Tagged With "Program"
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
This can't possibly be true, because throwing objects heavier than a baseball causes your arm to get injured. The epidemic of ucl injuries among NFL starting quarterbacks is all the evidence you need.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
I starting researching this many years ago when my son started to pitch. I purchased Dr Bagonzi book probably 14 years ago (one of the first to do weighted ball studies, he got his PhD on the subject) well before Wolforth developed his current program and have followed Wolforth and Kyle's programs from afar. Fast forward, my son's college program historically has the best pitching staffs in D3 baseball, in part because they are on the leading edge of these types of programs. (don't get me...
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Food for thought: If you walk in to a Bass Pro, Cabela's, or other outdoor store, and walk over to the bows, you'll most likely see a sign "NO DRY FIRING". Dry firing a bow is pulling back the string and releasing without an arrow on the bow. Dry firing puts too much stress on the limbs of the bow and often damages the bow, hence the warnings about no dry firing. When a bow is fired normally, with an arrow nocked, the arrow absorbs that excess stress, preventing damage to the limbs. You can...
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Completely different mechanics throwing a football. Also, note how all the college & NFL QB's throw heavy footballs & reach back & long toss footballs with elevated front shoulder to see how far they can throw the football to increase their arm strength............Um, they do none of this because it is junk science & develops mechanics apart from their goals. Perfectly fine for pitchers though......
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Rob T, Ha, thanks. Will talk our offensive coordinator into working on our running game this week.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Steve A., I'm thinking that 'Rob' was joking. At least that's how I took it.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
So, basically you can throw a heavy object as long as you do it with the proper mechanics? Now if somebody would just figure out how to incorporate both of those things I'm thinking they could create a program that would increase velocity and reduce injuries. - But that's just those voices in my head doing that crazy talk thing again.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
If you threw a football with the same delivery, arm action and intensity as a pitcher your arm would last about 2 starts before you blew it out. The point is: It (the football) is a different object, with a different, less stressful, less max effort, less load delivery. Additionally, it is a different shape & yes, it weighs more. In addition: Happy for your boys & the success & increase! They are still not yet fully mature males & please revert back to my Captain Crunch...
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Steve A. have you done enough research to realize that the underweight object actually poses more of an injury risk than the overweight object? Also, important distinction is plyocare work vs. all-out weighted ball velocity throwing. The prior should preceed the latter to improve mechanics, strength, flexibility and reduce risk of injury. And there are many MLB guys using both plyocare and weighted balls even if their organization doesn't officially have it as part of their program. The...
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Is it just me or is there a segment of posters here who are unable to absorb the English language before offering a reply. Please read my last sentence above. " I have not looked at it deep enough to have an opinion." Does this confuse you? Is it unclear in any way?
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
So, you're saying you can throw the heavy object - just not the way a baseball is traditionally pitched? Perhaps by throwing the heavy object, the body learns how to perform the throwing motion in a safer manner, and becomes conditioned to do so. - of course the pitchers could just keep doing the same thing the same way they have always done it. By the way, the Earth is flat. I've seen the pictures.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Yes, that's exactly what I am saying! Javelin, shot put, football, temper tantrum etc. etc. BTW: I want to congratulate myself for a new first: I have now officially been criticized for having "no opinion." Now that I think on it, this may not be a first. "No Oinion Criticism" may have come up in a discussion about curtain colors with Mrs. Steve A.....
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Absorb this from my post then... "I agree there is much still to be learned about the subject, but to dismiss it out of hand as inherently dangerous is counterproductive to that learning and growth." My point is more to your overall dismissal of the practice as "junk science" without really having done the research, which you admit you haven't done.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
The point is you HAVE expressed an opinion without enough knowledge or facts to back it up. That is the problem that limits exploration, learning, and progress. I'm not an expert either, but I have an open mind.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
You have no idea of the level of research & study I have done on the topic (heavy baseballs, not light!). I don't think any would appreciate my attempt to write a novel on it here. I have laid out sound, well thought out arguments against the use of heavy baseballs. I have also admitted their possible benefit balanced vs the obvious potential dangers. If you took the time to actually read what I have written, you would see for yourself. I am personally against their use. This does not...
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Jeez, I leave for 5 minutes and you guys get all snippy. I think what I said here is being overlooked: Perhaps by throwing the heavy object, the body learns how to perform the throwing motion in a safer manner, and becomes conditioned to do so. Rather than using weighted balls to do no more than "strengthen", they should be used as a tool to train the body to use different mechanics. Going all the way back to Marshall, weighted balls have been used not just to make the arm stronger - but to...
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Wow! I guess I shouldn't have mentioned the "F" word! Football! Sorry!
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
I agree that many pitching coaches are Advertising with velocity gains of teenage Players who would have gained velocity throwing a coconut. for a lowly trained or Young Person almost any Training will provide gains and kyle will be the first to admit that. once you reach a certain Level genetics start to Play a huge role. however even at the highest Level there can be gains. kyle Trains many pro pitchers and a lot of them have gained even if it is only 2-3 mph. also even at the mlb Level...
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
BTW what is interesting that with the modern Training we have the top velocities in MLB haven't really increased. chapman is a bit of an outlier often hitting over 103 but other than him the top velos are around 100 just like they were in the Prior decades. Nolan ryan threw just as hard as syndergaard or Randy Johnson. what did Change is the average velocity. there are much less pitchers throwing 88 nowadays and average Velo is really up. the Training does help but there seems to be a border...
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Fun movie if you haven't seen it. Seems to support that top end hasn't changed but average velocity probably has https://www.google.com/?gws_rd...stball+movie+trailer
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Go with a proven program and you'll be fine. If you think something does not feel right when performing the activity, stop, think, and adjust (call the program and ask questions). Light, normal, and heavy is proven to work either in throwing or hitting.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
I am told by a very reliable source (Former D1 20 year Coach) that what has changed is the gun used to measure velo. "Back in the day," 80's-90's, you had the Jugs & the Ray. The difference between the 2 was that typically, the Jugs would read the velo at a closer proximity to release while the Ray was roughly velo at the plate. The swing was typically 3-4 mph with the Jugs having the higher reading. Now it seems to be the Stalker which I understand tags velo at release & has a...
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Re: Top Velocity V.S. Pitch Harder
Wesley, Stay as far away from Pitch Harder as you possibly can. I'm not a big fan of Top Velocity either, as Olympic Lifts can be dangerous and probably are not as effective as just plain old good synching of the kinetic chain. Top Velocity, however, is light years more legitimate than Pitch Harder.
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Re: Top Velocity V.S. Pitch Harder
Thanks for the response. I will probably go with the Top Velocity as the guy I was talking to from Pitch Harder didn't say how his program was better, he just tried to say how Top Velocity wasn't good.
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Re: Top Velocity V.S. Pitch Harder
Yeah. Did he try to tell you how he's one of the most sought after trainers in the MLB? That is legit one of his claims. No one even knows who he is.
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Re: Top Velocity V.S. Pitch Harder
He did say that. And as for the Olympic style lifts, I am doing some of those right now at the sports performance place I go to, but haven't been there for 2 weeks, we do squat, deadlift, bench press, hanging power cleans(still learning how to do those so not doing any weight really)
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Re: Top Velocity V.S. Pitch Harder
Well, keep us updated on how it all goes. Interested to see what value TV adds if one is already doing Olympic lifts.
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Re: Arm Conditioning/ Velocity Program
Hey what was that round black thing MLB flamethrower Aroldis Chapman was throwing in the bullpen in game 6 of NLCS tonight?? I thought MLB didn't use weighted balls. Crazy huh?