Smokeless tobacco

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
Alcohol is not addicting. Do you drink in front of your son?

I drink addicting caffeine drinks too. Guess I'm a horrible father and I have no right to try and prevent him from smoking or chewing tabacco. For that matter, go ahead and give him the crack pipe.

You have to fight stupidity with wisdom. As America's leading drug addiction expert puts it, the NIDA's Dr. Nora Volkow, nicotine addiction is a disease where brain changes translate into an inability to control drug intake. These drug induced brain modifications then signal the brain with a message that's equivalent to "when you are starving," the signal to "seek food and eat it," that the drug is "necessary to survival," that dopamine pathways ensure "long-lasting memory of salient events." Our priorities hijacked, our self-induced mental disorder having left us totally convinced that that next nicotine fix is as important as life itself, where do we turn once we awaken and realize that we've cooked in brain damage that takes years to recover from.

Rules are not enough of a reason even more so when they are so poorly enforced. Very much so when encouraged to break them "discreetly".

I meant to put in a ? mark ....it is addicting. Calm down and trust your son will make good choices.

quote:

Originally posted by Aleebaba:
12 to 15 deaths per year? That's ridiculously idiotic and completely ignorant. IEBSL, I don't want to spend time debating you. I just suggest you parent your child, and I will parent mine.

I would suggest that if you really want to have that attitude, you shouldn't have asked for advice.

quote:

Originally posted by Matt13:

quote:

Originally posted by Aleebaba:
12 to 15 deaths per year? That's ridiculously idiotic and completely ignorant. IEBSL, I don't want to spend time debating you. I just suggest you parent your child, and I will parent mine.

I would suggest that if you really want to have that attitude, you shouldn't have asked for advice.

I kind of have to agree with you, people should know by now that when you post something you might get more advice than you were expecting, or the answer wasn't what you would have liked to have heard.

I have a question, why are parents not able to let go and let their children grow up? This is not personally directed to the OP, I have been guilty on occasion of it myself.

From my experience, there is only so much we can control and for how long. I hope that the decision where your son will go and play will be based upon other criteria, not if anyone might dip or not. I smoked when my son was in HS and college which is equally disgusting, therefore I wasn't setting a good example to tell him what he could and couldn't do when he left home about tobacco use. He asked me for years to stop, always telling me it was disgusting, yet he still did what he wanted when he left home.

Present the facts to your kids about situations that they are going to face when they leave home and hope that they make the right decisions and stop driving yourselves crazy over stuff that you can't control anymore.

For the record, I would worry much more about the indulgence in alcohol and other substances. The temptation to join in a game of beer pong is much more tempting than taking dip (trust me).

quote:

Posted March 09, 2012 11:25 PM Hide Post
12 to 15 deaths per year? That's ridiculously idiotic and completely ignorant. IEBSL, I don't want to spend time debating you. I just suggest you parent your child, and I will parent mine.

Don't call me idiotic, I am not offended. However I guess you know way more that the CDC since that is where I got the stat from.

I didn't realize we were restricted to subject matter.

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:

I have a question, why are parents not able to let go and let their children grow up? This is not personally directed to the OP, I have been guilty on occasion of it myself.

From my experience, there is only so much we can control and for how long. I hope that the decision where your son will go and play will be based upon other criteria, not if anyone might dip or not. I smoked when my son was in HS and college which is equally disgusting, therefore I wasn't setting a good example to tell him what he could and couldn't do when he left home about tobacco use. He asked me for years to stop, always telling me it was disgusting, yet he still did what he wanted when he left home.

Present the facts to your kids about situations that they are going to face when they leave home and hope that they make the right decisions and stop driving yourselves crazy over stuff that you can't control anymore.

For the record, I would worry much more about the indulgence in alcohol and other substances. The temptation to join in a game of beer pong is much more tempting than taking dip (trust me).

Good question. We give our kids space and if they make mistakes, we let them figure it out and we were there for support, not to completely bail them out. As for the alcohol thing, kids are gonna drink. So why make drinking taboo? If the law was lowered to 18 and parents allowed their kids to have a few drinks in the home but driving rules MUST be strictly enforced by the parents. By time these kids get to college, the so called temptation to play a beer pong game won't be so strong because having a beer won't be a big deal by time they get there because they been there done that. There's a better chance that by time they go off to college, when they go out for a few drinks, they'll know how to handle themselves a little better than hiding them away from it , then unleasing them off to college where drinking becomes new and cool to them and go all berzerk over drinking and go overboard. The best advise to give the college freshman is to not give into the older college students pressure to drink. If they at least get the tools to learn before they get to college, the less chances they get trapped in a bad spot. As for smokeless tobacco, again, all you can do is show them the end result of long term use of using it. They have to learn to think for themselves.

quote:

Originally posted by IEBSBL:
All college associations have a no dip policy and the player and coach will be ejected. My question is after you keep him from going to a college that has players that use dip, are you then going keep him from going to a college that has players who drink. After that are you going to keep him from going to a college that has players who have s e x. After that maybe schools that have players that drive their cars to fast. Look, I get it, I have kids to and want to keep them safe and I want to see them be successful. My question to you is what is the age your son needs to be before you take the baby on board sign out of your volvo and let him make his own decisions?

I am sorry if this sounds harsh but really. Parents accuse coaches of over coaching. Well guess what this is an example of over parenting.

I couldn't agree more.

Send your kid to BYU. All issues of choice and morality will be solved. let's party break out the

[/QUOTE]

I would suggest that if you really want to have that attitude, you shouldn't have asked for advice.[/QUOTE]

Maybe I did get a little too sensitive, but I do not like it when people say "take the baby on board sign off" or bull like that when I'm just getting opinions on the issue. I don't think I should be attacked as a parent for merely being concerned about an issue. I understand that there would be some backlash because there are lots of tobacco users on this forum, but I bet most of them wish they never started. And because I personally do not care if my son decides to drink in moderation in college should not be a license to get off the subject of tobacco. If you want to debate alcohol fine, but I would rather stick to the tobacco issues for now.

quote:

Originally posted by Aleebaba:
I don't think I should be attacked as a parent for merely being concerned about an issue.

I would posit that you have gone far beyond "merely being concerned" to the point of being obsessive about one detail and having lost perspective about the totality of the situation.

quote:

Originally posted by Aleebaba:
I don't think I should be attacked as a parent for merely being concerned about an issue. I understand that there would be some backlash because there are lots of tobacco users on this forum, but I bet most of them wish they never started.

I don't use tobacco, and never have. But I share most of the sentiments expressed here.

So many words - and diversions - for such a simple subject.

Tobacco is really bad for you.
Tell your kids not to do it.
After you tell them - hope that they follow your advice.

Anything beyond that is a huge waste of time. IMO.

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
and it is getting ridiculously stupid

It's truly amazing how much we agree at times, TR.

quote:

Originally posted by IEBSBL:
I might be giving you parenting advice but here is the issue 1)When do you let go. 2) you say that you do not care about alcohol but there are 24,518 deaths per year according to the CDC involving alcohol but there are only 12 to 15 deaths per year attributed to smokeless tobacco.

Interesting stat on the smokeless tobacco.

It got me curious as to what other causes of death might be with similiar mortality rate.

1. Pets- 31 deaths per year.
2. Bee/Wasps- 53 deaths per year.
3. Rattlesnake- 5.5 deaths per year.
4. Horse- 20 deaths per year.

I think it's safe to say the next time you reach for the dip to go for a horseback ride with your dog to take a look at the bee hive in rattlesnake country. You may want to make sure your life insursance premium is current.

FWIW; T.Gwynn by shear coincidence has used smokeless tobacco for excess of 20 years has had his 2nd cancer surgery to remove a tumor on his partid gland in the last 18 months. His MD has stated that smokeless tobacco had no bearing on the cause of the tumor, located on the right jaw again by coincidence the same side he has used for 20 years. The MD has stated he's based his decision on the fact that there are no current studies that would either confirm or deny smokeless tobacco would be the cause of this type of cancer. To T. Gwynn credit he's come out publicly and has stated he believes it was the cause.

We were very disappointed when I found my sons dip one day in HS.
The point that I was making was that here, after all of these years of him telling me to stop, now we find out he's dipping.
We laid out boundaries, but once he left home, there was only so much we could control. That is all I was saying.
Fortunately there are rules in place, but again, what a person does off the field is his business. If your son is impressionable (meaning that others can easily persuade him to do something), then you are in trouble, but hopefully you have spoken to him about what is acceptable to you as a parent and what is not. He may or may not take your opinion into consideration.
I don't think it was a lecture, rather than just a suggestion that at one point you cannot control what your son does or doesn't do as an adult. You came on here very sternly and very emphatic he wasn't going to go anywhere where anyone was involved with dip, if you had something to do with it. I can't speak for others but IMO that should not be criteria for his desision.

And how would you know, you gonna ask the coach? What do you think he is going to respond?

A good suggestion (from me) might be to have your son attend the local JUCO program, live at home and follow him where ever he goes, then you will have FULL control over everything he does.

Just sayin......and BTW, don't EVER allow your son to go off to play pro ball!

And I don't use tobacco products.

in our region hs campuses are tobacco free--- that is a good start

tpm--- does your suggestion eliminate the calls from mom to the college baseball coaach?

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
tpm--- does your suggestion eliminate the calls from mom to the college baseball coaach?

Absolutely, dads too, and I do suggest that parents go to visit often and keep in touch with their players and talk to them when the players need someone to listen.