and our Twitter account, @InformedAthlete.  

NCAA Division II has already given clear guidance to their member schools that any spring sport athlete who had their season cancelled due to COVID-19 can have another season of eligibility.  (I've been shown a copy of what Division II sent out to each school.)

I haven't seen guidance from NCAA Division III yet that is as clear and detailed as Division II.

And, Division I has not finalized their guidance on this issue yet.  They're still seeking input from the D1 conferences across the country, or least they were as of yesterday morning.

Finally, I was a guest on a podcast this week in which I and host Geoff Rottmayer talked about the impact of this situation on college athletes - not just in baseball but for all spring sports - at the two and four-year level, as well as on high school recruits.  You can find the podcast here: https://baseballawakening.podbean.com/

latebloomer21 posted:
adbono posted:
d-mac posted:
phillyinNJ posted:

son just received the official email from his AD concerning the season cancellation at his JUCO...he will retain his soph status, but now season ending will only make it that much more difficult in the recruiting process...looks like recruiting will be turned to a virtual event as well.

How does that work with JUCO's?  I assume all Sophomore's have to transfer out due to being done with their hours but get an extra year at the next level? 

JuCo sophs will have the option to come back for a 3rd year if they choose to. At my sons school a couple are considering doing that b/c they are coming off injuries, are just now healthy, and don’t yet have a four year school to go to. Obviously there are academic challenges that go along with spending 3 years at a JuCo and I wouldn’t recommend that anyone do that under normal circumstances. 

As the CCCAA in CA isn't governed by the national Juco's, all the California Juco's are still in the waiting game.  Season has not been canceled, but merely postponed.  This is good in that hope for this season still remains (albeit diminishing daily), but bad in that there has been no official ruling on status of players and whether they will also be given a "do-over".   Gotta believe they eventually will.  At least my sophomore pitcher surely hopes so.  

Season is now cancelled. Everyone gets their year back (CCCAA).

 

Rick at Informed Athlete posted:

...

NCAA Division II has already given clear guidance to their member schools that any spring sport athlete who had their season cancelled due to COVID-19 can have another season of eligibility.  (I've been shown a copy of what Division II sent out to each school.)

...

 

 

Apparently DII just changed their minds, and only Seniors will get another year of eligibility.

 

I can't see any way this is fair...

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LHP's Roady posted:
latebloomer21 posted:
adbono posted:
d-mac posted:
phillyinNJ posted:

son just received the official email from his AD concerning the season cancellation at his JUCO...he will retain his soph status, but now season ending will only make it that much more difficult in the recruiting process...looks like recruiting will be turned to a virtual event as well.

How does that work with JUCO's?  I assume all Sophomore's have to transfer out due to being done with their hours but get an extra year at the next level? 

JuCo sophs will have the option to come back for a 3rd year if they choose to. At my sons school a couple are considering doing that b/c they are coming off injuries, are just now healthy, and don’t yet have a four year school to go to. Obviously there are academic challenges that go along with spending 3 years at a JuCo and I wouldn’t recommend that anyone do that under normal circumstances. 

As the CCCAA in CA isn't governed by the national Juco's, all the California Juco's are still in the waiting game.  Season has not been canceled, but merely postponed.  This is good in that hope for this season still remains (albeit diminishing daily), but bad in that there has been no official ruling on status of players and whether they will also be given a "do-over".   Gotta believe they eventually will.  At least my sophomore pitcher surely hopes so.  

Season is now cancelled. Everyone gets their year back (CCCAA).

 

I hope you are right, but its not showing on their website nor their twitter feed.  

Rick at Informed Athlete posted:

For any who might be interested, we're trying to keep our clients and subscribers updated on new developments through our weekly email newsletter, our Informed Athlete Facebook page, and our Twitter account, @InformedAthlete.  

NCAA Division II has already given clear guidance to their member schools that any spring sport athlete who had their season cancelled due to COVID-19 can have another season of eligibility.  (I've been shown a copy of what Division II sent out to each school.)

I haven't seen guidance from NCAA Division III yet that is as clear and detailed as Division II.

And, Division I has not finalized their guidance on this issue yet.  They're still seeking input from the D1 conferences across the country, or least they were as of yesterday morning.

Finally, I was a guest on a podcast this week in which I and host Geoff Rottmayer talked about the impact of this situation on college athletes - not just in baseball but for all spring sports - at the two and four-year level, as well as on high school recruits.  You can find the podcast here: https://baseballawakening.podbean.com/

Thank you for this post and for the link to the podcast. I listened to it and learned something that specifically applies to my son’s situation. Would not have known it otherwise and it is helpful to know now as opposed to later. 

adbono posted:
d-mac posted:
phillyinNJ posted:

son just received the official email from his AD concerning the season cancellation at his JUCO...he will retain his soph status, but now season ending will only make it that much more difficult in the recruiting process...looks like recruiting will be turned to a virtual event as well.

How does that work with JUCO's?  I assume all Sophomore's have to transfer out due to being done with their hours but get an extra year at the next level? 

JuCo sophs will have the option to come back for a 3rd year if they choose to. At my sons school a couple are considering doing that b/c they are coming off injuries, are just now healthy, and don’t yet have a four year school to go to. Obviously there are academic challenges that go along with spending 3 years at a JuCo and I wouldn’t recommend that anyone do that under normal circumstances. 

My son is looking elsewhere...he retained his soph eligibility and graduates with his AS in may, so as long as he can find a place to play and fits academically, he will be moving to a four year this fall.

My son, who is committed to a Patriot League team got a call from the RC Friday letting him know none of the Seniors will return because they all have jobs.  It was a relief to hear it and was what we suspected. The school prides itself on graduates having jobs before leaving school. This was one of the things that drew us to the school. That and the high starting salaries for most grads!

Kimb27 posted:

My son, who is committed to a Patriot League team got a call from the RC Friday letting him know none of the Seniors will return because they all have jobs.  It was a relief to hear it and was what we suspected. The school prides itself on graduates having jobs before leaving school. This was one of the things that drew us to the school. That and the high starting salaries for most grads!

That is good news (for your son and for the seniors).  But keep in mind:  Given the state of the economy, some of those job offers may be withdrawn between now and this summer.  During the 2008 recession, grad school enrollments grew quite a bit.  This may or may not affect your son's future college (and I hope it doesn't), but I expect some graduating seniors may find returning to school looks more attractive than it might have even a month ago. 

Kimb27 posted:

Chico you may be right. But, grad school app deadlines have passed I think. So, that could be a problem, right?

In most cases, I would think that's true.  But there are options such as waiting to get one's bachelor's degree and enrolling in the fall to work on a second major or a minor, and then starting grad school in the spring semester.  Or some programs might make space in a master's program for a good student who was suddenly jobless. 

I'm not trying to be alarmist.  Whatever happens, I assume your son will enter college this fall expecting to have to compete for roster space, and whether he is competing with any 5th-year seniors is beyond his control anyhow.  My son is also starting college in 2020.  I have told him he may be playing fall ball with some 23-year-olds that he didn't expect to see on the field.  He told me it was no big deal--which is exactly what he ought to say (even if his old man is a little bit concerned).

c2019 posted:

So do they come back as a redshirt or their current class?

I’m guessing they would use the redshirt term. A player has been referenced in the past by redshirt (eligibility year) since his academic year may be different. 

However if a student is in his third year of academic attendance but on track to graduate he’s just called a junior athletically.

Last edited by RJM
Eokerholm posted:

Agreed for your program, however, if they move draft to August before school starts they all will have a chance to showcase/combine and then decide and move on and not incur another year of school or delay the real world if they don’t draft...

And with just 3 months before Omaha and draft, I would have hoped they had back up plans in place...

Nothing is guaranteed in life but death and taxes. No one expects to get laid off, divorced, or cancer. Life happens....

Food for thought.

https://www.baseballamerica.co...ft-signing-deadline/

If they uphold 30 day signing period, August draft might not be feasible.

Domino effect.

 

I just spoke to a current D1 player in the American Athletic Conference. His coaches are telling him there is a 70% chance that NCAA doesn’t give an extra year of eligibility to any D1 players.  30% chance for seniors only.  Since MLB has already announced a draft of only 5-10 rounds D1 coaches already know that they will have more juniors returning than anticipated. The only decision that won’t result in roster chaos is for NCAA not to give any players an extra year. So my money is on that. 

In that case, my suggestion is that any D1 baseball player (and any other D1 spring sport athlete) had better be contacting their school and conference SAAC representatives (Student-Athlete Advisory Council) to do all they can through social media to let their voices be heard before the vote on Monday.  

Check out Twitter for a lengthy tweet from TCU baseball senior Haylen Green posted last evening as an example.  

Rick at Informed Athlete posted:

In that case, my suggestion is that any D1 baseball player (and any other D1 spring sport athlete) had better be contacting their school and conference SAAC representatives (Student-Athlete Advisory Council) to do all they can through social media to let their voices be heard before the vote on Monday.  

Check out Twitter for a lengthy tweet from TCU baseball senior Haylen Green posted last evening as an example.  

What do you think they will do with Hardship Redshirts Rick?  Will these guys still be able to apply for them or will they try to dissolve that clause this year?  Looking through the SEC teams almost every pitcher on every team except may 3-4 per team is eligible.

adbono posted:

I just spoke to a current D1 player in the American Athletic Conference. His coaches are telling him there is a 70% chance that NCAA doesn’t give an extra year of eligibility to any D1 players.  30% chance for seniors only.  Since MLB has already announced a draft of only 5-10 rounds D1 coaches already know that they will have more juniors returning than anticipated. The only decision that won’t result in roster chaos is for NCAA not to give any players an extra year. So my money is on that. 

Players need to band via social media, create a petition, run it up to their representatives  and start a class action suit against the NCAA and MLB.

The legal group that lead the lawsuit against the NCAA would probably love to have this case.

Last edited by CollegebaseballInsights
Rick at Informed Athlete posted:

In that case, my suggestion is that any D1 baseball player (and any other D1 spring sport athlete) had better be contacting their school and conference SAAC representatives (Student-Athlete Advisory Council) to do all they can through social media to let their voices be heard before the vote on Monday.  

Check out Twitter for a lengthy tweet from TCU baseball senior Haylen Green posted last evening as an example.  

And what kid couldn't write that this year?  My hs senior got 2 games.  No prom, likely no graduation.  Now many will get no freshman year either.  It sucks.  For everyone.  No one else is getting a redo on their businesses, jobs, etc.  This was a disaster, but everyone is being affected.   If everyone gets another year, the only one that really get screwed are the incoming freshmen because they get to lose two years.

baseballhs posted:
Rick at Informed Athlete posted:

In that case, my suggestion is that any D1 baseball player (and any other D1 spring sport athlete) had better be contacting their school and conference SAAC representatives (Student-Athlete Advisory Council) to do all they can through social media to let their voices be heard before the vote on Monday.  

Check out Twitter for a lengthy tweet from TCU baseball senior Haylen Green posted last evening as an example.  

And what kid couldn't write that this year?  My hs senior got 2 games.  No prom, likely no graduation.  Now many will get no freshman year either.  It sucks.  For everyone.  No one else is getting a redo on their businesses, jobs, etc.  This was a disaster, but everyone is being affected.   If everyone gets another year, the only one that really get screwed are the incoming freshmen because they get to lose two years.

Difficult to compare College and high school eligibility.

 

I screen shotted an excerpt from the 3/20/20 information posted on the NCAA website. Based on what this says, I feel like NCAA  is gonna defer the tough decisions to individual schools (maybe conferences). I am remaining hopeful that the NCAA will allow SA, no matter what age/year the opportunity to compete for a roster spot. The best players have earned that right. The incoming freshman that would have been drafted in other 6th round will compete for a spot against a junior that might have been drafted in late rounds. Sucks for everyone. But what would suck worse, is not even getting a chance to compete. 
A239EF68-9278-4BA5-89E0-A5BBDA7E8CC7

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Rick at Informed Athlete posted:

Regarding hardship redshirts for athletes that meet the "normal" requirements for a hardship waiver due to injury or illness, I would certainly think that athletes will still be apply to those.  I can't imagine the NCAA would take away an opportunity to use a waiver that's been "on the books" for many years.  

Question for you. What do you think the denominator will be for spring SA?  The number of games the baseball team played, or the number of games that were scheduled? Or is it a specific set number for each division?

RoadRunner posted:

I screen shotted an excerpt from the 3/20/20 information posted on the NCAA website. Based on what this says, I feel like NCAA  is gonna defer the tough decisions to individual schools (maybe conferences). I am remaining hopeful that the NCAA will allow SA, no matter what age/year the opportunity to compete for a roster spot. The best players have earned that right. The incoming freshman that would have been drafted in other 6th round will compete for a spot against a junior that might have been drafted in late rounds. Sucks for everyone. But what would suck worse, is not even getting a chance to compete. 
A239EF68-9278-4BA5-89E0-A5BBDA7E8CC7

Yeah, sure, NCAA makes decision to give everyone another year of eligibility, then coaches have to come in and clean up the mess.  

I heard it could go either way, I hope they vote not to give anyone another year of eligibility, because it just creates a very, very difficult situation and a lot of folks are gonna be pissed off at  the coaches. 

I believe in college over the draft, for most freshman, but if your son really wants to play professional ball and a team offers an opportunity, take it, make them pay for school or remainder. Because the opportunity may not ever come up again. Same for juniors, if you really want to go pro, money shouldn't be your priority. 

JMO

 

Iowamom23 posted:

Here's a link to an article in the Register on this and specifically related to baseball. Most of you may have understood this before, but it became much more clear to me after I read this. I think you can read up to 10 stories for free, so paywall shouldn't be an issue.

 

https://www.desmoinesregister....ity-vote/2922144001/

Nice article and thank you for posting. I am not an expert, so I don’t understand how this would cost schools more $?  I realize that certain conferences have their own rules about so called guaranteed scholarships, which they manage to work around every other non COVID 19 season. Granting the waiver within the current framework seems possible to me. Would there be more cuts?  For sure. Would the P5 possibly have to adjust their so called guaranteed scholarships (which aren’t a guarantee anyhow), for a time?  Maybe. 

TPM posted:
RoadRunner posted:

I screen shotted an excerpt from the 3/20/20 information posted on the NCAA website. Based on what this says, I feel like NCAA  is gonna defer the tough decisions to individual schools (maybe conferences). I am remaining hopeful that the NCAA will allow SA, no matter what age/year the opportunity to compete for a roster spot. The best players have earned that right. The incoming freshman that would have been drafted in other 6th round will compete for a spot against a junior that might have been drafted in late rounds. Sucks for everyone. But what would suck worse, is not even getting a chance to compete. 
A239EF68-9278-4BA5-89E0-A5BBDA7E8CC7

Yeah, sure, NCAA makes decision to give everyone another year of eligibility, then coaches have to come in and clean up the mess.  

I heard it could go either way, I hope they vote not to give anyone another year of eligibility, because it just creates a very, very difficult situation and a lot of folks are gonna be pissed off at  the coaches. 

I believe in college over the draft, for most freshman, but if your son really wants to play professional ball and a team offers an opportunity, take it, make them pay for school or remainder. Because the opportunity may not ever come up again. Same for juniors, if you really want to go pro, money shouldn't be your priority. 

JMO

 

If I remember correctly, your son is a coach?  Perhaps you would feel differently about having an opportunity to compete if he was a player right now and not a coach?  Maybe not. My son would love to be a HC someday. And yes it would be difficult for the coaches. But in the end they will all still be coaches and getting paid.  They don’t have a 4 season limit. Nothing taken away from them, unless they perform poorly. 

RoadRunner posted:
TPM posted:
RoadRunner posted:

I screen shotted an excerpt from the 3/20/20 information posted on the NCAA website. Based on what this says, I feel like NCAA  is gonna defer the tough decisions to individual schools (maybe conferences). I am remaining hopeful that the NCAA will allow SA, no matter what age/year the opportunity to compete for a roster spot. The best players have earned that right. The incoming freshman that would have been drafted in other 6th round will compete for a spot against a junior that might have been drafted in late rounds. Sucks for everyone. But what would suck worse, is not even getting a chance to compete. 
A239EF68-9278-4BA5-89E0-A5BBDA7E8CC7

Yeah, sure, NCAA makes decision to give everyone another year of eligibility, then coaches have to come in and clean up the mess.  

I heard it could go either way, I hope they vote not to give anyone another year of eligibility, because it just creates a very, very difficult situation and a lot of folks are gonna be pissed off at  the coaches. 

I believe in college over the draft, for most freshman, but if your son really wants to play professional ball and a team offers an opportunity, take it, make them pay for school or remainder. Because the opportunity may not ever come up again. Same for juniors, if you really want to go pro, money shouldn't be your priority. 

JMO

 

If I remember correctly, your son is a coach?  Perhaps you would feel differently about having an opportunity to compete if he was a player right now and not a coach?  Maybe not. My son would love to be a HC someday. And yes it would be difficult for the coaches. But in the end they will all still be coaches and getting paid.  They don’t have a 4 season limit. Nothing taken away from them, unless they perform poorly. 

2000 people have died as of today from this deadly virus and more to come.  Thats killing me inside. 

Yes,I feel terrible for the players just as I feel terrible for the coaches that also busted their rear ends getting their guys ready to compete. Endless hours. It sux for sure for everyone. Everyone. 

But losing a year of eligibility for any sport, isn't the end of the world right now. Not with what's happening now.

Schools  have made good on their scholarship commitments.

In the end, with or without an extra year, your son will get what he came to school for, his degree.

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