Arizona Junior Fall Classic

Good thread on the Arizona Junior Fall Classic.

Does anyone have any insight on the Sophomore vs. Junior classic? How do they compare? Sophomore doesn't have an academic game opportunity . . . any other major differences? Lots more colleges at the junior game?

After a couple months off, 2019Son is starting up with fall baseball and has the opportunity to go to both, but finances and time commitment will limit us to one or the other.

FWIW, I found this thread on the Senior vs. Junior (http://community.hsbaseballweb...55#18047621920410955) but was wondering if anyone had been to both the Sophomore and Junior (even if in different years).

Thanks in advance.

BOF pretty much said it all. If your kid is an uncommitted  rising Jr or Sr it's a MUST DO event . Especially the academic game try-outs if high academic player. Lots of east coast schools in attendance

Can't speak to the soph game except to say this - the team that my son went with last year as junior took two teams to the event, one junior,  one sophomore.  I don't believe they went to the sophomore event.

Definitely a good event if your son has Ivy aspirations.

My son got some interest out of the Jr Classic from one Ivy and some very good D3 schools, but since those guys  don't seem to get too serious until the summer before Senior year, and none of those guys every got really serious, I feel like going to the Jr. Classic was more valuable as an intro to that kind of event.  It's kind of a special skill to play in a game where winning isn't the most important thing.  And it seemed to get my kid more ready for this past summer playing more events like HF and Stanford.

2019 Dad--sorry my 2017 did not go to the Sophomore event but he go to the Junior one and is going to the Senior one this year as well.  The most obvious difference is that Sophomore one is NOT a showcase.  It is a tournament format similar to the PG tournament events.  So if your son is on a strong team that can advance, there is a great chance he will be watched.  I cannot speak to how many coaches watch that one, but remember the three events occur over 3 consecutive weekends.  I would guess it would be hard for any college other than the AZ schools to be able to watch all 3 events, so I am assuming fewer scouts will be at the Sophomore one.

The Junior showcase has a fair number of scouts, but it is random luck as to whether or not your son gets seen.  The field layout is bad in that there are 4 games going on at the same time where the home plates all back up to each other.  This is the preferred place to have your games, as scouts can roam easily and watch kids from 4 games at once.  But the other fields are only paired up and farther away so we saw very few scouts at any of those fields.  I am assuming it will be the same for the Sophomore and Senior showcases, so bear that in mind if exposure is your goal.

If you click on the list of the teams attending, I can tell you the quality of teams and players is exceptional.  Virtually every elite travel ball team is there, so it would give you and your son and good chance to see where he is relative to the players on these teams.  Some of them may already have D1 commitments as Sophomores. 

But I totally understand the travel and costs issues, and it may make the most sense to wait until his Junior year if you are sure he can get on a team that is invited to play.

It is an excellent event, but it is not similar to a PG tournament.  There are many very noticeable differences.  Actually the fall classics aren't really tournaments at all.  Not sure what they do now, but in the past they didn't keep score and there was no champion or championship game.

Still very good exposure for the players even if it is still that way.

Thanks everyone! I knew this forum would have good insight. I knew that that Junior and Senior Classics were like scout ball (roll the innings after five or six batters, no score kept) but didn't realize that the Sophomore Classic was like a regular tournament. Good point about them being on consecutive weekends, too.

When I read Backstop's excellent post, I realized I was unclear in my post -- my son has the opportunity to go to both events next month, so the immediate decision is Sophomore vs. Junior event this fall. And it sounds like the consensus advice of the board would be to go to the Junior event.

Thanks again!

Like mentioned above the Sophomore Classic is a scored event (pools, brackets, champions, etc) where as the Jr. & Sr. Classics are 'showcase' events (no score kept, 6 hitters per inning, etc.). Not many scouts/RC's at the Soph event, but there are a few (certainly local and regional schools). We ran into a mlb scout last year but he was there to pump his side business ( college recruiting assistance).

If your choice is between Soph & Jr.? definitely go with the Jr. Classic.

Jr. will have quite a few scouts/RC's, but probably not quite as many as the Sr. Classic. Both the Jr. & Sr. All-Academic try-outs/games will have the most scout's RC's on hand. That all happens on 1 field.

I was under the impression that the Jr. would have more scout attendance than the Sr. based on many D1's and D2's having filled their 2017 commitments already but that does not seem to really be the case. My kid is a 2018 and a few of the schools he is in conversations with are asking if he'll be playing in the Sr. event b/c that is what they are coming for (we are local).....Strange but true- I recently looked at the HS commit list for many of the mid-major D1's ( WAC, Big West, WCC etc.) and hardly see any 2018's on the lists and also very few 2017's? Obviously the big name D1 major baseball programs are a different story.

You can see the schools that were in attendance the previous year at the website (2015 college attended tab) there is a Sr. page and a Jr. page (can't seem to post a link here?):

azfallclassic.com 

Hope this helps...PM me if you want more. We reside in Greater Phx. Metro

DesertDuck posted:

Like mentioned above the Sophomore Classic is a scored event (pools, brackets, champions, etc) where as the Jr. & Sr. Classics are 'showcase' events (no score kept, 6 hitters per inning, etc.). Not many scouts/RC's at the Soph event, but there are a few (certainly local and regional schools). We ran into a mlb scout last year but he was there to pump his side business ( college recruiting assistance).

If your choice is between Soph & Jr.? definitely go with the Jr. Classic.

Jr. will have quite a few scouts/RC's, but probably not quite as many as the Sr. Classic. Both the Jr. & Sr. All-Academic try-outs/games will have the most scout's RC's on hand. That all happens on 1 field.

I was under the impression that the Jr. would have more scout attendance than the Sr. based on many D1's and D2's having filled their 2017 commitments already but that does not seem to really be the case. My kid is a 2018 and a few of the schools he is in conversations with are asking if he'll be playing in the Sr. event b/c that is what they are coming for (we are local).....Strange but true- I recently looked at the HS commit list for many of the mid-major D1's ( WAC, Big West, WCC etc.) and hardly see any 2018's on the lists and also very few 2017's? Obviously the big name D1 major baseball programs are a different story.

You can see the schools that were in attendance the previous year at the website (2015 college attended tab) there is a Sr. page and a Jr. page (can't seem to post a link here?):

azfallclassic.com 

Hope this helps...PM me if you want more. We reside in Greater Phx. Metro

 

Thanks DesertDuck! (Oregon fan down there in Sun Devil land?!?) We'll go with the Junior Classic; sounds like it is the better choice.

Go DUCKS!!

For the most part, the Senior Fall Classic has been and still exists as a one-stop last-minute Christmas shopping event for a ton of mid-major D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and JUCOs looking to finish out their class. However, with how the recruiting calendar has been moved so much earlier for many Division-1 programs the Senior Fall Classic does not get nearly as much scrutiny from the bigger D-1 programs as even 5 years ago where you would see numerous PAC-12, SEC, and Big 12 schools in attendance. 

The reason I bring this up is for this: the earlier recruiting calendar has been a huge benefit to the Junior Fall Classic as it has become a premier underclass event that puts players in front of numerous Power 5 D-1 programs and nearly all West Coast D1s and as such can serve as a tremendous exposure event if a player flashes Division-1 potential. With that, if your son is even slightly interested in the academic route to recruiting, the Junior Academic Game is arguably the best academic showcase available to juniors as they will be playing in front of virtually all of the academic big dogs (check the colleges attended list from last year) and most of the other D1s in attendance will stick around for it too. 

While I cannot speak for the Sophomore Classic as I did not attend it last year, I can definitively say that the Junior Fall Classic is as big of an event as they come and I cannot recommend it enough to juniors. 

highheat15 posted:

For the most part, the Senior Fall Classic has been and still exists as a one-stop last-minute Christmas shopping event for a ton of mid-major D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and JUCOs looking to finish out their class. However, with how the recruiting calendar has been moved so much earlier for many Division-1 programs the Senior Fall Classic does not get nearly as much scrutiny from the bigger D-1 programs as even 5 years ago where you would see numerous PAC-12, SEC, and Big 12 schools in attendance. 

The reason I bring this up is for this: the earlier recruiting calendar has been a huge benefit to the Junior Fall Classic as it has become a premier underclass event that puts players in front of numerous Power 5 D-1 programs and nearly all West Coast D1s and as such can serve as a tremendous exposure event if a player flashes Division-1 potential. With that, if your son is even slightly interested in the academic route to recruiting, the Junior Academic Game is arguably the best academic showcase available to juniors as they will be playing in front of virtually all of the academic big dogs (check the colleges attended list from last year) and most of the other D1s in attendance will stick around for it too. 

While I cannot speak for the Sophomore Classic as I did not attend it last year, I can definitively say that the Junior Fall Classic is as big of an event as they come and I cannot recommend it enough to juniors. 

What's your experience with the first day, Thursday, Academic Tryout and Games?  We were able to find a roster spot for my 2018 for the entire weekend (Thank you Smoke), but son has the ACT on that Saturday and is now unable to play the through the weekend.  

I've now signed up 2018 for only the one day Thursday Academic Tryout and Game.   He'll find out Sept 25th if he's selected.

Thanks.

My kid did the tryout last year.  He didn't make the team but just being at the tryout got him some attention, including one Ivy.  BTW, I wanted to buy airline tickets early enough to get a decent price, and I didn't want to pull my kid out of school early for no reason, so I emailed the tournament to ask what the odds of selection were. They said they turn away many kids to the Sr. event but none, so far, to the Jr. event.

JCG posted:

My kid did the tryout last year.  He didn't make the team but just being at the tryout got him some attention, including one Ivy.  BTW, I wanted to buy airline tickets early enough to get a decent price, and I didn't want to pull my kid out of school early for no reason, so I emailed the tournament to ask what the odds of selection were. They said they turn away many kids to the Sr. event but none, so far, to the Jr. event.

Thanks JCG.  How big are the rosters for the teams for the games? Enough kids for two or four teams to play each other that evening?

He didn't make the game, and we didn't go, as we had hitting and a tour of the new ASU facility with the team we were traveling with. That was awesome.  If I recall correctly they selected about 20 players for each of two teams.

My guy didn't make the game, either.  I remember seeing the list of kids who did make it, and thinking that he would've gotten 2-3 innings in the field and maybe one at bat, simply based on how many other outfielders were on the list.  But I thought the tryout itself was worth it.  Typical showcase: 60/throws from your position/2 rounds of hitting.  LOTs of coaches, and as mentioned above by highheat, may be a better value than the senior classic.  Certainly seem to be more high academic teams at the jr. event than the sr. event.

Two questions:

1. the past coach list looks similar to the HF coach list. Any additional benefit if son has already attended HF?

2. the academic schools all demand to know ACT/SAT before getting serious. Mine just took the ACT test last Saturday, but scores won't be available until mid-Oct. The AZ fall classic schedule doesn't seem to align?

Bogeyorpar posted:

Two questions:

1. the past coach list looks similar to the HF coach list. Any additional benefit if son has already attended HF?

2. the academic schools all demand to know ACT/SAT before getting serious. Mine just took the ACT test last Saturday, but scores won't be available until mid-Oct. The AZ fall classic schedule doesn't seem to align?

Bogey, my  2018 just took ACT on Saturday Sept 10.  They said multiple test scores available starting Tuesday Sept 20th (10 days after).  Even if son takes it on Oct 22nd, you'll have scores, excluding writing, starting Nov 1 prior to HF.

We're considering AZ camp as well, Academic Tryout piece.  Not sure if I'm overreaching, but thought was my 2018 could play in front of same schools twice in 3 weeks which would be good ( I think)???  

But, before I buy plane tix, I want son to email coaches to confirm they're attending.

Smoke. I just checked the website for all the schools that attended the Senior classic in 2015 and it was over 200.  That doesnt mean each was there for the academic game or tryouts, but only that each coach had checked in for at least one of the days during the weekend.  I anticipate a higher number of coaches at Senior Academic tryouts and game.  My belief is that the higher academic schools usually want at least 5 semesters of grades before they put you on a watch list.  The mid majors, D2, and D3 programs have waited for the D1 teams and players to have settled out and now they have their focus of players that are more suited for their programs.  Its "go time" for both the players and the schools with November 1 in a few weeks.

It's definitely go time, but it's not like these coaches have been sitting on their hands all summer. I'm guessing most of higher academic schools are filling holes in their recruiting classes at this point. One school may have everything they need but a LHP, while another has their LHP but needs a speedy MIF.  I think if you go to AZ Senior Classic you should go with a very open mind.

I agree with JCG's perspective that the Senior Fall Classic may be too late for many of the schools, particularly the D1's.  But it is still worthy to attend for 2017's who now are realizing the D1 dream is over and need to consider the other tiers, who will likely still have openings and will be looking for players to fit their needs. 

And if a kid can get invited into the Academic game, that might give them a chance with some of these schools who do not have the budget to go many places and need to see players in action versus video.  By now, most of these schools have gotten test scores and transcripts from their earlier recruit lists and will have a better idea how prospects may be able to actually get admitted to their schools.  And it's crunch time for submitting applications for the 2017s and they need to know if a school may be interested in them so they can apply before they are eliminated by the deadline. 

sunwalkingvalley posted:

Smoke. I just checked the website for all the schools that attended the Senior classic in 2015 and it was over 200.  That doesnt mean each was there for the academic game or tryouts, but only that each coach had checked in for at least one of the days during the weekend.  I anticipate a higher number of coaches at Senior Academic tryouts and game.  My belief is that the higher academic schools usually want at least 5 semesters of grades before they put you on a watch list.  The mid majors, D2, and D3 programs have waited for the D1 teams and players to have settled out and now they have their focus of players that are more suited for their programs.  Its "go time" for both the players and the schools with November 1 in a few weeks.

Important points to note, especially about what scholastic records the high academic coaches will want.  Part of my reasoning was my 2017 has heard from many high academics already and it felt like they were closing down their searches.  It simply may be, however, that they are done looking at him, one way or the other, and are still in the hunt for more players.  Thanks for the clarification!!

This is a great thread, and really useful info in particular for the academic game. (I already have a mental note to plan on my son trying out for the academic game next (junior) year.)

Something else to add for the timetable.  We are on the West coast.  It seems that a lot of posters are on the East coast.  FWIW, my outside observation for the last 3 years( s is a 2017) is that the East coast recruiting calendar is about a year ahead of West coast.  The big schools, UCLA, UW, fill up pretty fast, but most of the other schools are still actively recruiting all the way to a Senior's spring.  UC Davis has said they leave 4-5 slots open for the late bloomers, but they do have to offer 5-6 guys before they get a player to accept.  Utah signed 4-5 guys in our area in late Spring last year.  Some of this is due to the draft as well.  2 years ago, Cal Poly had 3 guys drafted that they didnt anticipate, so they had to scramble.

When we were visiting with coaches on the East coast, we asked why the recruiting timetable is so much faster on the East coast.  The coach responded that just in his area, there are 9 major schools that are looking at the high level recruits.  So, they have to get on the recruits early and try and fill the class with athletes that they fill are projectable.  On the west coast we are very spread out geographically  with a ton of high level players in california and Arizona.  The mid majors seem to be able to let things settle out and then see what recruits are still on the list.  Even Pac 12 still recruits through senior year.  One of my former players signed in July w a D2.  All that said and done, if 2017 gets the full green light and offer at one of the schools that love him before Nov 1, S recruiting is probably done.  I am willing but would prefer not to continue the recruiting process until spring.