Pitching Epiphany

Yes, it kind of looks like he is palming the ball.  That could be an issue both in terms of velocity, movement and control.  My kids were always taught to hold the ball looser....like holding an egg.  This improved velocity, movement and control especially on two-seamers.   Is that what you are asking him to do? 

@fenwaysouth posted:

Yes, it kind of looks like he is palming the ball.  That could be an issue both in terms of velocity, movement and control.  My kids were always taught to hold the ball looser....like holding an egg.  This improved velocity, movement and control especially on two-seamers.   Is that what you are asking him to do?

Perfectly described - like holding an egg. FB grip should be loose enough where the ball can easily be taken out of the pitchers hand with no resistance. Tight grip with the fingers translates to tense muscles in the forearm - and tense muscles don’t perform to the maximum potential - relaxed muscles do.

Yes guys. Thanks. Thumb on bottom. Loose grip. Like gripping an egg.  Slight space inbetween ball and hand. Also going to experiment putting his pointer and middle finger closer together.  

Played catch today after school. First 8-10 throws he said it felt very awkward. But he got the hang of it. Took a ball and put a thumbtack in it where his thumb should be. After about 30 or 40 throws took the thumbtack out amd told hom to be aware and deliberate on grip each throw. Says starting to feel more natural now. Then we went back to how he used to throw and he said, wow, feels kinda like a change up. Flatground: Without a doubt ball is spinning more and definitely looks like he’s “slinging” it now, if that’s a good way to describe how it’s coming out of his lower 3/4 release slot. Bunch more ASR now too. Tomorrow and Friday some more catch play, then on the bump Saturday morning. Keep you posted.  

My son has a low 3/4 slot.  His velo dipped due to injury and a year later he was still not close to his old high.  Even with working out religiously, adding another inch, and just maturing a year.  He pitches only out of the set.  Coach told him that he was starting with his hands too high and to start lower and voila now working at a new high velo range with a new top velo too.   I know it seems too simple but it worked.  It's always something with pitchers but now he see's 90 as doable where before it felt like a pipe dream. 

One disruption in the kinetic chain can ruin a Pitchers day. Lol

FWIW. Threw a bullpen yesterday. +5mph with new grip. Also, ability to locate improved as well.

Awesome!  A 5mph bump is a big deal.  Your son has some homework with the new skills he's developed.

Ditto on the velo bump, keep us up to speed on his development. One thing i think about when reading your post is wtf were the other pitching coaches thinking to NOT look at this grip. I "think" that's the first thing anyone checked when son received instruction on pitching. Typically after watching him throw or pitch the baseball.

@Orlando2022Dad posted:

FWIW. Threw a bullpen yesterday. +5mph with new grip. Also, ability to locate improved as well.

I’m gonna steal a page out of Consultants playbook and make a suggestion. Keep a notebook (or journal) and make notes about things that work (and don’t work) as your development continues. A grip change on a certain pitch would be a great example.  Every player (pitcher or position) falls into bad habits from time to time. The notes can be very helpful when trying to get back on the right track. It’s a little different for every player, but for me it evolved into writing initials of key mental cues (R, C, DO) on the underside of my cap. Relax, Concentrate, Don’t Overthrow. Whenever I needed to bring everything back into focus I took off my cap and looked at my cues. Sometimes it was between pitches, sometimes between innings, sometimes it was just at practice. It worked well for me.

@Shoveit4Ks posted:

Ditto on the velo bump, keep us up to speed on his development. One thing i think about when reading your post is wtf were the other pitching coaches thinking to NOT look at this grip. I "think" that's the first thing anyone checked when son received instruction on pitching. Typically after watching him throw or pitch the baseball.

You would be amazed how many so called pitching coaches never look at how kids grip the baseball. Especially all the internet gurus that have limited playing experience of their own.

@Orlando2022Dad posted:

FWIW. Threw a bullpen yesterday. +5mph with new grip. Also, ability to locate improved as well.

Have you checked again with the old grip to see how much the actual current difference is?

Maybe he can keep the old grip as a change up

I was a genius 2 years ago at one point.  Not much on a regular basis but One Time I got it right.  Senior varsity pitcher came to me for a few lessons to get ready for year.  Big kid, seemed to throw hard, but no velocity.  First thing i did was ask him to show me how he held the ball, do this every time.  Show me your four seam, show me your two seam, curve or whatever you throw, change-up.  First words after that was you don't throw a fastball.  He and his dad argued he threw 2 seam and four seam.  I said no.  The way you are holding the ball is neither.  Showed him how to hold a four seam and he instantly added 7 mph to his velo.  No one had ever shown him how to hold a ball.  I asked how did your coaches not catch this.  His dad was furious.  He said how did the pitching guys I took him to for three years not catch this?  Never assume.

But let me remind you that not everyone holds the ball the same way especially offspeed stuff.  Remember what works and begin to play with it a little one way or another because you may find something that works better for you.  Also, especially important lesson for parents is a left handed guy and a right handed guy definitely don't always hold the ball the same.  Make sure your pitching instructor understands both ways if your kid is different than them.  Middle son's pitching coach in college was a small framed flame thrower who never had to long toss or throw bullpens.  So when he became a pitching coach he never did either and did not allow his players to.  As you can imagine they failed a lot.  What works for one does not work for all.

Yeah, I’m pretty pissed off at all the money I spent with these pitching coaches and none of them picked up on this esp since his arm speed is quick into release. I’m sure as you can imagine we tried everything under the sun to see a uptick in velo. Nada. I felt bad for the kid. Although some PC did video for mechanics, none of them saw his claw like grip. It took our frustration to look closely at his entire sequence from toe to finger tip to find it and soooo glad we did. Quite the relief. He still grips the change up and curveball the same. Thanks for listening!

First, I’m happy for the kid it was discovered all that was wrong was his grip on pitches. Now, here’s the slap yourself in the head moment. There’s no excuse for this. There are plenty of places online to find proper grips on pitches.

In the era I grew up (70’s) I had no idea I was gripping pitches incorrectly until a former player from my high school washed out of the minors and returned as a pitching coach. The same thing happened for me as the original poster. My velocity increased just based on proper grip.

Even though I knew the proper grips I printed them off the internet for my son to have. He was gripping the ball properly starting in LL.

There’s nothing wrong with experimenting with grips to gain movement on pitches. But max velocity is what gets a kid recruited.

Thanks Orlando, for posting this info. In my limited experience, Pitching coaches start off with grips , when the players are young, but often don't check on the grip , in later years. I think i'll check my son's grip right now!