Batspeed MPH for HS Players

I googled and found some stuff.
http://www.denverhittingclub.com/BatSpeed.html

Albert Puljos is 86-87. Bat speed is good, solid contact is better.

Hitting is a guess has some stuff also. I think he did some work with a JC measuring kids - they were in the mid 90's if I recall correctly.

quote:

Originally posted by BOF:
Albert Puljos is 86-87. Bat speed is good, solid contact is better.

I think that's a myth from an article. His exit speed was 2nd highest in MLB in 2009 at 119.6 mph.

Exit speed is the goal. Bat speed is only an indicator.

quote:

Originally posted by SultanofSwat:
I think that's a myth from an article. His exit speed was 2nd highest in MLB in 2009 at 119.6 mph.
Exit speed is the goal. Bat speed is only an indicator.

Agreed on the goal, but I am not convinced yet it is a myth based on what I have read. There seems to be enough data on it to think otherwise. I know someone in the Cardinals organization and will check with them.

quote:

Originally posted by SultanofSwat:
I think that's a myth from an article. His exit speed was 2nd highest in MLB in 2009 at 119.6 mph.
Exit speed is the goal. Bat speed is only an indicator.

The goal I agree with , but the indicator I dont. The most important indicator of exit speed is getting the sweet spot on a wood bat. The sweet spot on a wood bat is small, but whats worse is the dramatic loss of energy when you miss the sweet spot, unlike in metal-comp you can still power the ball off the sweet spot as noted by hits off the handle. SO imo exit speed is based off adjustability when using a wood bat (with live pitching). Non-wood bat you maybe right.

Our highest high school player is 92. Hit exit speed is 95. We had a pro guy who had a bat speed of 84 and a ball exit speed of 96.

Bat speed is an indicator of potential. Pujols swings it at 86-87 and it extremely, extremely efficient TO the point of contact. A bat (log) moving 86-87 collides with an object weighing 5 oz at 80-100 MPH. Any math majors want to crank that out? Factor in the compression of the ball/sweet spot effect/energy transfer and I don't think it is unreasonable to think that 120mph exit speed is legit.

Unfortunately, most people don't know how to be efficient TO the point of contact and don't know how to TEACH being efficient to contact. If BlueDog would open up more than his cryptic answers, I bet he would surprise a lot of people. Why could smaller guys like Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Mickey Mantle, etc hit bombs. Don't tell me it is because they were stronger or more athletic because you could find hundreds of minor league guys who exhibit athletic "tools" equal to these guys. I have about a dozen high school players who swing the bat at or above Pujols' bat speed. And I've had many, many high school kids who recorded lower ball exit speed than bat speed during the initial testing we do. WHY???

Ask your players (or yourself) if they've ever taken a swing that just feels different. Feels fast, smooth, free... effortless. Yet the ball explodes. Ask them if they ever feel that in a training environment - off a tee, flips, BP. Then start to wonder if Pujols gets this feeling on almost every swing he takes because his mechanics allow it.

quote:

Unfortunately, most people don't know how to be efficient TO the point of contact and don't know how to TEACH being efficient to contact.

This is the truth and I have found most people aren't searching for it....

Just mention sequencing their body movement, the how and when, and they have a tendency to run away.....

But, they will talk about a smokescreen issue that is meaningless, forever.....

On Mr. Tewks statement about about strong players.........I have briefly worked with several High School players who were probably stronger than most MLB players and they never could hit with power because they wouldn't allow themselves to sequence their body efficiently.....

All this talk of batspeed really is meaningless if, as Mr. Tewks says, there is no efficiency in the body movement of the hitter....

quote:

Originally posted by BlueDog:

quote:

Unfortunately, most people don't know how to be efficient TO the point of contact and don't know how to TEACH being efficient to contact.

This is the truth and I have found most people aren't searching for it....

Just mention sequencing their body movement, the how and when, and they have a tendency to run away.....

But, they will talk about a smokescreen issue that is meaningless, forever.....

Presentation matters BlueDog! I played D1 and pro ball and nobody, never, ever even hinted at it. Yet now that I understand it and it explains all of the BEST swings in my career that I couldn't previously explain. And I can recreate the "effortless power" in the cage... And I can teach it. I've gone through different ranges of emotions about it because my career is over now. But at least now I can teach it. The swings that MLB guys take and you sit there thinking, "how do they do that??"... people should be searching for the answer to that and the FEEL of that.

It is different than what is taught. It bruises egos. It is not easy to feel and can be very difficult to grasp. But I've got a whole crop of HS hitters here in the Northeast who have felt it. I look for the smile after they do it right, the AHA. My HS player who swings it 92 and hits it 95 got it tonight. Just walked around the cage for a 2 minutes with a smile on his face. They feel "it" and ask when they can come hit again!

PS The pro player who is 84/96 hit with me last week and the quote of the day was, "You are blowing up my world." Five year, career .315 pro hitter with solid power numbers who would watch video of his best hit balls and not know what he did. Trial and error works for some people, but isn't it better to just teach it right???

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It is different than what is taught. It bruises egos.

Yes, it is, and, yes, it does......

If a player is involved in the, "figuring it out" process, he feels an ownership in his progression into developing into a great hitter.....He will retain what he learns and it will carry over to the games....

You talk about feel, I talk about sequencing.....One is the other...Most of the rest is smokescreens....

How is it different?

A big reason I don't like, or use, drills is because they have nothing to do with efficient body movement sequencing, other than to hinder it.....

Drills are good for Coach's egos, though......And, you will not be popular on their field messing with their ego.....

Is it possible to outline the desired sequense in a numerical list?

One thing that my sons have been taught is to freeze on the finish (during drills) so as to check himself. Where is his weight, front foot closed, "powerline", etc.

The thought being that if you can get to the proper finish, you must have done a number of correct things along the way. At the finish you are done, not in motion, and can check how you got there.

It is different because of the direction the hips and hands working together in. The vast majority of instruction is hip turn or knee turn (not hip drive and stretch/separation) combined with loading and pulling the arms. Tilt is greatly misunderstood as dropping - and if it isn't taught properly the hitter can drop. Bat speed is way out in front as a result of pulling with the arms. This is why kids can't catch up and why they can't hit off-speed pitching. It is also why kids don't have pop with wood.

quote:

Originally posted by BlueDog:
A big reason I don't like, or use, drills is because they have nothing to do with efficient body movement sequencing, other than to hinder it.....

Drills are good for Coach's egos, though......And, you will not be popular on their field messing with their ego.....

Can you give an example of drills you don't like? I will use what I need to for the player to achieve a feeling. This has nothing to do with ego and everything with the development of the hitter.

quote:

Originally posted by S. Abrams:
What is considered a good batspeed at the HS level? Range of speeds for Excellent, Good, Average,etc.?

Have a HS kid at 94 MPH off a tee...just wondering how he stacks up. No,isn't my son; he WISHES he was at 94 MPH like his teammate.

How are you guys measuring bat speed? I know some get the measurement confused with exit velocity. Not saying this is the case here, I'm just curious how you guys are recording it.

94mph is an excellent speed for any aged player on bat speed.

quote:

Originally posted by Mid-Atlantic Mustangs:
How are you guys measuring bat speed? I know some get the measurement confused with exit velocity. Not saying this is the case here, I'm just curious how you guys are recording it.

94mph is an excellent speed for any aged player on bat speed.

Swing Speed Radar for bat speed and a jugs gun for ball exit speed. Balls are flipped underhand (from the front, not side) and have to be less than 30 mph or the radar gun will pick it up. I know there are more expensive guns you can get that record EVERYTHING, but this format is working well for us.

Absolutely no idea how the HS measures batspeed. I avoid HS practices as much as possible; they don't need me watching them do drills. Was curious what most of the coaches/instructors here see in their players and how 94 MPH compared. My son ranged from 85-86 MPH which seemed about average from the chart on the site Eric G furnished.

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Can you give an example of drills you don't like?

All of 'em, except for one....

I put hitters in Epstein's torque position....That's the feel I feel they need to feel....

quote:

Originally posted by S. Abrams:
Absolutely no idea how the HS measures batspeed. I avoid HS practices as much as possible; they don't need me watching them do drills. Was curious what most of the coaches/instructors here see in their players and how 94 MPH compared. My son ranged from 85-86 MPH which seemed about average from the chart on the site Eric G furnished.

Highest I've seen with a high school player and a game weighted bat was 92. Same player swung a little league bat 101. But all that speed doesn't matter unless it is at contact and moving in the correct direction.

quote:

Originally posted by SultanofSwat:

quote:

Originally posted by BOF:
Albert Puljos is 86-87. Bat speed is good, solid contact is better.

I think that's a myth from an article. His exit speed was 2nd highest in MLB in 2009 at 119.6 mph.

Exit speed is the goal. Bat speed is only an indicator.

Nope, Pujols' bat speed was measured in a lab at Washington University. Much more accurate than someone putting a radar gun on a bat. It was part of a series of experiments comparing his traits to babe Ruth.

I'm calling BS on the highschool bat speed of 94mph. Thats faster than most Major League players.

I had an 18 yr old swinging a heavy 34" wood bat at 91 mph on Wednesday night. His ball exit speed was 93.

I have a few high school players over 90.


I call BS on the 134 mph that the denver hitting club posted. Throw out the misreads!!!

On nights that we hit with our 18u summmer team, we will get the radar gun out and get ball exit speed off the tee.. We use the same ball for every kid and a jugs gun.. Most of the kids are around 88-90.. We have a 1 or 2 that are around 92-94.. They all swing a 33/30 metal.. There was AA guy in there one night and he had a 34" wood and he was around 98.. I dont know how this translates into bat speed. I have heard that since the ball is not moving,they should be pretty close..

90's is legit, Question is can he hit with solid contact at those speeds. Just like in golf an 80% swing with solid contact and hit a ball just as far as a max effort swing. Some times less is more!