Uh oh...it's not fun anymore...

Don't think you're gonna like this, but I think you tell him to 'suck it up' and play ball (on his HS team).

My older son played high D1 in a top-25 program. His HS team was terrible. Never once did he/we consider not doing it.

While your son can certainly be 'scouted' in summer ball...perhaps even moreso if on the right team, a good college coach will wonder, 'Why didn't he play HS ball?' 'Does he believe he's above that?' 'Is he a quitter when things get tough?' 'Is he a team player or is it just about him?' 'Does he have problems with coaches?'

Minus abusive behavior by the coach...and whether your son is gonna play college ball or not...he will face poor/difficult bosses in life. Good lesson for the future in general.

Your son needs to play HS ball.

Rarely did I see college recruiters at our HS games. The local JUCO was about it. We did have our share of pro scouts each year, but I never really saw many college programs represented.

Hopefully your sons love for the game is stronger than needing to endure a poor coaching situation.

Thanks...and be sure that I don't want him to quit! I would never advise him to do that. I'm certain he'll stick with it. I'm sure that he's just frustrated right now, most of the boys are.

He's always been described as 'very coachable' and a team player. He wouldn't want to mess that reputation up. It's good to hear that your son ended up on a D1 team after playing on a terrible HS team. Gives one hope.

Welcome to the site. Encourage your son to appreciate the awesome opportunity he has. He is a young player on a talented team with more good young players coming up. He can not only be part of something special but can play a key role in just how special it is or is not. If he is a good teammate and is always encouraging and supportive of the other kids regardless of whether they are competing for a position, making errors behind him, or otherwise, he and the team will be all the better for it. Meanwhile, if he continues to work hard on his game, he will continue to earn opportunities to play. It is very important that you show that same attitude and support toward the team and don't point out (and count) the errors of the other players. He will, to some degree, follow your lead.

Understand that most good coaches don't care about summer or fall ball records. They are interested in seeing what the new players bring to the table, getting several pitchers some game innings, working different combinations to check for fit and chemistry, getting the young guys past the jitters of moving up a level, etc.

Understand that most good coaches are not there to be buddies with the players and, in fact, will often throw various types of challenges at the players that they will not like in an effort to test how they handle adversity and determine just how badly they want to play.

Sometimes, earning a starting spot as a freshman can be a bit of a curse. The tendancy is to then expect to earn things easily going forward. It is much better that he is being challenged again as a Soph. From this point on, every season, every new summer team, every game, he will have to prove himself all over again. The sooner he embraces that thought, the better prepared he will be mentally. From this point on, many of the players around him will continue to work hard to get better and better. He needs to know that he must do the same if he wishes to play at the next level.

He should understand that if he is viewed as an important part of the pitching rotation, many coaches will want to protect him and not use him as much as a position player.

He will be far better off if he (and you) can avoid getting caught up in the "assistant coach's cousin" stuff and just go out and play hard and keep earning his spot.

ATTITUDE is such a big piece of the equation to having success in this game. He can either see this as "not fun anymore" or he can recognize the awesome spot he is in and the great challenge ahead.

I totally agree with justbaseball. Sure, he can still get exposure from a good summer team. But, it will likely at least raise questions if not speak volumes of his makeup for the game if this situation is discouraging him from representing his school on the baseball team.

Best of luck.

I agree with what others have posted. Another aspect to look into is distractions. Your son has hit the age where girls, cars, hanging out, other activities, alcohol and even drugs can come into play. Please don't get mad at me. When I had this conversation with a friend about his son losing interest he went ballistic. Drugs was only a suggested possibility. It turned out I was right. His son went from college prospect to not playing senior year and flunking out of college.

My $.02. If he said that after a "tough loss" then I wouldn't worry too much. Nothing is fun after a "loss." HOWEVER, it looks like you are talking about fall ball. It's football season -- The wins and losses don't matter. Just maybe the assistant coach's cousin is playing himself out of a spot. If it is as bad as you say, I highly doubt the players you speak about will be in the same positions come spring (unless they improve over the winter). You certainly can't say your HS team will "suck" and quit based on a few fall ball games. I would tell you kid that his responsiblity is to hit every ball hard, and hit his locations on every pitch he throws, and then get his "sorry ***" into the gym to work on core strength, speed, agility, conditioning, etc. Good luck.

Years ago we had a player in our fall league that was by far the #1 prospect in the state. Scouts would call, making sure when and where he was scheduled to play.

Every week, just to make sure I would call the kid to make sure he was going to play. We wanted to make sure he would be there so we could give scouts accurate information.

Every week the kid would tell me, he didn't think he could make it that week. Every week I would call his dad and talk him into making sure his son would be there.

Long story short, he ended up getting drafted in an early round and was paid a small fortune to sign. He went to rookie ball and after about a month he quit and went home.

I called his dad and asked him what happened. He said that his son told him, he just doesn't really like baseball. At that point I think I learned a lesson. The kid had been telling us all along that he didn't really like baseball. We were just so caught up in his ability and potential that we didn't pay attention.

There are always exceptions to most anything, but the players that have made it big over the years are the ones who have something more than ability... They have a true passion and love for the game.

Young players can be dejected temporarily, but if it happens very often it's going to get in the way.

One more thing, I get tired of hearing about coaches ruining players love for the game... If a player has what it takes he won't be blaming any coach. If he is good enough to continue playing, sooner or later he will run into a coach he doesn't like. Even if he doesn't continue playing, he will run into someone he doesn't like who is in charge of things. Those that blame coaches for things (even if deserved), simply don't have what it takes. IMO

There are good coaches and bad coaches, just like good and bad players, umpires, etc.

Some use bad coaches as an excuse, others keep grinding away. If you were a college coach or a pro scout, which one would you want?

Good post, PG. There are 1000 reasons to leave the game but only one -- Love of the Game -- to stay. Part of this love is belief in one's ability.

Sounds like 2015 is making excuses to mask the real reason why he don't want to play any more. Players who love the game don't let outside forces affect their passion for the game. Sure, they might get frustrated at a bad situation but in the end, it don't stop the ones who really are into the game. If the player can only excel when the stars line up and claim they no longer enjoy the game when things don't go their way, then he's in for a rude awakening.

Don't think recruiters won't watch a player because of a bad coach. If a scout gets word that the player has an attitude, that might draw him away from looking at a player. You never know who's watching and all it takes is a player to show a bad attitude or body language in front of a talent evaluator, then his recruitability probably takes a nose dive.

If he's a legitimate prospect, then none of the outside distractions will affect him.

Your HS team will have little to do with your recruitment if you do things right. With that said, it will seem odd like others have said if your son doesn't play in HS.

I have played on lots of different teams and had many different coaches (3 different head varsity coaches while I was in high school, even). I've had different opinions about them and there were times that things got VERY frustrating. Sometimes you'll say things like your son did because, well, it isn't that fun to lose. It isn't fun to be screamed at. It isn't fun to think that your coach is doing a bad job or isn't doing a good job because of non-baseball reasons. Encourage son to stick it out, things get better. Focus on the positives and put things in perspective. Find a good summer program that will be both fun and very competitive.

When I was a freshman in high school I had the opportunity to transfer to a local private school with a very good baseball program. I decided against it because I didn't want to leave my friends in public school. The ensuing 3 years of my baseball career were completely miserable. My high school baseball coach was one of the worst individuals I have ever encountered and to this day I stand by my word that I will never speak with him again. I spent many nights of high school contemplating just quitting the team...before and after I had committed to play in college. I didn't. I stuck it out, played out the misery and handed in my uniform at the end of my senior year.

A family friend asked me a few months ago if I had regretted not switching high schools because of how terrible my high school coach was. I said no, I didn't. He helped shape who I am today. He helped mold me as a baseball player and as a person. I often set out during my daily life with a concerted effort to never treat people the way he treated me, and never approach the game of baseball the way he presented it. He availed me the opportunity to mature along the way...to learn how to deal with individuals I didn't get along with and how to continue progress and find personal success within what I wanted to accomplish.

The last thing I would want is to force anyone to continue to play the game. But a bad experience with a coach should not be a reason to quit. The glass is always half full...and the passion for the game is often everlasting.

Nice post PG. I had a player play for me that was very very talented. One of if not the most talented players I ever had the opportunity to coach. His problem was unless he was actually playing in a game and doing well it wasn't "fun" to him. He didn't enjoy working at the game. The day to day grind that it takes to survive in this game. He didn't like to practice. He didn't enjoy or love the game. And when I say the game I mean the grind, the work, the smell of the grass, being at the field early and staying late.

He was drafted and did extremely well both years in pro ball. In fact made the top prospects list for his org. And then he up and walks away from the game. He said "It just wasn't any fun."

Your sons comments bother me to be honest with you. So you only have fun when you win? You only have fun when your on a winning team? You throw your team mates under the bus and accuse the coach of messing up your son? Players that make it in this game are the players who love the game. Have a true passion for the game. Enjoy the grind of the game. They don't make excuses they fight.

What is going to happen if your son is recruited by schools that have had a history of losing? What is going to happen if he is drafted by the worst team in pro ball? You can tell who the real players are not when they are 3-3 and they are beating someone like a rented mule. Check out a kid who is 0-3 and getting pounded and he plays like he is 3-3 and in a 1 run game with everything on the line.

You need to have a heart to heart with your son and find out where his heart really is. And you need to think twice before talking about kids making errors and costing you games because Kharma is a b_tch. Just my 2 cents. But kids who have yet to really be faced with real adversity in this game who make comments like that make me serious doubt their love for the game. Whats he going to do when he is riding the pine as a freshman in college and 40 games into the season he has 5 at bats and 5 innings in the field? And he is expected to work just as hard as everyone else and have a great attitude and be a great team mate? In fact a kid in this situation if he wants to change it needs to work harder than everyone else.

Like PG I am a little sick of all these threads and comments about coaches ruining kids. Excuses are so easy to find. And they are exactly what ruins kids. And when the parents are leading the excuse band wagon is there any wonder when they fail?

Sometimes, venting is good. For everyone.

Tomorrow is a new day.

That's very true Sultan.

Coaches don't burn out kids unless they are illegally physically or emotionally abusing them. Not being in the lineup is not emotional abuse. Being told you're not good enough to start isn't emotional abuse. A varsity coach not lavishing attention on a freshman or JV player is not emotional abuse. Some players and their parents use coaches as an excuse for their kids not having the mental tenacity to fight through the issues.

quote:

One more thing, I get tired of hearing about coaches ruining players love for the game... If a player has what it takes he won't be blaming any coach. If he is good enough to continue playing, sooner or later he will run into a coach he doesn't like. Even if he doesn't continue playing, he will run into someone he doesn't like who is in charge of things. Those that blame coaches for things (even if deserved), simply don't have what it takes. IMO

This is a poignant post and should be read and re read by all .The favorite thing my son says "no excuses in baseball" Control what you can control.Be a good teammate,work hard.

And as well as Coach may said,you have to love the smell of the grass,the new glove,the new bat,heck my son is 22 and when he has a new bat he stands in the mirror and watches himself take swings.he runs his hands over the wood and look at the bat like it was a piece of precious gold.

You have to really, really love it>what he is experiencing now is minimal as to what lies ahead.

And if he decides baseball isnt for him,the world will continue to turn.As hard as it is to face that there are other things some kids want to do.

I do think if you dont really love it,it would be hard to do the grind.

Are some players and parents blaming the coach for perceptions their kids create? When my son was a freshman on JV and a soph on varsity the varsity coach intimidated the hell out of him. This was after the coach fawned on him in 8th grade and invited him to a couple of varsity practices. I told my son while the coach does seem to have communication issues and leaves players wondering where they stand it's who he is. Get used to it. Junior year when my son was hitting third and having a great season his perception of the coach completely changed. It wasn't that the coach changed. My son knew where he stood based on his own assessment of his on the field production.

Its very easy for kids to love it when everything is going good. Its very easy to love it when the investment given yields results that are liked and many instances almost immediate. What happens when you have to work extremely hard, sacrifice what others around you do not have to give up and you are getting in return very little that can presently be seen? Do you have to love it? Only if you want to finish what you start. I wonder sometimes if people realize that most players at the college level do not play or play very little? 8 or 9 position players will get all the playing time. Three guys will start on the weekend and a couple of more mid week. And then 4 or 5 will get time out of the pen. Thats about 18 or 19 guys that will see time. The rest? I wonder how much they love it? I wonder how much that pitcher who gets a couple of innings a week if he is lucky feels about the game? Or that RHH that is the designated RHH in situations vs LHP? You know the guy that might get a couple of AB's a week? These guys that bust their butt everyday day in and day out and then are lucky to get their number called. And if a QAB is not produced they may not get another shot for 2 weeks? And those scenarios go on and on.

Summer baseball at the college level. Get up go work out. Get to the field and get on a bus. Ride for 4 hours get off the bus and get ready for BP. Play a 3 hour game and eat what is offered by the host team. Get on a bus ride 4 hours back and get in the bed at 3am. Get back up that morning and go work out because you have to be at the field at 3pm for the 7pm game. Finish that game at 10pm, eat, go to bed and get ready for another 3 plus bus ride the next day. And did I mention that you might not be in the line up every day? You might rotate as a catcher. You def won't if your a pitcher. Do you love it?

The fact is your either a ball player or your not. You either have that love and passion for it or you don't. You can't make a kid love it. And you can't stop a kid from loving it. You might be able to put some roadblocks in front of him. But you won't stop him. He will fight for what he loves. You might be able to manipulate the situation for him in order for him to like it. But you can't make him love it. And when girls, cars, friends, parties, life in general comes calling baseball will fade. When adversity comes it just won't be worth it. When they are no longer the star and the attention fades away its just not worth it.

For the player that loves the game the game is much more than the games. Its the practice. Its the workouts. Its the team mates. Its the locker room. Its the smell of the grass. Its the smell of the glove. Its that little voice in their head that says "I got one more great start in me" "One more great game at the plate" "I am almost there" "I am still a player" "I aint done yet" "I still got a shot" "We can do this one more time" "We can make it happen" "Im not giving up" "This is who I am" "This is what we are about" and I could go on for days.

Loving the game is much more than the actual game. Its way more than that. Its that feeling of being on a team. Being a part of a team. Being a part of something bigger than you. Knowing that your doing what you love and your working at being better at what you love to do. That there is a fine line between having success and failing and you can eek past that fine line if you dont give in. Putting it on the line and having the balls to know that you might just fail but you also might just not.

I have so much respect for the JH's of the world. The Adam Pendleton's of the world. Matt Foats of the world. They have the guts to fight for what they love. They are going to finish the race. And they will not have to look in the mirror when their 40 and wonder what could have been, should have been, would have been, they will know.

We live in a world today where the easy way out is often disguised with excuse's and blame put on others. I just call it what it really is today and what it always has been. Your too soft, you didn't really love it, you were not willing to pay the price because the price was too high for you, you don't want to admit it so you blame someone for your failure to pay that price. You didn't love it. Your simply not a ball player. Ball players look in the mirror for the answers. Never for excuses. They simply don't exist.
You can give your kid excuses and then wonder why he always has them one day. Or you can choose to see adversity as fire that will forge the steel. Or you can allow it to burn you up and use it as an excuse. Excuses are for losers. Ball players never lose. They just run out of innings. And then they win in life. While everyone else is whining and moaning in the midst of adversity ball players are right at home and will find a way to win.

quote:

You can give your kid excuses and then wonder why he always has them one day.

Every time you do something it gets easier to do the next time. It not only applies to hard work at practice, it applies to making excuses and quitting.

WorkHard, welcome. My comments are not specifically about your son, but a general observation.

My son is a high school senior who wants to play baseball in college. Four years ago the same could have been said about many of his teammates. Over the past few years, some kids have lost their passion. Some are still playing, but you can tell they are just about done, even though they may have the physical skills to keep playing.

Baseball requires mental and emotional stamina. At some point every player will have a bad coach. Every player will have to overcome injury. Every player will fail, perhaps repeatedly. And at some time everyone has to push to overcome some limitation.

My son couldn't play most of his junior HS season due to injury. He was depressed and really thought about how much he wanted to play. He came out of it loving it more than ever, but I wasn't sure how he would emerge from the experience. It was a gut check.

WorkHard, good luck to your son as he works his way through this phase.

My daughter is a sophomore in college. Fall game yesterday didn't go well. They lost two. Daughter didn't play well. Came over to me after the game and started to cry. I told her that anyone can lead when the going is easy. Whomever can handle adversity determines who the real players and leaders are. She wiped her eyes and went to get equipment to carry to the bus. Your son needs to lead now.

I can't thank you enough for all of your thoughtful replies. It's great to get input from so many passionate and knowledgable baseball folks.

Please know that son has a complete love of the game, told me so today. I think yesterday was just an especially tough loss for him. Trust me, we've played on some less than stellar teams, it's not just about fun when we're winning. He is now, and has always been the kid that shows up early and stays late. We practice three hours a day, six days a week, and the coaches are very good about staying with him (or anyone) who wants to take some extra swings, or extra grounders or fly balls. And he's always had the mindset of 'I'll play wherever the team needs me.'

He does have the passion. He won't go to parties, no drugs, no drinking, heck, he won't even drink soda because he says it's bad for your body. A straight A student last year and this year. He'll come home from practice and spend an hour in the garage hitting off the tee.

Because we have six games coming up in the next eight days, the team had the day off today. Son and I were able to go watch some friends play league that don't have fall ball at their schools. A coach that he adores spent an hour with him...the take-away? As many of you have said, you can only control yourself. You can control your own game, how you pitch, how you field, how you bat. You have no control over how your teammates perform. Frustrating? Absolutely. But out of his control. It made him feel better to talk it out with someone other than mom. Tomorrow is another day with another game. And as he told me tonight - any day of baseball is a good day. Step up, move on, and play ball.

WorkHardPlayHard,

I'm glad to see your son pull himself up and give himself some perspective on this. Maturity does that to a young man. This site is full of folks who played on not so great high school teams, but have gone on to achieve some great things beyond high school. There are many threads on this topic.

Please have your son keep up the hard work on the baseball field and in the classroom.

Fun and love... Nothing is fun all the time. Injuries, surgery, losing, getting yelled at, being booed, reading negative remarks, long bus trips, being broke, etc. These things and many many more are not much fun.

It aint easy, there will be obstacles! It is the love for the game that keeps you going when things aren't fun. That is why it is nearly impossible to make it unless you have a true love for the game. You can have all the talent in the world and it won't be enough. We've seen it many times.

AMEN Brother!

That is actually a piece of what we do hold on to as we hope to see our son progress. His sheer love for and pleasure he derives from being on a baseball field. Playing a game or practicing, it does not matter which. He will take ground balls until the coach hitting fungo has had enough.

I have never seen my son happier and smiling more broadly then when he is on a baseball field.

Coach May and PG please keep telling it like the way it is.

Coach May, I am so glad to see you post, haven't seen any in a few months (might be that I just missed them!) I love your passion for the game as well as so many on here. I think in another life (or maybe this one) you could be a writer as well. Your words are powerful. I just wanted to thank you for caring about this game and website so much you share your insight and doing it in such as elegant way that is inspiring to me

"the game is much more than the games. Its the practice. Its the workouts. Its the team mates. Its the locker room. Its the smell of the grass. Its the smell of the glove." - Coach May

That's good stuff right there.... and so true.

quote:

Originally posted by floridafan:
AMEN Brother!

I have never seen my son happier and smiling more broadly then when he is on a baseball field.

I certainly SECOND floridafan's comment here. It also sent me back many years when I first started coaching my son's teams and the "try outs" and draft process the rec league employeed. During tryouts I would always try to note the expression the 5 and 6 years olds had on their face when they ran the bases. When talent did not lead me pick a player I had notes on who had smiles on their faces as they ran the bases!

Usually worked out pretty well because they were the kids that liked to put out the most effort on the field, even at that young age!

quote:

but with such a poor team and questionable coach,

quitting is easy. If you do it once the second time is even easier.

Life is full of disappointments. Inconsiderate neighbors, careless co-workers, rude customers, incompetent bosses, and sloppy roommates. We encounter them in all walks of life as well as in baseball. Teammates that care more about individual stats than team goals and objectives. Coaches that play their kids and other favorites, fans who berrate mediocre umps and parents who build their sons up by tearing others down....the list goes on.

We've taught our son if you focus on all the bad behavior and negatives, whether in life or baseball, you will miss the beauty of the game and what makes it so special. Because baseball is a game of failure, that is what makes the successes so sweet. Some of the best baseball games our son has played didn't result in a W. But knowing that the team played to a level of higher competition and gave it their best, it made that "L" not seem so bitter. Losing doesn't get easier when wins are precious, but our son has learned to accept defeat with a determination to work harder. He had a coach instill in him early on that it is better to play a great team and lose giving it your best than to play an average team and dominate them.

You will always encounter athletes with more talent. You can't control that. But pride, hustle and desire are up to the individual.

Through the recruiting process, our son learned that what impressed 2 college coaches wasn't just based on his ability and athleticism, but also the way he handled himself when his team wasn't winning... Leadership, teamwork, passion and self-motivation are part of the toolkit every player needs, both on and off the field.

Just sent CM last post to son to read and inspire him.

Thanks Coach!

quote:

Originally posted by floridafan:

I have never seen my son happier and smiling more broadly then when he is on a baseball field.

]

Every time I see my son on a baseball field one thing comes to my mind, 'he is in his element here'. Content, smiling, joking, HAPPY! Every team he has been on it's been the same thing. The day I don't see these things is the day I'll know the end of his baseball journey is near.

Filsfans post reminded me of something my son and I talk about.

There are guys who play baseball, and there are baseball players. The difference between the two isn't talent.

Well, we lost our game tonight. But at least it was a good game. Son started in right, made three amazing catches. Moved to third in the fifth and had a couple great plays. Had a couple hits and a couple walks. Then he asked to catch the JV game, and they let him do that, too, the whole game. He wants to have time at all nine positions this fall, so far he's done seven.

He loved every minute of it, just like he has since he was three. Even raking the mound, even though he didn't toe the rubber tonight. Had several parents tell me they love his attitude and that their freshmen kids look up to him. He's gonna be fine.

quote:

Originally posted by WorkHardPlayHard:
Well, we lost our game tonight. But at least it was a good game. Son started in right, made three amazing catches. Moved to third in the fifth and had a couple great plays. Had a couple hits and a couple walks. Then he asked to catch the JV game, and they let him do that, too, the whole game. He wants to have time at all nine positions this fall, so far he's done seven.

He loved every minute of it, just like he has since he was three. Even raking the mound, even though he didn't toe the rubber tonight. Had several parents tell me they love his attitude and that their freshmen kids look up to him. He's gonna be fine.

That's great, WHPH. Sounds like he has that love of the game folks here are talking about.

The last thing I'll leave you with is a suggestion that you continue working on your part and associate his success less with his statistical results of a game and more on his enjoyment, effort and attitude of being a team player. Try to find it in yourself to express genuine support of each of his teammates and of the team, including the coaches, win or lose, agree or disagree with the decisions made. Over time, this will benefit your son more than you can imagine and will also allow you to enjoy the whole experience more, wherever it leads.

I'm not saying you shouldn't be elated with him having a great day on the field, just trying to help you get through something we all experience to one degree or another.

Best wishes and keep us informed as he goes through his journey.

Glad to see your son has a better outlook after the last game. He has a long way to go and there will be a lot of ups and downs, but, it sounds like he thought it through and has a better outlook.

When my son decided he wanted to play, I told him there was only one rule: If you chose to play, you can't quit. You have made a commitment to the other players and coaches. If you decide after the season, you don't want to play that's fine, but you will not be allowed to quit until the seasons done I don't care if you are best or worse player on the team. In over 12 years of playing I only had to remind him once.

Now that his ability to play has been suspended for a while, he has taken that commitment into his current challenge no matter if he has good days or bad ones he refuses to give up.