Prospect Camps

I think most of them have coaches from other schools even if it is smaller local schools which is really useful, especially early in the process when you don't know for sure where your son fits in recruiting wise. My son went to 4 camps; 3 because they were already interested in him and one because he was interested in them. He preferred the camps where there were games or game scenarios mostly because they are more fun but the camp where he ultimately committed did not have games. Just BP and other measurables. TBH, it was a camp that they created to work around the "no unofficial visits" rule so that certain kids they were interested in could see the facilities, meet the coaches, etc... A lot of kids were there but there were definitely kids they were targeting...

This year the kid went to 2 HA camps both were #2 and both played games to assess the pitchers. This is the only format he experienced for all the schools camps he attended.

In my experience, the Coaches from multiple schools (showcase) leads to a prospect camp where the interested Coaches can get more eyes on a recruit to make a decision to offer or not.   So, in my mind the prospect camp with a single school has already qualified the recruit as a final candidate for their roster.  If the goal is an offer, then I'll take the single school prospect camp.

My son went to several of them and the best results were at the one school camps. He always tried to make sure he knew who was going to be there and that they knew he was going to be there. He was a pitcher who looked like a college pitcher when he walked on the field, before even picking up a ball. He went to a school largely because of a one day camp, where the coaches probably knew of him but did not really know him. I don't think it happens very often that a player ends up at a school mainly because of a one day camp like that     

My answer would be , depends on where your son is in the process. Early on (freshman, sophomore, early junior year) son would attend camps with multiple coaches (bang for buck). Ones at Di/Ivy schools would often have multiple coaches from D3 from neighboring states (Harvard bubble would have MIT and others, William and Mary once had a camp at Tufts). Around this time son would do Showcases like Showball/Headfirst. Junior year he would focus on school specific camps where they were were recruiting him and RipkenFanSon built a rapport with.

I always say that one school (position coach)specific prospect camp son attended was the best $75 we would spend. Son stood out, got much attention from coach. Really changed the dynamic and focus of the school on him. He was offered a few months (and several observations) later, and played at this school.

I will add this, that sometimes it was very hard to gauge the interest of those who were there supposedly to scout players. He would throw at one camp and generate very positive attention and comments, and throw the same or better maybe at another and it was as if he was invisible. I really wondered sometimes if the coach or coaches at some camps had any interest in recruiting any players, or if it was mostly just a fund raiser.

I've treated all of these camps as fundraisers unless we were personally asked to attend by the coach (not a mass email) or asked to attend by our travel coach.  At that point, we prefer to attend the "mini camps" where there's only 25 kids that lasts for 3 hours (no scrimmage) as it's a lot cheaper and really intended for the coaches to take a closer look at the players they are interested in.

As for getting visibility, I figure we pay enough already for travel team and PG/PBR tournaments.

@atlnon posted:

I've treated all of these camps as fundraisers unless we were personally asked to attend by the coach (not a mass email)

Ditto this.

I see camps still being offered now, saying that XYZ school coaches will be attending when I know XYZ is done with their 2022 class. It's just a way for volunteers to make some cash.

Are you guys talking about emails like this:

As an identified prospective student athlete, I wanted to make you aware that we will again be back in your area this fall, this time to work the College Coaches Showcase Camp in Buffalo, MN on Sunday, October 3rd.  We have found events like this to be highly productive for us so we were excited to be invited back, along with Ohio University, Southern Illinois University - Edwardsville, the University of Minnesota Duluth, Northland College, Northern State University, and St. Cloud Technical Community College. Information and registration for the event can be found at www.CollegeBaseballProspects.com.

Or are you talking about emails (still could be from a list) about Prospect Camps on campus of the actual schools hosting the camps? I think that there would be WAY more value attending a camp on said schools campus rather than at a neutral site. The email above was from an assistant "coach" that is not even listed on his schools website under the coaches.

Either way, it's to pay the volunteer coaches.

I used to direct my angst towards the programs/coaches when it comes to camps, but I've pulled a 180 to a point where I'm perfectly at peace with them.  It's the same with everything in life.  Let the buyer beware.  if you're not doing your homework ahead of time, I can't feel one bit sorry for anyone who attends a camp and feels they got little to no value out of it. 

Most college coaching jobs are unpaid and camps are one way for them to eat something other than Ramen.  is that the worst thing in the world?  Nope.  Having said that, we quickly got to a place where my son would not be attending a single camp unless there was already interest.  If my son wasn't being personally invited by a coach and/or having back and forth communications with them, he wasn't going.  I don't care if there are 20 programs with coaches attending or just the one.  No interest ahead of time = no go.  Save the money for the next opp when you've successfully garnered some interest via pre-selling or whatever.

Back when we were green, my son did attend one of those "College Coaches Showcases Camps" where about a dozen or so programs (4 of my son's targets) were going to be in attendance.  To this day, it was the most expensive camp/showcase my son ever attended and was, BY FAR, the worst/least valuable.  My son has attended about 14 camps/showcases of some kind over the last 2 years and that one stands on its own as a monument to how awful it can get.  I remember watching one of the coaches throwing BP from behind an L screen.  I am not a coach of any kind, but I was embarrassed for the guy even though I was up in the stands.  I've seen dads throw BP 100 times better than this guy did yet he was an assistant coach for an NAIA program.  I absolutely could not believe that any college coach could be that bad at throwing BP.  But passed that, the event was horribly disorganized and inefficient.  To this day, its the only one where my son left wholly dissatisfied and 100% sure it was a total waste of his time and my money.  Interestingly enough, it was the first time CCSC held a camp here and in the last 2 years, they haven't been back.  I can only imagine they got absolutely hammered with negative feedback.  But I own the mistake.  My son didn't have any real interest ahead of time from programs attending (even though he was trying) and I coughed up the money anyway.  That's on me.  I now consider it my donation to the "Assistant Coaches Against Ramen" fund.

At the end of the day, we actually need the parents and players who don't do their homework.  We need the suckers to help keep the costs down.  My son attended the camp of a D1 last month (personally invited) and there were about 40 kids there.  Best I could tell, there were 3-4 kids there that the coaches were genuinely looking at.  Without those 36-ish kids and their parents blindly handing their money over, there is no way my son could afford that camp.  No one is putting on a 4-hour camp for 3-4 kids at $150 a head.  It's kinda messed up, but I owe some thanks to those who show up to camps hoping to be discovered.

Yeah. There's some positives. Get to workout and play on a college field. Get to see other kids at your position. Maybe even get some instruction or wisdom that might be useful. And, like you said, can't fault the coaches for trying to make a buck especially since the NCAA screws them from getting paid.

But, unless you are throwing 93 or running a 6.4 or hitting it 430 feet, the odds of getting attention at one of these things are against you.

I won't call out any bad camps, but the 3 camps that my kids went to that stand out to me (my kids don't go to any of these schools) are:

St. John's - when Blankmeyer was there.

Rutgers - when Owens took over the HC job. He reminds me of Blankmeyer

Stonybrook  - Senk ran a very good camp.

Oh!  I signed up 2023 for our local hometown 2day D2 "prospect" camp.  Single college.  Not invited.  $200.  I think 2023 is likely a D3 player but thought this might tell me for sure.  It'll be metrics then 1  1/2 days of scrimmages.  So if I understand, the camp will have like 5 true prospects and my kid is just money filler?  I feel dumb.

I stumbled upon a fall camp at a SEC school recently.  Oddly placed on a page that was linked to by something random.  The public is not meant to find it in large numbers.  Serious recruits are.  It lists the range 9th thru JUCO.  All their public camps stop at 12th.  Gotta keep the NCAA happy by having it on the website.  Just not easily found.  For all practical purposes it's invite only.

@Dadbelly2023 posted:

Oh!  I signed up 2023 for our local hometown 2day D2 "prospect" camp.  Single college.  Not invited.  $200.  I think 2023 is likely a D3 player but thought this might tell me for sure.  It'll be metrics then 1  1/2 days of scrimmages.  So if I understand, the camp will have like 5 true prospects and my kid is just money filler?  I feel dumb.

If your kid has fun and gets in a workout, then there worse ways to burn $200. Also, keep in mind, anyone can sign up for any camp. Just because it is a D2 camp doesn't mean it's going to be mostly D2 talent there.

My son did a camp/lesson on a Wednesday night at Wright State fall of 2019 (pre-pandemic). My kid was 1/5 kids for 2 hours. He worked about 30 minutes with their Sr Catcher at the time (who then played an extra yr and signed a minor league deal after this season) and got to hit 75-100 balls on their field with the unpaid assistant (now the 3rd assistant). It was an AMAZING deal for $40 (I paid after and gave the kid a $50 cuz he deserved it!). Kid will forever have a special place in his heart for Wright State. Seek out those types of camps/opportunities if you can!

Wish we lived in a place that had piles of D1's that had unpaid assistants hungry for lessons/camp type opportunities that were reasonably priced.

@Dadbelly2023 it actually sounds perfect. It's local (so no travel and overnight costs), reasonable for a two day camp and you have a goal (to see where your son fits in either based on the other players there or, even better, coach feedback).  Hopefully it is well run and even if you don't get accurate and helpful feedback, he will get some good reps in this weekend. And I think the comment about throwing mid-90s with a sub 6.5 sixties is only applicable to certain camps. You CAN get noticed if you fit what the coach is looking for... I think the idea is to have eyes wide open. If you are going to a camp hoping to get an offer and you are no where near what they are looking for, then it is wasted money. Otherwise, you should be fully aware of what camps are and have reasonable expectations of what you are getting out of it.

I appreciate all the comments that have been shared. Would your son attend a Head First or Showball event only if he was invited?

My son has done many "team camps" with his travel team. Never really had a choice because it was on the schedule. To me, this was like doing a tournament except the games were more controlled. And, it gave him a chance to talk with college coaches - some of them more than once because they all come to the same things.

Twice he did a camp as an individual. Both D1.

First time it was his "dream school" meaning the one he talked about for years as the one he wanted to play at since he was young. So, we drove 5 hours and got a hotel, etc.

Immediately, he hated the campus and the surrounding area. Then, he didn't connect with the coaches. In the span of two days it went from the school he talked about for years to the school he would never go to even if they asked. Money wasted? To me, it at least got the first one done, gave him some experience and allowed him to stop wasting time thinking about that school.

Second time was different. He attended a clinic run by a major league coach. They clicked right away and they major league coach was like "You're not committed? You should be...let me make a phone call." Next thing we know he's having phone conversations with the recruiting coach at the school (who was also the college coach of the big leaguer when he was in college). Recruiting coach asks my son to come to their camp that's coming up.

Me, the kid and my wife fly to the school, get a hotel, rent a car, etc. This is not a cheap trip. School is beautiful and would be a dream to attend. Kid does extremely well at the camp and the recruiting coach says "Your in the rotation of kids at your position in your class that we are looking at." This was January 2020 and my son is a 2022.

Then we don't hear from the recruiting coach much but it was at the onset of the pandemic. But later another 2022 at my son's position commits and we realized this probably wasn't going to happen. (Ironically the recruiting coach has since moved on to another school.)

Was it a huge waste of money? Airfare, hotels and meals for three? The car rental? Not really. We did other things while there. Sightseeing, etc. It was one of the rare times my wife was able to do the far baseball travel thing with him. (It's usually just me to save money.) We had a nice few days there.

But that was it for individual camps. I came to the conclusion that "Unless they ask you to come down personally then it's a longshot and nothing is going to happen."

@johnlanza posted:

I appreciate all the comments that have been shared. Would your son attend a Head First or Showball event only if he was invited?

No, those are totally different types of event.  They have a very large range of schools, and, being mostly D3, it's expected that many of the kids will not have been seen by those coaches.  Having said that, two things:

- it's certainly a good idea to contact some of the coaches at those showcases beforehand, or even better, to have a travel coach contact them, so that they will know to look for you if they're interested.  Mind you, if they are interested, they will probably also invite you to their own camp!

- you have to go at the right time for your recruiting.  If you're a D3 recruit, that means summer after junior year.  Not much point going earlier, imo, unless you are a HA D1 recruit.

@Francis7 posted:

Recruiting coach asks my son to come to their camp that's coming up.

Me, the kid and my wife fly to the school, get a hotel, rent a car, etc. This is not a cheap trip. School is beautiful and would be a dream to attend. Kid does extremely well at the camp and the recruiting coach says "Your in the rotation of kids at your position in your class that we are looking at." This was January 2020 and my son is a 2022.

Then we don't hear from the recruiting coach much but it was at the onset of the pandemic. But later another 2022 at my son's position commits and we realized this probably wasn't going to happen.

^^ This happened to my son.  Most frustrating part about it is not the wasted money, but the silence afterwards.  We wonder how common it is.

I wanted to add that no matter what level your son is, it's important to get an opinion from an informed source (travel coach, instructor, etc.) about where and/or whether your son fits.  There's no point travelling to, and spending money for, any camp or showcase if it's not a fit.

I should say, too, that we did everything that Dadbelly2023 and Notmadeof$$ did (even drove through a snowstorm...).  Only realized it in hindsight.

HA non-local recruiting poses challenges, because many baseball coaches/organizations are not familiar with how that type of recruiting works.  I had gotten in the habit of asking our coach whether my son should attend this or that camp, but he had never heard of Headfirst, even though he and it had been around for years.  He was really helpful with local schools at all levels, and he was happy to contact coaches when we asked, but he didn't know most of the HAs that were not local.

As mentioned above, Showball and Headfirst are different. I've had a few people who went to SB say they wish they did HF. The main complaint was the limited amount of AB's in game situations. I think my son had 12 AB's at the HF showcase. My son is a 2023. It was probably a little early, but we we had a break in the schedule and he was coming off a couple solid tournaments. To us, it was well worth the time and money.

As far as individual or group college camps, I think your expected results will determine the value. If your kid wants to go to a camp at his dream school and you can afford it, go for it. If you are only considering it for realistic recruiting purposes then you need to qualify the interest. An email invitation that has not been personalized is a waste of your time and money IMO. My son probably gets 10 invites a day. Most of the time the coaches have never seen his video. If it seems legit and my son is interested he will reach out to the RC via phone.

My son and I never assessed camps based on the style of camp. Our assessment was based on whether the objective was met.

His first camp was post freshman summer. It was a local D1. We saw it as nothing but an opportunity to experience a camp. Objective met. He drew interest from programs he had no interest including the host.

Post soph summer he did two showcases where the application had to be signed by a pro scout. If a kid plays for a name travel program a signature isn’t hard to get. He was “discovered” by the college programs his travel coach had contacted and a few others.

He was supposed to do Head First post junior summer. But he got injured. Four HA’s with interest (had seen him) asked if he would be there.

The best bang for the buck was a free showcase the team did with another travel team in front of several college coaches free of charge. It was two name travel programs. The range of colleges was ranked D3 to P5.

When my son was fourteen I drove by and stopped to watch a few hours of a college camp. The college ran Saturday camps for four weekends in the early fall. I only saw four players I thought were major conference material. A current player helping out said the four players were found at East Cobb and invited for the weekend. Every local attending the camp was a dreamer (in terms of that college). But there were lesser programs in attendance watching.

Son did a few camps with his travel teams, but by and large every camp he went to was at a college he was interested in. We usually made it a two-day visit — college visit first day, standard academic tour, walk through the dorms, visit with professor, often attending a class. Then the next day the camp. He got a full view of the school. It was interesting to me how many college coaches told us we didn't need to do that tour on the academic side. They said they'd take care of it, but I felt like son got a view of what school was like if he didn't play baseball.

The thing I loved about my son and his recruiting process was he didn't really care why they had the camp or what the coach was trying to do. He was there to do his thing, which was impress people.

Having said all that, he was offered at his current D1 after attending the third camp at the school. As in, we had been to two camps, they told him they wanted to see him at one more and I finally relented and gave them another $100. During the scrimmage, son pitched and was basically done, so he started "coaching" third base. Batters told their coaches in the scrimmage that they didn't know the signs my son was delivering. :-)

After a while, HC went to the dugout where son was supposed to be. He wasn't there. HC was looking everywhere, including under the benches to see if his bag was still there. Son was out playing right field for a kid who had bailed early.

When he returned to dugout, HC grabbed him and pulled him out along with PC. I assumed he was in trouble for all his antics. They made him an offer then and there. It was definitely worth the $100.

Son didn’t do a lot of travel ball, no PG, HF, etc.  Used camps as our means to get noticed. We targeted his current school early on and he attended camps annually starting his freshman year. Got his offer junior year and worked out details while HC was at HF, “scouting” other players.

Son received multiple offers, all via camps.    Admittedly, son wanted to stay regional, so it was easier to schedule and plan around camps.  

I sometimes think “what if” if we took an alternative approach.  But son was a late bloomer (size, velo), so I believe we would have been throwing money away and not sure he would have received the offers he had, if we went the traditional route.