Does anyone have any thoughts on it? Some people swear it is neccessary and others say don't do it.
Original Post
Replies sorted oldest to newest
In my opinion, scap load should be ORGANIC to the pitching motion and should not be 'forced'. In other words, if you're forcing your scaps together just to try and reach a state of 'scap load', you're heading towards injury.
I hope that makes sense -- scap load cannot be separated out from a sound mechanical process. It'll happen by itself if everything else is correct. If the cart (scap load) is put before the horse (sound form), it's trouble.
I hope that makes sense -- scap load cannot be separated out from a sound mechanical process. It'll happen by itself if everything else is correct. If the cart (scap load) is put before the horse (sound form), it's trouble.
Interesting question ....
I've been thinking and reading about "Scapula loading" ever since I first heard about it years ago. I'm by no means an expert but I have come to a couple of conclusions:
1. Looking at the muscle groups related to the scapula and their range of motion, it doesn't make sense that they could contribute more than fractionally.
2. In order to "load" the Scapula, you are really just extending the arm and shoulder backwards. The true muscle groups that come into play then are the much stronger muscles across your chest.
3. The increased extention creates a longer path to delivery allowing a fraction of a second longer to increase velocity.
We have all heard ton's of "terms" over the years in baseball from "squish the bug", etc etc. "Scapula Loading" really is just another way of trying to get you into a position of maximum effort and the muscles near/around the scapula don't do anything but SLOW DOWN the efforts of your shoulder and chest muscles to violently throw your arm and shoulder forward. So much for the term, it's a gimmick.
What it is really describing is a Maximum Effort type of delivery. That's great ... but ... is that good? If you are a Max effort kind of pitcher, always going 100%, you have nothing left in your tank. Now you are getting into pitching philosophies where some people believe that you go 100% (there isn't any such thing as 101% or any higher number) all the time or whether you pitch at 90%.
To me, it the difference in a starter (90% pitcher) mind-set versus a closer (max-effort) kind of guy.
Neither is right or wrong, just different. But I don't personally want a max-effort starter. I want someone who has gas in his tank, but can put some extra "oomph" on the ball as a reverse change of speeds occasionally. I want someone who can eat up innings and changes speeds. That's not consistent with a max-effort kind of pitcher.
So ... Scapula loading is a description that is supposed to trigger a backward movement by the shoulder (the scapula's are pretty passive) during the early stages of the delivery in order to maximize the armpath. The Scapulas don't load, they are along for the ride. Your chest muscles will be more involved and I believe you may be more prone to injury. You may achieve extra velocity, but you also may experience a corresponding loss of control due to the increase armpath and the increased number of elements you have to control during your delivery. You may just throw the p*ss out of the ball great. Each person is different and each delivery is a bit different.
I've been thinking and reading about "Scapula loading" ever since I first heard about it years ago. I'm by no means an expert but I have come to a couple of conclusions:
1. Looking at the muscle groups related to the scapula and their range of motion, it doesn't make sense that they could contribute more than fractionally.
2. In order to "load" the Scapula, you are really just extending the arm and shoulder backwards. The true muscle groups that come into play then are the much stronger muscles across your chest.
3. The increased extention creates a longer path to delivery allowing a fraction of a second longer to increase velocity.
We have all heard ton's of "terms" over the years in baseball from "squish the bug", etc etc. "Scapula Loading" really is just another way of trying to get you into a position of maximum effort and the muscles near/around the scapula don't do anything but SLOW DOWN the efforts of your shoulder and chest muscles to violently throw your arm and shoulder forward. So much for the term, it's a gimmick.
What it is really describing is a Maximum Effort type of delivery. That's great ... but ... is that good? If you are a Max effort kind of pitcher, always going 100%, you have nothing left in your tank. Now you are getting into pitching philosophies where some people believe that you go 100% (there isn't any such thing as 101% or any higher number) all the time or whether you pitch at 90%.
To me, it the difference in a starter (90% pitcher) mind-set versus a closer (max-effort) kind of guy.
Neither is right or wrong, just different. But I don't personally want a max-effort starter. I want someone who has gas in his tank, but can put some extra "oomph" on the ball as a reverse change of speeds occasionally. I want someone who can eat up innings and changes speeds. That's not consistent with a max-effort kind of pitcher.
So ... Scapula loading is a description that is supposed to trigger a backward movement by the shoulder (the scapula's are pretty passive) during the early stages of the delivery in order to maximize the armpath. The Scapulas don't load, they are along for the ride. Your chest muscles will be more involved and I believe you may be more prone to injury. You may achieve extra velocity, but you also may experience a corresponding loss of control due to the increase armpath and the increased number of elements you have to control during your delivery. You may just throw the p*ss out of the ball great. Each person is different and each delivery is a bit different.
Oh, I don't know.....
Every pitcher who throws to his ability does it. Every hitter who hits to his ability does it.
Every player that plays at a high level knows how to load and unload every muscle group that is used.
Every pitcher who throws to his ability does it. Every hitter who hits to his ability does it.
Every player that plays at a high level knows how to load and unload every muscle group that is used.
Drop down to the "Coaches Tips" forum (page 2) and you'll find about 40+ posts about this topic from different people on here.
Basicly it's the elbow taking the hands back toward the dugout behind the batter. It's loading. Same as if you are going to throw a punch.
CV
Basicly it's the elbow taking the hands back toward the dugout behind the batter. It's loading. Same as if you are going to throw a punch.
CV
scapula loading is an interesting topic with many opinions to say the least. I thought I would toss mine out there as well...take it or leave it. I understand the concept of elongating the muscles to create a fast contraction but I disagree with the idea of tension to creat quickness. The term reciprocal innervation is a fancy term that simply states that when muscles contract against each other maximum contraction is not achieved. In order for the front of the shoulder and chest area to help achieve maximum contraction the back of the shoulder and scapular region must be relaxed. For this reason I try to focus my players on proper separation and positioning while staying extremely relaxed and effortless. JMO
I admit that I am not 100% sure of what "scapula loading" means; but if it is what I think it is, then I would not advise it. My son is currently finishing up his reconditioning while focusing on undoing the mechanics of the "scapula loading" after several months of physical therapy. The physical therapy was necessary due to shoulder impingement which the psychical therapist thinks was partly caused by my son leading with the elbow during his windup (he is a catcher/infielder) instead of leading with his hand. I think the problem mainly occurred when my son performed a catcher's snap throw. I have heard many people teach that a catcher should bring the ball back behind the ear (which usually involves leading with the elbow) - my son used this technique and loaded his scapula in an effort to get more pop. Another often heard advice to young catchers - take the glove and ball back towards the ear in the windup - I would not advise that either for a couple of reasons: 1) the catcher might lose a strike call by the umpire due to the excessive glove movement and 2) having the glove too far back in the windup can adversely affect timing. In my son's case, he was getting the glove back around his ear and appeared to either rush to open up his shoulders on the throw or fail to properly open up his shoulders (which seemed to cause a consistent tail to the right on his ball flight). I apologize if I've improperly used the term "scapula loading" - I just wanted to warn others (it is quite a frustrating and worrisome time when your son has an arm/shoulder injury). Best wishes.
Here is an example of scap loading.
MoDad, you are not talking about the same thing.
HHH,
All great power pitchers do it. The max effort argument is incorrect in my opinion. Which is worth what you paid for it.
Teacherman, good post.
hsbaseballcoach,
The way to do it is to increase core strength. Scap loading is like every other new technique. It ain't going to happen over night. The guys who start early or naturally do it become power pitchers. After years of doing the motion one no longer has to create tension to be successful it becomes easy and second nature. The key is start early with proper mechanics and build you core strength and develop your scapular muscles.
Jeff brantley was broadcasting a game and I heard him state that he would do it differently if he were a young player today. he would develop his flexibility and scap muscles. jmo
MoDad, you are not talking about the same thing.
HHH,
All great power pitchers do it. The max effort argument is incorrect in my opinion. Which is worth what you paid for it.
Teacherman, good post.
hsbaseballcoach,
quote:I understand the concept of elongating the muscles to create a fast contraction but I disagree with the idea of tension to creat quickness. The term reciprocal innervation is a fancy term that simply states that when muscles contract against each other maximum contraction is not achieved.
The way to do it is to increase core strength. Scap loading is like every other new technique. It ain't going to happen over night. The guys who start early or naturally do it become power pitchers. After years of doing the motion one no longer has to create tension to be successful it becomes easy and second nature. The key is start early with proper mechanics and build you core strength and develop your scapular muscles.
Jeff brantley was broadcasting a game and I heard him state that he would do it differently if he were a young player today. he would develop his flexibility and scap muscles. jmo
quote:Originally posted by MoDad:
I admit that I am not 100% sure of what "scapula loading" means; but if it is what I think it is, then I would not advise it...
Brilliant.
Big ...
I don't disagree with the position... I just disagree with the naming of the term ...
Scapula loading is a huge misnomer. You are creating extension, lengthening the arm path and involving the chest muscles in the delivery.
... Call it "Chest Expansion" or "Path Lengthening" ... at least those have an element of the truth in it.... The Scapula is a bone ... how do you load a bone.
I don't disagree with the position... I just disagree with the naming of the term ...
Scapula loading is a huge misnomer. You are creating extension, lengthening the arm path and involving the chest muscles in the delivery.
... Call it "Chest Expansion" or "Path Lengthening" ... at least those have an element of the truth in it.... The Scapula is a bone ... how do you load a bone.
1. Looking at the muscle groups related to the scapula and their range of motion, it doesn't make sense that they could contribute more than fractionally.
Yeah, fractionally, like, 2%-5% difference is the difference between playing in the big leagues and not. 89mph may not get you there but 91 might. Do you want that "fractional" increase?
2. In order to "load" the Scapula, you are really just extending the arm and shoulder backwards. The true muscle groups that come into play then are the much stronger muscles across your chest.
A rather incomplete definition. But, it's the one you like.
...So much for the term, it's a gimmick.
Only because you don't know what it is. Easier to say "it doesn't fit my baseball religion" than to learn about it.
...I want someone who has gas in his tank, but can put some extra "oomph" on the ball
As in, that is exactly what scap loading can help with.
Yeah, fractionally, like, 2%-5% difference is the difference between playing in the big leagues and not. 89mph may not get you there but 91 might. Do you want that "fractional" increase?
2. In order to "load" the Scapula, you are really just extending the arm and shoulder backwards. The true muscle groups that come into play then are the much stronger muscles across your chest.
A rather incomplete definition. But, it's the one you like.
...So much for the term, it's a gimmick.
Only because you don't know what it is. Easier to say "it doesn't fit my baseball religion" than to learn about it.
...I want someone who has gas in his tank, but can put some extra "oomph" on the ball
As in, that is exactly what scap loading can help with.
quote:Originally posted by HiHardHeat:
Big ...
I don't disagree with the position... I just disagree with the naming of the term ...
Scapula loading is a huge misnomer. You are creating extension, lengthening the arm path and involving the chest muscles in the delivery.
... Call it "Chest Expansion" or "Path Lengthening" ... at least those have an element of the truth in it.... The Scapula is a bone ... how do you load a bone.
More religion.
TripleH,
Without getting into the arguing part of it, one does call it loading when you apply force to a bone. I don't know if that is precisely what is happening when pitcher's "scapula load", but you may have been defining scapula loading with your first post in which case there isn't any argument at all. In other words, expanding the chest muscles may result in loading the scapula.
Regardless, scapula loading seems to be fairly univeral amongst mlb pitchers, and more pronounced with some of the harder throwing ones.
That leaves the only question as: "Does it come naturally, or should it be taught?"
I'll go with the teach it approach, although it is going to be a different motion for most pitchers and trying to make a sudden change could result in injury and could certainly result in less control in the short term.
Without getting into the arguing part of it, one does call it loading when you apply force to a bone. I don't know if that is precisely what is happening when pitcher's "scapula load", but you may have been defining scapula loading with your first post in which case there isn't any argument at all. In other words, expanding the chest muscles may result in loading the scapula.
Regardless, scapula loading seems to be fairly univeral amongst mlb pitchers, and more pronounced with some of the harder throwing ones.
That leaves the only question as: "Does it come naturally, or should it be taught?"
I'll go with the teach it approach, although it is going to be a different motion for most pitchers and trying to make a sudden change could result in injury and could certainly result in less control in the short term.
By all means teach a kid to load up. I dont care what you call it the fact is a relaxed muscle is not as powerfull as a loaded up tense muscle. In fact without loading the scaps you are taking that totally out of the equation and will never throw at your max potential. Its like kids that dont use their legs and throw all arm on the hill so to speak. All you have to do is try for yourself. You get instant feedback and you can feel that you are more powerfull when you load your scaps on a throw. Its like having a relaxed plant leg and trying to throw vs a tight powerfull quad plant leg.
I guess I'm not making my point clearly .... The term is inaccurate and I personally don't care for it. The 2%-5% increase, if you believe that, is fine, but it's not coming from the scapular region muscles.
Does my son "load" according to the "scap loading" pics/theories/religion/etc (or whatever you want to call it)? Yes.
Does he throw as hard as he can on every pitch? No, he's not a "Max effort" pitcher.
Does he break 90? Yes.
Work on the shoulder muscles, rotator cuff, legs, abs, chest, thighs ... That's were the speed is coming from.
Get to a good pitching coach. Check him out and make sure your mechanics are clean and powerful. Nothing ... no book, method (or religion if you want to call it that) replaces a good set of eyes.
Does my son "load" according to the "scap loading" pics/theories/religion/etc (or whatever you want to call it)? Yes.
Does he throw as hard as he can on every pitch? No, he's not a "Max effort" pitcher.
Does he break 90? Yes.
Work on the shoulder muscles, rotator cuff, legs, abs, chest, thighs ... That's were the speed is coming from.
Get to a good pitching coach. Check him out and make sure your mechanics are clean and powerful. Nothing ... no book, method (or religion if you want to call it that) replaces a good set of eyes.
TripleH,
I doubt very much if even some of the hardest throwing closers throw with max effort all of the time. Most pitchers throw about 4 to 5 mph less than their top speed on most pitches.
The key is that practicing at times with max effort will allow a pitcher to increase their top speed and along with it their cruising speed. Last time we checked my 13yo threw a top speed of 69, could hit 67, 68 consistently when throwing with nearly max effort and threw most of his pitches around 63 or 64. I think knowing how to throw 3 or 4 mph harder than his regular speed with some modicum of control is a valuable tool in the arsenal.
edited - Since he's in the middle of the season all we've done to try to increase scap loading is run him through mirror drills each morning. It probably isn't going to make any difference in his arm action for now but it may help him increase his scap loading once he's no longer throwing in games on a regular basis.
I doubt very much if even some of the hardest throwing closers throw with max effort all of the time. Most pitchers throw about 4 to 5 mph less than their top speed on most pitches.
The key is that practicing at times with max effort will allow a pitcher to increase their top speed and along with it their cruising speed. Last time we checked my 13yo threw a top speed of 69, could hit 67, 68 consistently when throwing with nearly max effort and threw most of his pitches around 63 or 64. I think knowing how to throw 3 or 4 mph harder than his regular speed with some modicum of control is a valuable tool in the arsenal.
edited - Since he's in the middle of the season all we've done to try to increase scap loading is run him through mirror drills each morning. It probably isn't going to make any difference in his arm action for now but it may help him increase his scap loading once he's no longer throwing in games on a regular basis.
quote:Originally posted by HiHardHeat:
I guess I'm not making my point clearly .... The term is inaccurate and I personally don't care for it...
Doesn't mean it doesn't exist in ALL top performers.
I recommend.......
Horizontal Abduction = Scapula Loading
Maybe there is 2%-5% more for your son HHH? That would only be 94-95mph if he's at 90 now.
Would you rather have IT or your religion?
Morons?
I see you identified.
quote:Originally posted by Teacherman:
I see you identified.
Now thats funny little man.
quote:We have all heard ton's of "terms" over the years in baseball from "squish the bug", etc etc. "Scapula Loading" really is just another way of trying to get you into a position of maximum effort and the muscles near/around the scapula don't do anything but SLOW DOWN the efforts of your shoulder and chest muscles to violently throw your arm and shoulder forward. So much for the term, it's a gimmick.
The Scapular Muscles
On your prosected specimens identify the following muscles of the scapular region (Netter, 160, 395-398):
deltoid
supraspinatus
infraspinatus
teres major
teres minor
subscapularis
Identify the borders of the deltoid (Netter, 395). Note that it originates from the lateral third of the clavicle, the acromion and spine of the scapula. It inserts into the deltoid tuberosity of the humerus. The action of the deltoid is abduction of the arm.
The deltoid muscle is innervated by the axillary nerve. The axillary nerve passes posterior to the humerus enroute to the deltoid muscle. The posterior humeral circumflex artery passes along with it to contribute to the blood supply of the deltoid. The axillary nerve also supplies the teres minor muscle. We will identify the nerve later.
The deltoid and trapezius muscles lie superficial to the supraspinatus and infraspinatus muscles. To see these muscles completely you will need a prosection in which the deltoid and trapezius muscles are reflected or removed. Note that the supraspinatus and infraspinatus muscles insert into the greater tuberosity of the humerus. The supraspinatus initiates abduction; the infraspinatus is a lateral rotator of the humerus. These muscles are innervated by the suprascapular nerve
The teres minor muscle lies just below the infraspinatus. It originates from the lateral border of the scapula and inserts into the greater tubercle of the humerus. The teres minor is a lateral rotator; it is also an adductor of the arm.
The teres major originates from the inferior angle of the scapula and inserts into the crest of the lesser tubercle. Teres major is an adductor, medial rotator and extensor. It is innervated by the lower subscapular nerve.
The subcapularis muscle originates from the subscapular fossa of the scapula and inserts into the lesser tubercle of the humerus. It's action is to medially rotate the arm. This muscle is innervated by the upper and lower subscapular nerves.
Four of the scapular muscles contribute to a musculotendinous cuff around the shoulder joint, the rotator cuff. These muscles are the supraspinatus, infraspinatus, teres minor, and subscapularis. There tendons blend with the capsule of the shoulder joint. The rotator cuff muscles help stabilize the shoulder joint by holding the head of the humerus in the glenoid cavity. Have you heard of rotator cuff injuries?
To say that these muscles do not help with velocity would be incorrect in my opinion.
quote:Work on the shoulder muscles, rotator cuff, legs, abs, chest, thighs ... That's were the speed is coming from.
Why work on those and not the scapular muscles. It makes no sense. Why ignore anything just because you don't like the term? I am confused.
quote:So much for the term, it's a gimmick.
why dont you get out of your wheel chair and try it,
quote:Does my son "load" according to the "scap loading" pics/theories/religion/etc (or whatever you want to call it)? Yes.
lets see a video clip of him then...
quote:Does he throw as hard as he can on every pitch? No, he's not a "Max effort" pitcher.
good, then the kid that throws 95 will make it ahead of him and get paid more
quote:Does he break 90? Yes.
i smell bull ****, show us a clip with the radar gun at the end, this is the internet you cant fool me, i know a 15 year old that is having trouble breaking 90 consistantly that throws with the intent of a hungry wolf
so i just devoured hisoftheat, anyone wanna argue weighted baseballs dont work either?
Attacking HHH's son's ability is off base and you are wrong about his son not hitting 90. I don't mind a discussion, but let us not get personal. His son is a fine player.jmo
Can someone help me learn how to do this scap loading. I have seen it before, but I'm not sure how to learn and put it in my delivery.
Agreed Bighit. I happen to agree with the ****** teachings, but if someone else doesn't, I really don't care. Berating someone is probably not going to get them to see your view in any discussion. If I'm not mistaken, Paul ***** was the first to use the term, "scapula loading", so I use his definition. If he is correct, then lots of pitchers are in fact scapula loading. Video clips show this without question.
BigHit15
It's really, really good seeing you back on the board. We missed you.
Thanks Teacherman. Horizontal Abduction is a much more descriptive term describing what is going on during the delivery.
Big: You've made my point for me ... on all of these muscles, the insertion point is the Humerus, which makes them part of the shoulder muscles. Of course you work on them, Anterior and Posterior. Working and strengthening the rotator cuff is critical.
Ogba: Nice first post ...
-------------------------
I really don't care one way or another which "professor of theology" someone follows, but I believe that you will make more progress if it's done in an "eyes on" situation. I believe that a pitching instructor/coach/guru or whatever you want to call it is more beneficial than a website, method or far distant expert who can't see you.
So ... why not max effort? This one probably does fall into the category of a religion for us. I've seen a lot of "max effort" high schoolers have to go under the knife for various reasons. I don't believe that they always have their growth plates closed, or have built sufficient bone density or muscle mass to allow the shock absorber action that is necessary to slow down their arm repeatedly from repeated max effort deliveries. Some guys mature earlier. For them it's fine.
As a person's body matures, then it's fine ... but my son still have some open growth plates that show on X-ray and has more physical maturing to do. He's a HS senior.
Teacherman: Every time I post, the points I'm trying to make are:
1). There is no one way to do anything. Look at the hitters/pitchers in the majors. They aren't carbon copies.
2). Extremes don't have a history of a high sucess rate. Yes pitchers can be sucessful throwing over the top at 12:30, but they are rare. Hitters can be out of sync and hit .300 in the pros.
... and still contend that you can't load a bone.
It's really, really good seeing you back on the board. We missed you.
Thanks Teacherman. Horizontal Abduction is a much more descriptive term describing what is going on during the delivery.
Big: You've made my point for me ... on all of these muscles, the insertion point is the Humerus, which makes them part of the shoulder muscles. Of course you work on them, Anterior and Posterior. Working and strengthening the rotator cuff is critical.
Ogba: Nice first post ...
-------------------------
I really don't care one way or another which "professor of theology" someone follows, but I believe that you will make more progress if it's done in an "eyes on" situation. I believe that a pitching instructor/coach/guru or whatever you want to call it is more beneficial than a website, method or far distant expert who can't see you.
So ... why not max effort? This one probably does fall into the category of a religion for us. I've seen a lot of "max effort" high schoolers have to go under the knife for various reasons. I don't believe that they always have their growth plates closed, or have built sufficient bone density or muscle mass to allow the shock absorber action that is necessary to slow down their arm repeatedly from repeated max effort deliveries. Some guys mature earlier. For them it's fine.
As a person's body matures, then it's fine ... but my son still have some open growth plates that show on X-ray and has more physical maturing to do. He's a HS senior.
Teacherman: Every time I post, the points I'm trying to make are:
1). There is no one way to do anything. Look at the hitters/pitchers in the majors. They aren't carbon copies.
2). Extremes don't have a history of a high sucess rate. Yes pitchers can be sucessful throwing over the top at 12:30, but they are rare. Hitters can be out of sync and hit .300 in the pros.
... and still contend that you can't load a bone.
quote:Originally posted by HiHardHeat:
BigHit15
It's really, really good seeing you back on the board. We missed you.
Thanks Teacherman. Horizontal Abduction is a much more descriptive term describing what is going on during the delivery.
Big: You've made my point for me ... on all of these muscles, the insertion point is the Humerus, which makes them part of the shoulder muscles. Of course you work on them, Anterior and Posterior. Working and strengthening the rotator cuff is critical.
Ogba: Nice first post ...
-------------------------
I really don't care one way or another which "professor of theology" someone follows, but I believe that you will make more progress if it's done in an "eyes on" situation. I believe that a pitching instructor/coach/guru or whatever you want to call it is more beneficial than a website, method or far distant expert who can't see you.
So ... why not max effort? This one probably does fall into the category of a religion for us. I've seen a lot of "max effort" high schoolers have to go under the knife for various reasons. I don't believe that they always have their growth plates closed, or have built sufficient bone density or muscle mass to allow the shock absorber action that is necessary to slow down their arm repeatedly from repeated max effort deliveries. Some guys mature earlier. For them it's fine.
As a person's body matures, then it's fine ... but my son still have some open growth plates that show on X-ray and has more physical maturing to do. He's a HS senior.
Teacherman: Every time I post, the points I'm trying to make are:
1). There is no one way to do anything. Look at the hitters/pitchers in the majors. They aren't carbon copies.
2). Extremes don't have a history of a high sucess rate. Yes pitchers can be sucessful throwing over the top at 12:30, but they are rare. Hitters can be out of sync and hit .300 in the pros.
... and still contend that you can't load a bone.
TRANSLATION: I love my religion.
quote:Originally posted by obga:quote:So much for the term, it's a gimmick.
why dont you get out of your wheel chair and try it,
quote:Does my son "load" according to the "scap loading" pics/theories/religion/etc (or whatever you want to call it)? Yes.
lets see a video clip of him then...
quote:Does he throw as hard as he can on every pitch? No, he's not a "Max effort" pitcher.
good, then the kid that throws 95 will make it ahead of him and get paid more
quote:Does he break 90? Yes.
i smell bull ****, show us a clip with the radar gun at the end, this is the internet you cant fool me, i know a 15 year old that is having trouble breaking 90 consistantly that throws with the intent of a hungry wolf
so i just devoured hisoftheat, anyone wanna argue weighted baseballs dont work either?
Hey Obga, Why don't you post some film of yourself? By the way, there is not a starting pitcher in the big leagues that throws as hard as he can on every pitch. If you had ever pitched at a high level, you would know that.You come here with your first post and rip into a respected member of this community and the only thing you have is what you have learned from a guy who never played anything and has never taught anyone, and swings the bat like an old washerwomen.
Obga we dont attack peoples kids here. We dont attack peoples kids period. The fact that he is indeed a stud player does not matter at all. The fact that you come on here and try to smack down respected members of our community does. Go ahead Teach work him over real good and he will go away. Be quiet for awhile and learn your place son. If you have something to add that is based on experience great we are all for it. But if all your going to do is bash people that you dont even know anything about please find someplace else to do it.
quote:... Go ahead Teach work him over real good and he will go away...
If me pointing out that he doesn't know what he's talking about "sends him away" so be it.
Then, pick on me (because I said it) rather than the bad information he's spewing.
What's also interesting is the definition of "respected member". Usually it's a parent of a talented son. Like they have much to offer.
Most have no clue. But they are religious.
quote:Originally posted by Coach May:
Obga we dont attack peoples kids here. We dont attack peoples kids period.
Coach ...
Your boys are looking good for the playoffs. Good luck this week and knock 'em dead !!!!! I believe you guys should cruise through the first two rounds. 15 wins in a row doesn't hurt going into the playoffs and you have those young guns playing great this year.
H3
And Coach ... you missed Teach's point... he's not after Obga, he's after me since I disagree with his religion.
Thanks HHeat. Well we lost tonight 10-7. Our #1 was unable to go due to a bad ankle. We started a Freshman on the hill that is really talented and he pitched great for 6 innings. We were tied 3-3 in the 7th and he hit the lead off man. We pulled him with two on and one out and they proceeded to get 6 hits in a row. It was just one of those things were they just had eyes. They scored 7 in the 7th and took a 10-3 lead going into the bottom of the 7th. We fought back and hit a grand slam and made it 10-7. We loaded up the bases again and had the tying run at the plate but we struck out to end the game. We had a heck of a year 21-4 overall. Its tough to loose anytime especially when you have won 15 in a row and feel that you have a chance to go deep in the playoffs. But Im proud of my boys they never quit and fought untill the end. I give Manteo alot of credit they were clutch all night. We will be fine. We have two sophs and one fresh on the hill this year and they are going to be very very good in the future. As we were leaving the field one of our coaches said "I dont know what Im going to do after school tomorrow". My boy said "Im going to come to the field and hit and start my long toss program". I tell you what I am so proud of him. He started behind the plate as a Freshman and was outstanding. He had 13 runners attempt steals this year and he threw out 8. He did not give up a stolen base in the conference 14 games no passed balls. He was a warrior. He hit .390 in conference play and .320 for the season with 9 doubles and 2 hrs. I had to brag on him a little it sure hurts to see your kid cry his eyes out after a game. But it also makes you feel good to know that he cares so much as well.
Teach-
My recollection is that scap loading is primarily via horizontal aDduction of the scapula (sometimes called horizontal adduction of the shoulder or RE traction among other confusing things).This is not to be confused with "shoulder abduction" or adduction which is actually referring to the arm bone lifting up away and back down toward the side)AB means whatever structure is being referred to is moving away from the midline,ADduction toward midline.In case of "horizontal adduction".it means the scap is pinching toward the midline/spine as it loads.
I personally think this is important info for the swing/throw skills coach to know,helps with communication with training rehab types as well.
Throwing studies have shown that degree of scap load and arm layback (horizontal adduction of scap and degree of external rotation of arm/humerus) are significantly related to velocity,probably because this means there is increased range of motion and better sequencing for the rapid acceleration/whipping of the arm.
In hitting,I think a good back scap load can shorten and quicken the swing as well as allow for more built in on the fly automatic adjustment capability (automaticity).
My recollection is that scap loading is primarily via horizontal aDduction of the scapula (sometimes called horizontal adduction of the shoulder or RE traction among other confusing things).This is not to be confused with "shoulder abduction" or adduction which is actually referring to the arm bone lifting up away and back down toward the side)AB means whatever structure is being referred to is moving away from the midline,ADduction toward midline.In case of "horizontal adduction".it means the scap is pinching toward the midline/spine as it loads.
I personally think this is important info for the swing/throw skills coach to know,helps with communication with training rehab types as well.
Throwing studies have shown that degree of scap load and arm layback (horizontal adduction of scap and degree of external rotation of arm/humerus) are significantly related to velocity,probably because this means there is increased range of motion and better sequencing for the rapid acceleration/whipping of the arm.
In hitting,I think a good back scap load can shorten and quicken the swing as well as allow for more built in on the fly automatic adjustment capability (automaticity).