The Strike Zone

quote:

Originally posted by willj1967:
This comment is for youth games only, I'd rather see the umpire expand his zone a bit up and down, but not off the outside corner. I see so many pitches 5-6 inches off the outside corner called strikes, and the same ump calls a ball for a pitch right down the middle at the belly button.

It seems to me the pitch just below the letters and just below the knees are at least hittable, while the pitch off the outside corner is not. So for me at least, I'd like to see the zone called a little more liberally up and down, but tighten up the outside corner a bit.

Jon

I'm sorry, cannot do that. The rule book doesn't say that.

to wildthingking!!!!!!!!!

I've never applied an animation to a post before (and hope to never do it again), but you could hear me applauding from across the Atlantic on this one.

I won't beat this specific horse anymore, because I've done so over and over and over..

I will however share a conversation I recently overheard in a team clubhouse after a game here in Belgium. Essentially it was a senior local ump (at least 45 years old) explaining to a parent the various strike zone deviations that he regularly applies according to:::

1.) age group
2.) weather (cold? better not take too many pitches with this guy)
3.) Time of year (early in the season, as compared late in the season)
4.) body language (any hitter showing no indication that he was really prepared to swing and gets no "calls")
5.) pitchers ability to repeat location (whether or not its out of the zone)

etc etc...

Its always been obvious to me that this sort of thing goes on all the time. It was just the exceptionally detailed justification as to why he felt empowered to re-write the rules according to personal preference that really got me.

mmmmm........lets not stop at baseball,,,,,,why not move the rim up to 10'6" when the NBA playoffs start.

HaverDad in Brussels

Midlodad you are so right. I still remember that game he called against Atlanta. I dont think I have ever seen an umpire dictate a winner in any game as much as he did in that one. I want consistency. I know going in to every game that the strike zone is going to vary from umpire to umpire. But what I dont want is it to vary from inning to inning with the same umpire. As long as it is called both ways the same and it is consistent that is fine with me. I do not like a high strike zone but I do like an umpire that calls the low strike. I dont mind giving a little off the plate outside or inside. I guess I am a pitchers coach when it comes to strike zones. Just dont call a ball on a pitch at the knees on the black in the first inning and then ring my guy in the 7th on the same pitch. Just be consistent and theres no problem.

I was catching our game yesterday and the umpire after an inning of getting no outside corner calls randomly tells me that I "should move more outside if I want to get that call because he can't see the outside corner". I was shocked to hear this, but needless to say I moved over.

Not quite sure why you were "shocked" to hear an umpire tell you how to get the pitch called a strike?........I work with all my catchers....

For example, Im not the tallest umpire in the world and some of my higher level catchers are big boys.......staying down helps me see that outside pitch better......I may say to them....stay down so I can get a better look at that pitch.....

Listen...and adapt....work with your umpire...

I was only shocked because of the fact the umpire decided to wait till the 3rd inning to tell me he couldn't see the outside pitch. He wasn't a short guy, about as tall as me (6'0). All around this umpire wasn't very good at all.

Ok I can see that......but what did you do over 3 innings to get that pitch called a strike?......

3 innings and that pitch is consistently called a ball....

you still want it called a strike, so work with him...ask him..."do I need to bring that in?"...answer..."no just move over a bit and give me a better look"......problem solved......3 innings earlier...you save your pitchers arm and get strikes...

Well see I didn't realize he couldn't see that pitch. I thought he was just another umpire that didn't call that pitch. When he did tell me to move outside more I asked If I should do it on all pitchs or just outside ones.. And when I did move over I asked If that was enough and he said yea.. I usually get about every pitch an umpire is gonna call, so I figured it was more him then me..

HaverDad:

I have had several experiences where I have listened to umpires tell their peers what their strike zone was. I had the chief of umpires at a tournament tell me there was no witten strike zone in the rule book.

Baseball is a game of rules. If you change the rules by your actions but don't notify anyone that you are doing so then that would called cheating. Does the foul fine get moved everytime there is a different umpire in the game?

The biggest excuse I hear is that the games would take forever. Not so if the umpires called the written strike zone. It's pretty big, letters to bottom of the knees.

when i first started coaching in LL we seldom finished a game. they usually lasted 2 1/2 hours. not unusual to have 20 walks. i wanted my kids to hit the ball not walk unless it was an unhittable pitch.the coaches started talking and we had a meeting with the umps to broaden the strike zone. in reality we probably just explained the strike zone to the umps, as we found out most didn't know it. the games breezed after that and kids started hitting. it wasn't to reward anyone it was to get the kids thinking hit not walk.that was 12 years ago,this year they went to the LLWS. but i know it wasn't the strike zone.

quote:

Originally posted by HaverDad:


to wildthingking!!!!!!!!!

I've never applied an animation to a post before (and hope to never do it again), but you could hear me applauding from across the Atlantic on this one.
.

HaverDad in Brussels

This being a first...and presumably a last use of animation in a post by HaverDad I feel honored to preserve this portion of his momentous post.

Those are good looking hands Haverdad...and loud too!

quote:

Originally posted by wildthingking:
The biggest excuse I hear is that the games would take forever. Not so if the umpires called the written strike zone. It's pretty big, letters to bottom of the knees.

Well this strike zone didn't keep the game going on forever...it only seemed that way...it lasted for just over three months...July 1, 1971 to October 9, 1971.

And I guess it really is up in the air where the bottom of the letters are with this strike zone.

The knees present some problems too...the batter's stances are very different...some are actually squatting. And I always thought- "There's no squatting in baseball."

And look at the size of the sweet spot on those bats they're using...couldn't the lettering on those bats be judged as taunting to the pitchers?

kind of mean when all the tall guys are longshoreman and the short guys............do all the work. it just ain't right.

Good point 20dad.

Now let's put this thread back in gear and catch up to the discussion.

Uh...20dad? Where'd they go? Did they turn left or right at the outside corner?

C'mon guys! We gotta' get this thread going again...otherwise we'll land in water hotter than MN-Mom's fish boil!



20dad...do you have another cousin or nephew we could use to push this buggy? We gotta' get some speed up before I can pop the clutch!

Hmmm? I've heard of it being done before...might work.