Is it common for a high school program to tell its players that during the season they are not allowed to have hitting or pitching lessons? The rationale is so that there is only one message to the player. It took me by surprise.
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It wouldn’t surprise me about conflicting information. But a bigger concern with pitchers would be lack of control by the high school coach regarding pitch counts during baseball lessons running concurrently with his baseball season.
Absolutely. Many coaches want for that time frame you to do it their way. You can't go to a hitting or pitching instructor while you are playing high school for certain coaches because their way is best. I understand it as long as they are doing what they are supposed to do and know what they are talking about. It also keeps control of how much pitching is going on with a player as RJM stated. My biggest problem with pitchers was finding out that they had thrown during the week without telling me when I coached travel and HS. I pulled a kid once in the first inning when I found out from the other coach that he had thrown 80 pitches the night before with his dad.
Our HS coach did require us to stop lessons, during the baseball season. I get it for pitchers, pitching count etc!
If you are getting outside hitting lessons during the season that contradict what the head coach is teaching you..........................YOU BETTER HIT.
@PitchingFan wrote, “I understand it as long as they are doing what they are supposed to do and know what they are talking about.”
And therein lies the problem. Way too many don’t.
Baseball season is 10 months per year for a good high school player. 4 months for HS Season, 2 months summer travel, 2 months for the fall.
Normally no baseball in Aug and Nov.
HS Coach is dealing with to many players and normally can't pick up specific tweaks to a player's approach (be it hitting or pitching).
Note, we still did our hitting lessons 2 times per week during the HS season. Provided the hitting coach the game videos so they can review his approach and then make the necessary corrections.
Depending on when he pitched, we might do a lesson address form (again provided videos).
Why because there were times when the coach did not do weekly bullpen, but expected the pitcher to perform.
The same can be said for hitting. Taking 15 swings in batting practice during the season is cutting it.
To adbono's point
Just retired, 600 win, soon to be HOF coach, taught the kids to swing down and hit grounders and line drives. A pop up, to him, was anything that hit the top of the net before the end of the 70' net.
I can see it for pitchers, especially starters.
@JETSR71 posted:To adbono's point
Just retired, 600 win, soon to be HOF coach, taught the kids to swing down and hit grounders and line drives. A pop up, to him, was anything that hit the top of the net before the end of the 70' net.
That approach to hitting is geared towards the 80% of HS players that will never play beyond HS. My youngest son played for a guy just like you described ( minus 500 wins and HOF credentials) at one of the biggest 6A HSs in Texas. Since 2016 (son’s first year as Varsity starter) that program has sent 27 kids to college baseball programs (about 50/50 4 year schools vs JuCo). That’s 4-5 kids per year. Over that 6 year span they have made the playoffs one time and won one playoff game (thanks to a bases clearing double in the bottom of the 6th by adbono jr). They play in an incredibly competitive district but the track record (with that much talent) is a joke. The HC is a nice guy and it’s hard not to like him but he is clueless about how to run a program and never seems to get the right 9 guys on the field. He is especially brutal at evaluating pitchers. A 2017 grad from that HS that has trained with me for the past 4 years is a great example. Last year he pitched his D2 team to a conference championship, was 1st team all-conference & MVP of a regional. But he was not allowed on the mound in HS b/c the HC “didn’t trust him.” IMO (for most people) one of the trickiest parts of HS baseball is figuring out the HS coaching staff and navigating around their bad decisions w/o getting your kid in hot water. If you are fortunate enough to play in a program where that’s not necessary, count your lucky stars.
To date there is no individual hitting or pitching instructions, particularly for the freshman and JV teams (my 2025 goes between the two). The hitting is as @CollegebaseballInsights says, about 18 swings (2 bunts, 2 hit and runs, 8 swings) about 2 times per week and then scrimmage once a week of about 2 ABs. The pitching is inconsistent but usually one inning per week in the scrimmage and no bullpens. So, there is obviously areas for improved reps/preparation.
The issue that I am struggling with is that they have the kids sign a form with the rules/expectations of the team, so if I allow him to continue with his hitting lessons then I am condoning going against his word. I spoke with his hitting instructor about it and he, of course, said that he did not understand the rule and I should do what is best for my kid, and he knew what he would do in my situation--continue lessons. However, as Upton Sinclair said, "It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it."
So I am stuck with choice of teaching character / importance of your word (and hoping everything works out) and continuing with the hitting instruction because he will continue to benefit from it.
Ultimately we decided to go with the character building/commitment to your team choice. So no hitting instructions. Hopefully he will not go into an extended slump and make me second guess my decision. I would not begrudge another parent for making the opposite decision as me.
@Tigre Azul posted:To date there is no individual hitting or pitching instructions, particularly for the freshman and JV teams (my 2025 goes between the two). The hitting is as @CollegebaseballInsights says, about 18 swings (2 bunts, 2 hit and runs, 8 swings) about 2 times per week and then scrimmage once a week of about 2 ABs. The pitching is inconsistent but usually one inning per week in the scrimmage and no bullpens. So, there is obviously areas for improved reps/preparation.
...
Ultimately we decided to go with the character building/commitment to your team choice. So no hitting instructions. Hopefully he will not go into an extended slump and make me second guess my decision. I would not begrudge another parent for making the opposite decision as me.
Is there a third choice? Obviously that's not enough hacks. If I was in your shoes, I think I would keep up the lessons, but tell the coach "for the next few months please just pitch to him. No instruction." Unless you throw well enough to do it yourself.
I would do the exact same thing JCG said.
@adbono posted:That approach to hitting is geared towards the 80% of HS players that will never play beyond HS. My youngest son played for a guy just like you described ( minus 500 wins and HOF credentials) at one of the biggest 6A HSs in Texas. Since 2016 (son’s first year as Varsity starter) that program has sent 27 kids to college baseball programs (about 50/50 4 year schools vs JuCo). That’s 4-5 kids per year. Over that 6 year span they have made the playoffs one time and won one playoff game (thanks to a bases clearing double in the bottom of the 6th by adbono jr). They play in an incredibly competitive district but the track record (with that much talent) is a joke. The HC is a nice guy and it’s hard not to like him but he is clueless about how to run a program and never seems to get the right 9 guys on the field. He is especially brutal at evaluating pitchers. A 2017 grad from that HS that has trained with me for the past 4 years is a great example. Last year he pitched his D2 team to a conference championship, was 1st team all-conference & MVP of a regional. But he was not allowed on the mound in HS b/c the HC “didn’t trust him.” IMO (for most people) one of the trickiest parts of HS baseball is figuring out the HS coaching staff and navigating around their bad decisions w/o getting your kid in hot water. If you are fortunate enough to play in a program where that’s not necessary, count your lucky stars.
Spot on. Navigating the ego of a HS coach can be very tricky. They can mess you up.
@TerribleBPthrower posted:I would do the exact same thing JCG said.
With that handle, of course you would.
@JCG posted:Is there a third choice? Obviously that's not enough hacks. If I was in your shoes, I think I would keep up the lessons, but tell the coach "for the next few months please just pitch to him. No instruction." Unless you throw well enough to do it yourself.
@JCG I like the grey area created there.
My son is currently getting more swings in than just at formal practice. He stays after practice to hit in the cage (no coaching) and also goes to a baseball specific training facility that has cages so will hit off the tee/machine there and tee at home. My BP is fairly good, so I will add that back in on Sundays (only day off from team activities). I am not a baseball player (beyond LL), so I do not provide any tips when he hits BP with me. Just the occasional, "nice hit", "wow you crushed that" or "what happened there?"
This topic depends on the HS program you attend. Some HS programs are just better than others. They provide a ton of reps through quality practice, and also usually play a tougher schedule. If you find yourself at one of higher end programs than you will likely have very little time, and/or need, for any additional hitting/pitching lessons. However, if your HS program is giving you 10 swings a practice (2 of which are bunts) and playing bottom level teams, then getting outside help may just be required to continue to get better. I think the overall mindset is HS baseball comes first during the HS season. Basically just don't be an idiot and throw 80 pitches with your pitching coach the night before a HS bullpen session and/or game.
Also, those "old school" coaches are being replaced/retiring. The trend now is flipping to the other side. Little 130lb Johnny might just need to "get on top of the ball" 
mysson hits/plays for a the coach that his HS head coach's son used to play for. no problems on our end, lol
@Tigre Azul posted:@JCG I like the grey area created there.
My son is currently getting more swings in than just at formal practice. He stays after practice to hit in the cage (no coaching) and also goes to a baseball specific training facility that has cages so will hit off the tee/machine there and tee at home. My BP is fairly good, so I will add that back in on Sundays (only day off from team activities). I am not a baseball player (beyond LL), so I do not provide any tips when he hits BP with me. Just the occasional, "nice hit", "wow you crushed that" or "what happened there?"
You can't get too much tee work.
The area could be even more grey. I mean, a guy who really knows what he's doing would pitch to your son low and away, up and in, etc., in a progression such that your son would know from experience what technique each pitch was trying to reinforce. And if he texted some encouragement afterwards, that would not be a crime, would it?
Son was told this freshmen year, he adhered to the coaches wishes. Son spent a majority of practice hitting off a tee freshmen year, never again. It also became apparent the coach and his staff, knew nothing about pitching. Son was a varsity PO. Sophomore year, coach gave permission to get outside lessons during the season, he even knew his short comings.
@Tigre Azul posted:To date there is no individual hitting or pitching instructions, particularly for the freshman and JV teams (my 2025 goes between the two). The hitting is as @CollegebaseballInsights says, about 18 swings (2 bunts, 2 hit and runs, 8 swings) about 2 times per week and then scrimmage once a week of about 2 ABs. The pitching is inconsistent but usually one inning per week in the scrimmage and no bullpens. So, there is obviously areas for improved reps/preparation.
The issue that I am struggling with is that they have the kids sign a form with the rules/expectations of the team, so if I allow him to continue with his hitting lessons then I am condoning going against his word. I spoke with his hitting instructor about it and he, of course, said that he did not understand the rule and I should do what is best for my kid, and he knew what he would do in my situation--continue lessons. However, as Upton Sinclair said, "It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it."
So I am stuck with choice of teaching character / importance of your word (and hoping everything works out) and continuing with the hitting instruction because he will continue to benefit from it.
Ultimately we decided to go with the character building/commitment to your team choice. So no hitting instructions. Hopefully he will not go into an extended slump and make me second guess my decision. I would not begrudge another parent for making the opposite decision as me.
The HS coach was very aware of son and another player from middle school as both were playing on very good travel organization.
Upon 8th grade graduation, HS Coach asked my son to play on 16u summer team. I said, we've already committed $$$$$ to the travel org, but we will attend game when we can.
My approach was not to retard the growth of my son's baseball skills. In 9th grade, I knew he would be one of the top 5 all around players on varsity team.
In order to prepare for 2010 season, we did an advanced workout, Dec (workouts include bands and address internal/external hip rotation, core, arm care).
Hitting from Dec - Feb (750 swings per week), tee, soft and simulated machine (85+ mph).
Pitching (8 wks) from Jan - Feb
School had captain's practice, so he attended (good politics).
First school practice was March (1st week), primary outfield, secondary pitcher (2 seam was 84, hard baring in. he hit a lot of batters). Note, this would change by Junior year.
Any way, I had to sure my son understood, he had to pace himself because the High School season is just the start.
Most players that are in their 1st year of playing High School ball, may or may not hit a wall during the summer season for many reason.
Since I was paying $$$ for Travel Baseball, that season carried more weight than the high school season.
Note, the high school coach would actually benefit more in the long run with the training and affiliation my son had with travel baseball.
@adbono posted:That approach to hitting is geared towards the 80% of HS players that will never play beyond HS. My youngest son played for a guy just like you described ( minus 500 wins and HOF credentials) at one of the biggest 6A HSs in Texas. Since 2016 (son’s first year as Varsity starter) that program has sent 27 kids to college baseball programs (about 50/50 4 year schools vs JuCo). That’s 4-5 kids per year. Over that 6 year span they have made the playoffs one time and won one playoff game (thanks to a bases clearing double in the bottom of the 6th by adbono jr). They play in an incredibly competitive district but the track record (with that much talent) is a joke. The HC is a nice guy and it’s hard not to like him but he is clueless about how to run a program and never seems to get the right 9 guys on the field. He is especially brutal at evaluating pitchers. A 2017 grad from that HS that has trained with me for the past 4 years is a great example. Last year he pitched his D2 team to a conference championship, was 1st team all-conference & MVP of a regional. But he was not allowed on the mound in HS b/c the HC “didn’t trust him.” IMO (for most people) one of the trickiest parts of HS baseball is figuring out the HS coaching staff and navigating around their bad decisions w/o getting your kid in hot water. If you are fortunate enough to play in a program where that’s not necessary, count your lucky stars.
At my first high school I played for a legend. He’s in the state high school hall of fame and the state baseball hall of fame. He was also my father’s high school coach. The guy didn’t teach me a thing about baseball. Even the players knew he was starting a couple of the wrong players. But he coached at a largest classification high school with a constant stream of incoming talent. He couldn’t fail as long as he showed up for work.
My son was fortunate to have a former D2 All American infielder as a high school coach.
@ReluctantO'sFan posted:This topic depends on the HS program you attend. Some HS programs are just better than others. They provide a ton of reps through quality practice, and also usually play a tougher schedule. If you find yourself at one of higher end programs than you will likely have very little time, and/or need, for any additional hitting/pitching lessons. However, if your HS program is giving you 10 swings a practice (2 of which are bunts) and playing bottom level teams, then getting outside help may just be required to continue to get better. I think the overall mindset is HS baseball comes first during the HS season. Basically just don't be an idiot and throw 80 pitches with your pitching coach the night before a HS bullpen session and/or game.
The high school he attends is a perennial contender in the state. Varsity is starting their season in Southern California against 4 good/great teams, have another tournament in which they will play top teams from Arizona, Nevada, Colorado, and Utah, and they schedule tough for regular season as well. We could not be happier with the program. Total buy-in from us. But like I said the no outside hitting/pitching caught me off guard, as to me it seems like it could only help supplement as long as the kid/outside coach did not do anything stupid (like pitching 80 the day before a game).
This is a long ride for us, so I appreciate hearing everyone's perspective.