Can some folks outline the appeal procedure for a baserunner leaving early? Also, in practice does the umpire provide any hint as to what the eventual call might be?
At a game this past weekend and it looked like a runner might have left early. I assume there is no penalty if you lose the appeal, but coach simply passed on the opportunity. My feeling was that it couldn't hurt to try.
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Until an ump gives the correct answer:
You get the ball to the mound, pitcher throws to the base in question, fielder steps on it. He usually says "the runner left early" though he doesn't have to. That's the usual procedure, but I think you can go right to the base without stopping at the mound. For example, ball from OF could have been cut by F3, runner from 3b is already home, and he could throw to F5 for appeal.
One thing I remember from coaching lower level is that the ball must be live. So in LL for example if your fielders can't catch and throw any other runners could be advancing while you appeal.
Umps are supposed to stay silent on this, just like they do if they they notice improper batter at the plate.
Appeals are easy in high school rules because they can be made while the ball is live or when it is dead. Other rule sets require the ball to be live but NFHS does not. And the appeal doesn't have to originate on the mound. Just tag the base or the runner and state what you are appealing.
There is no penalty for an unsuccessful appeal or even multiple unsuccessful appeals on the same play.
Umpires should never say or do anything to alert a team to the potential for a successful appeal.
On rare occasions, players or coaches ask if they should appeal something. It's rare because it's just as easy to make the appeal as it is to ask about it.
Recently, I granted time after the batter-runner fell down while rounding first base and limped into second base in obvious pain. While he was being tended by the trainer, the defensive coach ambled over to me and asked if there was any point in appealing the touch at first. Since I had seen the player trip over the base, I advised the coach to save himself the trouble.
Another time, a runner left third early on a fly ball to left. After the runner scored and headed to the dugout, the catcher asked me if he had left early. I told him there was a procedure in place to get my opinion on that question. He figured it out, made the appeal, and got the out.
Consider this - how many times have you seen runners fail to tag up? Defense takes the ball to the bag and steps on it and the call is made.
Appeal play. It is no different than runner leaving early - only the ask being made is Left early vs. Never tagged up.
I have umpired HS ball for better than 10-years. I have had two appeal plays that have gone against the offensive team. In both cases, the runner left early (off the bag about a step).
After the call, one team would not let me fill my water bottle in their dugout, it was 110 degrees and no water. The other call was much easier as I had a coach, third baseman and runner, all waiting for the catch. The coach is yelling at his player to go and then pushes his shoulder. If I had not called the out for leaving early, I would have called the out for interference.
In both cases, the wrath of the coach, team and fans was unbelievable.
ILVBB- Where a coach makes contact with the runner. Is that something that needs to be appealed by the opposing team like appealing a left early or is that something you as an umpire can make an immediate call on? Unusual for a full time coach to make that error. I would think a parent/coach or player playing base coach would make that error!
So, re: multiple appeals....runners on second and third, and you think both runners left early. You can appeal the runner at 3rd base and whether the umpire calls him safe or not, you can then appeal the runner leaving early at second?
smokeminside posted:So, re: multiple appeals....runners on second and third, and you think both runners left early. You can appeal the runner at 3rd base and whether the umpire calls him safe or not, you can then appeal the runner leaving early at second?
Correct.
Kevin A posted:ILVBB- Where a coach makes contact with the runner. Is that something that needs to be appealed by the opposing team like appealing a left early or is that something you as an umpire can make an immediate call on? Unusual for a full time coach to make that error. I would think a parent/coach or player playing base coach would make that error!
Coach physically assisting a runner is a delayed dead ball, though the runner is out immediately.
In the situation ILVBB described above, if the defense made an immediate live-ball appeal for leaving too early, it might have been just as easy to grab the appeal out.
I don't think I've ever made that call (though I've called batters out when coaches interfered with attempts to catch foul pops) so I could imagine it might take a moment to process what you see when you're focusing on the catch and the runner's start and you unexpectedly see the coach swat the player.
Swampboy posted:Kevin A posted:ILVBB- Where a coach makes contact with the runner. Is that something that needs to be appealed by the opposing team like appealing a left early or is that something you as an umpire can make an immediate call on? Unusual for a full time coach to make that error. I would think a parent/coach or player playing base coach would make that error!
Coach physically assisting a runner is a delayed dead ball, though the runner is out immediately.
In the situation ILVBB described above, if the defense made an immediate live-ball appeal for leaving too early, it might have been just as easy to grab the appeal out.
Coach assist is not an appeal play. It is to be called by the PU immediately when he sees it. The ball remains live so that the offense is permitted to get additional outs on the play.
The defense can not make a live ball appeal of the runner leaving early immediately when it happens. This appeal is made when action is relaxed.
As mentioned by Swampboy, HS ball allows for missed base and failure to tag up appeals when the ball is dead. The coach need only tell the umpire that he wants to appeal #XX for leaving 3rd early or #XX for missing the base. These appeals can be made when the ball is live by throwing to the base or tagging the runner after action is relaxed.
Too many times I see in HS ball, the coach do the entire dance of getting the ball in play so they can appeal when it's not necessary.
Be careful with the word "catch" for leaving too early. 8-2-6(a)(2) "Leaving a base on caught fly ball before the ball is first touched" (something also noted in the PEN section just before). Think about it awhile. Now imagine a scenario where the first touch isn't the eventual fielder who catches the ball... When a coach asks you about things be sure you understand the first touch vs. catch timing so you explain it right. It's still a judgement call regarding when the runner leaves the bag and first touch, so it's all about "seeing" two things at one time, getting good angles, etc.
As for not being able to fill your water bottle when it's 110 - that's just plain stupidity, but unfortunately predictable... One would think that's an "unsporting act" which has consequences though ;-) One would think perhaps better than a possible alternative. A lawsuit waiting to happen.
