Clifton runs a hitting school in the SW.
Chameleon, what the heck is a hitting school?
Blue Dog,
I don't run a hitting "school".
I have on average 13 kids per week and try to help them hit better, that's all.
What part did you feel was dramatic?
The interpretation of a cue.
Agreeing with Micmister.
Or quoting his remark about "adding confusion"?
If he was asking me I was willing to answer, if he was talking to hscoach, I was going to leave it alone. I was looking for clarification.
When he said he was talking to "neither" I thought he was "adding confusion"..
I'll watch the quotes. O.K.?
On the other hand,,,buzz off.
I don't run a hitting "school".
I have on average 13 kids per week and try to help them hit better, that's all.
What part did you feel was dramatic?
The interpretation of a cue.
Agreeing with Micmister.
Or quoting his remark about "adding confusion"?
If he was asking me I was willing to answer, if he was talking to hscoach, I was going to leave it alone. I was looking for clarification.
When he said he was talking to "neither" I thought he was "adding confusion"..
I'll watch the quotes. O.K.?
On the other hand,,,buzz off.
Oh Brother
Clifton, you don't have to watch anything on my account......You can quote till the cows come home for all I care......I don't run anything around here, for sure......
I just think it's confusing to people like me who have problems following all but the simplest of conversations, especially about hitting......
I'll be glad to stay out of your business.....I was just wondering where you were coming from with all the quoting stuff....I still don't know, but, I'll steer clear of your posts, no problem....
I just think it's confusing to people like me who have problems following all but the simplest of conversations, especially about hitting......
I'll be glad to stay out of your business.....I was just wondering where you were coming from with all the quoting stuff....I still don't know, but, I'll steer clear of your posts, no problem....
Blue Dog,
Did you see the barrel above the hands?
Did you see the barrel above the hands?
Sorry I couldn't get back to you guys earlier. I think LClifton demonstrated with his illustration the cue keeping the barrel above the hands. There are many ways to say similar things. I have found that when I demonstrate for my players the point I am making and use the cue keep the barrel up as long as possible, it has been very effective. I find it easier than telling them to load the wrist via flexion of the brachioradialis and extensor carpi radialis longus and to maintain that flexion until maximun force has been obtained through the sequential timing of trunk rotation and mass transfer due to center of gravity relocation. Upon reaching said time and having established the path of the sphere to be struck, the loading phase then becomes the striking phase and the barrel travels at a high rate of speed in a mostly circular path to said sphere. But I prefer keep the barrel above the hands as long as possible! 
Not interested in the direction the bathead goes from a flat position.
I'm interested in what direction the hands turn the barrel at "go".[/QUOTE]
Away from the hitter backwards and around. The hands grip the bat and work with the body during the go to excellerate the head when needed.
Shocker,
I'm interested in what direction the hands turn the barrel at "go".[/QUOTE]
Away from the hitter backwards and around. The hands grip the bat and work with the body during the go to excellerate the head when needed.
Shocker,
quote:Originally posted by BlueDog:
Chameleon, what the heck is a hitting school?
He teaches young boys pick up lines.
quote:Originally posted by LClifton:quote:Originally posted by LClifton:
Are you asking me or hscoach?quote:=Mic
Neither, just wondering.quote:Why add the confusion?
I was just making a general statement about your posts. I realize there's a question mark at the end of the last sentence, but since it began with "why", I didn't know what else to put there.
quote:Originally posted by hsballcoach:
Sorry I couldn't get back to you guys earlier. I think LClifton demonstrated with his illustration the cue keeping the barrel above the hands. There are many ways to say similar things. I have found that when I demonstrate for my players the point I am making and use the cue keep the barrel up as long as possible, it has been very effective. I find it easier than telling them to load the wrist via flexion of the brachioradialis and extensor carpi radialis longus and to maintain that flexion until maximun force has been obtained through the sequential timing of trunk rotation and mass transfer due to center of gravity relocation. Upon reaching said time and having established the path of the sphere to be struck, the loading phase then becomes the striking phase and the barrel travels at a high rate of speed in a mostly circular path to said sphere. But I prefer keep the barrel above the hands as long as possible!
You're right, there's less confusion your way.
Public apology to Blue Dog. I apologize.
Mic,
My bad for stepping in and causing confusion in an attempt to explain how the cue "barrel above the hands" was demonstrated to me some time ago.
It made sense to me then and I thought (wrongly, I guess) that some didn't agree with what hscoach meant. So I took a run at it.
Really mean it. My apologies.
-LClifton
Mic,
My bad for stepping in and causing confusion in an attempt to explain how the cue "barrel above the hands" was demonstrated to me some time ago.
It made sense to me then and I thought (wrongly, I guess) that some didn't agree with what hscoach meant. So I took a run at it.
Really mean it. My apologies.
-LClifton
quote:Originally posted by LClifton:
Public apology to Blue Dog. I apologize.
Mic,
My bad for stepping in and causing confusion in an attempt to explain how the cue "barrel above the hands" was demonstrated to me some time ago.
It made sense to me then and I thought (wrongly, I guess) that some didn't agree with what hscoach meant. So I took a run at it.
Really mean it. My apologies.
-LClifton
Not a problem. I had seen a hitting video with Terry Kennedy demonstrating, where he said keep the barrel above the hands too. I didn't really understand it at the time either and thought, "if you want to hit ground balls maybe!" I would think keeping the barrel above the hands would really only work if you were squating really low or on high pitches.
In the nano-second thinking of these swing moves, the catcher is already throwing the ball back to the pitcher.
quote:Originally posted by OLDSLUGGER8:
In the nano-second thinking of these swing moves, the catcher is already throwing the ball back to the pitcher.
The thinking happens in BP and study hall. Once you come to the plate it's see ball hit ball on every pitch, IMO.
quote:Originally posted by micmeister:quote:Originally posted by OLDSLUGGER8:
In the nano-second thinking of these swing moves, the catcher is already throwing the ball back to the pitcher.
The thinking happens in BP and study hall. Once you come to the plate it's see ball hit ball on every pitch, IMO.
So you agree, it is the eyes that lead the swing..you said see ball hit ball
But I can't because my shoulder load took a bit longer than usual, then I had to send the barrel rearward, then they broke for commercial.
Have you all considered that these young men you insist your will upon step aside with their buddies and give you the collective -EDIT LANGUAGE- ??
Guys........chopped liver !!
Chameleon,
Do you have any pictures (or individual frames from a video clip) that show the bat blurring as a result of the rotation between the hands (torque) at go? I'm just trying to make sure that I understand when the torque first occurs.
Thanks.
Do you have any pictures (or individual frames from a video clip) that show the bat blurring as a result of the rotation between the hands (torque) at go? I'm just trying to make sure that I understand when the torque first occurs.
Thanks.
quote:Originally posted by rocket:
Chameleon,
Do you have any pictures (or individual frames from a video clip) that show the bat blurring as a result of the rotation between the hands (torque) at go? I'm just trying to make sure that I understand when the torque first occurs.
Thanks.
Ortiz, page two of this thread. Chameleon is no more.
quote:Originally posted by OLDSLUGGER8:quote:Originally posted by micmeister:quote:Originally posted by OLDSLUGGER8:
In the nano-second thinking of these swing moves, the catcher is already throwing the ball back to the pitcher.
The thinking happens in BP and study hall. Once you come to the plate it's see ball hit ball on every pitch, IMO.
So you agree, it is the eyes that lead the swing..you said see ball hit ball
But I can't because my shoulder load took a bit longer than usual, then I had to send the barrel rearward, then they broke for commercial.
Have you all considered that these young men you insist your will upon step aside with their buddies and give you the collective -EDIT LANGUAGE- ??
Guys........chopped liver !!
A lot of people can see the ball, but not too many can hit the darn thing, LOL!
micmeister,
I am looking for individual frames from video clips, not an actual clip. I have been looking at a clip of Alfonso Soriano to investigate how the bat blurs. After stopping this clip at the point the bat starts to blur, it is apparent that the bat is not being blurred as a result of torque created between the hands (rotation between the hands). His bat becomes blurred at the barrel and at the handle. There exists a point in the middle of the bat that is not blurred. This indicates that the middle of the bat has less velocity than the handle and the barrel. The only explanation for this is that rotation is occurring somewhere in the middle of the bat. The point in the middle of the bat is acting as an axis of rotation. This is the result of the handle being moved (no torque) in one direction, and the barrel responding by moving in the opposite direction. This seems to contradict the belief that the bat is being blurred as a result of rotation between the hands.
If the bat was rotated by torque on the handle, the axis of rotation would occur between the hands and the bat would become increasingly blurred as the distance from the hands increased. This is not occurring in the clip of Alfonso Soriano.
I am looking for individual frames of the bat blur being discussed on this forum to verify that I am looking at the correct portion of the swing. I may not be looking at the same blur that the people on this board are referring to. I also do not want to make claims on the existence of torque in relation to bat blurring without looking at many examples.
Thanks
I am looking for individual frames from video clips, not an actual clip. I have been looking at a clip of Alfonso Soriano to investigate how the bat blurs. After stopping this clip at the point the bat starts to blur, it is apparent that the bat is not being blurred as a result of torque created between the hands (rotation between the hands). His bat becomes blurred at the barrel and at the handle. There exists a point in the middle of the bat that is not blurred. This indicates that the middle of the bat has less velocity than the handle and the barrel. The only explanation for this is that rotation is occurring somewhere in the middle of the bat. The point in the middle of the bat is acting as an axis of rotation. This is the result of the handle being moved (no torque) in one direction, and the barrel responding by moving in the opposite direction. This seems to contradict the belief that the bat is being blurred as a result of rotation between the hands.
If the bat was rotated by torque on the handle, the axis of rotation would occur between the hands and the bat would become increasingly blurred as the distance from the hands increased. This is not occurring in the clip of Alfonso Soriano.
I am looking for individual frames of the bat blur being discussed on this forum to verify that I am looking at the correct portion of the swing. I may not be looking at the same blur that the people on this board are referring to. I also do not want to make claims on the existence of torque in relation to bat blurring without looking at many examples.
Thanks
quote:Originally posted by rocket:
micmeister,
I am looking for individual frames from video clips, not an actual clip. I have been looking at a clip of Alfonso Soriano to investigate how the bat blurs. After stopping this clip at the point the bat starts to blur, it is apparent that the bat is not being blurred as a result of torque created between the hands (rotation between the hands). His bat becomes blurred at the barrel and at the handle. There exists a point in the middle of the bat that is not blurred. This indicates that the middle of the bat has less velocity than the handle and the barrel. The only explanation for this is that rotation is occurring somewhere in the middle of the bat. The point in the middle of the bat is acting as an axis of rotation. This is the result of the handle being moved (no torque) in one direction, and the barrel responding by moving in the opposite direction. This seems to contradict the belief that the bat is being blurred as a result of rotation between the hands.
If the bat was rotated by torque on the handle, the axis of rotation would occur between the hands and the bat would become increasingly blurred as the distance from the hands increased. This is not occurring in the clip of Alfonso Soriano.
I am looking for individual frames of the bat blur being discussed on this forum to verify that I am looking at the correct portion of the swing. I may not be looking at the same blur that the people on this board are referring to. I also do not want to make claims on the existence of torque in relation to bat blurring without looking at many examples.
Thanks
Since the guy that understands this the most has been kicked off of this site, I will try to explain what I understand. The blurr rearward, IMO, is caused by a combination of a pronation of the top forearm and a supination of the bottom forearm (as someone explained as "working the top hand under the bottom hand") and in conjunction with the rear elbow tuck and the shoulder tilt. This process is very clear in the slowed down video of David Ortiz in this thread. As far as no blurr being in the middle of the bat, it isn't being moved as much, distance wise, since the center of rotation is closer to the knob. It takes a certain speed to cause a blurr on a camera.
Thanks for the response. In the clip mentioned in my previous post, the barrel and the handle are blurred more than the middle. This implies that the hands and the barrel are moving with a greater velocity than the middle of the bat. The only explanation that I can give for this is that the barrel is rotating around an axis located near the middle of the bat. This can only happen if the handle is being accelerated in one direction and the barrel is reacting by accelerating in the opposite direction. This would contradict the idea of the bat being rotated between the hands.
Torque applied by the hands would create a situation where the bat becomes increasingly blurred as the distance from the hands increased, but this is not occurring in the example that I am looking at. The point in the middle of the bat with less blur makes me wonder if this reasoning is incorrect. That is why I am looking for more examples.
Torque applied by the hands would create a situation where the bat becomes increasingly blurred as the distance from the hands increased, but this is not occurring in the example that I am looking at. The point in the middle of the bat with less blur makes me wonder if this reasoning is incorrect. That is why I am looking for more examples.
