Does anyone here have any good advice for teaching a kidd to hit a curve ball consistantly???
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Don't miss fastballs.
Swing at CBs when you have 2 strikes only.
Swing at CBs when you have 2 strikes only.
PRACTICE ---PRACTICE ---- PRACTICE
Yeah, thanks TRhit I am learning how to throw one so we can do just that.
First the player have to recognize the pitch(a hitter can not hit a CB if he doesn't know the comming pitch is a CB)
secondly the hitter has to hold the swing until the curve breaks and swing at the ball depending it location.
A good drill to practice holding the swing to the last moment is: A soft toss from behim the hitter, who will have just fractions of seconds to swing after see the ball coming from behim.
secondly the hitter has to hold the swing until the curve breaks and swing at the ball depending it location.
A good drill to practice holding the swing to the last moment is: A soft toss from behim the hitter, who will have just fractions of seconds to swing after see the ball coming from behim.
First--and I'm serious--have the kid see an optometrist. He needs to see the rotation of the seams. Second, do drills where he stays back on the ball and drives it to the opposite field. Many, many players wash out because they are dead-pull hitters who never learned to get late reads and hit oppo.
I disagree with redbird5 that you should only hit curve balls with strike two. Most hitters are guess hitters and if you're guessing curve and get a fastball you're toast. Besides, it depends on the count. Also, some pitchers have patterns where they throw the curve on strike one.. if it is a hanging curve, mash it!
By the way, for all you youngsters out there.. DO NOT UPPERCUT when you hit the curveball. Hit it with your line drive swing. Why? because the downward angle of curve will do the rest.. and put it over the fence. If you upper-cut you'll generally pop-up, ground-out, or strikeout.
I disagree with redbird5 that you should only hit curve balls with strike two. Most hitters are guess hitters and if you're guessing curve and get a fastball you're toast. Besides, it depends on the count. Also, some pitchers have patterns where they throw the curve on strike one.. if it is a hanging curve, mash it!
By the way, for all you youngsters out there.. DO NOT UPPERCUT when you hit the curveball. Hit it with your line drive swing. Why? because the downward angle of curve will do the rest.. and put it over the fence. If you upper-cut you'll generally pop-up, ground-out, or strikeout.
Does anyone think it is possible to visually detect the supination in the pitcher's throwing hand when he throws a curve? A couple years ago, the varsity coach at my son's high school passed out a tip sheet and this was one of the tips. However, as a pitching coach I know that seeing what the throwing arm/hand does during the forward acceleration (i.e. internal rotation) part of the throw is next to impossible to see with the naked eye. Well, at least it is with my eyes 
The cue you'll hear the most (and I think it's a good one) is "keep your hands back."
If you've got a pitching machine that can throw them set it up and hit a ton of them... Tony Gwynn uses the term "carve the ball" ... when you take the soft pitch away to oppo.
Then have someone give you some soft toss where they mix in a quick toss with a delayed toss... they'll sort of fake the toss, you load up and take your stride but keep your hands back.. and then carve the ball into the net.
Then have someone throw you some good ole curve balls to practice hitting and get after it. good luck... the best way to get a fastball in the game is to hit the daylights out of a curveball in an earlier at bat.
If you've got a pitching machine that can throw them set it up and hit a ton of them... Tony Gwynn uses the term "carve the ball" ... when you take the soft pitch away to oppo.
Then have someone give you some soft toss where they mix in a quick toss with a delayed toss... they'll sort of fake the toss, you load up and take your stride but keep your hands back.. and then carve the ball into the net.
Then have someone throw you some good ole curve balls to practice hitting and get after it. good luck... the best way to get a fastball in the game is to hit the daylights out of a curveball in an earlier at bat.
One of the things we teach is to read the angle on the ball. Fastballs tend to come down out of the pitcher's hand, whereas curveballs, especially ones that are loopy as most in high school are, tend to go up right out of a pitcher's hand. If you can teach this along with spin recognition, when to swing at a curve and when not to, and being patient by letting the curveball get deeper on your body at contact, you will have a good start.
If a guy has a good curve that doesn't come up initially out of his hand, then you have to rely on spin recognition.
If a guy has a good curve that doesn't come up initially out of his hand, then you have to rely on spin recognition.
quote:a hitter can not hit a CB if he doesn't know the comming pitch is a CB).
True if you are a guess hitter like most. Untrue if you are a "see it and hit it" type hitter, especially linear-approach hitters who learn to stay back on the ball.
Bum
"Reconize" a pitch it is not guessing. If you only "see the ball, hit the ball" without knowing the pitch is going to break, your swing will be empty.
"Reconize" a pitch it is not guessing. If you only "see the ball, hit the ball" without knowing the pitch is going to break, your swing will be empty.
quote:Most hitters are guess hitters and if you're guessing curve and get a fastball you're toast
Why would you guess? I understand charts and tendencies but guessing is not part of this equation.
Also, I never said to look for a CB with 2 strikes. My hitters do not change their approach...we sit on a FB that we can mash...with 2 strikes we still look FB and adjust to the CB. We work on recognition of pitches but that doesn't mean they necessarily want to hit CBs when they are even/ahead in the count.
If you have to be a guess hitter in HS, odds are you won't be a hitter at the next level. Hitting is hard enough without trying to guess what the pitcher is throwing. Why not just sit on pitches you know you can handle until you get into a count where you have to handle everything?
Sorry, redbird5, I stand by what I say. Most hitters are guess hitters.
This is not to say its right. My own son I taught to stay back on the ball -- read the ball as Racab says -- and I believe that's the best approach.
This is not to say its right. My own son I taught to stay back on the ball -- read the ball as Racab says -- and I believe that's the best approach.
quote:Originally posted by Bum:
Sorry, redbird5, I stand by what I say. Most hitters are guess hitters.
This is not to say its right. My own son I taught to stay back on the ball -- read the ball as Racab says -- and I believe that's the best approach.
Yes, most hitters are guess hitters. That is why they don't make it to the next level.
Most GOOD hitters are not guess hitters. Most GOOD hitters punish FBs and take CBs until you get to 2 strikes. Why would you teach anyone otherwise?
BTW, congrats on your son's no hitter. I am assuming you want there to be more guess hitters?
this is was i was taught. first, and probably the most important, you have to see the rotation of the ball. then, after you load, you wait longer to rotate your hips then you would with a fastball and see the ball break. the swing should be exactly the same, you just stay back longer.
Cleanuphitter, you have a PM.
Thank you, redbird5. It was a happy day, for sure.
There can be a situation where you jump on the curve. Just today I was observing a pitcher who, if he thought he was facing a good hitter, threw a first-pitch hanging curve every time. Might have fun with that one!
There can be a situation where you jump on the curve. Just today I was observing a pitcher who, if he thought he was facing a good hitter, threw a first-pitch hanging curve every time. Might have fun with that one!
redbird5,
Henry Aaron was a guess hitter...according to Henry Aaron. I think he made it to the next level.
If I remember correctly he'd pick the pitch and then sit on it until he got it.
Getting back on topic redbird5 and TR both gave good advice in the first few posts of this thread. There are situations where if a pitcher has shown a tendency to throw curves on a given count such as 0-1 and you aren't handling the fastball that well you might want to look for a curve before 2 strikes but generally speaking redbird is right on.
Henry Aaron was a guess hitter...according to Henry Aaron. I think he made it to the next level.
If I remember correctly he'd pick the pitch and then sit on it until he got it.Getting back on topic redbird5 and TR both gave good advice in the first few posts of this thread. There are situations where if a pitcher has shown a tendency to throw curves on a given count such as 0-1 and you aren't handling the fastball that well you might want to look for a curve before 2 strikes but generally speaking redbird is right on.
what i have been taught by an ex cleveland indian pitcher is "hips before hands". The concept being throwing your hips into the pitch like any old fastball but to keep you hands back long enough to recognize what he pitch is. all it really is is keeping you weight back and letting the ball travel. I would recogmend seeing as many curve balls possible and really keeping you wieght back on every pitch. more balls will go to the opposite field.
stay back, and hit the ball with the barrel on the way up
quote:Originally posted by CADad:
redbird5,
Henry Aaron was a guess hitter...according to Henry Aaron. I think he made it to the next level.
1) Aaron was part of the minority. (No pun intended)
2) The difference in Aaron's guessing is that it wasn't pitch to pitch. I have no problem with a hitter looking for a specific pitch in an at bat. I would not call that guessing.
First off, as a hitter, especially as you get older there is more guessing involved as the kids begin to throw upper 80s+ because they cant react that fast.
Second, answering the question on how to help to teach a hitter how to hit a curve. My old coach use to throw wiffle balls (baseball sizes ones) and have us hit it up the middle or to the opposite field. By doing this it forces the hitter to stay back longer and still use their same swing. I thought it helped me a lot.
Second, answering the question on how to help to teach a hitter how to hit a curve. My old coach use to throw wiffle balls (baseball sizes ones) and have us hit it up the middle or to the opposite field. By doing this it forces the hitter to stay back longer and still use their same swing. I thought it helped me a lot.
The hitters' approach should be "Middle Of The Field".....LC Gap to RC Gap.....If your approach is middle of the field it should give you the best chance to square up (not just hit) not only breaking balls but any off speed pitch for that matter by keeping you on the pitch, so to speak.....Very difficult to hit a "Good Curve Ball"...the old adage is "nobody hits the good breaking ball, they hit the bad ones"..by good I mean well located (down in the strike zone if not out of the strike zone)...and by "bad" I mean an off speed pitch up in the strike zone....and by up I mean mid-thigh to the belly button area.....young hitters get themselves in trouble or get themselves out by their approach, which is generally "Pull".......off center BP could help with the young hitter who has not yet learned how to hit with a good approach.....that approach being "Middle Of The Field".....and understand that your "approach" may change depending on the situation.......The question was "how to hit the breaking ball".....Situational hitting is slightly different
And one thing of note.....Roger Thomas asked if it was possible to detect the supination of the arm to hit the breaking ball.....
The arm pronates after release no matter what pitch is thrown......
With the young or inexperienced pitcher it's possible to see him slow his arm when throwing offspeed pitches but I personally feel the approach is the most important in the development of young hitters.....
As far as guessing on pitches......certainly nothing wrong with guessing if a pitcher has distinct tendancies.....but I would also add that if a hitter is going guess, it would be advisable to guess only when the count is in the hitters favor.....I would suggest looking or "guessing" (if you will) for a location over "guessing on a particular pitch"....
The arm pronates after release no matter what pitch is thrown......
With the young or inexperienced pitcher it's possible to see him slow his arm when throwing offspeed pitches but I personally feel the approach is the most important in the development of young hitters.....
As far as guessing on pitches......certainly nothing wrong with guessing if a pitcher has distinct tendancies.....but I would also add that if a hitter is going guess, it would be advisable to guess only when the count is in the hitters favor.....I would suggest looking or "guessing" (if you will) for a location over "guessing on a particular pitch"....
I go with Recab and TRHit on this one. You have to be able to recognize the curveball (spin) before you can hit the curveball and you have to have a lot of practice to effectively hit the CB once you are able to recognize one. (If you watch the pitcher’s hand after release you will lose sight of the ball). I also think the drill Recab mentions with the soft toss from behind is a good drill because it teaches the hitter to be an “explosive” type hitter which allows the hitter more time to recognize and hit the off speed pitch. Two other drills I used: I used another drill where I would drop a ball from shoulder high and my son could hit the ball before it got to his belt level. Another soft toss drill is varying the speed (trajectory) of the soft toss. Try to handcuff your son with your soft toss by doing this. It’s amazing that you can teach a quick bat and teach a hitter to stay back and explode on the ball just by soft tossing. Cleanuphitter said: Instead you should teach him good fundamental basics of hitting and then spend a few bucks getting him some professional lessons. He will get better at hitting the curve as the opposing pitchers get better at throwing the curve.
Fungo
I personally think that would a lot of effort on your part with poor results. You actually would lull your son into being able to hit “your” curve ball which may or may not be very good.quote:Yeah, thanks TRhit I am learning how to throw one so we can do just that.
Instead you should teach him good fundamental basics of hitting and then spend a few bucks getting him some professional lessons. He will get better at hitting the curve as the opposing pitchers get better at throwing the curve.Fungo
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bum:
First--and I'm serious--have the kid see an optometrist. He needs to see the rotation of the seams.
I took my 11 YO to the eye guy and he got a very slight prescription and it made a huge difference with recognizing off-speed. He was complaining about not seeing the curve; his script is .50 in both eyes and he's a happy youngster again.
First--and I'm serious--have the kid see an optometrist. He needs to see the rotation of the seams.
I took my 11 YO to the eye guy and he got a very slight prescription and it made a huge difference with recognizing off-speed. He was complaining about not seeing the curve; his script is .50 in both eyes and he's a happy youngster again.
At the age of 11 your son is "complaining about not seeing the curve"----- what league does he play in
OUCH !!!!!!!!!!!!
OUCH !!!!!!!!!!!!
My approach to hitting a curve is, see if out of the hand... and my coach preaches watching the ball out of the hand, and following the hand of the pitcher. Whether he snaps his wrist, grasps the ball deep in his paml [3 fingers usually] or comes strait out with a fastball.
I think the key approach to a curve ball is don't let the break scare you, and hang in there.
The hands need to stay back, because even if you are fooled, your hands stay cocked and can at least foul the ball off.
A big thing is focusing on taking it the other way, and reacting that your going to take it the other way [assuming righty to righty]
Lastly, the only way to get good at hitting breaking pitches, is to practice against them.
I hate pitching machines, but I think hitting curves off them can help to some extent, although the repetition of the break kinda screws with the whole thing, but it gets the idea down.
oh, one more thing
Dont duck when a curve comes, it seems to be a natural reaction [from what Ive done, and ive seen]
but after you realize, if it hits you, it doesn't hurt, and normally it will break to the heart of the plate, and well... think right field.
I think the key approach to a curve ball is don't let the break scare you, and hang in there.
The hands need to stay back, because even if you are fooled, your hands stay cocked and can at least foul the ball off.
A big thing is focusing on taking it the other way, and reacting that your going to take it the other way [assuming righty to righty]
Lastly, the only way to get good at hitting breaking pitches, is to practice against them.
I hate pitching machines, but I think hitting curves off them can help to some extent, although the repetition of the break kinda screws with the whole thing, but it gets the idea down.
oh, one more thing
Dont duck when a curve comes, it seems to be a natural reaction [from what Ive done, and ive seen]
but after you realize, if it hits you, it doesn't hurt, and normally it will break to the heart of the plate, and well... think right field.
I know this thread is about hitting the curve, but what about the changeup? Our LL doesn't allow CBs, but our better hitters are seeing a lot of changeups.
I've explained to them the "usual" off-speed counts, but of course, as we all know, NOT being predictable is a pitcher's goal, so they will also see some on 1st pitch or even 2-0, etc. I also tell them to watch for the pitcher's body/arm to slow down, as many of them tip off their changeups quite a bit. But they're still often way in front of it. And the two hitters who see the most are known to be gap-to-gap hitters, so they're not failing because their swings are solely dead-pull types.
Thoughts? Thanks.
I've explained to them the "usual" off-speed counts, but of course, as we all know, NOT being predictable is a pitcher's goal, so they will also see some on 1st pitch or even 2-0, etc. I also tell them to watch for the pitcher's body/arm to slow down, as many of them tip off their changeups quite a bit. But they're still often way in front of it. And the two hitters who see the most are known to be gap-to-gap hitters, so they're not failing because their swings are solely dead-pull types.
Thoughts? Thanks.
DH33
I second this!!
I had a kid duck in 9-10 allstars and he got hit right in the eye by a curveball. I had another get hit in the cup when he leaned back on one.
It is nearly impossible to get little leaguers to turn into the pitch or step back!
And I know, what the heck is a 10 year old throwing a cb? Some Dad's never care.
quote:oh, one more thing
Dont duck when a curve comes, it seems to be a natural reaction [from what Ive done, and ive seen]
I second this!!
I had a kid duck in 9-10 allstars and he got hit right in the eye by a curveball. I had another get hit in the cup when he leaned back on one.
It is nearly impossible to get little leaguers to turn into the pitch or step back!
And I know, what the heck is a 10 year old throwing a cb? Some Dad's never care.
quote:My approach to hitting a curve is, see if out of the hand... and my coach preaches watching the ball out of the hand, and following the hand of the pitcher. Whether he snaps his wrist, grasps the ball deep in his paml [3 fingers usually] or comes strait out with a fastball.
Huh? If you can see a pitcher snap his wrist or tell how deep he's griping the ball you should be fighting crime in spandex instead of playing ball. Nobody can see that stuff and from the college level and up, all good hitters are looking for 1 pitch, not reading the spin or anything like that. If you are trying to see the pitch and determine if it's fastball or offspeed, then swing, you will never be succesful. Sit on one or the other.
quote:Originally posted by Sandman:
I know this thread is about hitting the curve, but what about the changeup? Our LL doesn't allow CBs, but our better hitters are seeing a lot of changeups.
Good rule.
quote:Huh? If you can see a pitcher snap his wrist or tell how deep he's griping the ball you should be fighting crime in spandex instead of playing ball.
HA! That is really funny! (Also, I tend to agree. Maybe it's MY eyesight, but if you can see the pitcher's hand and grip that clearly, either his arm speed is awfully slow or your eyes are a lot better than mine.)
Three things:
1. Recognize the difference between the FB and the CB...see the "Hump"
2. Stay tall and balanced.
3. Get a lot of reps.
1. Recognize the difference between the FB and the CB...see the "Hump"
2. Stay tall and balanced.
3. Get a lot of reps.
Wow.. brought back from the dead...
The stitches I had inside my mouth and the large amount of swelling to my face has to disagree. Getting hit with a curve ball DOES hurt.
Now, I do agree to NOT duck out on a curve ball but to make a comment like that is just flat-out wrong..
quote:if it hits you, it doesn't hurt,
The stitches I had inside my mouth and the large amount of swelling to my face has to disagree. Getting hit with a curve ball DOES hurt.
Now, I do agree to NOT duck out on a curve ball but to make a comment like that is just flat-out wrong..
RedBird took the words out of my mouth, dont miss fastballs. And for the record, Ted Williams also said he was a guess hitter. Its not a bad thing if you are making educated guesses based on the pitcher, count, situation, etc. but most high schoolers arent that advanced.
A great phrase I remembered was "sit on what you are going to get". Commit to sitting on the curveball, see it out of the hand and look for the ball up in the zone. If its a curve starting down you are in trouble. As for reacting to a curve out of the hand and hitting it consistently, Ill refer to Ken Harrelson when he said, "honestly,how many great curveball hitters have you ever seen? usually guys with slow bats."
I will disagree somewhat on not swinging at the curve unless there are two strikes. Hangers are meant to be destroyed.
A great phrase I remembered was "sit on what you are going to get". Commit to sitting on the curveball, see it out of the hand and look for the ball up in the zone. If its a curve starting down you are in trouble. As for reacting to a curve out of the hand and hitting it consistently, Ill refer to Ken Harrelson when he said, "honestly,how many great curveball hitters have you ever seen? usually guys with slow bats."
I will disagree somewhat on not swinging at the curve unless there are two strikes. Hangers are meant to be destroyed.
