SWAGGER

Yes, it often adds to the drama of the game.

I have to admit that I liked the team with Whammer!

gotwood

That ain't swagger

TR I think it all depends on how one defines swagger on the baseball field. I like a team that is confident. I like a team that hustles all the time in everything they do. I like a team that respects their opponents and opponents coaches. I like a team that gets after it hard all the time. I like a team that has everyone into the game at all times. The bench up and cheering for the guy at the plate or the defense and pitcher when they are in th field. I love a team that just goes about its business of playing the game hard and doing whatever it takes to win. I love a confident player who understands that he will get out and he will get another chance.

If swagger is defined as confidence and then it is displayed with the aforementioned attributes then the answer is yes. But if swagger means "Cocky" and strutting around like your Gods gift to the game then NO! Those teams make me sick and I want to beat them down to the dirt! And they are a direct reflection of the coaching staff.

Wham!! You said it best Coach May!

Coach


I am talking confidence bordering on cocky---knowing what and who you are

I played that way I like my teams to play that way---

Then Im with you TR. I love confident players that when they walk up to the field you can see they expect to win. I can see it in a kid when he walks up to the plate to hit. You can tell he believes he is going to mash. There is a big difference in being confident and being cocky imo. Confident players carry themselves in a manner that exudes that confidence. Cocky players are trying to look confident but are actually clowns.

Kinda' like all of John Wooden's great basketball teams at UCLA. They knew they were winners and they absolutely reflected the demeanor of Coach Wooden. He is the greatest in my book!

The line between confidence and cocky is pretty fine and can be one of those "irregular verbs";; the same attitude described as: we're confident, you're cocky, those blankety-blanks make Ricky Henderson look like Mother Theresa.

Just takes one or two guys to step over the line to become the kind of team Coach May describes as the ones he wants to beat into the dirt.

Confidence with respect for the game is my idea of a ball team.

I was lucky enough to coach a team once that had a lot of guys under 6 foot tall but had that "swagger." We were ranked #1 in the St. Louis area. We went to play the #2 ranked team in St. Louis. Mike Shannon even announced during a Cardinal broadcast that this was going to be "The High School game of the year." When we got off of the bus, they were waiting on us and tried to intimidate us as we walked to our dugout. Pure BS! One D-I recruit announced that the JV Team plays "over there." Our guys kept walking with that "swagger." WE SHORT GAMED THEM. That team I was fortunate enough to coach went on to win a State Championship.

An example of swagger vs cocky:

We were in a tournament a few years back playing a team from Texas who was supposedly one of the top ten teams in the event---we win the pregame toss and I chose to be home---their coach looks at me and says "Well I guess we get to score first"---I passed it along to our kids and told them just button your lips and play tour game---the Texas kids mouthed all game trying to upset us---well at games end not only had they not scored AT ALL, they were No Hit ----LOL---Guess who got the last laugh

"I am talking confidence bordering on cocky---knowing what and who you are"

Great definition, TR. Personally, I love to see players and teams with swagger - it adds another dimension (or level of excitement) to how they play the game. Son has had team coaches say they expect it and college coaches say they won't take players without it.

In summer ball the cocky/unsportsmanlike teams get a reputation real fast. It doesnt matter what state you are from, everybody in the country gets the scoop. It is amazing how small the baseball world is when it comes to stuff like that. Those teams also wear a big target on their back.

IMHO, a good example for this topic is Andrew Carignan for North Carolina and I realize he played for TRhit in the past.

I have heard announcers say that his teammates consider him to be supremely confident, whereas the same announcers said that opponents often consider him to be cocky. I guess it is all in your perspective. If that type of body language gets to your opponents then maybe it is a good thing. He seems to pitch with the attitude that "Here is my stuff, see if you can beat me."

Another one that swaggers on the mound is Wes Roemer for Cal State Fullerton imho.

Reggie Jackson certainly had the swagger.

One cannot walk a fine line with swagger. Swagger is bold, arrogant, or showing off in a superior manner. Cocky is conceited and aggressive in behavior. Neither have any place on an American baseball field.
Quiet self-confidence gives one the ability to perform at the highest level while allowing one to do all the things that do show up in a box score...superior control of ones "self" is the ultimate game winner, and ultimately the greatest most effective way to quiet the flapping, sneering lips of the swaggerer!

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Quiet self-confidence gives one the ability to perform at the highest level while allowing one to do all the things that do show up in a box score...superior control of ones "self" is the ultimate game winner, and ultimately the greatest most effective way to quiet the flapping, sneering lips of the swaggerer!

Agree 100%. Reminds me of Tim Duncan with the Spurs. Quiet, unsassuming, but deadly on the court. My son is like Tim on the baseball field and is very put off by cocky players, who trash-talk and think it's all about them rather than the team.

Pride goes before the fall.

"....Here is my stuff, see if you can beat me."

Many prefer Tim Duncan’s game because he carries himself with a quiet self-confidence, which I consider a very admirable trait. Unfortunately, players such as Duncan’s are often labeled by the media and the press as “dull and boring.”

On the opposite end of the spectrum, take Muhammad Ali, "the greatest" media sensation of them all, who carried "the greatest" swagger of them all. Many loved him, and many hated him, but the bottom line is, he could back it up.

As much as we want to beat into submission, opposing players and/or teams with a swagger, myself included, there’s not a whole lot you can do if they can back it up.

CD mentioned Reggie Jackson having a swagger, and he definitely did; especially in October.

Ali was way beyond swagger. More like showmanship.

How about Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods, would you call those guys swagger or quiet self confidence?

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How about Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods, would you call those guys swagger or quiet self confidence?

eddie - good observations.

Triple Dad - Sometimes it depends on your perspective but this is a good question you ask. Flying through the air with your tounge hanging out and dunking the ball over someone seven inches taller is swagger imho.

When Tiger pumps his fist or wears red on Sunday, that seems to be swagger to me. Most do not consider him cocky however - at least I don't.

Derick Jeter has it but most consider him a classy ball player so it seems acceptable.

I love Tim Duncan but he does seem boring at times. I definitely appreciate athletes like him.

I never cared for Ali but loved Sugar Ray Leonard who could swagger with the best of them. Many considered Ray cocky and it would be hard for me to disagree with them. It seems when there is a certain amount of charm about someone, the public looks the other way somewhat when the swagger merges into cockiness.

Babe Ruth had the swagger imho and from what I have read and observed from old footage Lou Gehrig did not. Both styles were wildly successful however.

Some modern ones like Deon Sanders seemd to more on the cocky side but Deon could back things up.

Sometimes we see our adversaries as cocky and our hometown boys as having swagger. Interesting topic nonetheless.

BOTH.

They believed they were the best, and they showed it.

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Sometimes we see our adversaries as cocky and our hometown boys as having swagger. Interesting topic nonetheless.

Great point!

Ditto!

Three years ago a pitcher from the visiting team with a 24-0 career record "swaggered" onto the field at Doug Kingsmore Stadium (home field). The HC took one look at that and said "go get him boys". He left with a 24-1 record.

Baseball, IMO, is about humility and confidance. That is what we always taught our son. His coaches had the same philosophy.

Also, IMO, no matter at what age, visitng teams should always show respect when they come into someone elses' house.

Interesting topic! Obviously, we can all see and interpret this a bit differently in various players. I personally appreciate what I think of "swagger" as being which is portraying a love for the game and a confidence that you're good at the game. I think an individual player can give off that vibe as well as some teams.

Carnigan that has been mentioned has a "swagger", but I don't find it offensive. I find myself cheering for him and players that play with that intensity and "I'll do it" attitude. However, one can quickly go over the line and appear full of themselves... that's not an appealing player to watch IMO. There have been a few of those in the CWS that I simply haven't enjoyed watching.

There's a fine line.

I think there is a difference between "swagger" and "strut"----Carignan has swagger and confidence---and why not? Just look at his record---my wife watches him walk to the mound says to me every time---"They won't get a hit off him. He owns them".

There are certain players that simply exude that special something either on the mound or in the batters box---they are the special players and they have "swagger".

Let me add that they are fun to coach because you just sit back and let them "play"

If your good and you know it, that is being cocky. IMO. You can be as cocky as you want just as long as you win. once you loose well people will srcutinize you for being to cocky or arragant.

as for the being respectful as some of you have mentioned. when i am on the field i will shut up and not talk trash to the other team, BUT the minute i hear a word, or the other team gets too (cocky) i bury their brains and let them hear all about it.

there is a line between self-confidence and purposelly acting out to show up the other team.

TR and other;

During our Goodwill Series in Australia, Japan, Korea and America, several players "stand out"
with self assurance and swagger.

Delmon and Dimitri Young; Aaron Hill,
Andy and Adam LaRoche, Jereme Bonderman, Bobby Jenks, Jimmy Rollins, Eric Chavez, Josh Prince [U of Texas],Torii Hunter, Derek Lee, Nomar, Geoff Jenkins and in 1983-84 Matt Williams, Gregg Jeferies and John Wetteland.

One of my favorite was Albert Pujols. They all had a "common" tread. "They expected to win".
At the age 16-18, they were not imitated.
Our coaches also expected to win.

Bob

I think the difference is the talking.

Why would you have to go out and tell someone how good you are if you're really that good.

Confidence is knowing you're better but not feeling the need to tell everyone, let you're game do the talking.

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Originally posted by gotwood4sale:
I have to admit that I liked the team with Whammer!

Woody, that wasn't a baseball team, that was the J Geils Band. And that wasn't a kid with a real short bat....that was Magic Dick and his harmonica.

"Whammer Jammer, lemme hear ya, Dicky!"
~ Peter Wolf, 1974

I remember it well Krak although I was only 12 years old at the time this was released:



Here are the songs on this live album:

1 First I Look at the Purse
2 Homework
3 Pack Fair and Square
4 Whammer Jammer
5 Hard Drivin' Man
6 Serves You Right to Suffer
7 Cruisin' for a Love
8 Looking for a Love



BTW - Peter Wolf had swagger

Faye Dunaway thought so....for awhile anyway!

We're at a tournament right now and I really haven't seen any of what I'd call 'swagger' on any of the teams, including the one that has three just-drafted players on it......but this is the Northwest, and the kids out here just aren't into the swagger. They just come out and play hard, hustle on and off.....the basics.

My Old definition of Swagger vs Cocky.
Swagger is confidence, a look that is carried on the field, and displayed during games. The knowledge that when one brings his game, it will be impressionable and will make a difference.

Cocky is almost the same, but it includes boasting and one thing thats has no business in baseball.... Trash Talking.

Whether one backs it up or not, to be cocky will never impress me, even as a coach of a player who seems to be. I would have a talk with the cocky player so that he may respect the game and the players around him, but still bring his game everytime out.

When Texan Son is on the mound, he just loves to see a kid swagger up to the plate. Almost as much as he enjoys seeing the kid sulk back to the bench.

Cocky kids swagger in my book of definitions (realizing that all don't share that definition).

Do your talking with your play.

I guess Swagger is not a TEXAS thing

Swagger is like most others said being confident.. That just means that you are confident you'll get the job done whatever it takes. I personally don't talk ****, but I feel I have a ton of swagger. A college coach saw me play once and said I have the most confidence he's ever seen walking up to the plate. I walk up to the plate focused and confident. I feel when I don't go to the plate that way I don't perform as well. Talking **** not only is very immature, it takes away from the game.

I don’t like swagger because of its definition.

1. To walk or conduct oneself with an insolent or arrogant air; strut.
2. To brag; boast.
To browbeat or bully (someone).

However, if we changed the word swagger to confidence… then I love it!

I see losers walking down the street with swagger every day. I don’t think it's “confidence” but they do have swagger! And… What’s with the pants hanging below the rear end with the underwear showing thing? Sorry, guess I’m not sure what that means, if anything! Add a little swagger to that and what do you have?

You don’t need swagger to have confidence… You need heart and ability! I have heard the word used often to describe certain players. It’s never used to describe a bad player and I’m pretty sure those using that word haven’t looked up the definition. In fact, in baseball I think the word means something a bit different.

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What’s with the pants hanging below the rear end with the underwear showing thing? Add a little swagger to that and what do you have?

A naked hiney?

Agree with ya PG!

i'm not sure what you call it? but i like the guy you hate to play against but love to play with. hardnosed?